Is Yo! Son Goku and his friend return! Canon?

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Re: Is Yo! Son Goku and his friend return! Canon?

Post by Demon Prince Piccolo » Sat Nov 06, 2021 5:37 am

There will be people saying Dragon Ball GT is canonical (if there are people in this very forum who would do that, please do speak up!
GT is absolutely part of the "original, pre-Super anime canon" if one is to look at it like that. Despite my earlier stance that I don't like breaking things in "multiple canons," that's just how I view it because...that's how it is. I don't consider it canon to the manga's story or with either rendition of Super, but in conjunction with the original DB and Z anime, absolutely. We know Toriyama had very little to do with GT (and nothing to do with the story), and people have tried to make his words on it indicate that he "hates" the series so they could "prove" it's not canon for years. Here is Herms' translation, in which his tone has been and can be up to interpreation https://www.kanzenshuu.com/translations ... ama-intro/. Obviously he wouldn't publicly trash the series, as this was a blurb from the GT Dragon Box. But to me, his comments are still pretty carefully worded and honestly pretty...neutral? He's not in any way acknowledging GT as a part of his canon, but he's welcoming people who enjoy GT to view it as a "grand side-story" to Dragon Ball. I take this to mean you can count it alongside the original anime if you want to, and if you don't want to, you can easily disregard it.

Again, that's the thing with this whole debate. People are going to say there's an obvious Toriyama canon...and you're right, even though I still maintain the current work by Toriyama can be viewed in conjunction with or separate to his original 42 volumes (pre-updated Kanzenban ending). People will maintain there's an original anime canon of OG+Z, with GT in the mix if you want to include it...and you're right. Obviously there's the 3 OG DB movies, the original 13 DBZ movies, and the GT-aesthetic DB movie Path to Power floating out there. And then it goes on with the advent of the Son Goku and friends special which was the one this topic specified (Toriyama canon or not is still in question when it comes to the extent of his involvement), the pre-Super Z movies BoG and RoF, then the Super anime, the Super manga, and Super Broly. And Heroes/Dragon Ball Online being it's own thing.

No one is coming to any formal agreement on this debate because people are defining canon on different terms, none of which are technically incorrect here, and that's fine, but it's important to point out. There's a Toriyama canon across the original manga and anything he's helped write in more recent years, there's an original Toei canon, there's a current Toei canon...I'm not going to get into the rest. But generally, the people mentioning any Toriyama as THE canon is because he's the author/creator of the original work and they ascribe sovereignty to his work over anything else. That's perfectly fine. And then, with the advent of all the anime, the filler, etc....I mean the whole reason this topic was begun in the first place is because someone wanted to know where this anime fit in with Toriyama canon. I don't think anything anyone has said here has been wrong, really, for the points they're arguing. The thing is, everyone is coming at it from a different angle. If we're talking about a clear Toriyama canon, then yes, a lot will be non-canon to that. And then so on. I think myself and any of the people stating "everything" or "nothing" is canon just meant any of them can form "a" canon to fit how you want it to, if you exclude something here-and-there that contradicts something and consider the different mediums separate from one another. That's it. Maybe the point wasn't explained well or got overcomplicated in the process. And now I look like a hypocrite because, despite saying [in nerd voice] "multiple canons are silly," I've discovered that's exactly what I do across the different mediums. :lol: I just don't think of them as "universes" per se. But it's clear the people talking about an OG anime canon or even a Dragon Ball Online canon aren't talking about the same thing as the "main Toriyama canon"...and that's also fine.

Anyway, I'll let y'all have this topic now for real. Apologies if there's any typos; I typed this after randomly waking up in the middle of the night. Back to bed I go. :crazy: :wave:
The story of DRAGON BALL starts from the moment Goku met Bulma. I don't really mind the Z, so long as it's understood that it's not the true beginning of the story.

I actually prefer the Goku vs Tenshinhan and Goku vs Piccolo Jr. rivalries to the Goku vs Vegeta rivalry.

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Re: Is Yo! Son Goku and his friend return! Canon?

