Dragonball Movie Update! What is UP with this?

[SSj_Rambo]

Ahhh, Roshi with sunglasses and Goku with emotion, just how it should be.

[Raz]

Just something to throw out there, what if Goku were raised by his grandpa to be a martial artist and after he was killed his adventures lead Goku on an adventure with Bulma.

After their first adventure it seemed like everything was over, maybe even skipping over Pilaf or the RRA for times sake.

After this, Goku. Mr Chipper Little Guy enrolls in school out of necessity longing for his boyhood adventures to occur.

To contrast this sort of origin story you could fastforward Goku's adult life four years where he had had Gohan and lived with Chi Chi in serenity. That gap of time didn't identify with Goku's behavior either but was a springboard for the events with Goku's friends to get to know a new character (Gohan) and to introduce Goku's past and Raditz, not to mention offering reason as to why these things occured that catapulted into long time rival and enemy Vegeta.

The point of this is, like one of the forum members have said is we are creating a very negative opinion of Goku in rescent pages solely on a dreadful looking movie poster and 50 words asto how the story begins.

We all have seemed to agree with the Director and Producer and even Chatwins own outlook on the role. Considering he doesn't contrast it with the anime Goku he may not have known much about the series before starting and was spot on with his take on our hero.

I don't feel you can walk into this film without expecting an element of 'cheese' some of what makes Dragon Ball is the 'cheese.'

As far as the movie poster goes I don't care for it either, but you know if Chatwin is meeting all of the criteria for an excellent Goku with the exception of his look I would still be critical at this point because we know nothing of any great substance with regards to the film.

I really think we do need to wait for a trailer before jumping to conclusions and running with them. Or at least a descent synopsis.

Some people may have already figured out I dig the Transformers big time, when the film came out last year just a few months before its arrival you had fan complaints being hollared at studios including death threats to Michael Bay's office about how he is going to destroy the film and how he had better not show up at the release of the film.

When the fans saw Megatron's head, and Prime's blue truck with flames they reacted like religious fanatics crying blasphemy.

This sort of behavior continued over each and every little detailed offered by the studios and long running gags were shown insulting Michael Bay. When the movie finally came out, there were its detractors, but by and large even people who would later criticize the movie would begrudgingly admit to enjoying it all the way through. You can find those sorts of reviews everywhere.

My point is that the film may look terrible in our eyes right now, but we have more going for this film than transformers fans had walking into their own film. We have a kick ass fight choreographer and an awesome director. We really need to calm down. If we don't that's fine but we will be wasting a great deal of energy unecessarily.

[Victator Supreme]

That black suit, if it's real, is likely just a base coat. Ala the the rubber that Rebecca Romijn wore as Mystique. Other layers may be added, painting will be done, etc. It just looks like it's there for musculature definition and body form.

EDIT:
The tone of my earlier post stems from coming in to see what news has come up that's got everyone talking again and finding pages of people bitching about trivial crap that doesn't even matter at all.

By changing his most critical character point, going from bliss happiness to unsettling awareness, and how he took it in such admirable strides, they are changing him into something else.

This, right here, is part of the point I (and Kaboom) have been trying to drive into people's heads for a while now.

ALL that we know is that Goku is now in the city. Based on blurbs we've gotten he apparently still has the EXACT same personality as ever. Only his current setting has changed. Hell, we don't even know how long he's BEEN in the city. He may have just gotten there a few months or so ago, or even a couple of years, and still be like a fish out of water.

The point is we don't know. We don't know. We have maybe 50 words on Goku and all anyone can see is "city" and "Highschool". Just because he's goes to school does not mean that he's Peter Parker or Clark Kent. What, if Super Man moved into the mountains and learned martial arts would he be Goku? No. He'd be Superman living in the mountains and doing martial arts.

If it was the first fucking live action Superman movie ever. Then yeah that would be fucking up Superman. But its pretty clear you do not have the first idea what you are talking about.

