The All-Purpose "Versus" Thread

[LightBing]

Vegeta vs Goku vs Kuririn vs Freeza vs Bulma vs Mr.Satan vs Piccolo - Who's the better detective?

Basically rank them by order of detective skills. If you want a scenario: they all independently investigate a murder in West City. They can't be helped by the characters they are competing with and characters with special "cheating" skills, like Dende observing everything from the Lookout.

[PFM18]

Vegeta vs Goku vs Kuririn vs Freeza vs Bulma vs Mr.Satan vs Piccolo - Who's the better detective?

Basically rank them by order of detective skills. If you want a scenario: they all independently investigate a murder in West City. They can't be helped by the characters they are competing with and characters with special "cheating" skills, like Dende observing everything from the Lookout.

Well Mr. Satan is probably the worst since he would just claim that he caught the perpetrator of the murder regardless of what actually happened lol. Otherwise I am not really sure

I apologize, but that's like saying Freeza can beat Super Buu. And maybe the difference's higher.

I don't understand. I thought it's common sense that Frieza is above Super Buu?

Piccolo was even with a rusty Ssj2 Gohan. Ssj God Goku is universes, galaxies above him.

Yeah but that's the Universe 6 Arc. Tournament of Power Arc Piccolo is dimensions above his U6 arc counterpart

I meant Namek Freeza.

And no, ToP Piccolo was even with a rusty Ssj2 Gohan during their training. So that's how strong he is.

I mean Gohan had been training since ROF and he had gotten pretty strong by that point. He was just weaker than if he had his Ultimate transformation.(Since it was established that it is not a flat boost but a transformation.) Goku was suppressed, but he atleast seemed to have forced Goku to use SSJ so Gohan has to be very strong by this point.

[jeffbr92]

Who's strongest character in DB the Avengers can defeat? (Together and as individuals)

[Dragon Ball Gus]

Monaka vs Dr. Rota

[Alruneia]

Monaka vs Dr. Rota

Dr. Rota wins by using his signature ability of

[BlueVegerot]

Base Toppo vs Golden Freeza. 1 on 1 fight with no outside interference allowed, who wins?

[PFM18]

Base Toppo vs Golden Freeza. 1 on 1 fight with no outside interference allowed, who wins?

Toppo. They couldn't handle him individually they beat Base Toppo by attacking from both sides and cornering him. I think Toppo would have a slight edge against Golden Freeza.

[supercat]

Base Toppo vs Golden Freeza. 1 on 1 fight with no outside interference allowed, who wins?

Based on a few feats and such, I would say Base Toppo seems comparable to some unspecified level of SSB Goku's Kaioken. He also held his own quite well against Frieza and Android 17 (two SSB-tier fighters) despite having to hold them off from both sides.

-SSB Goku flares his Kaioken, yet Toppo still has confidence he could take him on. Whis' father stopped the fight stating that the two could destroy each other. This implies Toppo = SSB Goku Kaioken x2 at the very least.

-Goku tells Vegeta he may not be able to beat Toppo even with SSB. This is in total contrast to what he said about Frieza, whom he would put back in his place should there be trouble.

[Zamasu55]

Base Toppo vs Golden Freeza. 1 on 1 fight with no outside interference allowed, who wins?

Based on a few feats and such, I would say Base Toppo seems comparable to some unspecified level of SSB Goku's Kaioken. He also held his own quite well against Frieza and Android 17 (two SSB-tier fighters) despite having to hold them off from both sides.

-SSB Goku flares his Kaioken, yet Toppo still has confidence he could take him on. Whis' father stopped the fight stating that the two could destroy each other. This implies Toppo = SSB Goku Kaioken x2 at the very least.

-Goku tells Vegeta he may not be able to beat Toppo even with SSB. This is in total contrast to what he said about Frieza, whom he would put back in his place should there be trouble.

You're right, but Toppo seemed to be slightly retconned during the ToP.

- He seemed scared of Ssj Berserker Kale, which was nothing special in the end.
- He struggled A LOT against SsjB Vegeta.
- He also had a difficult time against 17, and it was taking hours to beat him in that beam struggle.

