Nozawa and the nuances of acting being lost on the new generation of Seiyuu

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Nozawa and the nuances of acting being lost on the new generation of Seiyuu

Post by Cure Dragon 255 » Fri Jan 28, 2022 1:12 pm

Nozawa has made the comment that lately the new crop of Japanese Voice Actors arent really trained or inspired by naturalistic methods of acting but rather imitate Anime acting, creating an imitation of an imitation.

How do you feel about this?
Marz wrote: ↑Wed Jul 21, 2021 11:27 pm "Well, the chapter was good, the story was good and so were the fights. But a new transformation, in Dragon Ball? And one that's ugly? This is where we draw the line!!! Jump the Shark moment!!"

This forum is so over-dramatic that it's not even funny.
90sDBZ wrote: ↑Mon Jul 01, 2019 2:44 pm19 years ago I was rushing home from school to watch DBZ on Cartoon Network, and today I've rushed home from work to watch DBS on Pop. I guess it's true the more things change the more they stay the same. :lol:

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Re: Nozawa and the nuances of acting being lost on the new generation of Seiyuu

Post by JulieYBM » Fri Jan 28, 2022 1:18 pm

I feel like she doesn't care if she's divisive so I don't care to listen to her opinion on the subject.
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Re: Nozawa and the nuances of acting being lost on the new generation of Seiyuu

Post by WittyUsername » Fri Jan 28, 2022 1:21 pm

Just to clarify, is she saying that the newer seiyuu these days are just imitating the older veterans?

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Re: Nozawa and the nuances of acting being lost on the new generation of Seiyuu

Post by Yuji » Fri Jan 28, 2022 1:30 pm

WittyUsername wrote: ↑Fri Jan 28, 2022 1:21 pm Just to clarify, is she saying that the newer seiyuu these days are just imitating the older veterans?
I assume she's saying that voice actors try to fit into a general role or stereotype of what an anime character should sound like, instead of trying to sound like an authentic and real person.

She's right, by the way, but that's just the nature of any new medium, they start to consolidate expectations and everything that follows has to meet them. Nozawa is old enough to have been around once anime voice acting was in its infancy and there were no expectations of what "anime voice acting" is.

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Re: Nozawa and the nuances of acting being lost on the new generation of Seiyuu

Post by Cure Dragon 255 » Fri Jan 28, 2022 1:38 pm

JulieYBM wrote: ↑Fri Jan 28, 2022 1:18 pm I feel like she doesn't care if she's divisive so I don't care to listen to her opinion on the subject.
What? Why cant that just be her honest assesment?
Marz wrote: ↑Wed Jul 21, 2021 11:27 pm "Well, the chapter was good, the story was good and so were the fights. But a new transformation, in Dragon Ball? And one that's ugly? This is where we draw the line!!! Jump the Shark moment!!"

This forum is so over-dramatic that it's not even funny.
90sDBZ wrote: ↑Mon Jul 01, 2019 2:44 pm19 years ago I was rushing home from school to watch DBZ on Cartoon Network, and today I've rushed home from work to watch DBS on Pop. I guess it's true the more things change the more they stay the same. :lol:

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Re: Nozawa and the nuances of acting being lost on the new generation of Seiyuu

Post by PurestEvil » Fri Jan 28, 2022 1:40 pm

Interesting topic, though I wish there was a second professional opinion
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Re: Nozawa and the nuances of acting being lost on the new generation of Seiyuu

Post by Soppa Saia People » Fri Jan 28, 2022 1:43 pm

PurestEvil wrote: ↑Fri Jan 28, 2022 1:40 pm Interesting topic, though I wish there was a second professional opinion
this is from a few years ago, but megumi hayashibara had this really open interview from a few years ago, that i find really interesting.
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Re: Nozawa and the nuances of acting being lost on the new generation of Seiyuu

Post by VegettoEX » Fri Jan 28, 2022 1:46 pm

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Re: Nozawa and the nuances of acting being lost on the new generation of Seiyuu

Post by JulieYBM » Fri Jan 28, 2022 1:53 pm

Cure Dragon 255 wrote: ↑Fri Jan 28, 2022 1:38 pm
JulieYBM wrote: ↑Fri Jan 28, 2022 1:18 pm I feel like she doesn't care if she's divisive so I don't care to listen to her opinion on the subject.
What? Why cant that just be her honest assesment?
Because, like...who cares? I have my own opinions on the subject and I don't really care about what she says since:

1. She's just another one of my fellow adults.
2. She's offering nothing of substance.

If Nozawa Masako made an account on Kanzenshuu and posted "Kids these days don't know how to act!" or what-the-fuck-ever Mike would be like "Uh, okay, what does that mean? Who? What where?"