Putting Goku into any kind of high school enviorment is getting him wrong. This is pretty basic shit. Saying well "He was 18 in the comic." Is just ridiculous. The argument fails on every basic leval. But you know what the difference is. At that point we had already seen Goku develop as a character. Which even then. He was never put into a high school enviorment. But you know maybe I'm wrong. Maybe Bulma finds him in the moutains, he meets Roshi and Krillan and goes to high school later. Maybe the movie is 5 hours long. But you know what I seriously doubt it. I bet it starts out in high school, and resembles Dragonball. In the sense Thor resembles Pamela Anderson if you squint real hard.

[JulieYBM]

Well, with Transformer's there are multiple toys and designs. The point is moot that the TFs looked different as they are always changing and HASBRO wanted a über realistic look, as far as I have heard.

[Raz]

Transformers from the beginning ran uder the concept of 'G1 Inspired' so they weren't dealing with any of the other series. If you watch it versus the five series and their subseries then G1 is really the only one it shares similarities with.

Hasbro also was pushing for more G1-esque looks for the characters but Bay convinced them to allow him to do an alien approach. In the end the only stipulations they had for Optimus Prime was that he have a red chest, be a truck and have a transformation they could manipulate for toy design.

Transformers is the best comparison you will find to the Dragon Ball series in terms of transition to film. At least in rescent years.

They are both anime based, both have huge followings, both have gone through numerous treatments; comparing OCEAN, FUNi and the various releases versus the number of series in Transformers, Both of them come from the 80's both of them have hip designers involved in the theatrical productions.

Chances are Dragon Ball will not be the Dragon Ball we know anymore than the Trasformers film was true to its original.

The Transformers curbed a great deal of fan output by carrying a great number of familiar lines and character names. Having Peter Cullen as the voice of Optimus Prime was a nice touch as well. The film plotline ws only slightly more inspired than toy trucks from outerspace huffing and puffing through numerous fight scenes but it worked for the audience.

I don't expect Dragon Ball will cover any new ground in terms of special effects but if Shaolin Soccer is any indication of what we are in for then a lot of tonue in cheek humor and outstanding fight scenes will be the main course.

I think you may be more comfortable comparing Dragon Ball the film to Dragon Ball Z movies rather than the series itself.When they make this film I doubt we will be looking at a one run film; it is very likely this will be intended for a series. Every new comic adventure that has been moved into film I can think of with the exception of Ghost Risder as of late is transitioning into lengthy trilogies. Even Wolverine is expected to add another number under the belt of the X Men.

[JulieYBM]

Transformers more or less was a 'pilot' episode of a series. You might have to--gasp--do a little thinking about it but it makes sense. We're introduced to the plot and TF world through a teen. The Decipticons make their moves--disabling human technology, finding the location of Megatron and the All Spark--by Bumblebee makes first contact with humanity and befriends the holder to the map to the All Spark. The government tracks down the alien life forms by acquiring the boy they make first contact with and capture another of the alien life forms. Meanwhile both brigades of TFs track down the All Spark and Megatron and make a race to get the cube far enough behind the 'frontline' that it can be relocated so as to prevent the building of another Decepticon army. This is actually a very pivitol point in the Transformers war because centuries of war can finally be put to and end (the existence of further TFs is unknown) with only a few spare soldiers remaining. Things do not quite go as planned, the cube is constantly in the middle of the battle and an entire city block is turned into a warzone but with their leader crushed and Starscream too much of a coward to fight on his own the [known] Decepticons are pretty much non-existant and the war is over, espicially with no cube to restore life to Cybertron or create new TFs.

Now that I am completely off topic, I'll quit here.

[Xyex]

If it was the first fucking live action Superman movie ever. Then yeah that would be fucking up Superman.

Wow, really? Having "When the movie starts Superman is in the woods alone doing martial arts training" would completely alter his character? Even though nothing else at all is said about him? Including no mentions as to WHY he's in the woods alone doing martial arts training? Huh. And here I thought characters had more depth than where we find them at the start of a movie.

But its pretty clear you do not have the first idea what you are talking about.

I know more than you do, obviously. If hundreds of fanfic writers can convincingly set Goku somewhere other than the mountains and still leave him exactly the same person despite the background change I think a couple of professionals can do it as well.