Post by Aim » Mon Nov 08, 2021 8:06 pm

TheGreatness25 wrote: Fri Nov 05, 2021 1:09 am
JulieYBM wrote: Thu Nov 04, 2021 11:59 pm
Aim wrote: Thu Nov 04, 2021 11:29 pm
Because I want you to change how you interact with media. Don't like something? Ignore it. Like something? Enjoy it! What does it matter if it falls under a 'canon' when the reality of the situation is that the IP holders often just ignore things they made up previously to create a type of work they want to create in the now?
If Aim is anything like me, then the argument of "Just enjoy what you enjoy!" isn't relevant. I don't think that Aim ever said anywhere that something being non-canon automatically makes it unenjoyable. I know I never said anything like it. The idea of an established canon for me is what part of the story can I pay attention to and know that those events exist in the current direction of the story and which events don't. Me saying that GT isn't canon isn't me saying that I don't enjoy it--it's me saying that at the end of the day, it doesn't matter what happened in the series because it doesn't count in the current main story.

Anyway, I didn't want to get all in the weeds over this. I don't particularly care that much, I guess. And to be fair, it's not like I participate in any discussions that warrant such a deep knowledge of the story. I guess I'm curious how the fans who say that there's no canon or everything is canon see things.
Basically.

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Re: Is Yo! Son Goku and his friend return! Canon?

Post by ABED » Mon Nov 08, 2021 9:05 pm

VegettoEX wrote: Fri Nov 05, 2021 4:37 pm The conversation has long set sail from when I last dropped in, but I wanted to follow-up on what I initially said here with a few personal tidbits, and why all of this is ultimately contradictory, even when you make your own rules for yourself.

I don't think it's out there to say "the original version as it was originally printed is the canon." Right? Even if you don't necessarily agree with that viewpoint, you have to at least concede you understand where someone might be coming from? And agree to disagree?

OK, cool. So:

I don't consider the kanzenban ending the canonical ending to the series. I don't care if Toriyama wrote it himself. That's not what premiered in the original printing in the pages of Weekly Shonen Jump.

(I would say this is my "Han shot first", but I don't know jack about Star Wars beyond attempting to make that comparison.)

(There's something to be said for "the latest version" being the "canonical" version, but the actual latest version of the manga is a weird amalgamation of both the WJ printing and the updated kanzenban ending!!!)

At the same time, I consider Gohan to be four years old when Raditz shows up, not three. But Mike, you say, in the pages of Weekly Jump it's said that Gohan's three! You're right. I guess my "out" for this is that within the pages of Jump they/Toriyama change this, not just the ancillary media.

It's Dragon Ball. As a wise absolutely canonical version of a man once said, "The only rule is: there are no rules."
Again, is that really the crux of your argument? There is no canon or continuity because there are a few trivial inconsistencies? What long form story doesn't have these sorts of inconsistencies?

In one of the numerous canon threads, someone brought up the Halloween franchise and I think it's illustrative of the point I'm gonna make. I don't think of canon in terms of there being one version of it, nor do I think it makes something better or worse to be canon. What I care about is when there are conflicting version of events, which events are said to have taken place in a given timeline. There are several Halloween continuities and the sequels throw out whatever films from their canon they don't think works for the story they are telling. I don't care if Laurie Strode is Michael's sister, I just need to know if she is so I can understand the story they are telling.
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Re: Is Yo! Son Goku and his friend return! Canon?

Post by Aim » Tue Nov 09, 2021 2:51 am

Gonna make another topic about how the special is the best looking design wise for modern Toriyama.

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Re: Is Yo! Son Goku and his friend return! Canon?

Post by pepd » Tue Nov 09, 2021 8:56 pm

Grimlock wrote: Sat Nov 06, 2021 3:30 am
pepd wrote: Fri Nov 05, 2021 7:38 pmif "canon" is Toriyama's story and he didn't make this hypothetical continuation, it would be non-canon, yes. Not according to anyone, but according to its definition (the "canon" definition of this premise and the one is usually implied). It would still be the official continuation of the canon tho.
But for that to be a thing we would first need to live in a reality in which everyone's in agreement that only what Toriyama does is canonical (and it would be even better if we had an official statement saying as much). Since that reality is but a dream, things won't be that easy.
I wasn't arguing that it is, just addressing the questions you made on the hypothetical that it is; but no, not everyone has to agree on or know one meaning of a word for it to be it's meaning in a context.
Also, we already have people ignoring/hating works that are supposedly "non-canonical", imagine if we got to that point. Would those people simply stop following Dragon Ball because everything would not be canonical? That would be really sad and moronic...
People should enjoy what they want, not give more value to canonicity than it has, and hating is dumb,
but the response of people to something being or not canon has nothing to do with whether or not it is.
I don't get much the "it's just a gag" argument, but following people's logic, "only what Toriyama does is canonical", then Neko Majin should be considered canonical by default, it is done by Toriyama. Or is there another standard/rule here?
The existence of impossible gags it's an aggravating to the uncertainty of being future events that may be contradicted at some point, and opens the possibility of all the manga itself being an impossible non-canonical gag. I do consider it at least probably canon (as a gag manga, with impossible, non-canon events like the Freeza army Vegeta one), but since it is a gag manga set in the future I can't affirm it is. And "only A is B" does not equal "all A is B".
Shouldn't "Toriyama canon" be the movies to begin with? Or are you saying we don't know if the very lines that mention Tarble in both movies came from Toriyama? Because that would raise even more questions to be asked and more points of view to be discussed and analyzed.
Yes, that's what I was saying.

