Shunsuke Kikuchi vs other Contemporary Japanese Composers

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Shunsuke Kikuchi vs other Contemporary Japanese Composers

Post by Cure Dragon 255 » Sun Oct 24, 2021 4:25 pm

People have said in the past that Kikuchi pales in comparison of other contemporary Japanese composers. Like the guy who does Lupin The third and so on. What do you think?
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Re: Shunsuke Kikuchi vs other Contemporary Japanese Composers

Post by PurestEvil » Sun Oct 24, 2021 4:40 pm

Kikuchi's music (for Dragon Ball, at least) isn't all that complex. The pieces predominantly use the same key signatures of F, use fairly simpler melodies, and sounds kind of dated to the 80s. To be fair, though, Dragon Ball/Z is a simple anime for kids, and the Kikuchi scores do sound similar to some of the martial arts film soundtracks at that time.
Yuji Ohno's music, compared to Kikuchi's, is more diverse and timeless, while being somewhat more ambient to fit the mood of Lupin III. Technically speaking, the production of Ohno's music is "better" in terms of composition complexity and audio quality (it's actually in stereo!!!). I would say it's more "mature" than Kikuchi's score.
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Re: Shunsuke Kikuchi vs other Contemporary Japanese Composers

Post by Masquerade » Sun Oct 24, 2021 5:20 pm

Whoever does MHA's soundtrack knows what's up.

Kikuchi's a one note monkey. Fuckin Kohei Tanaka ran circles around him.

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Re: Shunsuke Kikuchi vs other Contemporary Japanese Composers

Post by PurestEvil » Mon Oct 25, 2021 3:09 am

Masquerade wrote: Sun Oct 24, 2021 5:20 pm Kikuchi's a one note monkey. Fuckin Kohei Tanaka ran circles around him.
Well that’s a bit harsh, innit? I am not too familiar with Tanaka’s BGM work outside of Dragon Ball, but calling Kikuchi “one note” is an exaggeration.
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Re: Shunsuke Kikuchi vs other Contemporary Japanese Composers

Post by Dragon Ball Ireland » Mon Oct 25, 2021 5:26 am

Can't say I know any other contemporary Japanese composers, although being the kind of Dragon Ball fan I am I'm kinda biased as none of the other anime scores I've heard have stood out to me.
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Re: Shunsuke Kikuchi vs other Contemporary Japanese Composers

Post by Majin Buu » Mon Oct 25, 2021 5:46 pm

There are other Japanese composers I like: Shiro Sagisu (mainly for his Eva work), Kaoru Wada (for Inuyasha), Akira Senju (for Full Metal Alchemist Brotherhood), Seikou Nagaoka (for Tenchi Muyo Ryo-Ohki/Tenchi Universe; I like Tenchi in Tokyo's music too, but Kikuchi did that) off the top of my head.

But for me, Kikichi stands alone because of how distinct his style is. I haven't heard anything in anime since that sounds like him.
Masquerade wrote: Sun Oct 24, 2021 5:20 pm Kikuchi's a one note monkey. Fuckin Kohei Tanaka ran circles around him.
For me, a musician can be as "one note" as they want as long as I'm still enjoying their work. For example, with Sagisu I specified that I like his Eva work because I don't care for his work on Bleach due to it sounding far more generic than his Eva work. Yeah, Eva and Bleach are two very different shows so it makes sense that he would approach composing their music differently, and yeah, being able to adapt to different types of shows makes him a versatile composer; but at the end of the day that doesn't change the fact that I only like one of those two scores and prefer Sagisu when he's making Eva music.

As far as Kohei Tanaka is concerned, I checked out One Piece's score a few years ago and was thoroughly disappointed by how generic sounding it was (I know he works with another guy on One Piece so it's not all him). I listened to quite a bit of that score and it just did nothing for me, so based on that alone I'll take Kikuchi over him any day.

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Re: Shunsuke Kikuchi vs other Contemporary Japanese Composers

Post by Demon Prince Piccolo » Mon Oct 25, 2021 8:24 pm

I don't have any knowledge of contemporary Japanese composers, but if Kikuchi is a one-trick pony, then he was one hell of a one trick-pony. From the Red Ribbon Army saga and onward, he composed some of my absolute favorite tracks.
The story of DRAGON BALL starts from the moment Goku met Bulma. I don't really mind the Z, so long as it's understood that it's not the true beginning of the story.

I actually prefer the Goku vs Tenshinhan and Goku vs Piccolo Jr. rivalries to the Goku vs Vegeta rivalry.