Hell, I've got a fic where Goku's essentially from Otherworld, spent the first 6 years of his life in a crowded orphanage in a big city, got adopted by Gohan and lived with him and Krillin in the mountains for 12 years, then moved to live with Roshi in the city and started going to highschool. And guess what? He's still the same Goku in personality that we see at the end of DB and start of DBZ.

Putting Goku into any kind of high school enviorment is getting him wrong.

Putting him into a highschool enviroment is adapting the location. The location IS NOT THE FUCKING CHARACTER.

At that point we had already seen Goku develop as a character.

Fuck, we're starting with fucking PICCOLO. Of course we're going to skip over some of the earlier development points. Of course we're going to start with a less naive Goku than we had at the start of the manga. Of course he's going to have grown some before we first see him in the movie.

Does that mean he can't have the same fucking personality? No, it doesn't. Just because they're changing a backdrop and altering some of his upbrining doesn't mean that he wont still be recognizable as Goku.

You'd have grounds for your arguement if we'd actually SEEN something so far that supported it. But we've not seen any trailers yet to show us that he acts differently. Once we see him acting in someway that totally goes against Goku then ok, I'll agree with you, they screwed him up. But until then there's just not enough information to make a call EITHER WAY.

EDIT
Just re-read my post and I think, maybe, I should stay out of this thread for a while. Oi. x.x

Oh, and one last thing:

They are both anime based,

Transformers is not an anime.

[Onikage725]

This, right here, is part of the point I (and Kaboom) have been trying to drive into people's heads for a while now.

Maybe noone (on either side) needs to be trying to drive anything into anyone's head.

[djkalteraphine]

If it was the first fucking live action Superman movie ever. Then yeah that would be fucking up Superman.

Wow, really? Having "When the movie starts Superman is in the woods alone doing martial arts training" would completely alter his character? Even though nothing else at all is said about him? Including no mentions as to WHY he's in the woods alone doing martial arts training? Huh. And here I thought characters had more depth than where we find them at the start of a movie.

But its pretty clear you do not have the first idea what you are talking about.

I know more than you do, obviously. If hundreds of fanfic writers can convincingly set Goku somewhere other than the mountains and still leave him exactly the same person despite the background change I think a couple of professionals can do it as well.

Hell, I've got a fic where Goku's essentially from Otherworld, spent the first 6 years of his life in a crowded orphanage in a big city, got adopted by Gohan and lived with him and Krillin in the mountains for 12 years, then moved to live with Roshi in the city and started going to highschool. And guess what? He's still the same Goku in personality that we see at the end of DB and start of DBZ.

Putting Goku into any kind of high school enviorment is getting him wrong.

Putting him into a highschool enviroment is adapting the location. The location IS NOT THE FUCKING CHARACTER.

Alright pal, look. First off, and I've said this to you a lot lately, please calm down and keep this civil.

Secondly, you are woefully unaware of how the conscience mind develops. If you take a person and change the first 18 years of their life, including very key, personality shaping events, you are going to be left with a profoundly different person.

Socially awkward is not the same as socially inept.

Son Goku's true essence from the manga has everything to do with how he got there. And completely disregarding it leaves you with an entirely new person, with different values, different experiences.

[Captain Awesome]

Maybe noone (on either side) needs to be trying to drive anything into anyone's head.

Agreed, it seems that the more "positive" members are the ones being the most aggressive.

[Rocketman]

Every new comic adventure that has been moved into film I can think of with the exception of Ghost Risder as of late is transitioning into lengthy trilogies.

I heard they were looking into making a sequel, actually. I look forward to it, as I'm one of those weirdos who liked Ghost Rider.

[JulieYBM]

Yeah, Ghost Rider was pretty good.

As for a sequel to this film...well, I suppose the advance in technologies would make for some pretty good eye-candy...

[Kendamu]

Maybe noone (on either side) needs to be trying to drive anything into anyone's head.

Agreed, it seems that the more "positive" members are the ones being the most aggressive.

Ditto. I'm tried of having to be an apologist for expressing a negative opinion on a discussion forum. Its not like I'm telling other people that they're not allowed to have a positive opinion. I just wanna express what I think as well and it shouldn't be looked at as some sort of offense.