[PFM18]

Base Toppo vs Golden Freeza. 1 on 1 fight with no outside interference allowed, who wins?

Based on a few feats and such, I would say Base Toppo seems comparable to some unspecified level of SSB Goku's Kaioken. He also held his own quite well against Frieza and Android 17 (two SSB-tier fighters) despite having to hold them off from both sides.

-SSB Goku flares his Kaioken, yet Toppo still has confidence he could take him on. Whis' father stopped the fight stating that the two could destroy each other. This implies Toppo = SSB Goku Kaioken x2 at the very least.

-Goku tells Vegeta he may not be able to beat Toppo even with SSB. This is in total contrast to what he said about Frieza, whom he would put back in his place should there be trouble.

We know toppo wasnt using FP but he was losing to SSB especially initially. Just because he didnt crap himself at the sight of SSBKK doesnt mean he can take him on. He fought evenly with SSB Vegeta too. He overpowered 17 in a beam struggle so I think Vegeta, Goku, Golden Freeza, and Toppo are all the same level with 17 below them

[Superboy-Prime Solos]

Who Would Win?

Superboy-Prime Or SSJ4 Xeno Goku?

Rules:
•Please, No Bias.
•Give Actual Logical Arguements
•No Fallacies
•Speed Equalized
•No Insults
•Keep The Amount Of Bibles (Very Large Arguements And Refutes), Low.

[shadowfox87]

Who Would Win?

Superboy-Prime Or SSJ4 Xeno Goku?

Rules:
•Please, No Bias.
•Give Actual Logical Arguements
•No Fallacies
•Speed Equalized
•No Insults
•Keep The Amount Of Bibles (Very Large Arguements And Refutes), Low.

Speed Equalized? Ok, because Superboy prime couldn't even be stopped by Flash in the speedforce. Anyways, this is an easy one. SSJ4 Xeno Goku is defeated by SSB Goku who is weaker than Beerus, God of Destruction. MSSB Vegeta who is almost equal to Goku's full power SSB sparred with Beerus in the manga and lost. One of Superboy prime's greatest feat is surviving a blast from a weakened Anti-Monitor which was a universe destroying blast (https://imgur.com/a/Pq1hO#0). Beerus, God of Destruction, can also destroy an entire universe, but was holding back significantly in order to keep the universe preserved. On the other hand, Anti-Monitor can destroy several universes not just 1. While Superboy Prime has shown to move universes and create tears in it, he has not ever destroyed a single universe. This puts him below universe destruction level. Pre-crisis superman was able to sneeze away a solar system, but it takes millions of solar systems to make 1 galaxy and billions of galaxies for 1 universe.

Other feats of Superboy Prime including punching out of the Phantom Zone however this is essentially the same as punching out of the Room of Spirit and Time in DBZ by Buu and Gotenks, who are much weaker than SSJ4 Xeno Goku. So even with speed equalized, given that Superboy Prime can survive blasts from Anti-Monitor and SSB Goku would lose vs Beerus full power, Superboy prime wins in durability.
Zeno > Grand Priest > Anti-Monitor > Angels > Ultra Instinct Goku > Jiren > Beerus > Superboy Prime > SSB Goku > SSJ4 Xeno Goku.

[Superboy-Prime Solos]

Who Would Win?

Superboy-Prime Or SSJ4 Xeno Goku?

Rules:
•Please, No Bias.
•Give Actual Logical Arguements
•No Fallacies
•Speed Equalized
•No Insults
•Keep The Amount Of Bibles (Very Large Arguements And Refutes), Low.