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Re: Shunsuke Kikuchi vs other Contemporary Japanese Composers

Post by jjgp1112 » Mon Oct 25, 2021 8:33 pm

Yeah, he definitely stuck with the same key, which resulted ina lot of stuff sounding samey. I always noticed this, but especially once i started making beats and sampling his stuff - every time I'd pitch something up a certain notch, they'd all still sound the same :P
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Re: Shunsuke Kikuchi vs other Contemporary Japanese Composers

Post by Demon Prince Piccolo » Mon Oct 25, 2021 9:09 pm

jjgp1112 wrote: Mon Oct 25, 2021 8:33 pm Yeah, he definitely stuck with the same key, which resulted ina lot of stuff sounding samey. I always noticed this, but especially once i started making beats and sampling his stuff - every time I'd pitch something up a certain notch, they'd all still sound the same :P
I wonder if he was going for a particular motif to be consistent throughout the series. I haven't listened to his non-Dragon Ball work much, though, so not sure if that's actually the case lol.
The story of DRAGON BALL starts from the moment Goku met Bulma. I don't really mind the Z, so long as it's understood that it's not the true beginning of the story.

I actually prefer the Goku vs Tenshinhan and Goku vs Piccolo Jr. rivalries to the Goku vs Vegeta rivalry.

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Re: Shunsuke Kikuchi vs other Contemporary Japanese Composers

Post by Soppa Saia People » Mon Oct 25, 2021 9:41 pm

sagisu's work on kare kano is leagues better then his eva work in my opinion, but as far as 90s anime composer's (i know kikuchi's work dates back to the 70s) go i definitely think shinkichi mitsumune is my favorite. his work on utena is obviously Just So Good but even the stuff i've heard from his work on Yu Gi Oh is pretty sick.

edit : he also apparently did stuff for flcl? incredible.
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Re: Shunsuke Kikuchi vs other Contemporary Japanese Composers

Post by Masquerade » Tue Oct 26, 2021 1:16 am

Majin Buu wrote: Mon Oct 25, 2021 5:46 pm
As far as Kohei Tanaka is concerned, I checked out One Piece's score a few years ago and was thoroughly disappointed by how generic sounding it was (I know he works with another guy on One Piece so it's not all him). I listened to quite a bit of that score and it just did nothing for me, so based on that alone I'll take Kikuchi over him any day.
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Re: Shunsuke Kikuchi vs other Contemporary Japanese Composers

Post by Majin Buu » Tue Oct 26, 2021 8:50 am

Demon Prince Piccolo wrote: Mon Oct 25, 2021 9:09 pm I wonder if he was going for a particular motif to be consistent throughout the series. I haven't listened to his non-Dragon Ball work much, though, so not sure if that's actually the case lol.
His music sounds very different until the original Kamen Rider in the early 70s, though all I've listened to for his pre-Kamen Rider work is the later Showa era Gamera films (though the very last one was made years later and sounds more like a Kikuchi score compared to his earlier Gamera work) so I admittedly don't have a very large sample. From that point on he starts sounding more and more like the Kikuchi we know; and this extends to both his non-Dragon Ball anime work as well as his Tokusatsu work.

His signature sound seems to have come together with the original Kamen Rider, with some occasional variation afterwards. It's not untrue that he was a bit one-note as a composer, but I can easily overlook that because the man made a lot of music that I simply enjoy listening to.
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Re: Shunsuke Kikuchi vs other Contemporary Japanese Composers

Post by jaisonas » Tue Oct 26, 2021 5:57 pm

Majin Buu wrote: Mon Oct 25, 2021 5:46 pm
As far as Kohei Tanaka is concerned, I checked out One Piece's score a few years ago and was thoroughly disappointed by how generic sounding it was (I know he works with another guy on One Piece so it's not all him). I listened to quite a bit of that score and it just did nothing for me, so based on that alone I'll take Kikuchi over him any day.
One piece's music has downgraded over the years imho so its no wonder you thought that. Its most iconic pieces were the original orchestral soundtrack Tanaka which is quite iconic.
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Re: Shunsuke Kikuchi vs other Contemporary Japanese Composers

Post by Hellspawn28 » Tue Oct 26, 2021 8:52 pm

Akira Ifukube comes to mind with Kukuchi doing Gamera meanwhile Iukube did Godzilla. Not to mention, Toho considers Toei to be their biggest rival.
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Re: Shunsuke Kikuchi vs other Contemporary Japanese Composers

Post by Majin Man 101 » Sat Jul 30, 2022 2:35 am

Demon Prince Piccolo wrote: Mon Oct 25, 2021 8:24 pm I don't have any knowledge of contemporary Japanese composers, but if Kikuchi is a one-trick pony, then he was one hell of a one trick-pony. From the Red Ribbon Army saga and onward, he composed some of my absolute favorite tracks.
I cannot believe the blasphemy I am hearing on this thread!!!! Kikuchi's music is timeless and it is like no other! He is a master composer and he is so deeply intertwined with what Dragon Ball should sound like. Its equivalent to how John Williams made Star Wars what it is, and how Howard Shore made The Lord of the Rings what it is.

