How strong is Goku Jr?

Discussion, generally of an in-universe nature, regarding any aspect of the franchise (including movies, spin-offs, etc.) such as: techniques, character relationships, internal back-history, its universe, and more.

Moderators: Kanzenshuu Staff, General Help

User avatar
Hellspawn28
Namekian Warrior
Posts: 14032
Joined: Mon Sep 07, 2009 9:50 pm
Location: Maryland, USA

How strong is Goku Jr?

Post by Hellspawn28 » Tue Nov 09, 2010 10:18 pm

I was not sure if this thread was done or not, but how strong do you think Goku Jr was in GT: Hero Legacy? Would you say he was weaker or stronger then DB Kid Goku?
PS4 username: Guyver_Spawn_27
MAL Profile: http://myanimelist.net/profile/Hellspawn28
Steam: http://steamcommunity.com/id/GS27/

User avatar
Zionist
Beyond-the-Beyond Newbie
Posts: 411
Joined: Sat May 01, 2010 12:12 am

Re: How strong is Goku Jr?

Post by Zionist » Tue Nov 09, 2010 10:21 pm

He was a Super Saiyan.....obviously he was stronger than Kid Goku. But if it's an an exact power level you're looking for, sorry, that I can't provide.
Rocketman wrote:Who gives a shit about a Broly fan's feelings.
Zoms wrote:That moment when you relate your ship to glass tubes...

User avatar
Savage68
I'm pretty cozy, here...
Posts: 1929
Joined: Wed Apr 29, 2009 12:16 pm
Location: Baltimore, MD
Contact:

Re: How strong is Goku Jr?

Post by Savage68 » Tue Nov 09, 2010 10:41 pm

Hellspawn28 wrote:Would you say he was weaker or stronger then DB Kid Goku?
..........stronger. But like Zionist is saying, there's no real way in Hades for us to gauge Goku Junior's strength.

User avatar
B
Born 'n Bred Here
Posts: 5561
Joined: Tue Dec 09, 2008 10:15 am
Contact:

Re: How strong is Goku Jr?

Post by B » Tue Nov 09, 2010 10:54 pm

I would wager he's somewhere between Farmer With Shotgun and Goku at the beginning. Does he actually do any fighting besides one-shotting Yao as a Super Saiyan? I forget.

But yeah, if you assume his actual battle power is a number between 5 and 10, as Super Saiyan, which is a 50X increase, he is of course stronger than Goku. If you're generous and say it's 9, he's slightly stronger than Goku and Piccolo when they fight Raditz.
Keen Observation of Dragon Ball Z Movie 4's Climax wrote:Slug shits to see the genki

User avatar
Nazi Cola
Advanced Regular
Posts: 1068
Joined: Wed Apr 28, 2010 8:25 pm
Location: Inside you
Contact:

Re: How strong is Goku Jr?

Post by Nazi Cola » Tue Nov 09, 2010 11:24 pm

I'll be generous and say around Kid Goku at the 22nd TB, while Super Saiyan, so pretty low without.
CatouttaHell wrote:I guess he's just impossibly powerful and he now gets thrills from letting things go as much to hell as possible before busting out his ultimate power and ending the villain or some shit.

User avatar
Zionist
Beyond-the-Beyond Newbie
Posts: 411
Joined: Sat May 01, 2010 12:12 am

Re: How strong is Goku Jr?

Post by Zionist » Tue Nov 09, 2010 11:28 pm

Nazi Cola wrote:I'll be generous and say around Kid Goku at the 22nd TB, while Super Saiyan, so pretty low without.
Even with a Base Power level of 5, with Super Saiyan he would be stronger than 22nd Budokai Tien and Goku. Do remember the initial Multiplier is X's 50.
Rocketman wrote:Who gives a shit about a Broly fan's feelings.
Zoms wrote:That moment when you relate your ship to glass tubes...

User avatar
Savage68
I'm pretty cozy, here...
Posts: 1929
Joined: Wed Apr 29, 2009 12:16 pm
Location: Baltimore, MD
Contact:

Re: How strong is Goku Jr?

Post by Savage68 » Tue Nov 09, 2010 11:30 pm

"22nd Budokai Goku" is being generous? Remember, kids in this series are stronger and stronger and stronger with each generation. Even 14-year-old Pan in GT is stronger than flippin' Dr. Gero.

