What does the Japanese fandom think of the West’s version of Dragon Ball?

Discussion regarding the entirety of the franchise in a general (meta) sense, including such aspects as: production, trends, merchandise, fan culture, and more.

Moderators: General Help, Kanzenshuu Staff

User avatar
goku the krump dancer
I Live Here
Posts: 3570
Joined: Sat Sep 12, 2009 10:34 pm

Re: What does the Japanese fandom think of the West’s version of Dragon Ball?

Post by goku the krump dancer » Tue Jan 11, 2022 12:47 pm

I've long since grown past the phase of feeling like I need to introduce any woman i'm dating to Dragon Ball or any anime for that matter if she isn't already interested, the idea sounds good on paper of cuddling up with you S/O and enthusiastically indulging your nerdy thing but most times it just comes off like a chore and not as genuine. Plus i'd much rather it be a situation where i have my thing and she has hers and we dont feel the need to watch every single thing together all the time, i'm getting tired just thing of the smothering.

There're videos on Youtube of some sapp showing his apparent "Non Dragon Ball Fan" wife, different moments from the series to get her reaction and I guess attempt to peak her interest in the series and of course he's showing her old funi dub clips but its just so cringe. The guy has the nerdiest voice in the world and while he's trying to enthusiastically add context to the different scenes his wife is showing obvious signs of complete disinterest, its so bad.
It's not too late. One day, it will be.
Peace And Power MF DOOM!
Peace and Power Kevin Samuels

User avatar
Koitsukai
I Live Here
Posts: 4265
Joined: Tue Feb 06, 2018 5:02 pm

Re: What does the Japanese fandom think of the West’s version of Dragon Ball?

Post by Koitsukai » Tue Jan 11, 2022 1:19 pm

The DB movies can be a nice gateway to the franchise, it's just an hour or so long and they are kinda fun, and a little cleaner than the anime with the Roshi/Oolong antics and all.

Vijay
Advanced Regular
Posts: 1423
Joined: Fri Sep 06, 2013 9:48 am

Re: What does the Japanese fandom think of the West’s version of Dragon Ball?

Post by Vijay » Tue Jan 11, 2022 3:00 pm

Aim wrote: Tue Jan 11, 2022 7:19 am
Vijay wrote: Tue Jan 11, 2022 12:57 am
DragonBallFoodie wrote: Mon Jan 10, 2022 4:58 pm This requires asking Japanese fans, either on this forum or elsewhere.

But I hope they think well of the dub.
I'm Japanese fan of the show. I always feel Jap version vastly outclasses western/Funimation its hilarious to even draw a comparison.

Og DB, DBZ dub in particular in hilarious. While there were significant improvement over the years with dbgt, kai, super, bog, rof, super...u get it...that doesnt excuse the fact their voice casts, pool of talent & respect towards thr character & source material (name changes/dialogue & line alterations/characterizations) by West/Funi is supposed to be lapped or appreciated by Jp fans

I kinda enjoy 1% of entire westernized version for various reasons included (1 or 2 musical scores/bgm & voices thats abt it)
Do you think the English scores outmatch the Japanese in anyway?

I agree with the treatment Dragon Ball has gotten. Unfortunately there’s a monopoly on dubbing basically. No variation.
Suprisingly yes. Few dbgt scores esp in Baby, Super 17 & Shadow Dragon Saga had some notable if not superior scores compared to japanese version with apt placing

I dont remember the score names, but Episode 22 frm dbgt had great score & outclasses its japanese counterpart durin the entire Baby's revival & action sequence

Likewise in Episode 59, Goku KHH + Dragon Fistin Omega, or Veggie & Goku power-up as SSJ4 to Omega..those sequences had amazing Funi score outclassin its japanese counterpart

But it applies only for dbgt & super. As most japanese score in dbgt & dbs were pretty jarring/weird imo due to wrong placing & unexciting score in general...even the battle theme is so-so. Guess its due to change in composer to Akihito Tokunaga in dbgt

But in og DB & DBZ, Shunsuku Kikuchi was Emperor👑 his scores reign supreme till date

User avatar
Majin Buu
Advanced Regular
Posts: 1105
Joined: Sat Jul 23, 2005 2:23 pm

Re: What does the Japanese fandom think of the West’s version of Dragon Ball?