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Re: Is Yo! Son Goku and his friend return! Canon?

Post by ZodaEX » Thu Nov 11, 2021 7:17 am

ABED wrote: Mon Nov 08, 2021 9:05 pm
VegettoEX wrote: Fri Nov 05, 2021 4:37 pm The conversation has long set sail from when I last dropped in, but I wanted to follow-up on what I initially said here with a few personal tidbits, and why all of this is ultimately contradictory, even when you make your own rules for yourself.

I don't think it's out there to say "the original version as it was originally printed is the canon." Right? Even if you don't necessarily agree with that viewpoint, you have to at least concede you understand where someone might be coming from? And agree to disagree?

OK, cool. So:

I don't consider the kanzenban ending the canonical ending to the series. I don't care if Toriyama wrote it himself. That's not what premiered in the original printing in the pages of Weekly Shonen Jump.

(I would say this is my "Han shot first", but I don't know jack about Star Wars beyond attempting to make that comparison.)

(There's something to be said for "the latest version" being the "canonical" version, but the actual latest version of the manga is a weird amalgamation of both the WJ printing and the updated kanzenban ending!!!)

At the same time, I consider Gohan to be four years old when Raditz shows up, not three. But Mike, you say, in the pages of Weekly Jump it's said that Gohan's three! You're right. I guess my "out" for this is that within the pages of Jump they/Toriyama change this, not just the ancillary media.

It's Dragon Ball. As a wise absolutely canonical version of a man once said, "The only rule is: there are no rules."
Again, is that really the crux of your argument? There is no canon or continuity because there are a few trivial inconsistencies? What long form story doesn't have these sorts of inconsistencies?

In one of the numerous canon threads, someone brought up the Halloween franchise and I think it's illustrative of the point I'm gonna make. I don't think of canon in terms of there being one version of it, nor do I think it makes something better or worse to be canon. What I care about is when there are conflicting version of events, which events are said to have taken place in a given timeline. There are several Halloween continuities and the sequels throw out whatever films from their canon they don't think works for the story they are telling. I don't care if Laurie Strode is Michael's sister, I just need to know if she is so I can understand the story they are telling.
There isn't an official canon. We've already gone over this multiple times before. Your head canon is and always has been whatever you want it to be. Not sure why you insist on constantly going in circles with this.

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Re: Is Yo! Son Goku and his friend return! Canon?

Post by ABED » Thu Nov 11, 2021 6:02 pm

Headcanon is a contradiction in terms. You don't get to determine what is or isn't canon. And just because someone claims there is no canon doesn't mean I have to agree.
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Re: Is Yo! Son Goku and his friend return! Canon?

Post by TobyS » Thu Nov 11, 2021 11:25 pm

VegettoEX wrote: Fri Nov 05, 2021 4:37 pm The conversation has long set sail from when I last dropped in, but I wanted to follow-up on what I initially said here with a few personal tidbits, and why all of this is ultimately contradictory, even when you make your own rules for yourself.

I don't think it's out there to say "the original version as it was originally printed is the canon." Right? Even if you don't necessarily agree with that viewpoint, you have to at least concede you understand where someone might be coming from? And agree to disagree?

OK, cool. So:

I don't consider the kanzenban ending the canonical ending to the series. I don't care if Toriyama wrote it himself. That's not what premiered in the original printing in the pages of Weekly Shonen Jump.

(I would say this is my "Han shot first", but I don't know jack about Star Wars beyond attempting to make that comparison.)