User avatar
Nazi Cola
Advanced Regular
Posts: 1068
Joined: Wed Apr 28, 2010 8:25 pm
Location: Inside you
Contact:

Re: How strong is Goku Jr?

Post by Nazi Cola » Wed Nov 10, 2010 6:48 am

Okay, I don't know what I'm talking about. But he's got such little Saiyan blood in him, I don't think he could utilize that "hybrid powa" like everyone else. Pan was 1/8 or 1/16, can't remember, and she was strong, but I think you're gonna start losing that hybrid potential once the Saiyan blood percentage reaches a certain fraction.
CatouttaHell wrote:I guess he's just impossibly powerful and he now gets thrills from letting things go as much to hell as possible before busting out his ultimate power and ending the villain or some shit.

User avatar
dbgtFO
Kicks it Old-School
Posts: 7774
Joined: Thu Aug 26, 2010 5:07 pm
Contact:

Re: How strong is Goku Jr?

Post by dbgtFO » Wed Nov 10, 2010 7:05 am

Nazi Cola wrote:Okay, I don't know what I'm talking about. But he's got such little Saiyan blood in him, I don't think he could utilize that "hybrid powa" like everyone else. Pan was 1/8 or 1/16, can't remember, and she was strong, but I think you're gonna start losing that hybrid potential once the Saiyan blood percentage reaches a certain fraction.
He has SSJ, that should tell you he has a lot Saiyan potential just to have that form in the first place.

User avatar
TheDevilsCorpse
Moderator
Posts: 11377
Joined: Sun Jun 20, 2010 4:34 am
Contact:

Re: How strong is Goku Jr?

Post by TheDevilsCorpse » Wed Nov 10, 2010 7:18 am

Nazi Cola wrote:Okay, I don't know what I'm talking about. But he's got such little Saiyan blood in him, I don't think he could utilize that "hybrid powa" like everyone else. Pan was 1/8 or 1/16, can't remember, and she was strong, but I think you're gonna start losing that hybrid potential once the Saiyan blood percentage reaches a certain fraction.
Not in the Tori-verse.
After everything he's done and all the faux explanations he's given for things, like how Piccolo can survive off of water from an enzyme or how Goten and Trunks didn't have tails because it was a recessive Saiyan gene (don't remember if the last one was actually said by him or if it is fanwank I heard somewhere), do you really think genetics work the same in his stories as they do in real life?

BTW, Gohan had 1/2 Saiyan blood, Pan had 1/4, and Goku Jr. would have 1/16 since he is Pan's grandson.
Last edited by TheDevilsCorpse on Wed Nov 10, 2010 7:21 am, edited 1 time in total.
Direct translations of the Korean DB Online timeline and guidebook.
My personal "canon" and BP list. (Coming Soon)

User avatar
Godo
I Live Here
Posts: 3318
Joined: Sun Aug 13, 2006 9:25 am

Re: How strong is Goku Jr?

Post by Godo » Wed Nov 10, 2010 7:21 am

I bet that his power works like Gohan's "hidden power" bursts in the beginning. Thus, he isn't that strong to begin with, since he draws out that hidden power in times of crisis.

How strong would Goku Jr. be in his fight against Vegeta Jr. then? I bet around Goten and Trunks' level when they fought in the tournament.
Funny thing, that fight is more or less a copy of the Goten vs. Trunks fight. I don't know if it was intentional though.

User avatar
SSJ4_Zankuto
Beyond-the-Beyond Newbie
Posts: 378
Joined: Fri Mar 05, 2010 8:43 pm
Location: South Wales
Contact:

Re: How strong is Goku Jr?

Post by SSJ4_Zankuto » Wed Nov 10, 2010 8:14 am

I think Goku Jr's power level is around 1,000,000 - 2,000,000 at least so he could be weaker then 100% Frieza while as Super Saiya-jin.

User avatar
TheGreatness25
I Live Here
Posts: 4280
Joined: Fri Oct 19, 2007 9:36 am

Re: How strong is Goku Jr?

Post by TheGreatness25 » Wed Nov 10, 2010 11:02 am

I think he's stronger than Kid Goku from Dragon Ball. They do say that mixing races makes the child stronger, hence Gohan. Now Goku Jr. is like a super dilute form to the point of which his Saiyan blood is almost non-existent (but not enough for him to turn Super Saiyan according to Toei), but still. Pan was a quarter Saiyan and I'm pretty sure that she was stronger than Goku from DB (Pan from the last episodes of DBZ) or maybe even Gohan in the beginning of the series. So it's possible that Goku Jr. was stronger than child Goku from Dragon Ball especially because Pan was training him. His whimpiness had nothing to do with power.