Post by Majin Buu » Tue Jan 11, 2022 3:20 pm

Vijay wrote: Tue Jan 11, 2022 3:00 pm As most japanese score in dbgt & dbs were pretty jarring/weird imo due to wrong placing & unexciting score in general...even the battle theme is so-so. Guess its due to change in composer to Akihito Tokunaga in dbgt
Can't speak to Super, but definitely agree for GT. I think Tokunaga's score is good enough, but it needed more tracks since what was there started to get repetitive after a while, which wouldn't have been an issue if it was as good as Kikuchi's work.

User avatar
Super Sonic
Born 'n Bred Here
Posts: 5171
Joined: Tue Feb 03, 2004 4:45 pm

Re: What does the Japanese fandom think of the West’s version of Dragon Ball?

Post by Super Sonic » Tue Jan 11, 2022 3:21 pm

With the title, I think it's kinda how some Americans think regarding the Japanese versions of Transformers. A curiosity, but not caring about changes so much. Maybe a wonder about the Beast Wars anime series, but not anger over the gag dub of Beast Wars. Some don't care about calling Optimus "Convoy". Though will agree that Kiss Players should never leave Japanese shores. It's an example of what gives some folks the opinion, "Japan, you weird".

kei17
I Live Here
Posts: 4142
Joined: Wed Dec 05, 2007 9:23 am

Re: What does the Japanese fandom think of the West’s version of Dragon Ball?

Post by kei17 » Tue Jan 11, 2022 4:58 pm

Most of the DB fans in Japan do not even care about foreign versions of the franchise simply because there's no need to do so, but from what I've been seen and heard, their reactions are mainly about how Goku sounds weird with male voice actors. Also I've seen a few people saying the Faulconer score has more modern feelings and is somewhat cooler. Such people's opinions are based on only short clips shown in foreign dub comparison videos, though. I bet they'd probably change their mind if they got to know its mickey mousing type of scoring.

Aside from the fandom, Blue Popo in the CW version of Kai seems to be well known in the Japanese-speaking world of the Internet through my blog, and it's sometimes cited as an extreme example of political correctness in America.

User avatar
TheGreatness25
I Live Here
Posts: 4922
Joined: Fri Oct 19, 2007 9:36 am

Re: What does the Japanese fandom think of the West’s version of Dragon Ball?

Post by TheGreatness25 » Tue Jan 11, 2022 7:30 pm

MasenkoHA wrote: Tue Jan 11, 2022 11:38 am
TheGreatness25 wrote: Tue Jan 11, 2022 11:21 am I tried getting the wife into Dragon Ball, but I don't think it would be easy to sell her on watching the whole thing in subtitles. As it were, we got through to the Red Ribbon stuff (the dub) and she tapped out. She seemed to like the story, but it was too much of an ask to go through the whole series.
Understandable. The original Dragon Ball by itself is 153 episodes. That’s an investment of anyone’s time especially if they never watched the series before. These days most shows I get into don’t go past 80-90 episodes. Given the shows that get the most attention tend to be 8-13 episodes a season it’s understandable someone would tire of Dragon Ball nearly 70 episodes in.
Maybe it would've been more fitting with the Faulconer score as intended, but damn, it was bad.
.
Common opinion is the dub works best with its music but I always felt the exact opposite. The American score is so loud and screaming for your attention and not…good that combined with the amateur acting of the Texas cast in the Freeza and Cell sagas it creates a symphony of ear bleeding cringe. But since I just plain don’t like 98 percent of the music Funimation came up with, I’m not the best person to ask compared to a fan with more neutral opinions.

Majin Buu wrote: Tue Jan 11, 2022 10:30 am
Cure Dragon 255 wrote: Tue Jan 11, 2022 10:25 am Have you tried Kai?
If you're referring to me, I haven't even watched Kai and personally don't care for it, let alone shown it to my wife.
Fans really do need to stop acting like an improved English dub makes Kai good or worth watching. Gohan and Freeza having more appropriate English voices doesn’t cancel out everything wrong with Kai as a shallow recut
I don't mind the Faulconer score that much. Do I wish that it had a less synthy sound? Sure. Do I dislike the little jingles in scenes that don't mean anything (as opposed to the character pieces or major pieces)? Yoi betcha. But, I can't say that I hate the Falconer score. I think it might make watching the dub more tolerable because Funimation would throw in random lines when nobody's supposed to be speaking, so a lot of the time, it sounds awkward when there's a dead silent staredown and some character says some random crap.