Toriyama didn't make Dragon Ball folks!! Kikuchi did and thats a fact and dont forget it.

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Re: Shunsuke Kikuchi vs other Contemporary Japanese Composers

Post by MasenkoHA » Sat Jul 30, 2022 10:56 pm

Idk kinda feels like some of the criticisms of Kikuchi work is based solely on Dragon Ball. I definitely haven't heard a large variety of his work but what I have heard from him outside of Dragon Ball (Tenchi in Tokyo, Female Prisoner 701: Scorpion, a little bit of the original Kamen Rider) they all sound different to me. I am a big fan of Kikuchi's work for Dragon Ball particularly stuff from the Red Ribbon arc to Saiyan arc DB movies 2 and 3 and Z movies 1-3,8, and 9.

The datedness of Dragon Ball's soundtrack seemed to be deliberate as it was invoking 70s martial arts flicks which was in line with what Toriyama was inspired by so I can't think of a more appropriate soundtrack.

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Re: Shunsuke Kikuchi vs other Contemporary Japanese Composers

Post by DBZAOTA482 » Sun Jul 31, 2022 8:58 am

Shunsuke Kikuchi had such a distinctive style. He captured the essence of Dragon Ball like no other and it's hard to watch the anime without his music.
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Re: Shunsuke Kikuchi vs other Contemporary Japanese Composers

Post by PurestEvil » Sun Jul 31, 2022 2:08 pm

Majin Man 101 wrote: Sat Jul 30, 2022 2:35 am
Demon Prince Piccolo wrote: Mon Oct 25, 2021 8:24 pm I don't have any knowledge of contemporary Japanese composers, but if Kikuchi is a one-trick pony, then he was one hell of a one trick-pony. From the Red Ribbon Army saga and onward, he composed some of my absolute favorite tracks.
I cannot believe the blasphemy I am hearing on this thread!!!! Kikuchi's music is timeless and it is like no other! He is a master composer and he is so deeply intertwined with what Dragon Ball should sound like. Its equivalent to how John Williams made Star Wars what it is, and how Howard Shore made The Lord of the Rings what it is.

Toriyama didn't make Dragon Ball folks!! Kikuchi did and thats a fact and dont forget it.
Are you, like, being ironic or something?
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Re: Shunsuke Kikuchi vs other Contemporary Japanese Composers

Post by Majin Man 101 » Sun Jul 31, 2022 2:21 pm

PurestEvil wrote: Sun Jul 31, 2022 2:08 pm
Majin Man 101 wrote: Sat Jul 30, 2022 2:35 am
Demon Prince Piccolo wrote: Mon Oct 25, 2021 8:24 pm I don't have any knowledge of contemporary Japanese composers, but if Kikuchi is a one-trick pony, then he was one hell of a one trick-pony. From the Red Ribbon Army saga and onward, he composed some of my absolute favorite tracks.
I cannot believe the blasphemy I am hearing on this thread!!!! Kikuchi's music is timeless and it is like no other! He is a master composer and he is so deeply intertwined with what Dragon Ball should sound like. Its equivalent to how John Williams made Star Wars what it is, and how Howard Shore made The Lord of the Rings what it is.

Toriyama didn't make Dragon Ball folks!! Kikuchi did and thats a fact and dont forget it.
Are you, like, being ironic or something?
It’s just out of my special interest in soundtrack music that I say this.

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Re: Shunsuke Kikuchi vs other Contemporary Japanese Composers

Post by PurestEvil » Sun Jul 31, 2022 4:11 pm

Majin Man 101 wrote: Sun Jul 31, 2022 2:21 pm
PurestEvil wrote: Sun Jul 31, 2022 2:08 pm
Majin Man 101 wrote: Sat Jul 30, 2022 2:35 am

I cannot believe the blasphemy I am hearing on this thread!!!! Kikuchi's music is timeless and it is like no other! He is a master composer and he is so deeply intertwined with what Dragon Ball should sound like. Its equivalent to how John Williams made Star Wars what it is, and how Howard Shore made The Lord of the Rings what it is.

Toriyama didn't make Dragon Ball folks!! Kikuchi did and thats a fact and dont forget it.
Are you, like, being ironic or something?
It’s just out of my special interest in soundtrack music that I say this.
Ah then sorry for asking
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