(There's something to be said for "the latest version" being the "canonical" version, but the actual latest version of the manga is a weird amalgamation of both the WJ printing and the updated kanzenban ending!!!)

At the same time, I consider Gohan to be four years old when Raditz shows up, not three. But Mike, you say, in the pages of Weekly Jump it's said that Gohan's three! You're right. I guess my "out" for this is that within the pages of Jump they/Toriyama change this, not just the ancillary media.

It's Dragon Ball. As a wise absolutely canonical version of a man once said, "The only rule is: there are no rules."
The weird amalgamation looks awesome. So we get kintoun gifting and a better closing message that isn't abuse the DBs and Vegetas still over surpassing Goku. It's the perfect combination.

And it's the latest version so I'm happy to declare that's the canonest haha.

I always handwaved Vegetas line as just like habit, like he doesn't really mean it, he wants to surpass him the way Ten and Piccolo still do.

You read it like “haha oh vegeta” but yeah I never really liked this over rated z era character getting the last panel.
Last edited by TobyS on Thu Nov 11, 2021 11:29 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Yamcha almost certainly did not cheat on Bulma:
He was afraid of Women, Bulma was the flirty one.
Yamcha wanted to get married (it was his gonna be his wish)
He suggested they settle down in the Trunks saga.
Alternate future Trunks is not a reliable source.
Toriyama wanted new SSJ Kids and not make new characters.

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Re: Is Yo! Son Goku and his friend return! Canon?

Post by TobyS » Thu Nov 11, 2021 11:28 pm

ABED wrote: Thu Nov 11, 2021 6:02 pm Headcanon is a contradiction in terms. You don't get to determine what is or isn't canon. And just because someone claims there is no canon doesn't mean I have to agree.
I disagree the head modifier is an admission your own ideas have no weight but anything you imagined happened off panel is fair game, if it doesn't contradict then it's a Schrödinger's cat kinda thing that's neither canon nor non canon.
Yamcha almost certainly did not cheat on Bulma:
He was afraid of Women, Bulma was the flirty one.
Yamcha wanted to get married (it was his gonna be his wish)
He suggested they settle down in the Trunks saga.
Alternate future Trunks is not a reliable source.
Toriyama wanted new SSJ Kids and not make new characters.

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Re: Is Yo! Son Goku and his friend return! Canon?

Post by Cipher » Fri Nov 12, 2021 4:48 am

Given Toriyama's involvement in its planning and Tarble's repeated referencing in subsequent Toriyama-scripted material, I think it's safe to say that at least in broad strokes, it is part of Toriyama's DB.

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Re: Is Yo! Son Goku and his friend return! Canon?

Post by nhienphan2808 » Fri Nov 12, 2021 6:53 am

TheGreatness25 wrote: Wed Nov 03, 2021 9:49 pm
VegettoEX wrote: Wed Nov 03, 2021 4:35 pm
TheGreatness25 wrote: Wed Nov 03, 2021 4:24 pm Let's simplify: 42 volumes of DB and Super (take your pick). That's it.
How does the manga end? Does Oob get Kinto'un? What's the last thing Vegeta says?
I would say the Kanzenban ending. An author could change their mind and retcon things. It's not on the fans to determine what the "true" story is. Doesn't mean that non-canon is bad or doesn't exist or whatever--just means that it doesn't influence the author's story going forward. Things like the movies, the Bardock special, Ginyu Special Forces on Kaio's planet, and GT aren't going to influence the story going forward, so they're not canon. If the next chapter comes out and Goku goes, "And remember that time that Tullece came!?" then that movie will become canon because it just popped up in the story. But until then, I think we have to assume that Toriyama's vision of the story--what came from his pen--is the canon. Just because there's a ton of material out there doesn't mean that it's all canon or there's no canon. That's silly. If there's no canon, then what's the current story built on?

Why is this a popular trend? "No canon!" Is it because it's too hard to reconcile all of the material? Is it a way to preserve the importance of all of it? I don't get it. Clearly there must be a basis for the story. The Bardock special and Broly movie didn't both happen in the current story. GT couldn't possibly be the outcome of the current story. The movies clearly didn't happen in the current story. Hell, even Battle of Gods didn't happen in the current story (even though that came from Toriyama, but he later re-wrote it). Thus, they're all non-canon. And while tomorrow with the stroke of the pen, Toriyama could change the entire notion of what's canon, the fact is that today, we have clear markers for what isn't canon i.e. part of the current story.
Sorry, what's this Battle of Gods being retconned business?
ShadowWolf87 wrote:Freeza beat Goku, beat Vegeta, and destroyed the Earth. Even if no one else knows it, who does? Goku.
Who gets told it's his fault for being so careless? Goku.
Who has to live with that similar to how he wanted to make Freeza live with the fact he'd been beaten by what he considered trash, and have to live with that shame? Goku.
Freeza got the perfect revenge.