WittyUsername
I Live Here
Posts: 4163
Joined: Sun Dec 22, 2013 12:09 am
Location: Houston, Texas

Re: What does the Japanese fandom think of the West’s version of Dragon Ball?

Post by WittyUsername » Tue Jan 11, 2022 8:46 pm

I can’t tell if the idea of Japanese fans liking the Faulconer music is completely baffling or perfectly believable.

Cipher
Born 'n Bred Here
Posts: 6332
Joined: Wed Oct 21, 2009 11:54 pm
Location: Nagano
Contact:

Re: What does the Japanese fandom think of the West’s version of Dragon Ball?

Post by Cipher » Wed Jan 12, 2022 5:05 am

They don't, mostly. Those online and invested enough to even encounter it would just find it a novelty, and as noted, get a kick out of some of the more famous scripting inaccuracies of its early run.

It's not something most people are even aware of.

Individual reactions to things like the score change via clips are going to come down to the individual.

The Japanese dub of Beast Wars is certainly something that came to my mind too, for a localization novelty from the other perspective.

Y'all need to be more embracing of watching shows with your S/O. (Has watched it all the way through with one, and the current one has already seen it all.)

User avatar
TheGreatness25
I Live Here
Posts: 4922
Joined: Fri Oct 19, 2007 9:36 am

Re: What does the Japanese fandom think of the West’s version of Dragon Ball?

Post by TheGreatness25 » Wed Jan 12, 2022 7:38 am

Cipher wrote: Wed Jan 12, 2022 5:05 am Y'all need to be more embracing of watching shows with your S/O. (Has watched it all the way through with one, and the current one has already seen it all.)
Why? Some people aren't into it, and it's a very big ask to basically force them to watch it for all of those episodes. Doesn't mean that there aren't other shows to watch.

User avatar
sangofe
Born 'n Bred Here
Posts: 7494
Joined: Sun Feb 15, 2004 3:39 pm

Re: What does the Japanese fandom think of the West’s version of Dragon Ball?

Post by sangofe » Wed Jan 12, 2022 9:57 am

A bit off topic, but it might reflect people's opinions of international dubs. Didn't Toei have a survey if they should include several dubs before releasing the Dragon Boxes and nobody really cared about that? I think I read that somewhere (personally I was very excited because I have always loved comparing dubs).
Vijay wrote: Tue Jan 11, 2022 3:00 pm
Aim wrote: Tue Jan 11, 2022 7:19 am
Vijay wrote: Tue Jan 11, 2022 12:57 am

I'm Japanese fan of the show. I always feel Jap version vastly outclasses western/Funimation its hilarious to even draw a comparison.

Og DB, DBZ dub in particular in hilarious. While there were significant improvement over the years with dbgt, kai, super, bog, rof, super...u get it...that doesnt excuse the fact their voice casts, pool of talent & respect towards thr character & source material (name changes/dialogue & line alterations/characterizations) by West/Funi is supposed to be lapped or appreciated by Jp fans

I kinda enjoy 1% of entire westernized version for various reasons included (1 or 2 musical scores/bgm & voices thats abt it)
Do you think the English scores outmatch the Japanese in anyway?

I agree with the treatment Dragon Ball has gotten. Unfortunately there’s a monopoly on dubbing basically. No variation.
Suprisingly yes. Few dbgt scores esp in Baby, Super 17 & Shadow Dragon Saga had some notable if not superior scores compared to japanese version with apt placing

I dont remember the score names, but Episode 22 frm dbgt had great score & outclasses its japanese counterpart durin the entire Baby's revival & action sequence

Likewise in Episode 59, Goku KHH + Dragon Fistin Omega, or Veggie & Goku power-up as SSJ4 to Omega..those sequences had amazing Funi score outclassin its japanese counterpart

But it applies only for dbgt & super. As most japanese score in dbgt & dbs were pretty jarring/weird imo due to wrong placing & unexciting score in general...even the battle theme is so-so. Guess its due to change in composer to Akihito Tokunaga in dbgt

But in og DB & DBZ, Shunsuku Kikuchi was Emperor👑 his scores reign supreme till date
I don't think Super has had different scores internationally.

