"Live Action Dragon Ball Z Movie"

[Anonymous Friend]

Well, when creating a film version you first have to answer...what story do you want to tell? What characters do you want to use? Pare down the elements to the essentials and see how the film begins to take shape from there. I don't think it's necessarily to include everything from the comics or the cartoons, just enough to tell the story that the film's creator wants to tell. Start with one character and then build the film from there, adding new characters only if necessary to develop the story of that central character.

For example, if we want to tell the Saiyan arc I believe that it would personally be best to centralize the film on Son Gohan. Use Son Gohan as the audience anchor. Not only is he new to battle but he's also going to be new to the greater world of Dragon Ball. Start a Saiyan arc film off not with Raditz but with Gohan waking up in the mud and filth after being kidnapped by Piccolo. Get your footing from there, seeing Gohan become acquainted with surviving on his own, learning martial arts and ki control and then being introduced to Gokuu's friends.

Something like this is what would definitely need to be done. I know everyone wants to get in as much of the DB stuff and showcase this and that. But starting with Dragonball takes too much time to get to the stuff more people familiar with the series will know of. Even if it get the Peter Jackson styled flming a trilogy all at once model, your best bet is going off of Z. We don't really need a bunch of character building on the already side characters to have their deaths later on matter. Later one we can always go back and do some DB movies.

or heck, do it like Warrior and turn it into a mini-series.

[JulieYBM]

We've been getting badass women since the 70s and probably earlier. And they've been extremely popular with men and women. Heck, Dragonball give us three of them in Bulma, Chi-Chi and Videl.

Also, men control women's lives? You do realise that almost every male on this planet simps for at least one woman?

Cis men/the patriarchy do[es], indeed, historically enforce their will over women through politics, media, society and family structures. Hell, men right now are trying to take away my right to exist and have human rights and healthcare.

Like, hi, woman who #LivesInASociety here. Okay, that sounds sarcastic but you get the point. I'm well aware that cool men exist. In fact, I'm friends with many cool guys! That doesn't mean that woman don't ultimately play second fiddle to cis men on this planet. This is a big part of why it's such a pain in the ass to get media created by and for women. Or women having any autonomy over their bodies.

Sorry, not able to put a lot of energy into this reply. I'm busy with stuff and health issues.

While men do carry the "showy" power, for the most part. Women have historically had that "hidden" power. Not saying every man does this. But we are generally surrounded by women we are desparate for their love and approval. Mothers, wifes, daughters. With the terms Daddy's Little Girl and Mama's Boy both indictating a female's influence over a male. Then there things like chilvary where men are supposed to put a woman's well being ahead of there own. And that comes from the idea that because men have that outward power, they should use it caringly.

And sure, plenty of societies "keep women down". I don't know too much about how they balance that with how they care for their women. Or at least I hope there is some sort of consideration to caring for them.

Like I said, they use legislature to take away our rights. They also pass us up for promotions in the workplace and use sexual harassment to keep us isolated, fearful or just straight up out of the workplace.

The world is systemically built to make life difficult for women and minorities. There is no 'balancing' 'caring for women' when they are actively seeking to take away our rights, our healthcare and keeping us dependent on cis men, among other things.


Anyway, off-topic, but it'd be cool to invite Matsui Aya back to write a Dragon Ball movie! She's the one female writer to be involved with the animated series so seeing her involved, especially on the heels of her kickass Pokemon episodes--would be a nice turn of events.

[WittyUsername]

Starting off with Tao Pai Pai doesn’t make much sense to me. He’s just a mercenary. You could maybe do the Red Ribbon Army, but I will echo the sentiment that starting off with Piccolo is the most pragmatic way to go.

It creates several problems. RR army is necessary for Cell and the androids, you skip over Goku getting real training from Kame Senin and Karin. You got to find new ways to get Kuriren and Tenshinhan in there.