Speed Equalized? Ok, because Superboy prime couldn't even be stopped by Flash in the speedforce. Anyways, this is an easy one. SSJ4 Xeno Goku is defeated by SSB Goku who is weaker than Beerus, God of Destruction. MSSB Vegeta who is almost equal to Goku's full power SSB sparred with Beerus in the manga and lost. One of Superboy prime's greatest feat is surviving a blast from a weakened Anti-Monitor which was a universe destroying blast (https://imgur.com/a/Pq1hO#0). Beerus, God of Destruction, can also destroy an entire universe, but was holding back significantly in order to keep the universe preserved. On the other hand, Anti-Monitor can destroy several universes not just 1. Other feats of Superboy Prime including punching out of the Phantom Zone however this is essentially the same as punching out of the Room of Spirit and Time in DBZ by Buu and Gotenks, who are much weaker than SSJ4 Xeno Goku. So even with speed equalized, given that Superboy Prime can survive blasts from Anti-Monitor and SSB Goku would lose vs Beerus full power, Superboy prime wins in durability.
Zeno > Grand Priest > Anti-Monitor > Angels > Superboy Prime > Beerus > SSB Goku > SSJ4 Xeno Goku.

Superboy-Prime Has Also Changed All Possible Realities.
http://2.bp.blogspot.com/kKY1TL3YS9mSeQ ... uxIA=s1600
http://2.bp.blogspot.com/U-sJ5g-YOU_vkh ... dEfQ=s1600
He Did This In A Dimension Devoid Of Any Solar Radition. Add This To The Fact, That, He Spent Years In That Dimension.
http://2.bp.blogspot.com/0PhDsJxOdTUxSk ... 7btA=s1600
He Also Was Able To Dismantle The Anti-Monitor.
http://2.bp.blogspot.com/jbBSt2gxR1iKbI ... plVc=s1600
Prime Also Irreparably Damaged The Space-Time Of Earth-15.
http://2.bp.blogspot.com/j4H9q5HNXtwdvg ... 853B=s1600
Prime Breaking Out Of The Phantom Zone, Is More Impressive, When You Find Out That The Phantom Zone Can Contain Dominus, A Multiversal+ Reality Warper.
⬇⬇⬇Dominus Respect Thread⬇⬇⬇
https://plus.google.com/110150123399134 ... HKYstBHykM
Here Is A Multiversal+ Durability Feat, For Prime.
https://www.google.pt/url?sa=t&source=w ... _qxQKI49cg
Proof For Infinite Speed Prime.
https://plus.google.com/117133601329367 ... soSUi5Q6qv
Possible Proof Of Speed Beyond Time, For Prime.
https://plus.google.com/108342040628408 ... mpxHiaX1ns

[shadowfox87]

Here Is A Multiversal+ Durability Feat, For Prime.
https://www.google.pt/url?sa=t&source=w ... _qxQKI49cg

I didn't know about this feat. If that's true, then I would place him just below Anti-Monitor. The other feats I'm aware of. Dimension reality warping have been done by villains like Janemba and Anilaza, so it's not that big of a deal. Anilaza punched holes in space and time in the World of void which is outside of space and time. In terms of speed, Superboy prime probably surpasses all characters in the entire DB verse. However, how that speed is directed into combat can be entirely different. Flash for example, has been defeated by Deathstroke before because Flash is predictable and moves in a straight line. Going to fast makes it difficult to turn and dodge. Reaction times are important, etc.

I also had edited my post before you quoted it so you may want to check it out again. I only added a couple more feats and addressed it. In any case, given the multiversal feat you referenced, this would be interpretation:

Zeno > Grand Priest > Anti-Monitor > Superboy Prime > Angels > Ultra Instinct Goku > Jiren > SSB Vegito > Beerus > MSSB Goku > SSB Goku > SSJ4 Xeno Goku

[Superboy-Prime Solos]

Here Is A Multiversal+ Durability Feat, For Prime.
https://www.google.pt/url?sa=t&source=w ... _qxQKI49cg

I didn't know about this feat. If that's true, then I would place him just below Anti-Monitor. The other feats I'm aware of. Dimension reality warping have been done by villains like Janemba and Anilaza, so it's not that big of a deal. Anilaza punched holes in space and time in the World of void which is outside of space and time. In terms of speed, Superboy prime probably surpasses all characters in the entire DB verse. However, how that speed is directed into combat can be entirely different. Flash for example, has been defeated by Deathstroke before because Flash is predictable and moves in a straight line. Going to fast makes it difficult to turn and dodge. Reaction times are important, etc.