User avatar
Alruneia
I Live Here
Posts: 2028
Joined: Sun Jun 14, 2015 2:40 pm
Location: Norway
Contact:

Re: What does the Japanese fandom think of the West’s version of Dragon Ball?

Post by Alruneia » Wed Jan 12, 2022 2:07 pm

WittyUsername wrote: Tue Jan 11, 2022 8:46 pm I can’t tell if the idea of Japanese fans liking the Faulconer music is completely baffling or perfectly believable.
I can believe it since they (according to the previous posts in the thread, at least) point out that it doesn't know when to shut up. If that wasn't brought up, then yeah, I probably wouldn't believe it, I'd think it was a sarcastic joke. I guess expressing that you like something while also acknowledging its negatives makes it seem more "real" to me. Besides, there's not a lot about music taste that isn't at least a little subjective, so it would be kinda strange if absolutely nobody in Japan liked the Faulconer score at least in a vacuum (so liking the songs themselves, ignoring their usage and placement in the show).
Probably Kanzenshuu's biggest Bulla fangirl. Current avatar: DBU Bulla as Sailor Princess Sadala, based on Sailor Moon: Cosmic Dance

Dragon Ball Ultimate - 74 out of 150 chapters complete
JoJo's Bizarre Adventure: Action Blue - link
Sailor Moon: Mindful of Love - link | Sailor Moon: Cosmic Dance - link

Dragon Ball Ireland
I Live Here
Posts: 3510
Joined: Thu May 21, 2015 9:09 am
Location: Sligo, Ireland

Re: What does the Japanese fandom think of the West’s version of Dragon Ball?

Post by Dragon Ball Ireland » Wed Jan 12, 2022 2:26 pm

kei17 wrote: Tue Jan 11, 2022 4:58 pmtheir reactions are mainly about how Goku sounds weird with male voice actors.
It's funny some Japanese people think that considering the fact a lot of western fans feel the exact opposite when it comes to Nozawa's Goku.
Alruneia wrote: Wed Jan 12, 2022 2:07 pmit would be kinda strange if absolutely nobody in Japan liked the Faulconer score at least in a vacuum (so liking the songs themselves, ignoring their usage and placement in the show).
Even in the event Japanese fans were asked about the English dub it is likely those who have seen it or heard its various replacement scores (or even given it enough of their time, because as kei has said for a lot of fans even within that niche they tend to only hear clips comparing international dubs, not the entire Funimation dub with it) would only make up a small sample size that doesn't represent Japanese fans as a whole. And yes there is a difference between liking a score and liking its placement or usage more generally. You will find plenty of Kikuchi loyalists that don't like how his score is used in Kai (I'm fine with it, but I'm in the minority). The same is true for Faulconer, although rather than being limited many fans (myself included) think the score is good, just overused and distracting especially in moments where silence benefits the scenes.
Do you have any info about international non-English broadcasts about the Dragon Ball anime or manga translations/editions? Please message me. Researching for a future book with Dragon Ball scholar Derek Padula :thumbup:

User avatar
Super Sonic
Born 'n Bred Here
Posts: 5171
Joined: Tue Feb 03, 2004 4:45 pm

Re: What does the Japanese fandom think of the West’s version of Dragon Ball?

Post by Super Sonic » Wed Jan 12, 2022 10:26 pm

While I'm guessing it's before kei17's generation, I'm now wondering what some guys in Japan would have reacted to "Battle of the Planets" which did more changes that what DB did stateside. Picturing someone wondering where the robot came from and what happened to Jinpei.

Vijay
Advanced Regular
Posts: 1423
Joined: Fri Sep 06, 2013 9:48 am

Re: What does the Japanese fandom think of the West’s version of Dragon Ball?

Post by Vijay » Thu Jan 13, 2022 4:33 am

Majin Buu wrote: Tue Jan 11, 2022 3:20 pm
Vijay wrote: Tue Jan 11, 2022 3:00 pm As most japanese score in dbgt & dbs were pretty jarring/weird imo due to wrong placing & unexciting score in general...even the battle theme is so-so. Guess its due to change in composer to Akihito Tokunaga in dbgt
Can't speak to Super, but definitely agree for GT. I think Tokunaga's score is good enough, but it needed more tracks since what was there started to get repetitive after a while, which wouldn't have been an issue if it was as good as Kikuchi's work.
I think Mr. Shunsuke Kikuchi captured the essence of DragonBall spirit. Should I say Sir was a tensai/genius as even his work in Dr. Slump was so endearing. He must've got this Godly talent to capture the nature of the show/scenes/episodes & the scores he provides essentially becomes the very soul of the anime he works on.