Too much of the foundation starts in the first few arcs

There’d be no guarantee that a hypothetical adaptation would get that far, but even if it did, the fact that Dr. Gero is motivated by a desire for revenge against Goku doesn’t seem like an especially important detail to keep. It’s not like Goku is the reason Dr. Gero is evil. He was already a mad scientist who was bent on world domination.

[MasenkoHA]

Starting off with Tao Pai Pai doesn’t make much sense to me. He’s just a mercenary. You could maybe do the Red Ribbon Army, but I will echo the sentiment that starting off with Piccolo is the most pragmatic way to go.

It creates several problems. RR army is necessary for Cell and the androids, you skip over Goku getting real training from Kame Senin and Karin. You got to find new ways to get Kuriren and Tenshinhan in there.

Too much of the foundation starts in the first few arcs

There’d be no guarantee that a hypothetical adaptation would get that far, but even if it did, the fact that Dr. Gero is motivated by a desire for revenge against Goku doesn’t seem like an especially important detail to keep. It’s not like Goku is the reason Dr. Gero is evil. He was already a mad scientist who was bent on world domination.

I think it’s more important Dr.Gero has a reason to create cyborgs to kill Goku. It doesn’t necessarily have to be connected to the Red Ribbon Army.

[JulieYBM]

I'd say change Gero's character a bit so that he has a more compelling reason for revenge. Maybe just have it so that Gokuu's assault on the Red Ribbon Army destroyed the power grid and Gero's machines that were keeping his son alive died? Or maybe go gag manga by having Gero lose something super stupid?

[WittyUsername]

It creates several problems. RR army is necessary for Cell and the androids, you skip over Goku getting real training from Kame Senin and Karin. You got to find new ways to get Kuriren and Tenshinhan in there.

Too much of the foundation starts in the first few arcs

There’d be no guarantee that a hypothetical adaptation would get that far, but even if it did, the fact that Dr. Gero is motivated by a desire for revenge against Goku doesn’t seem like an especially important detail to keep. It’s not like Goku is the reason Dr. Gero is evil. He was already a mad scientist who was bent on world domination.

I think it’s more important Dr.Gero has a reason to create cyborgs to kill Goku. It doesn’t necessarily have to be connected to the Red Ribbon Army.

I guess they could say that Dr. Gero wants to kill Goku because the collateral damage from Goku’s fight with Piccolo led to the death of Gero’s family. Not exactly an original motivation, but it’s not like Dr. Gero has a compelling reason for hating Goku in the manga.

Of course, I think they just as easily could have Dr. Gero be a simple mad scientist who wants to take over the world. I don’t think it’s necessary that he should be out for revenge.

[JulieYBM]

What if Gero actually wants revenge on Blooma instead? O.o

[MasenkoHA]

I guess they could say that Dr. Gero wants to kill Goku because the collateral damage from Goku’s fight with Piccolo led to the death of Gero’s family. Not exactly an original motivation, but it’s not like Dr. Gero has a compelling reason for hating Goku in the manga.

Right, that was what I was thinking. Have his son murdered by collateral damage when Goku fought Piccolo Daimao or something.

Of course, I think they just as easily could have Dr. Gero be a simple mad scientist who wants to take over the world. I don’t think it’s necessary that he should be out for revenge.

I think it makes it incredibly boring if he’s just generic mad scientist who wants to take over the world and Goku just happens to be the hero that opposes him. There should be some sort of personal connection. Otherwise everyone just feels like a template.

[Anonymous Friend]

Why does Gero need any previous connection to Goku? Why can't he just want money/power/respect?

[MasenkoHA]

Why does Gero need any previous connection to Goku? Why can't he just want money/power/respect?

Because there needs a reason for Goku to be involved other than “Oh these cyborgs are causing mayhem golly gee whiz guess I’ll stop them”

[Anonymous Friend]

Why does Gero need any previous connection to Goku? Why can't he just want money/power/respect?

Because there needs a reason for Goku to be involved other than “Oh these cyborgs are causing mayhem golly gee whiz guess I’ll stop them”

"Oh, gosh! They seem really strong! I should fight them!!!"

