Who is Goku's most important mentor?

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Who is Goku's most important mentor?

Post by LoganForkHands73 » Tue Jul 13, 2021 5:40 pm

Each of Goku's mentors represents a different stage in his life and journey as a martial artist, but who would you say is the most significant to him and to the story as a whole? Who's your favourite?

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Son Gohan Sr. -- Gohan taught Goku the very barest basics in fighting, but Goku's fond memories of his old grandpa and sentimental love for the Four-Star Dragon Ball were a major driving force behind his earliest adventures, culminating in a tearful reunion at Baba's Palace. Although he died before the story even began, Gohan taught Goku some of his lifelong values, including to be nice to women. I'd say he's a strong contender because of how much influence he still has over Goku's life, especially in the earliest few arcs.

Muten Roshi -- I think Roshi has perhaps the best claim to the title, for being the first major one who got Goku into martial arts, instilling in him most of his values and goals in life, while also acting as a surrogate grandfather figure. The Kamesenryu fighting style and philosophies have stuck with Goku throughout the saga -- to move well, learn well, play well, eat well and rest well. On top of that, he schooled Goku and Kuririn in basic life skills such as mathematics, literacy and manual labour. Roshi set the standard for all of Goku's other teachers, continuing to dispense wisdom even in Dragon Ball Super. What's also notable is that Roshi was lax in teaching Goku how to fight, instead putting him through a gruelling training regimen to get him up to a superhuman level of strength, speed and agility, and allowing the fighting instinct to come naturally.

Karin-sama -- You can't forget the squinty cat in the tower! Renowned as a God of Fighting, Karin was Roshi's own mentor decades before the story began. He promised to give Goku a vial of Divine Water that would boost his strength, but only if he could take it from him. Easier said than done. The whole test was a placebo trick, as the Divine Water was just regular tap water. Goku gaining the agility to catch Karin was the real power-up all along... well, until the Piccolo Daimao arc, where Karin casually hands over the actual Divine Water for a cheap power boost. Kinda broke his own lesson there. Karin is still a pretty big deal, though he's mainly a Senzu-dispenser these days.

Kami-sama and Mr. Popo -- Much of Goku's training at Kami's Temple is a mystery. The time between Goku's first meeting with Popo and the 23rd Tenkaichi Budokai is almost entirely skipped over in the manga. Although he was also quite hands-off, Kami gave Goku one of his most valuable training tools: weighted clothing, an evolution of the heavy turtle shells Goku and Kuririn wore while training under Roshi. On top of that, Kami has the Room of Spirit & Time tucked away, as well as other cool training simulations in anime filler. After defeating Piccolo and getting a little arrogant, Goku was cut down to size by Mr. Popo, who ate his goddamn Kamehameha. Many fans speculate that Kami's teachings gave Goku a greater sanctity for life, though this is unconfirmed. Whatever the case, his time on the floating island marked Goku's overdue growth into a young adult.

Kaio-sama -- Another strong contender, Kaio is a rung above Kami on the divine ladder, being the god of the entire northern quadrant of the universe. A great matial artist and powerful telepath, Kaio considers himself more of a comedian, but to his chagrin, no one wants to hear his terrible puns. Kaio is a hands-on mentor as he directly teaches Goku two extremely potent techniques: the Kaioken and the Genki Dama. He also seems to give Goku limited telepathy of his own. Since Kaio's planet has much higher gravity than Earth, simply being there strengthens Goku greatly, so he still comes back to visit every now and then. Despite how much Goku owes him, Kaio tends to get treated like crap ever since his little planet became an unofficial bomb disposal site. While he never leaves his planet, Kaio is arguably the most proactive master, as his telepathy allows Goku and Vegeta to request energy from the people of Earth for the giant Genki Dama against Majin Buu.

The Yardrats -- A race of mystical aliens from Planet Yardrat who go completely unseen in the original manga. After helping him recuperate from his epic battle with Freeza, they give Goku one of his most useful techniques: Teleportation, which alone took him nearly a year to master. They make full appearances in the Super manga, where they play a larger role in teaching Vegeta about the art of Spirit Control.