And this was early 80's/early 90's (Dr. Slump, DB, DBZ) & Sir"s output can range frm being cutely innocent to comedic & in DBZ...every fabric of epicness with those beautiful orchestral compositions...

Compared to that, I think Akihito Tokunaga was given a template as to how dbgt wud pan-out. As an adventurous show into outerspace...so some of his early soundtracks was just that...but thats abt it. I knw he's a great guitarist, but due respect I felt dude fits for shojo more than shounen. And pretty...very2 limited battle themes/scores that impresses that could reach even HALF or 1/4 of Shunsuke Kikuchi's work frm DB & DBZ

User avatar
Majin Buu
Advanced Regular
Posts: 1105
Joined: Sat Jul 23, 2005 2:23 pm

Re: What does the Japanese fandom think of the West’s version of Dragon Ball?

Post by Majin Buu » Thu Jan 13, 2022 10:26 am

Vijay wrote: Thu Jan 13, 2022 4:33 am I think Mr. Shunsuke Kikuchi captured the essence of DragonBall spirit. Should I say Sir was a tensai/genius as even his work in Dr. Slump was so endearing. He must've got this Godly talent to capture the nature of the show/scenes/episodes & the scores he provides essentially becomes the very soul of the anime he works on.
And this was early 80's/early 90's (Dr. Slump, DB, DBZ) & Sir"s output can range frm being cutely innocent to comedic & in DBZ...every fabric of epicness with those beautiful orchestral compositions...
Couldn't agree more. A few years ago I started seeking out his non-Dragon Ball anime work and he was very much an expert at musically representing the shows he worked on. Detractors like to say his music all sounds the same, but that's ignoring the huge emotional range his work had in spades (Dragon Ball/Z alone is a testament to that). He had the reputation of being a good luck charm for shows in Japan for a reason.
Compared to that, I think Akihito Tokunaga was given a template as to how dbgt wud pan-out. As an adventurous show into outerspace...so some of his early soundtracks was just that...but thats abt it. I knw he's a great guitarist, but due respect I felt dude fits for shojo more than shounen. And pretty...very2 limited battle themes/scores that impresses that could reach even HALF or 1/4 of Shunsuke Kikuchi's work frm DB & DBZ
Now that you mention it, I could totally see GT's score seamlessly fitting into a shojo-style magical girl anime.

The more ethereal sounding tracks of that score are the strongest IMO, which makes sense if he was strictly composing with space adventures in mind; but yeah, he lacked Kikuchi's range for sure.

DragonBallFoodie
Advanced Regular
Posts: 1371
Joined: Tue Jun 28, 2016 5:12 pm
Location: Zambia, Southern Africa

Re: What does the Japanese fandom think of the West’s version of Dragon Ball?

Post by DragonBallFoodie » Sun Jan 16, 2022 5:43 pm

So the Western fans like the Japanese version, but the Japanese like the Western version somewhat less. Sounds fair I guess.
"Don't take pleasure in destruction!" / "I will not let you destroy my world!"
A true hero goes beyond not the limits of power, but the limits that divide countries and people.

User avatar
Super Sonic
Born 'n Bred Here
Posts: 5171
Joined: Tue Feb 03, 2004 4:45 pm

Re: What does the Japanese fandom think of the West’s version of Dragon Ball?

Post by Super Sonic » Mon Jan 17, 2022 9:27 pm

Well, also remember unlike Westerners with anime, there is no dub/sub debate in Japan regarding Western cartoons. So that could be a factor in things.

User avatar
Aim
Banned
Posts: 761
Joined: Mon Feb 17, 2020 8:06 am
Contact:

Re: What does the Japanese fandom think of the West’s version of Dragon Ball?

Post by Aim » Wed Jan 26, 2022 1:38 am

Vijay wrote: Tue Jan 11, 2022 3:00 pm
Aim wrote: Tue Jan 11, 2022 7:19 am
Vijay wrote: Tue Jan 11, 2022 12:57 am

I'm Japanese fan of the show. I always feel Jap version vastly outclasses western/Funimation its hilarious to even draw a comparison.