[MasenkoHA]

Why does Gero need any previous connection to Goku? Why can't he just want money/power/respect?

Because there needs a reason for Goku to be involved other than “Oh these cyborgs are causing mayhem golly gee whiz guess I’ll stop them”

"Oh, gosh! They seem really strong! I should fight them!!!"

And that’s boring. It’s just good guy fights bad guy because bad guy bad.

[JulieYBM]

Adding dimension to Gokuu beyond just liking to fight wouldn't be a bad thing, for sure. Gokuu needs to be unique without being boring.

[ABED]

That's a big no on Dr. Gero's son being collateral damage. What a stock motivation.

There should be some sort of personal connection. Otherwise everyone just feels like a template.

A villain with a personal connection doesn't make it any less generic. Sorry to back to the old Die Hard example but Hans Gruber has zero past with John McClane. What will separate them from the pack is the personality and the performance.

[goku the krump dancer]

What will separate them from the pack is the personality and the performance.

And I think this is an aspect of story telling that people seem to glaze over the most. A lot of people are under this impression that having some "Moraly complex" motivation or some deep connection to the main protagonist is what makes an antagonist fun to watch and that couldnt be further from the truth.

People liked classic Broly not for his motivation but because he had a cool design, he bulldozed the main cast in an pretty entertaining way and the way he affected Vegeta of all people is what won fans over the most.

[Neo-Makaiōshin]

And I think this is an aspect of story telling that people seem to glaze over the most. A lot of people are under this impression that having some "Moraly complex" motivation or some deep connection to the main protagonist is what makes an antagonist fun to watch and that couldnt be further from the truth.

People liked classic Broly not for his motivation but because he had a cool design, he bulldozed the main cast in an pretty entertaining way and the way he affected Vegeta of all people is what won fans over the most.

It's a matter of quantity (or oversaturation), what has been more prevalent in popular media, "not morally complex nor deep connection to the mc" villans or "morally complex with deep connection to the mc", depending on perspective, some say for far too long in modern media the former overwhelmened the later and that's why more people demand that kind of villan.

[WittyUsername]

That's a big no on Dr. Gero's son being collateral damage. What a stock motivation.

I don’t disagree, but if you had to give him a personal reason for hating Goku without including the RRA, that’s just about the only direction I can think of.

[MasenkoHA]

That's a big no on Dr. Gero's son being collateral damage. What a stock motivation.

So is mad scientist wants to take over the world because…mad.

It doesn’t have to be a dead son. It can even be the same Red Ribbon army related reason ala the actual story.

Hell even Julie’s suggestion he just has it out for Bulma . He can send the Cyborgs to kill her and Goku just has to protect his friend.

[ABED]

That's a big no on Dr. Gero's son being collateral damage. What a stock motivation.

So is mad scientist wants to take over the world because…mad.

It doesn’t have to be a dead son. It can even be the same Red Ribbon army related reason ala the actual story.

Hell even Julie’s suggestion he just has it out for Bulma . He can send the Cyborgs to kill her and Goku just has to protect his friend.

Yes, having a stock motivation going in no matter what it is won't make it deeper or more interesting. It all boils down to execution. If Goku's friends are put in danger over the course of the story, that's great. The simple fact that Goku destroyed his life's work is more than enough to motivate him. I think that's enough for anyone to understand.

To go back to Die Hard, he's just a bank robber, an exceptional thief, but still ultimately a thief, and yet a cinematic icon. The Predator was just going on a big game hunt. Any number of classic Bond villains fall into that category.

[JulieYBM]

Like, I can just imagine Blooma embarrassing Gero in front of a conference by calling his artificial humans designs unethical and stuff. Gero being a petty little shit because he thinks that he's entitled to being seen as a genius by the scientific community and then having some snot-nose Blooma be like "lol no" and eviscerating him in front of their colleagues would be way funnier and be a great establishing scene while also giving Blooma involvement in the story and and entry point to contribute to his defeat would be cool, IMO.

"Blooma cucks Gero in front of the science community" just sounds hilarious and so Blooma.