Whis -- The God of Destruction Beerus's camp, unassuming attendant; actually his teacher and the strongest being in Universe 7. Despite being a recent character in the revival era, Whis is already Goku's most prolific master, mentoring him and Vegeta in the usage of godly ki from 2014 to the present day. From day one, Whis has been trying to drill the principles of Ultra Instinct into the Saiyans' monkey brains, acclimatising them to the concept of letting their bodies instinctively react to any danger. He also tries to get them to work together, but that lesson mostly falls on deaf ears. Thanks to Whis's teachings, Goku has learned several transformations, including Super Saiyan Blue, Ultra Instinct Sign and finally Perfected Ultra Instinct. Like Kaio, Whis is also very dependable in helping Goku whenever he's in trouble, rewinding time to prevent Freeza's destruction of Earth, saving Gowasu from Zamasu, and blocking a punch from Moro.

Merus -- A super-competent agent of the Galactic Patrol; secretly Whis's angelic brother disguised as a mortal. Merus also helps Goku master Ultra Instinct in his own Time Chamber entrance. Although Angels are only allowed to use a limited amount of their power in training contexts, Merus feels a moral obligation to step in against Moro's galactic rampage, making him one of the few mentor figures to fight an enemy head-on alongside the Z-Warriors. The risk cost him his life, but his noble sacrifice gave Goku the Will to Power...-up against Moro.

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Daishinkan / Grand Priest -- Yeah, Goku training under Whis's dad is a development only seen in Super Dragon Ball Heroes, but I guess it deserves an honourable mention. In Heroes, Goku somehow escapes the exploding Prison Planet and briefly trains with the Grand Priest in mastering Ultra Instinct. Thanks to Heroes' breakneck pacing, we naturally don't see much of it, but it results in Goku being able to utilise Ultra Instinct Sign at will for the first time. Grand Priest also gives Goku some pretty good drip.

Goku himself -- Yep, this is peak meta. In the Namek arc, Goku wears a dogi with his own 'Go' kanji on it, symbolising his enlightenment after his high gravity training in Dr. Brief's spaceship. In other words, he becomes his own master. But even before that, he spent a long sojourn training himself in the wilderness prior to the 22nd Budokai. Although he loses the kanji, he continues to train himself throughout the Z era and beyond.
Last edited by LoganForkHands73 on Tue Jul 13, 2021 5:51 pm, edited 2 times in total.

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Re: Who is Goku's most important mentor?

Post by MasenkoHA » Tue Jul 13, 2021 5:45 pm

Roshi.

Do you see him wearing anyone else’s gi for very long?

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Re: Who is Goku's most important mentor?

Post by Yuji » Tue Jul 13, 2021 6:12 pm

MasenkoHA wrote: Tue Jul 13, 2021 5:45 pm Roshi.

Do you see him wearing anyone else’s gi for very long?
His own.

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Re: Who is Goku's most important mentor?

Post by ABED » Tue Jul 13, 2021 6:38 pm

Yuji wrote: Tue Jul 13, 2021 6:12 pm
MasenkoHA wrote: Tue Jul 13, 2021 5:45 pm Roshi.

Do you see him wearing anyone else’s gi for very long?
His own.
Which looks almost exactly like Muten Roshi's.
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Re: Who is Goku's most important mentor?

Post by Yuji » Tue Jul 13, 2021 6:53 pm

ABED wrote: Tue Jul 13, 2021 6:38 pm
Yuji wrote: Tue Jul 13, 2021 6:12 pm
MasenkoHA wrote: Tue Jul 13, 2021 5:45 pm Roshi.

Do you see him wearing anyone else’s gi for very long?
His own.
Which looks almost exactly like Muten Roshi's.
It has his own unique kanji and he has incorporated weighted clothing into his Gi following his training with God. So it is essentially God's modification of Roshi's Gi that became Goku's most iconic outfit. Roshi's original Gi hasn't been seen since the Daimao arc. After the Saiyan arc he ditches the turtle kanji, sporting the Go kanji from Namek onwards. There's also the fact that he uses his very own unique Gi in the first arc, at the end of Z, and all throughout GT.