So here I am going "Girl, are you even fucking watching cartoons? No? Then fuck off" because I know she isn't out here saying that shit about all the good anime being produced like the various titles at Kyouto Animation or SSSS.Gridman with it's absolutely stellar sound direction. I'll die on a fucking hill that Ueda Reina's performance in SSSS.Gridman is just as good if not better than, say, anything Nozawa has ever done. And you know what? That's fair! Because nobody has the time to watch that much goddamned cartoons.

Girl's coming out here saying she's selling shit from Tiffany1 when she's clearly just selling shit from those little shitty American gaccha machines.

Nozawa wants to shit-talk and feel important but won't even call anyone out by name because she doesn't actually want to commit (I likely wouldn't want to shit on my co-workers, either!). She just wants to feel important, which is why she's trying to spin a yarn about apparently knowing every single young voice actor and their ideologies about acting. Well, whatever girl, but anyone who asks "What if she's full of shit?" as a simple litmus test can tell what you're doing.

Honestly kills any respect I could have for her because it really goes to show she didn't place that much thought behind her premise and then some news sites pick up the quotes and sensationalize them.

Rolling my eyes.gif

1Yes, I Googled this to make this weird analogy.
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Re: Nozawa and the nuances of acting being lost on the new generation of Seiyuu

Post by Cure Dragon 255 » Fri Jan 28, 2022 1:59 pm

Oh ok, I just objected to the whole "If she doesnt care about being divisive" because Feminist and Trans people also speak without caring of being divisive and we shouldnt dismiss anyone's concerns under that premise.
Marz wrote: ↑Wed Jul 21, 2021 11:27 pm "Well, the chapter was good, the story was good and so were the fights. But a new transformation, in Dragon Ball? And one that's ugly? This is where we draw the line!!! Jump the Shark moment!!"

This forum is so over-dramatic that it's not even funny.
90sDBZ wrote: ↑Mon Jul 01, 2019 2:44 pm19 years ago I was rushing home from school to watch DBZ on Cartoon Network, and today I've rushed home from work to watch DBS on Pop. I guess it's true the more things change the more they stay the same. :lol:

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Re: Nozawa and the nuances of acting being lost on the new generation of Seiyuu

Post by JulieYBM » Fri Jan 28, 2022 2:03 pm

Cure Dragon 255 wrote: ↑Fri Jan 28, 2022 1:59 pm Oh ok, I just objected to the whole "If she doesnt care about being divisive" because Feminist and Trans people also speak without caring of being divisive and we shouldnt dismiss anyone's concerns under that premise.
That's my fault for poor writing. I was blanking on how to phrase what I was actually trying to say. Yay for ADHD!

I mean, clearly I was myself literally just throwing caution to the wind and calling a super-well-known actress out myself. :lol: I'm trying to not sanctify older people or people in positions of authority. :lol:
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Re: Nozawa and the nuances of acting being lost on the new generation of Seiyuu

Post by Zephyr » Fri Jan 28, 2022 2:08 pm

JulieYBM wrote: ↑Fri Jan 28, 2022 1:53 pm1. She's just another one of my fellow adults.
Obviously it's fair to question what sort of sample she's taken in forming the statement, and in many respects, yeah, clearly she's just another person with an opinion; but she's not "just" some rando, she's actually in the field she's commenting on. While it doesn't place her on a pedestal or make her comments above criticism, it also doesn't count for nothing with regards to speaking on a craft in which she has experience.