User avatar
Cipher
Born 'n Bred Here
Posts: 5506
Joined: Wed Oct 21, 2009 11:54 pm
Location: Nagano
Contact:

Re: How strong is Goku Jr?

Post by Cipher » Wed Nov 10, 2010 12:42 pm

Savage68 wrote:"22nd Budokai Goku" is being generous? Remember, kids in this series are stronger and stronger and stronger with each generation. Even 14-year-old Pan in GT is stronger than flippin' Dr. Gero.
I don't think it's ever indicated that she's stronger. She caught him off-guard with a kick and managed to get him in a hold until Giru could threaten him with his weaponry. Being able to hold him in a choke-hold doesn't necessarily mean she could take him in a fight.

But anyway, Super Saiyan Goku Jr. being around Piccolo Daimou era power sounds about right. I think it's rather generous to even put his untrained base form on the same level as Farmer with Shotgun, but whatever.

By the fight with Vegeta Jr., who knows? They're obviously much stronger, and their speed and use of bukujutsu seems to be on par with later Z characters. Around the level of Goten and Trunks at the 25th Tenkaichi Budokai might not be a bad guess.

User avatar
Savage68
I'm pretty cozy, here...
Posts: 1929
Joined: Wed Apr 29, 2009 12:16 pm
Location: Baltimore, MD
Contact:

Re: How strong is Goku Jr?

Post by Savage68 » Wed Nov 10, 2010 12:57 pm

Cipher wrote:She caught him off-guard with a kick and managed to get him in a hold until Giru could threaten him with his weaponry. Being able to hold him in a choke-hold doesn't necessarily mean she could take him in a fight.
He was struggling to break free from her hold for about 25 seconds, and could hardly budge. The scene's giving us the impression that he's weaker than she is.

User avatar
Chibi Mystic Gohan
I Live Here
Posts: 2876
Joined: Mon Oct 25, 2004 7:55 pm
Location: Wakusei Bejeeter

Re: How strong is Goku Jr?

Post by Chibi Mystic Gohan » Wed Nov 10, 2010 2:07 pm

TheDevilsCorpse wrote:
Nazi Cola wrote:Okay, I don't know what I'm talking about. But he's got such little Saiyan blood in him, I don't think he could utilize that "hybrid powa" like everyone else. Pan was 1/8 or 1/16, can't remember, and she was strong, but I think you're gonna start losing that hybrid potential once the Saiyan blood percentage reaches a certain fraction.
Not in the Tori-verse.
After everything he's done and all the faux explanations he's given for things, like how Piccolo can survive off of water from an enzyme or how Goten and Trunks didn't have tails because it was a recessive Saiyan gene (don't remember if the last one was actually said by him or if it is fanwank I heard somewhere), do you really think genetics work the same in his stories as they do in real life?

BTW, Gohan had 1/2 Saiyan blood, Pan had 1/4, and Goku Jr. would have 1/16 since he is Pan's grandson.
Toriyama did say the thing about recessive genes. See Shonen Jump issue #1.
君と再会ったとき 子供のころ大切に想っていた景色を思い出したんだ
僕と踊ってくれないか 光と影の Winding Road いまでも彼に夢中なの?

User avatar
The Tori-bot
I Live Here
Posts: 3214
Joined: Sun Jun 04, 2006 12:00 pm
Location: Penguin Village
Contact:

Re: How strong is Goku Jr?

Post by The Tori-bot » Wed Nov 10, 2010 2:17 pm

TheDevilsCorpse wrote:BTW, Gohan had 1/2 Saiyan blood, Pan had 1/4, and Goku Jr. would have 1/16 since he is Pan's grandson.
Isn't she his great-great-grandmother? So he would only be at 1/64.

... 1/64... there were 64 episodes of GT... and Goku Jr appears in episode 64...

... :shock:
Last edited by The Tori-bot on Sat Nov 13, 2010 8:16 pm, edited 1 time in total.
New to the forum? Just want to know when you'll hit your next posting rank? Ever wondered why some users have special titles, and what they mean? The answers to all these questions and more are waiting for you in the Kanzenshuu Member Hierarchy Guide!!
"Of all the things to worry about... the Wookiee has no pants." -- Mark Hamill
Herms wrote:Really, you could translate either title either way and nobody would care. But God would know.