Og DB, DBZ dub in particular in hilarious. While there were significant improvement over the years with dbgt, kai, super, bog, rof, super...u get it...that doesnt excuse the fact their voice casts, pool of talent & respect towards thr character & source material (name changes/dialogue & line alterations/characterizations) by West/Funi is supposed to be lapped or appreciated by Jp fans

I kinda enjoy 1% of entire westernized version for various reasons included (1 or 2 musical scores/bgm & voices thats abt it)
Do you think the English scores outmatch the Japanese in anyway?

I agree with the treatment Dragon Ball has gotten. Unfortunately there’s a monopoly on dubbing basically. No variation.
Suprisingly yes. Few dbgt scores esp in Baby, Super 17 & Shadow Dragon Saga had some notable if not superior scores compared to japanese version with apt placing

I dont remember the score names, but Episode 22 frm dbgt had great score & outclasses its japanese counterpart durin the entire Baby's revival & action sequence

Likewise in Episode 59, Goku KHH + Dragon Fistin Omega, or Veggie & Goku power-up as SSJ4 to Omega..those sequences had amazing Funi score outclassin its japanese counterpart

But it applies only for dbgt & super. As most japanese score in dbgt & dbs were pretty jarring/weird imo due to wrong placing & unexciting score in general...even the battle theme is so-so. Guess its due to change in composer to Akihito Tokunaga in dbgt

But in og DB & DBZ, Shunsuku Kikuchi was Emperor👑 his scores reign supreme till date
I see. When Japanese fans hear the voice cast speak, particularly Kuririn and Goku, do they recognize those voices as female, or male? Like, is it considered weird by some that a woman is playing a character like Son Goku? With the voice of Gohan and Goten, I’ve noticed myself I can tell them apart without seeing them, just by hearing them, can Japanese people do this as well?

Just something that’s interesting, because most western fans hate that Goku sounds the way he does in Japanese.

Vijay
Advanced Regular
Posts: 1423
Joined: Fri Sep 06, 2013 9:48 am

Re: What does the Japanese fandom think of the West’s version of Dragon Ball?

Post by Vijay » Wed Jan 26, 2022 3:09 am

Aim wrote: Wed Jan 26, 2022 1:38 am
Vijay wrote: Tue Jan 11, 2022 3:00 pm
Aim wrote: Tue Jan 11, 2022 7:19 am

Do you think the English scores outmatch the Japanese in anyway?

I agree with the treatment Dragon Ball has gotten. Unfortunately there’s a monopoly on dubbing basically. No variation.
Suprisingly yes. Few dbgt scores esp in Baby, Super 17 & Shadow Dragon Saga had some notable if not superior scores compared to japanese version with apt placing

I dont remember the score names, but Episode 22 frm dbgt had great score & outclasses its japanese counterpart durin the entire Baby's revival & action sequence

Likewise in Episode 59, Goku KHH + Dragon Fistin Omega, or Veggie & Goku power-up as SSJ4 to Omega..those sequences had amazing Funi score outclassin its japanese counterpart

But it applies only for dbgt & super. As most japanese score in dbgt & dbs were pretty jarring/weird imo due to wrong placing & unexciting score in general...even the battle theme is so-so. Guess its due to change in composer to Akihito Tokunaga in dbgt

But in og DB & DBZ, Shunsuku Kikuchi was Emperor👑 his scores reign supreme till date
I see. When Japanese fans hear the voice cast speak, particularly Kuririn and Goku, do they recognize those voices as female, or male? Like, is it considered weird by some that a woman is playing a character like Son Goku? With the voice of Gohan and Goten, I’ve noticed myself I can tell them apart without seeing them, just by hearing them, can Japanese people do this as well?

Just something that’s interesting, because most western fans hate that Goku sounds the way he does in Japanese.
Just to clarify, I'm Msian/Singaporean. Just a fan of japanese version as I've watched it for more than decade. Seems to be some misunderstandin goin om here...Unlike Kei, I'm not a Japanese fan who stayed in Japan etc.

That bein said, I absolutely adore how Nozawa-san does impeccable job as Goku, Gohan, Goten esp when those characters interact among each other.

Post Reply