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Re: Nozawa and the nuances of acting being lost on the new generation of Seiyuu

Post by JulieYBM » Fri Jan 28, 2022 2:22 pm

Zephyr wrote: ↑Fri Jan 28, 2022 2:08 pm
JulieYBM wrote: ↑Fri Jan 28, 2022 1:53 pm1. She's just another one of my fellow adults.
Obviously it's fair to question what sort of sample she's taken in forming the statement, and in many respects, yeah, clearly she's just another person with an opinion; but she's not "just" some rando, she's actually in the field she's commenting on. While it doesn't place her on a pedestal or make her comments above criticism, it also doesn't count for nothing with regards to speaking on a craft in which she has experience.
She definitely is a skilled actress and I don't make any claims that she is not. I do, however, call into question the idea that we should not question her on the subject and place that over not simply common sense but our own experiences. I think her ideas about acting are actually a useful tool that can and should always be kept in mind. What I find eye-roll-inducing was this idea that she is actually being legitimately damning of the industry, especially when said industry is not only filtered through the desires of sound directors, directors and producers but also mired in controversy with regards to pay.

Nozawa isn't that prolific anymore. Her experience is limited to a very small part of the industry and even within the small part of the industry I question whether she's actually qualified to be making statements about (nobody in particular, apparently!) all these kids who can't act or whatever.

Lord, this whole post I've just written sounds like an annoying broken record. I'm not going to spend forever re-writing it so I apologize to anyone who reads it.
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Re: Nozawa and the nuances of acting being lost on the new generation of Seiyuu

Post by Cure Dragon 255 » Fri Jan 28, 2022 2:28 pm

That was an awesome and well written post.
Marz wrote: ↑Wed Jul 21, 2021 11:27 pm "Well, the chapter was good, the story was good and so were the fights. But a new transformation, in Dragon Ball? And one that's ugly? This is where we draw the line!!! Jump the Shark moment!!"

This forum is so over-dramatic that it's not even funny.
90sDBZ wrote: ↑Mon Jul 01, 2019 2:44 pm19 years ago I was rushing home from school to watch DBZ on Cartoon Network, and today I've rushed home from work to watch DBS on Pop. I guess it's true the more things change the more they stay the same. :lol:

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Re: Nozawa and the nuances of acting being lost on the new generation of Seiyuu

Post by Anonymous Friend » Fri Jan 28, 2022 8:02 pm

JulieYBM wrote: ↑Fri Jan 28, 2022 2:22 pm
Zephyr wrote: ↑Fri Jan 28, 2022 2:08 pm
JulieYBM wrote: ↑Fri Jan 28, 2022 1:53 pm1. She's just another one of my fellow adults.
Obviously it's fair to question what sort of sample she's taken in forming the statement, and in many respects, yeah, clearly she's just another person with an opinion; but she's not "just" some rando, she's actually in the field she's commenting on. While it doesn't place her on a pedestal or make her comments above criticism, it also doesn't count for nothing with regards to speaking on a craft in which she has experience.
She definitely is a skilled actress and I don't make any claims that she is not. I do, however, call into question the idea that we should not question her on the subject and place that over not simply common sense but our own experiences. I think her ideas about acting are actually a useful tool that can and should always be kept in mind. What I find eye-roll-inducing was this idea that she is actually being legitimately damning of the industry, especially when said industry is not only filtered through the desires of sound directors, directors and producers but also mired in controversy with regards to pay.

Nozawa isn't that prolific anymore. Her experience is limited to a very small part of the industry and even within the small part of the industry I question whether she's actually qualified to be making statements about (nobody in particular, apparently!) all these kids who can't act or whatever.

Lord, this whole post I've just written sounds like an annoying broken record. I'm not going to spend forever re-writing it so I apologize to anyone who reads it.
There's plenty of times when someone mentions something that not such a revelation, but everyone realizes and understands under the surface, but is not being actively realized. Some of hand remark can spark further conversation which could cause a conscious effort for betterment or just flutter away to nothingness later on. And it shouldn't matter who says it. Everyone's voice should matter, right? Even a little bit.
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Re: Nozawa and the nuances of acting being lost on the new generation of Seiyuu

Post by LoganForkHands73 » Fri Jan 28, 2022 8:22 pm

I'd disagree with Nozawa and say that the studios are more at fault than the voice actors when it comes to imitations of imitations and so on. That was Miyazaki's point, which I agree with. The VAs are just being hired to play a role. If that role is Utterly Generic Harem Anime MC, a character archetype that pretty much has no grounding in reality anyway, that's exactly what they're gonna play. Can't blame 'em, a grind's a grind.