User avatar
Bussani
Kicks it Old-School
Posts: 8041
Joined: Mon Aug 25, 2008 2:35 am
Location: New Zealand

Re: How strong is Goku Jr?

Post by Bussani » Wed Nov 10, 2010 7:06 pm

The Tori-bot wrote:
TheDevilsCorpse wrote:BTW, Gohan had 1/2 Saiyan blood, Pan had 1/4, and Goku Jr. would have 1/16 since he is Pan's grandson.
Isn't she his great-great-grandmother? So he would only be at 1/64.
That is correct. It seems logical that the dwindling Saiyan genetics would have an effect on their potential--personally I believe that the 1/2 hybrids get the best of the two races and that's why they have such potential--but as TheDevilsCorpse says, there's nothing in the guides to support it. Even Pan's Daizenshuu bio only says that she hasn't become an Oozaru or Super Saiyan, not that her 1/4 blood makes it impossible or harder.
TheDevilsCorpse wrote:After everything he's done and all the faux explanations he's given for things, like how Piccolo can survive off of water from an enzyme or how Goten and Trunks didn't have tails because it was a recessive Saiyan gene (don't remember if the last one was actually said by him or if it is fanwank I heard somewhere), do you really think genetics work the same in his stories as they do in real life?
I wonder if the "Namekians surviving on water" thing is really that strange... I mean, they'd have to be some pretty special enzymes, but if you could get the hydrogen out of the water, then you have a pretty efficient energy source right there. The recessive gene thing is definitely Toriyama not knowing genetics very well, unless you do some severe fanwanking to make it make sense.
If TPP passes in your country it will be illegal for you to watch an imported DVD. Click here to learn more!

User avatar
TheDevilsCorpse
Moderator
Posts: 11377
Joined: Sun Jun 20, 2010 4:34 am
Contact:

Re: How strong is Goku Jr?

Post by TheDevilsCorpse » Wed Nov 10, 2010 11:02 pm

Bussani wrote:
The Tori-bot wrote:
TheDevilsCorpse wrote:BTW, Gohan had 1/2 Saiyan blood, Pan had 1/4, and Goku Jr. would have 1/16 since he is Pan's grandson.
Isn't she his great-great-grandmother? So he would only be at 1/64.
That is correct. It seems logical that the dwindling Saiyan genetics would have an effect on their potential--personally I believe that the 1/2 hybrids get the best of the two races and that's why they have such potential--but as TheDevilsCorpse says, there's nothing in the guides to support it. Even Pan's Daizenshuu bio only says that she hasn't become an Oozaru or Super Saiyan, not that her 1/4 blood makes it impossible or harder.
Hm, so he's Pan's great-great-grandson? I've never watched the GT special outside the dub when it was first released, can't seem to make myself watch it again. xD

As far as we know, even descendants as far down the line as DBO can still transform normally, having to gather the Dragon Balls to wish for the form may simply be a gameplay mechanic to make you play the game and actually work to get stronger than other players. The same way Dante in DMC can transform with his Devil Trigger at will, but during gameplay you can only transform when you have enough runes (assuming you aren't using a Super costume).
Bussani wrote:I wonder if the "Namekians surviving on water" thing is really that strange... I mean, they'd have to be some pretty special enzymes, but if you could get the hydrogen out of the water, then you have a pretty efficient energy source right there. The recessive gene thing is definitely Toriyama not knowing genetics very well, unless you do some severe fanwanking to make it make sense.
I understand how it could theoretically work, but it still seems pretty far out there to me...though not completely out of the realm of possibility. I just think there could have been a much easier and more logical answer, but then again, knowing Toriyama, it was much easier for him just to say its because of an enzyme without much thought.
Direct translations of the Korean DB Online timeline and guidebook.
My personal "canon" and BP list. (Coming Soon)

User avatar
JulieYBM
Namekian Warrior
Posts: 13600
Joined: Mon Jan 16, 2006 10:25 pm
Contact:

Re: How strong is Goku Jr?

Post by JulieYBM » Wed Nov 10, 2010 11:43 pm

I think by the time he fought Vegeta Jr. in the Tenka'ichi he was probably in the early millions. Having inherited his great great grandpa's name and look I'm willing to bet he inherited his fighting spirit.
Savage68 wrote:Even 14-year-old Pan in GT is stronger than flippin' Dr. Gero.
She's nine and ten in Dragon Ball GT. :p
She/Her | Popsicle Princess

Post Reply