I also had edited my post before you quoted it so you may want to check it out again. I only added a couple more feats and addressed it. In any case, given the multiversal feat you referenced, this would be interpretation:

Zeno > Grand Priest > Anti-Monitor > Superboy Prime > Angels > Ultra Instinct Goku > Jiren > SSB Vegito > Beerus > MSSB Goku > SSB Goku > SSJ4 Xeno Goku

Prime Doesn't Surpass All DB Characters In Speed. There Are Multiple Beyond Time Speed Feats In DB.
For Example:
Mira Transcends Time.
http://pm1.narvii.com/6665/10669ff6d14e ... 8c4_00.jpg
Mira, Towa And Demigra Exist Outside Of The Flow Of Time.
https://plus.google.com/113806516725407 ... bgvQT6RZiG
The Custom Character, Goku And Demigra Can Exist In The Crack Of Time, Which Has Been Stated To Be Separate From Time, And Is Beyond Time And Space.
https://imgur.com/a/GheOg
https://imgur.com/a/Y7vLv
Chronoa, Trunks And Vegeta Moved In The Crack Of Time.
https://plus.google.com/113806516725407 ... vA9zit1boM
Mira, Towa, Trunks And Chronoa Existed Beyond Time And Space.
https://plus.google.com/113806516725407 ... iqwVb6Ch49
DBFZ Hit's Attacks Are Beyond Time.
https://plus.google.com/113806516725407 ... A2Ljo5Bvy8
The Dokkan Battle Avatar Transcends Time.
https://m.imgur.com/GA9ntLd

Prime's Retcon Punch Can Change Someone's Existence, Retcon Them Out Of Existence, Make Them Non-Canon And More.
It Has Been Shown To Work On A Multiversal Scale, While Janemba's Warping Was Simply Macrocosmic.
Though, In Shin Budokai, Janemba, Has Been Shown To Warp Multiple Dimensions, Realities And Timelines.
https://m.imgur.com/a/81SR4
This Would Make Him Multi-Universal, But, You Could Highball Him To Multiversal+, Due To Cell's "Endless Worlds" Statement, But, That Is Just Taking Cell's Statement Out Of Context.

[shadowfox87]

Prime Doesn't Surpass All DB Characters In Speed. There Are Multiple Beyond Time Speed Feats In DB.
For Example:
Mira Transcends Time.
http://pm1.narvii.com/6665/10669ff6d14e ... 8c4_00.jpg
Mira, Towa And Demigra Exist Outside Of The Flow Of Time.
.

I think you're confusing actual speed with just existing in dimensions outside of time. Chronoa's Time Nest exists outside of time because she's the Kaioshin of Time and fixes anomalies that are part of the time flow. Hence, she has to exist outside of time to do this. All of the things that are being fixed by the Time Patrol, etc. are occurring outside of time and space otherwise it would create new timelines. Mira, Towa, and Demigra are creating time anomalies which are part of the flow of time and hence exclude themselves. Mira is just an android like Cell. He's been defeated by regular Future Trunks before. You have to be careful of the interpretation of "transcends time". Jiren was thought to "transcend time" because he overpowered Hit's Time Cage technique in the World of Void which was supposedly a dimension outside of time. However, in actuality, the World of Void is outside of time and space and that is what the "void" means. In that, it is simply another dimension like the Room of Spirit and Time where time moves faster. That is, the 48 mins spent in the World of Void would be like no time passed at all outside. Hit's technique is really Time Lag in that it makes his opponent slower but Jiren overpowered it simply by increasing his own speed over the lag.