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Re: Is Yo! Son Goku and his friend return! Canon?

Post by TheGreatness25 » Fri Nov 12, 2021 7:36 am

nhienphan2808 wrote: Fri Nov 12, 2021 6:53 am
Sorry, what's this Battle of Gods being retconned business?
It was overtly rewritten at a later time to include details inconsistent to the movie. What's wrong with it being rewritten and retconed? You can still watch and enjoy it.

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Re: Is Yo! Son Goku and his friend return! Canon?

Post by nhienphan2808 » Fri Nov 12, 2021 8:27 am

TheGreatness25 wrote: Fri Nov 12, 2021 7:36 am
nhienphan2808 wrote: Fri Nov 12, 2021 6:53 am
Sorry, what's this Battle of Gods being retconned business?
It was overtly rewritten at a later time to include details inconsistent to the movie. What's wrong with it being rewritten and retconed? You can still watch and enjoy it.
You mean rewritten in the Super manga ?
ShadowWolf87 wrote:Freeza beat Goku, beat Vegeta, and destroyed the Earth. Even if no one else knows it, who does? Goku.
Who gets told it's his fault for being so careless? Goku.
Who has to live with that similar to how he wanted to make Freeza live with the fact he'd been beaten by what he considered trash, and have to live with that shame? Goku.
Freeza got the perfect revenge.

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Re: Is Yo! Son Goku and his friend return! Canon?

Post by VegettoEX » Fri Nov 12, 2021 1:19 pm

What's being described is:

The events of of the 2013 theatrical film Dragon Ball Z: Battle of Gods were re-written in Dragon Ball Super the television series (different settings, different series of events leading up to it, different events happening within it, etc.).

Separate from that, the TV version acts as the base for the "comicalization" (Toyotaro's manga), which itself is missing tons of content.
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Re: Is Yo! Son Goku and his friend return! Canon?

Post by UpFromTheSkies » Fri Nov 12, 2021 7:55 pm

Toriyama wrote it, so I personally consider it canon, but take it how you will, everyone has a different canon. It's also one of my favorite Dragon Ball features, I love the animation style, especially how they made SS look, and the fun lighthearted nature of the story.

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Re: Is Yo! Son Goku and his friend return! Canon?

Post by ABED » Fri Nov 12, 2021 8:08 pm

TobyS wrote: Thu Nov 11, 2021 11:28 pm
ABED wrote: Thu Nov 11, 2021 6:02 pm Headcanon is a contradiction in terms. You don't get to determine what is or isn't canon. And just because someone claims there is no canon doesn't mean I have to agree.
I disagree the head modifier is an admission your own ideas have no weight but anything you imagined happened off panel is fair game, if it doesn't contradict then it's a Schrödinger's cat kinda thing that's neither canon nor non canon.
No, it's just a stupid term that has no meaning. Just say "I imagine X happened." It's a lot clearer. It doesn't equate what you think or wanted to happen with canon/continuity. Saying "headcanon" is a thing is saying it's a type of canon and it's not.
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Re: Is Yo! Son Goku and his friend return! Canon?

Post by TobyS » Mon Nov 15, 2021 9:55 am

ABED wrote: Fri Nov 12, 2021 8:08 pm
TobyS wrote: Thu Nov 11, 2021 11:28 pm
ABED wrote: Thu Nov 11, 2021 6:02 pm Headcanon is a contradiction in terms. You don't get to determine what is or isn't canon. And just because someone claims there is no canon doesn't mean I have to agree.
I disagree the head modifier is an admission your own ideas have no weight but anything you imagined happened off panel is fair game, if it doesn't contradict then it's a Schrödinger's cat kinda thing that's neither canon nor non canon.
No, it's just a stupid term that has no meaning. Just say "I imagine X happened." It's a lot clearer. It doesn't equate what you think or wanted to happen with canon/continuity. Saying "headcanon" is a thing is saying it's a type of canon and it's not.
Saying it has no meaning is stupid when it literally has an obvious meaning that is part of a common language of million of fans.

