Who beat Frieza on Earth in Future Trunks' timeline?

[Olivier Hague]

There is nothing to dictate that because Goku did it in the manga timeline, it happened exactly the same way in Trunks' time. For all we know, Goku and Freeza could have arrived at the same time, or Goku could have been the one to arrive ahead of Freeza.

How could Trunks' appearance delay the arrival of Gokû's pod?
That's how (that particular model of) time travel works, you know: time travelers change things around (directly or indirectly), and the result is two different timelines. If Trunks landed in a world where Gokû's pod was late to begin with, that's not "time travel".

Basically I was saying that it wasn't a wizard, it was a variation of the harmony and predestined time line theories. Someone alters events and prevents a death, only to have outside forces self correct by claiming the one who should have died. If you've ever seen any of the Final Destination movies, it uses a similar principle. Or better still, if you've watched LOST, think about what happened with Desmond and Charlie

So you were talking nonsense, indeed...

It is the butterfly effect. The fact there was one people more at Earth at that time (Trunks) made Cold's spaceship arrive earlier than it did in Trunks' future.

I'm going to assume you're joking.

[Senzu_Bean]

I'm going to assume you're joking.

I'm going to assume you never heard of Chaos theory before.

[Olivier Hague]

I'm going to assume you never heard of Chaos theory before.

I have. I guess I just never heard about how the presence of one extra human being on a planet could possibly accelerate an arriving spaceship like that. Are you arguing Trunks increased gravity to that point? Is he really that massive?
(and of course, that didn't affect Gokû's pod, for some reason)

[Senzu_Bean]

You definitely never heard of Chaos theory. Trunks presence didn't change Cold's ship speed nor his presence had anything to do directly with the alterations in the timeline. What it did was make subtle changes here and there, and those changes would make even greater changes in others places, and so on.

[Olivier Hague]

You definitely never heard of Chaos theory.

I just happen to have a far better understanding of it than you do, apparently.

Trunks presence didn't change Cold's ship speed nor his presence had anything to do directly with the alterations in the timeline. What it did was make subtle changes here and there, and those changes would make even greater changes in others places, and so on.

... and so on, until it altered the speed of Cold's ship, according to you. Yeah.
I'd love to see you provide us with one possible scenario for that one, really.

[Senzu_Bean]

I'd love to see you provide us with one possible scenario for that one, really.

First you would need to provide a possible scenario of how there are spaceships and time-machines.

I just happen to have a far better understanding of it than you do, apparently.

Oh, you definitely do not.

[Olivier Hague]

First you would need to provide a possible scenario of how there are spaceships and time-machines.

Actually, you would need to ignore the laws of physics and rewrite the basic example of the butterfly effect to something like "the flap of a butterfly's wings in Brazil can set off a tornado on Jupiter. Damn near instantly, too."

[Senzu_Bean]

First you would need to provide a possible scenario of how there are spaceships and time-machines.

Actually, you would need to ignore the laws of physics and rewrite the basic example of the butterfly effect to something like "the flap of a butterfly's wings in Brazil can set off a tornado on Jupiter. Damn near instantly, too."

You're applying something real in a non-real situation. First you need to ignore the laws of physics when there are spaceships and time machines, and not a cause-effect theory when the objects of study cannot be real by any means.

[Olivier Hague]

You're trying to apply something real in a non-real situation.

I'm assuming the flap of a butterfly's wings don't cause instant tornadoes, not even in the world of Dragon Ball. That seems like a fair assumption to me.
Thing is, you can't even begin to explain how Trunks' recent arrival in that timeline could possibly cause Cold's ship to go faster. And simply saying "it's fiction, dude!" (after initially trying to argue that science was on your side by mentioning a theory you don't even understand... yay for consistency) is a cop-out: you could just as well argue that Trunks' arrival instantly turned all elephants over the age of 3 into ice-cream, by that "logic". It's pointless and, quite frankly, dumb.

[Senzu_Bean]

It's pointless and, quite frankly, dumb.

No more than time travel just did it.

[Herms]

How could Trunks' appearance delay the arrival of Gokû's pod?

Trunks must have accidentally tapped the ground a little too hard and knocked the Earth farther from Goku's space pod and closer to Freeza's ship.

[Senzu_Bean]

How could Trunks' appearance delay the arrival of Gokû's pod?

Trunks must have accidentally tapped the ground a little too hard and knocked the Earth farther from Goku's space pod and closer to Freeza's ship.

I like.

[Olivier Hague]

It's pointless and, quite frankly, dumb.

No more than time travel just did it.

Considering that's what you're arguing ("fucking time machines, how do they work?"), it's precisely as dumb as that.

Trunks must have accidentally tapped the ground a little too hard and knocked the Earth farther from Goku's space pod and closer to Freeza's ship.

I know I've been walking on my toes ever since I got interested in space exploration: I wouldn't want to mess up the trajectories of space probes!

[Senzu_Bean]

It's pointless and, quite frankly, dumb.

No more than time travel just did it.

Considering that's what you're arguing ("fucking time machines, how do they work?"), it's precisely as dumb as that.

It sounds like I was the one who said time travel changes stuff cause it simple does.

[Olivier Hague]

It sounds like I was the one who said time travel changes stuff cause it simple does.

You were the one arguing that I shouldn't bring up physics (after you mentioned the chaos theory... really?) because "who the hell knows how time machines work, after all? it's fiction, man!"

[Senzu_Bean]

It sounds like I was the one who said time travel changes stuff cause it simple does.

You were the one arguing that I shouldn't bring up physics (after you mentioned the chaos theory... really?) because "who the hell knows how time machines work, after all? it's fiction, man!"

You were the one saying that is how time travel works - time travelers change things around just because.

And said this I won't further argue with you about this. I had my share of useless debates in the past.

[Olivier Hague]

You were the one saying that is how time travel works - time travelers change things around just because.

Their mere presence change things, butterfly effect and all that, yeah. Given time.
You simply can't expect Trunks' arrival to immediately alter something in outer space, just like you can't expect a butterfly to immediately cause a tornado. That's nonsense.

[the_abberration]

So you were talking nonsense, indeed...

No sir. I suggested a variation of the harmony theory, and predestined time line theory.

With all due respect. It's cool if you don't agree, but lose the attitude and insults please.

[Kaboom]

Guys, please prove to me that the attitudes are going to stop and that I won't have to lock this thread.

[Olivier Hague]

No sir. I suggested a variation of the harmony theory, and predestined time line theory.

Those aren't "theories" at all, just clumsy handwaving that's often used by lazy/dumb writers (and generally accompanied by nonsensical pseudo-scientific terminology, in order to lend the whole thing a false semblance of legitimacy).
If history is "predestined", you shouldn't be able to alter it. At all. The "course-correction" stuff in those examples you mentioned doesn't make sense, as it posits that some events have to happen... but all that other stuff? Well, that's trivial. Somehow.
No place for science, there.