But I agree Roshi is his most important master if we exclude Goku's own self-tutorship.

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Re: Who is Goku's most important mentor?

Post by MasenkoHA » Tue Jul 13, 2021 7:11 pm

Yuji wrote: Tue Jul 13, 2021 6:53 pm
ABED wrote: Tue Jul 13, 2021 6:38 pm
Yuji wrote: Tue Jul 13, 2021 6:12 pm

His own.
Which looks almost exactly like Muten Roshi's.
It has his own unique kanji and he has incorporated weighted clothing into his Gi following his training with God. So it is essentially God's modification of Roshi's Gi that became Goku's most iconic outfit. Roshi's original Gi hasn't been seen since the Daimao arc. After the Saiyan arc he ditches the turtle kanji, sporting the Go kanji from Namek onwards. There's also the fact that he uses his very own unique Gi in the first arc, at the end of Z, and all throughout GT.

But I agree Roshi is his most important master if we exclude Goku's own self-tutorship.
Some changing modifications doesn’t change that Goku’s most iconic outfit is based on the Turtle Gi

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Re: Who is Goku's most important mentor?

Post by Yuji » Tue Jul 13, 2021 7:22 pm

MasenkoHA wrote: Tue Jul 13, 2021 7:11 pm
Yuji wrote: Tue Jul 13, 2021 6:53 pm
ABED wrote: Tue Jul 13, 2021 6:38 pm Which looks almost exactly like Muten Roshi's.
It has his own unique kanji and he has incorporated weighted clothing into his Gi following his training with God. So it is essentially God's modification of Roshi's Gi that became Goku's most iconic outfit. Roshi's original Gi hasn't been seen since the Daimao arc. After the Saiyan arc he ditches the turtle kanji, sporting the Go kanji from Namek onwards. There's also the fact that he uses his very own unique Gi in the first arc, at the end of Z, and all throughout GT.

But I agree Roshi is his most important master if we exclude Goku's own self-tutorship.
Some changing modifications doesn’t change that Goku’s most iconic outfit is based on the Turtle Gi
Yes, but I doubt the turtle kanji is the most iconic imagery he's associated with. I'd guess it's the Go kanji, which is why it returned in DBS.

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Re: Who is Goku's most important mentor?

Post by MasenkoHA » Tue Jul 13, 2021 7:25 pm

Yuji wrote: Tue Jul 13, 2021 7:22 pm
MasenkoHA wrote: Tue Jul 13, 2021 7:11 pm
Yuji wrote: Tue Jul 13, 2021 6:53 pm

It has his own unique kanji and he has incorporated weighted clothing into his Gi following his training with God. So it is essentially God's modification of Roshi's Gi that became Goku's most iconic outfit. Roshi's original Gi hasn't been seen since the Daimao arc. After the Saiyan arc he ditches the turtle kanji, sporting the Go kanji from Namek onwards. There's also the fact that he uses his very own unique Gi in the first arc, at the end of Z, and all throughout GT.

But I agree Roshi is his most important master if we exclude Goku's own self-tutorship.
Some changing modifications doesn’t change that Goku’s most iconic outfit is based on the Turtle Gi
Yes, but I doubt the turtle kanji is the most iconic imagery he's associated with. I'd guess it's the Go kanji, which is why it returned in DBS.
The outfit is more identifiable than whatever kanji is currently on it

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Re: Who is Goku's most important mentor?

Post by ABED » Tue Jul 13, 2021 7:32 pm

It's not the kanji that Goku uses as the link to his master, it's the gi. He's modified it over the years but it still has a very similar overall look.
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Re: Who is Goku's most important mentor?

Post by Scientist Fu » Tue Jul 13, 2021 7:34 pm

It is Roshi without a doubt. We can even see tears flowing when he thought that his mentor died in the DBS anime. Roshi was his first mentor and he was like a "father" to him.