It means "what do you like to imagine happened off screen that is never confirmed but is technically possible and not contradicted later"

That's it. We see so little of these characters daily lives and or even lives total it's fertile soil.

If you ever speculated what a characters favourite food is, congratulations you created head canon.
Yamcha almost certainly did not cheat on Bulma:
He was afraid of Women, Bulma was the flirty one.
Yamcha wanted to get married (it was his gonna be his wish)
He suggested they settle down in the Trunks saga.
Alternate future Trunks is not a reliable source.
Toriyama wanted new SSJ Kids and not make new characters.

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Re: Is Yo! Son Goku and his friend return! Canon?

Post by TheGreatness25 » Mon Nov 15, 2021 12:14 pm

TobyS wrote: Mon Nov 15, 2021 9:55 am
ABED wrote: Fri Nov 12, 2021 8:08 pm
TobyS wrote: Thu Nov 11, 2021 11:28 pm

I disagree the head modifier is an admission your own ideas have no weight but anything you imagined happened off panel is fair game, if it doesn't contradict then it's a Schrödinger's cat kinda thing that's neither canon nor non canon.
No, it's just a stupid term that has no meaning. Just say "I imagine X happened." It's a lot clearer. It doesn't equate what you think or wanted to happen with canon/continuity. Saying "headcanon" is a thing is saying it's a type of canon and it's not.
Saying it has no meaning is stupid when it literally has an obvious meaning that is part of a common language of million of fans.

It means "what do you like to imagine happened off screen that is never confirmed but is technically possible and not contradicted later"

That's it. We see so little of these characters daily lives and or even lives total it's fertile soil.

If you ever speculated what a characters favourite food is, congratulations you created head canon.
I'm sorry, but head canon (and all of its derivatives) really has no meaning. It's fully possible that off-screen, Goku hosted a survival reality TV show while Vegeta told Bulma that he was training while he was really meeting up with Yamucha to pick up "profesional" ladies to "party" with and they get caught by Kuririn while he was participating in his hop scotch tournament. So what? What's the meaning there? That's just a bunch of stuff that I made up that has no meaning to anyone except me at all. I don't want to speak for ABED, but I'd imagine that's what he means by "it has no meaning."

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Re: Is Yo! Son Goku and his friend return! Canon?

Post by pepd » Mon Nov 15, 2021 1:44 pm

What you are pointing out is that headcanons have no meaning. The term "headcanon" does. I don't really se the point of dismissing the term or its use when the word itself establishes that its content exist only in one's head. Is not really a type of canon, just born born from the term.

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Re: Is Yo! Son Goku and his friend return! Canon?

Post by ABED » Mon Nov 15, 2021 8:18 pm

TobyS wrote: Mon Nov 15, 2021 9:55 am
ABED wrote: Fri Nov 12, 2021 8:08 pm
TobyS wrote: Thu Nov 11, 2021 11:28 pm

I disagree the head modifier is an admission your own ideas have no weight but anything you imagined happened off panel is fair game, if it doesn't contradict then it's a Schrödinger's cat kinda thing that's neither canon nor non canon.
No, it's just a stupid term that has no meaning. Just say "I imagine X happened." It's a lot clearer. It doesn't equate what you think or wanted to happen with canon/continuity. Saying "headcanon" is a thing is saying it's a type of canon and it's not.
Saying it has no meaning is stupid when it literally has an obvious meaning that is part of a common language of million of fans.

It means "what do you like to imagine happened off screen that is never confirmed but is technically possible and not contradicted later"

That's it. We see so little of these characters daily lives and or even lives total it's fertile soil.

If you ever speculated what a characters favourite food is, congratulations you created head canon.
No, I IMAGINED something. It's not any kind of canon. There was no reason to create a new term for this common practice that predates this ridiculous term. Even your definition fails to include when people include in it things they would prefer to have seen happen.

What purpose did that term serve when it was created? Why not just "I imagine..."? If it's not a type of canon, why conflate the two?

Sorry about being inexact when I wrote "it has no meaning". I write stream of consciousness. I guess what I really mean is closer to the term doesn't serve a good function as it isn't a good shorthand for words or phrases "headcanon" is meant to denote.
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