[djkalteraphine]

Yeah, Ghost Rider was pretty good.

As for a sequel to this film...well, I suppose the advance in technologies would make for some pretty good eye-candy...

I liked Ghost Rider, but I like anything with Sam Elliot or Eva Mendes.

Maybe noone (on either side) needs to be trying to drive anything into anyone's head.

Agreed, it seems that the more "positive" members are the ones being the most aggressive.

Ditto. I'm tried of having to be an apologist for expressing a negative opinion on a discussion forum. Its not like I'm telling other people that they're not allowed to have a positive opinion. I just wanna express what I think as well and it shouldn't be looked at as some sort of offense.

Thanks, Kendamu. That's exactly how I feel.

[Xyex]

Alright pal, look. First off, and I've said this to you a lot lately, please calm down and keep this civil.

Yes, I noticed this after I re-read my post. It just annoys me to no end to see so many pages about people complain about things that either don't matter (the poster) or could end up being beyond trival (Goku in highschool).

Secondly, you are woefully unaware of how the conscience mind develops. If you take a person and change the first 18 years of their life, including very key, personality shaping events, you are going to be left with a profoundly different person.

I'm well aware of how the mind develops. This is why I know that even two polar opposite background can produce people with identicle personalities and why two identicle backgrounds can produce people with completely different personalities. There's no one road to any outcome.

Besides, this is s Hollywood action flick, when have they ever bothered with psychology?

I heard they were looking into making a sequel, actually. I look forward to it, as I'm one of those weirdos who liked Ghost Rider.

I'd heard so many bad reviews of it I was expecting something more akin to Daredevil but the movie was awesome. Nice to hear they're doing a sequel.

Ditto. I'm tried of having to be an apologist for expressing a negative opinion on a discussion forum. Its not like I'm telling other people that they're not allowed to have a positive opinion. I just wanna express what I think as well and it shouldn't be looked at as some sort of offense.

I don't know about others but I have no problems with people not liking things they're hearing about the movie. Hell, there's things I'm not overly fond of myself. The issue comes about when people start to whine (and let's not kid ourselves, several pages about Chatwin's expression on a very early poster is whining) about things that are trivial (the poster) or that we don't even know yet (movie Goku being nothing like his manga counterpart).

[Raki]

I won't judge, rip, or praise this film until I see it.

[djkalteraphine]

Alright pal, look. First off, and I've said this to you a lot lately, please calm down and keep this civil.

Yes, I noticed this after I re-read my post. It just annoys me to no end to see so many pages about people complain about things that either don't matter (the poster) or could end up being beyond trival (Goku in highschool).

Again, it doesn't matter to you. Obviously it matters to us, or otherwise we wouldn't be discussing them. And besides that, this is a forum for discussing things. Like this movie. We're being asked our opinion on something and we're giving it. It isn't that complicated.

Secondly, you are woefully unaware of how the conscience mind develops. If you take a person and change the first 18 years of their life, including very key, personality shaping events, you are going to be left with a profoundly different person.

I'm well aware of how the mind develops. This is why I know that even two polar opposite background can produce people with identicle personalities and why two identicle backgrounds can produce people with completely different personalities. There's no one road to any outcome.

Then we have extremely different views of nature vs. nurture, owing to the fact that there are no identical personalities, and changing every event in a person's life, save how they were "born" (or in Goku's case, dropped on his head) makes them a different person.

I'm not saying it has to be completely the same, word for word. That's not how the medium works. Of course a movie is supposed to be a reinterpretation. But changing such fundamental things as Goku being isolated from the outside world for 12 years, and never stopping to take so much as a breath between adventures for another 6, takes the character to a point of where he can't possibly be the same character anymore.

Besides, this is s Hollywood action flick, when have they ever bothered with psychology?

Batman Begins ring any bells? And if you can relate and be pleased with Dragon Ball being an "action flick", quite plainly and simply, then once again, our views on Dragon Ball are too opposing to make this argument ever cease.

[Raz]

Please excuse my Ghost Rider spelling error from earlier on in this discussion.