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Re: Who is Goku's most important mentor?

Post by jjgp1112 » Tue Jul 13, 2021 9:25 pm

Master Roshi is the foundation for everything we see of Goku going forward. I think King Kai brought Goku the most significant leap, but it's Roshi all the way.
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Re: Who is Goku's most important mentor?

Post by ABED » Tue Jul 13, 2021 9:33 pm

It's also important to remember that everything Gohan taught Goku was taught to him by Muten Roshi, so even from the beginning, Muten Roshi had an influence on Son Goku.
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Re: Who is Goku's most important mentor?

Post by Kunzait_83 » Wed Jul 14, 2021 7:15 am

ABED wrote: Tue Jul 13, 2021 9:33 pmIt's also important to remember that everything Gohan taught Goku was taught to him by Muten Roshi, so even from the beginning, Muten Roshi had an influence on Son Goku.
100% this. Muten Roshi hands down takes the title for Goku's most important and significant teacher by a wide, wide margin, and its not even close at all.


That being said though...
jjgp1112 wrote: Tue Jul 13, 2021 9:25 pmI think King Kai brought Goku the most significant leap, but it's Roshi all the way.
I'd actually argue that 2nd to Muten Roshi might be Kami and Popo. Kaio definitely gave Goku some very crucial techniques that would serve him valuably for the rest of Z (making him probably my pick for 3rd), but Kami and Popo dramatically raised the ante in Goku's more overall fighting ability: the biggest focus of his training with them was on more advanced Ki sensing and manipulation techniques broadly, many of which would become mainstays synonymous with the level of fighting we see throughout Z, including the ability to fly, to sense Ki, and to control his own Ki.

We see Goku just starting to scrape into the surface of more advanced levels of fighting in the 22nd Budokai and Daimao arcs on his own, but Kami and Popo gave him the kind of formal training in metaphysical Ki mastery that he needed to make these impressive skills so second nature to him that he'd adopt them into his normal, day to day fighting and training routine. Just from what we see in both the manga and anime filler, a whole TON of the more Xianxia-like Daoist metaphysical/mystical aspects of Ki control were adopted by Goku directly from his training under Kami and Popo.

Kami and Popo I would argue represented a MASSIVE benchmark that took Goku from just starting to dip his toes into Z-caliber fighting to plunging all the way head-first into it wholeheartedly with no looking back. That's not to detract from Kaio (who was definitely a very significant influence over Goku's training and fighting evolution as well), but Kami and Popo's training seemed to lay down the foundations for all the insane, advanced, more overtly superhuman and magical stuff that we generally find synonymous with DBZ all becoming more standard-issue for the series going forward.

Kami also predates Kaio as Goku's first teacher who is of an actual, literal divine/heavenly/god status, so that he'd be the one to really bust open the dams that take Goku (and the series as a whole) from a relatively more "grounded" level of Wuxia to a more over the top insane, overtly Xianxia caliber of martial arts fantasy makes perfect sense and is totally fitting.

That he's also the creator of the original set of Dragon Balls that instigated the whole series' plot in the first place is also very nicely fitting in itself as well.
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Re: Who is Goku's most important mentor?

Post by Koitsukai » Wed Jul 14, 2021 8:14 am

Roshi set the foundations and taught him everything but flying and kaioken, and one of his most important lessons: don't rest on your laurels. He is also the one who helped him unlock UI, so he's still mentoring him, even if they meet every now and then.

Whatever gi or kanji he wears has nothing to do with it, though. He's not fashionable and his kanji only represents who's his current mentor is.

If I would put them in order:

Roshi (taught him everything)
Kamisama and Popo (completed Roshi's training)
Whis (took him a step further and has been doing it for like 4 years)
Kaiosama (taught him one of his strongest attacks and got him closer to his saiyan stuff)
Karin (similar to Kami's)
Merus (taught him a particular technique)
old guy from the DMV (taught him how to drive)

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Re: Who is Goku's most important mentor?

