What Toriyama does that is hard to replicate?

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Wrigglything
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What Toriyama does that is hard to replicate?

Post by Wrigglything » Thu Aug 18, 2022 4:06 am

It's no secret that this forum and other parts of the fanbase have been mixed towards Toyotaro's work in the Super manga. I never particularly hated his work at all, I think his character drawings were very good, but the panel layouts and action shots, while serviceable and legible, do feel lacking somewhat compared to Toriyama who I feel is more dynamic and snappy with his content.
Heard some good thing from Dragon Garow Lee's work of the Yamcha reincarnation manga, though I haven't read much of it to reach a definitive opinion.
So I guess I'd like to know a few things. What do you think Toriyama has that other official DB Manga artists might not be as considerate about? Do you think that there is too much tendency to try to replicate Toriyama's artstyle without much of their own flair? Heck, any opinion on any mangaka in general, DB or no even, so long as it is not hostile but constructive, is appreciated.

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Re: What Toriyama does that is hard to replicate?

Post by Xeogran » Thu Aug 18, 2022 4:29 am

Wrigglything wrote: Thu Aug 18, 2022 4:06 am What do you think Toriyama has that other official DB Manga artists might not be as considerate about?
His casual laziness that somehow develops into great concepts is just pure Toriyama. Like how Super Saiyan was supposed to be black haired, but he didn't want to spend even more time inking it so he made the hair blond. Pure genius :lol:

Since it's his trait as a human, it just can't be replicated easily. I mean theoretically it can, but the other artist would need to have a similar character and way of thinking.

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Re: What Toriyama does that is hard to replicate?

Post by DBZAOTA482 » Thu Aug 18, 2022 9:07 am

Toriyama is a really humble guy. If you notice in interviews, he tends to sell himself short.

The original Dragon Ball manga is an accidental stroke of genius. I'm sure not even Shueisha expected DB to become one of the most popular and influential media franchises of all-time.
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Re: What Toriyama does that is hard to replicate?

Post by Zephyr » Thu Aug 18, 2022 10:22 am

I think his particular (weird and irreverent) sense of humor and his sense of comedic timing, along with the way they can subtly manifest even in more serious and dramatic moments, is hard for others to replicate. Specifically because that's wrapped up in his individual identity and personality. As a result of this, humor is baked into DB, even at its most dire. Guy got his start drawing funny comics, became a household name drawing funny comics, and began Dragon Ball as a funny comic. Its most serious stretch (basically the time when Kondo was his editor) grew organically out of that foundation.

Also, I'm not sure it's so much something that he 'does', per se, but he's a big fan of kung fu movies, and that really shows in the overall thrust and theme of DB's narrative. That is, of a kung fu story about cultivating strength. Contrast this with a guy who by his own admission only really reads Dragon Ball, My Hero Academia, and watches Marvel movies. Not the same sort of media diet that Toriyama had. So I guess "consuming certain types of works" is a thing that Toriyama does/did that isn't necessarily being replicated. In contrast to having the same personality and sense of humor as the guy, this one seems like it should be much easier to replicate.

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Re: What Toriyama does that is hard to replicate?

Post by Adamant » Thu Aug 18, 2022 10:45 am

DBZAOTA482 wrote: Thu Aug 18, 2022 9:07 am The original Dragon Ball manga is an accidental stroke of genius. I'm sure not even Shueisha expected DB to become one of the most popular and influential media franchises of all-time.
I think westerners in general are a bit unaware of how big Dr. Slump was. Toriyama wasn't this unknown nobody that suddenly set the world on fire with Dragonball, he was the creator of one of the biggest and most popular media franchises at the time BEFORE he started working on DB.
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Re: What Toriyama does that is hard to replicate?

Post by Lord Beerus » Thu Aug 18, 2022 11:09 am

Toriyama's ability to make a moment in the narrative impactful without ever having to go over the top with imagery or dialogue.

Toriyama has been a master at being able to create a poignant story and/or character beat without having the characters overexplaining themselves through exposition or using imagery telling the reader to be emotional. Any imagery is subtle and the dialogue remains punchy enough, without feeling overbearing in emotional manipulation.

Honestly, Toriyama's general restraint in indulging in the more glurge and overly sentimental aspects of storytelling that are so common in most shonen anime and manga is quite admirable if you ask me.

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Re: What Toriyama does that is hard to replicate?

Post by Kamiccolo9 » Thu Aug 18, 2022 11:37 am

I'm actually pretty critical of Toriyama's storytelling, and his art peaks fairly early on and never reaches those heights again, but what I'll give the man is that he has a talent for, of all things, panel composition. You are never lost reading Dragon Ball. Toriyama had an unparalleled ability to guide your eyes around a page.
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Re: What Toriyama does that is hard to replicate?

Post by Jord » Thu Aug 18, 2022 12:05 pm

Create a believable world with all kinds of cultures, people and animals. It's cool that in the original series we saw such a variety of people and locations. Anyone can just create random creatures or locations but to Toriyamas credit he made his whole world seem cohesive.

(Allthough that whole retcon with Animorphaline was a bit strange. I liked it better when the beast men where just antromorphic animals instead of drugged up humans.)

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Re: What Toriyama does that is hard to replicate?

Post by capsulecorp » Thu Aug 18, 2022 12:13 pm

Lord Beerus wrote: Thu Aug 18, 2022 11:09 am Honestly, Toriyama's general restraint in indulging in the more glurge and overly sentimental aspects of storytelling that are so common in most shonen anime and manga is quite admirable if you ask me.
I think this is a big part of it, at least for me. He is largely unsentimental, or at least not schlocky and corny like Naruto or One Piece or some of the worst parts of Super.

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Re: What Toriyama does that is hard to replicate?

Post by Majin Buu » Thu Aug 18, 2022 12:53 pm

DBZAOTA482 wrote: Thu Aug 18, 2022 9:07 am Toriyama is a really humble guy. If you notice in interviews, he tends to sell himself short.
Perhaps, though I personally find it refreshing that he has no pretentions about his work and doesn't take Dragon Ball all that seriously himself.

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