I will say though, I may ducttape my ears if I hear another 'unpredictable Japanese delinquent' performance where the VA rrrrrolls all his rrrrrrr's and laughs like a damn banshee to sound "insane and wacky". It used to be somewhat cool, now it's just horribly overplayed.

I'm almost glad to see Nozawa speak her mind and say something mildly controversial, even if I don't particularly agree. She usually seems like such a nice old lady who's enthusiastic about everything, so it's nice to know she does in fact have some #spicy opinions, lol. Once you reach a certain age, they just start flooding out.

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Re: Nozawa and the nuances of acting being lost on the new generation of Seiyuu

Post by Vijay » Sat Jan 29, 2022 8:15 am

I agree with Nozawa-san. She's been in anime industry way too long & if there's a change, she'd be the 1st to notice

Culmination of studio interference, voice director & seiyuu's approach towards the character seem to be responsible

Accidentally watched Harem series few days ago. Noticed the MC & girls voice acting in both series I watched to be exceedingly generic, uninspired & honestly flat. Like a copy or imitation of countless other bombastic/tsundere chracters.

Shounen (aot, hxh), shojo, seinen doesnt seem diff either. They're okay...but on a platonic level & you dont get the same subtlety or novelty factor from a show say 20-30 years ago. Simplest comparison would be DB/DBZ voice direction/acting with that of DBKai/DBS. The diff is astounding & we knw how both Kai & DBS were geared towards kids/young generation. But that's for another day.

I barely would've watched beyond 15 anime, but outta all of them almost none managed to impress me. And that's baffling. Coming across over 50+ characters & none leavin an everlasting impression...πŸ˜…Perhaps that's the missing connection here? The naturalistic/realistic approach?

Thats not to say I dont appreciate current-gen seiyuu works at all. They're just...plastic if I could use the word. Like animation styles today, the va reflects it. Peace☺️✨

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Re: Nozawa and the nuances of acting being lost on the new generation of Seiyuu

Post by Soppa Saia People » Sat Jan 29, 2022 10:43 am

weird to bring up hunter x hunter when talking about shows from 20 years ago, the madhouse adaption is over a decade old and the story started in 90s with a adaption there as well. though it's just very weird to me to make sweeping statements with TV and stuff, especially one that airs in a country that i don't live in and don't know a lot about, and when plenty of old 90s and 80s popular shows get forgotten or has no impact outside of japan.

anyway on the topic, i think some people put tol much stock into these type of things, nozawa is and was a great voice actor and her opinion obviously means more then mine does, but at the same time, like Julie said, she isn't that prolific and to be honest doesn't do a whole lot outside of dragon ball and there's a pretty big disconnect between her, the idol seiyuu boom of the 90s, and modern day idol seiyuu, and just general how voice acting is viewed and respected now. so, well it's cool to see her talk about it and her, and megumi hayashibara in that interview i linked, obviously make fair and valid points but with nozawa, i don't think its the most objective point of view.

it's not the same thing but it kinda reminds when old musicians (from any era) talk crap about music of thw day (whether it's like 70s punk, 90s hip hop, 90s alt, etc. etc.), yes their opinion means more then mine and often have good critiques but it's also just clear that you know they aren't in that same generation and more often then not, don't have the same passion as they did when they were young either just from burn out or general age. same when people get mad at creators for not understanding their own series, i'm sure at the time of creating them or when they were their most successful they knew what made it so good and were proud of it but talking about it for 20 years and no longer being in that creative mind set changes your view on it.
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Re: Nozawa and the nuances of acting being lost on the new generation of Seiyuu

Post by Tian » Sun Jan 30, 2022 1:03 am

Well, it's not like Mrs. Nozawa is the only one who said something like that.

Other veteran voice actors/actresses around the world have said similar stuff about the current situation of their voice acting industries in their respective countries.

Some of them have valid reasons like the acting "chemistry" being somewhat lost after the analogic-to-digital transition or that the voice direction role is no longer given to an experienced actor/actress but an audio engineer (which unfortunately happens a lot in my country nowadays...)

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Re: Nozawa and the nuances of acting being lost on the new generation of Seiyuu

Post by Aim » Mon Jan 31, 2022 9:50 am

JulieYBM wrote: ↑Fri Jan 28, 2022 1:18 pm I feel like she doesn't care if she's divisive so I don't care to listen to her opinion on the subject.
Is that a problem?

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