Post by LoganForkHands73 » Wed Jul 14, 2021 11:18 am

Glad there's a clear consensus, Roshi is naturally the most important, but now I'm more interested in determining the second most important, lol. I think there's definitely some room for discussion there. There's definitely a compelling argument for Kami. I think the only hindrance for Kami is that we see so little of his training regimen, so we don't see how Goku's relationship with him and Popo develops. Flight was a huge advancement, but it's worth noting that Goku first demonstrates ki sensing after drinking Karin's vial of glorified rat poison. Undeniably, Kami and Popo helped Goku refine this on top of all his other skills.

What's strange is that the anime filler seems to indicate that Kami is more hands-off than Roshi. Wasn't there a scene in the Saiyan arc where Yamcha asks Kami to actually get off his ass and teach them something, and his response amounts to
Image
Then Popo basically sticks them in the Danger Room. Go nuts.

With Kaio, I think it's lovely how much he genuinely cares about Goku and his friends. Even though he has no personal stake in the fate of Earth or Namek for that matter, he still organises a plan to get everyone to safety and gets really invested in the outcome of every fight, because he cares about Goku that much. He even cares about people he's never met, like Kuririn and Gohan. Makes sense when you consider that the only companionship he had until Goku arrived was a pet monkey (and a talking cricket, and occasionally his quarrelsome siblings). While Roshi may have taught Goku the most, Kaio's always got Goku's back. It's just a shame that Goku never returns the favour.

Whis is probably Goku's most necessary mentor at the current moment and has been for some time. He's been Goku's guide down the path of the gods. The one downside is that Whis is often treated as a narrative crutch since he's effectively a walking Deus Ex Machina, which may hinder Goku's development as he's never allowed to learn from his mistakes when he can always rely on Whis to fix everything. Though in many cases, Whis's interference isn't that necessary. Did he really need to step in and spell out that Moro's Achilles' Heel was his forehead gem? It says a lot that the supposedly impartial Angel is the most proactive mentor in the series.

I wouldn't count out Goku himself either. Some of the most absurd power gains in the series have come from Goku training solo.
Koitsukai wrote: Wed Jul 14, 2021 8:14 am old guy from the DMV (taught him how to drive)
How on earth could I forget his REAL most important mentor? He probably had the hardest job of the lot in all seriousness: teaching Goku something unrelated to fighting.

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Re: Who is Goku's most important mentor?

Post by DBZAOTA482 » Thu Jul 15, 2021 11:43 am

Definitely Muten Roshi. He's the one who laid the groundwork and made Goku the fighter he is today.
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Re: Who is Goku's most important mentor?

Post by Peach » Fri Jul 16, 2021 1:53 pm

Master Roshi is the one who taught him how to train, work hard, and never stop improving. Not to mention pretty much all his martial arts techniques.

I can imagine Goku beating all his other villains eventually without the other mentors. It would take time, but he could do it. But i can't imagine him being a skilled martial artist who knows the value of training without Roshi.

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Re: Who is Goku's most important mentor?

Post by Goku da Silva » Sat Jul 17, 2021 9:33 pm

Muten Roshi, no doubt! :thumbup:

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Re: Who is Goku's most important mentor?

Post by Vijay » Sat Jul 17, 2021 9:47 pm

I think every single one of them played important part in Goku's growth.

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Re: Who is Goku's most important mentor?

Post by Kodoshin » Sat Jul 17, 2021 10:15 pm

Peach wrote: Fri Jul 16, 2021 1:53 pm Master Roshi is the one who taught him how to train, work hard, and never stop improving. Not to mention pretty much all his martial arts techniques.

I can imagine Goku beating all his other villains eventually without the other mentors. It would take time, but he could do it. But i can't imagine him being a skilled martial artist who knows the value of training without Roshi.
Not to mention his interactions with Roshi taught him how to deal with old perverts like the Elder Kaioshin. Yet another big factor in saving the universe! :)

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