Actually off-topic/on-topic, Transformers is an anime. It isn't the style we are most accustomed to in anime but is anime. There are four more seasons of sorts of Transformers originating in Japan. All of the animation is done in Japan with the exception of season 3 having been done in Korea. What may confuse you, (and admittedly me at one time,) was that initially it was designed for an american audience. Even the robots we know from the original transformers line is a hodge podge of various toylines; gunrobos, diaclone and dinorobos included.

The film as you said attempted to take it in a different direction but the intent from the beginning was to be 'G1 inspired.' You are right they did take it in a different direction, I am also right and more informed that they intended the series of films to adapt the original G1 series into a more refined and live action oriented presentation.

Back on the subject at hand, it is true you cannot discount Goku's past and merely rebuild it, but you can add to a background that has many gaps while still staying true to the story. All we know is that he is in school, we don't know for how long or under what conditions caused him to enroll. Even still, I have always felt and perhaps I am wrong, the fundamental charm to Goku is that no matter what he has been through or where he has gone he is always the same person. Yes he grew up, but he is still the hungry happy child with a penchant for fighting and learning that he always had even in his adult years.

I am not saying that your concerns are not valid, what I am saying is that assuming Goku is an entirely different person because of his mere presence in high school doesn't sound like a very good argument.

Would Super Man still be Super Man if he trained in martial arts in the forest and was raised by his grand father? Probably not, but if Clark Kent moved to Seattle and took up work as a politician he could still theoretically be the same person.

Goku wasn't a dullard, he was more carefree and driven by his passion certainly. Goku showed extraordinary promise throughout the series in his ability to adapt and learn. Was this because his nature was to hate school? If anything he has shown disinterest in Gohan's school work, not an ambivalence towards it. Goku wouldn't have to be an honor student to go to school.

Depending on how they weave this element into the storyline will determine how well they hold to Goku's character, not by the premise itself.

It's funny we have managed to argue out three pages of insults between various members without actually discussing these things. Everyone can have their own opinions, any one involved in this discussion could very well be right; I am witholding my judgement until the release. I can only speculate and criticize on various points, I would hope if I were totally out of line or making snap judgements that someone would point out my error.

[Kendamu]

Ditto. I'm tried of having to be an apologist for expressing a negative opinion on a discussion forum. Its not like I'm telling other people that they're not allowed to have a positive opinion. I just wanna express what I think as well and it shouldn't be looked at as some sort of offense.

I don't know about others but I have no problems with people not liking things they're hearing about the movie. Hell, there's things I'm not overly fond of myself. The issue comes about when people start to whine (and let's not kid ourselves, several pages about Chatwin's expression on a very early poster is whining) about things that are trivial (the poster) or that we don't even know yet (movie Goku being nothing like his manga counterpart).

When there's not much t' go on, what else're we gonna talk about? Its not like th' movie's come out yet.

[Xyex]

But changing such fundamental things as Goku being isolated from the outside world for 12 years,

And again we go to assumption. We know that Goku is in the city and attending Highschool. That's all. It was never said that he's been living in the city and going to school for his entire life. How do you know he didn't live in the mountains with Gohan until he was 12? Until he was 15? Until 5 days before the movie starts? That's my point, we don't know enough about this movie yet to make any kind of judgement calls on what kind of portrayal Goku will be getting.

Sure, he doesn't seem to have any of the Pilaf or RRA experiences in the movie. But that doesn't mean the lessons learned through contact with them couldn't have been learned some other way in his life time effectively producing a very similar personality to what we have in the manga.

Batman Begins ring any bells?

Meh, 1 out of 50 quadrillion doesn't count.

And if you can relate and be pleased with Dragon Ball being an "action flick", quite plainly and simply, then once again, our views on Dragon Ball are too opposing to make this argument ever cease.

See, that's the thing, I'm not looking for the manga panels projected into the big screen. I'm looking for a movie based on the story told in Dragonball. Nothing more. It's the same thing I look for when I go hunting for fanfics to read. Someone elses interpretation of the story with their own concepts and ideas mixed in. I mean, if I wanted anime/manga Dragonball I'd go watch the anime or read the manga, you know?