The events of Mira and Towa occur near Age 850, many years in the future as part of the DBO timeline. It's not like they exist outside of time, they are still part of history. Simply existing in a dimension outside of time does not mean your speed is faster. Being in the Room of Spirit and Time where time moves faster allows a character to train faster. Hit's pocket dimension has time that passes faster relatively, allowing him to move 0.1 s faster relative to the outside observer. In this case, he's moving faster because he's transiently traversing through a dimension that moves faster in time. Whis can rewind time by 3 minutes, but his speed is still independent of that. Superboy Prime was in the speedforce itself, which is essentially another dimension where time moves differently. Here, Prime beat other speedsters. To put it simply, just being outside of time does not mean you're fast. To compare apples to apples, we have to put characters in the same dimension and compare their physiological speed. Also, if your'e going to include expanded DB verse, then use DBH manga, Xenoverse, and DBO. Dokkan is completely different.

[Superboy-Prime Solos]

Prime Doesn't Surpass All DB Characters In Speed. There Are Multiple Beyond Time Speed Feats In DB.
For Example:
Mira Transcends Time.
http://pm1.narvii.com/6665/10669ff6d14e ... 8c4_00.jpg
Mira, Towa And Demigra Exist Outside Of The Flow Of Time.
.

I think you're confusing actual speed with just existing in dimensions outside of time. Chronoa's Time Nest exists outside of time because she's the Kaioshin of Time and fixes anomalies that are part of the time flow. Hence, she has to exist outside of time to do this. All of the things that are being fixed by the Time Patrol, etc. are occurring outside of time and space otherwise it would create new timelines. Mira, Towa, and Demigra are creating time anomalies which are part of the flow of time and hence exclude themselves. Mira is just an android like Cell. He's been defeated by regular Future Trunks before. You have to be careful of the interpretation of "transcends time". Jiren was thought to "transcend time" because he overpowered Hit's Time Cage technique in the World of Void which was supposedly a dimension outside of time. However, in actuality, the World of Void is outside of time and space and that is what the "void" means. In that, it is simply another dimension like the Room of Spirit and Time where time moves faster. That is, the 48 mins spent in the World of Void would be like no time passed at all outside. Hit's technique is really Time Lag in that it makes his opponent slower but Jiren overpowered it simply by increasing his own speed over the lag.

The events of Mira and Towa occur near Age 850, many years in the future as part of the DBO timeline. It's not like they exist outside of time, they are still part of history. Simply existing in a dimension outside of time does not mean your speed is faster. Being in the Room of Spirit and Time where time moves faster allows a character to train faster. Hit's pocket dimension has time that passes faster relatively, allowing him to move 0.1 s faster relative to the outside observer. In this case, he's moving faster because he's transiently traversing through a dimension that moves faster in time. Whis can rewind time by 3 minutes, but his speed is still independent of that. Superboy Prime was in the speedforce itself, which is essentially another dimension where time moves differently. Here, Prime beat other speedsters. To put it simply, just being outside of time does not mean you're fast. To compare apples to apples, we have to put characters in the same dimension and compare their physiological speed. Also, if your'e going to include expanded DB verse, then use DBH manga, Xenoverse, and DBO. Dokkan is completely different.

I Concede On Being Outside Time=Speed.

[theherodjl]

Let's see how far Goku, from the first chapter of DB, with SSJ transformations can go!

SSJ Kid Goku vs BoZ Goku
SSJ2 Kid Goku vs a lone Saibamen
SSJ3 Kid Goku vs Nappa
SSJ4 Kid Goku vs Nail
SSJG Kid Goku vs Namek Freeza
SSJB Kid Goku vs Android 18
Kaio-ken x20 SSJB Kid Goku vs SSJ2 Kid Gohan
UIO Kid Goku vs Fat Boo
MUI Kid Goku vs SSJ Gotenks

[Hugo Boss]

Prime's Retcon Punch Can Change Someone's Existence, Retcon Them Out Of Existence, Make Them Non-Canon And More.
It Has Been Shown To Work On A Multiversal Scale, While

Isn’t this basically what Zeno does? This is like Jiren merged with Zeno.

[PFM18]

Let's see how far Goku, from the first chapter of DB, with SSJ transformations can go!

SSJ Kid Goku vs BoZ Goku
SSJ2 Kid Goku vs a lone Saibamen
SSJ3 Kid Goku vs Nappa
SSJ4 Kid Goku vs Nail
SSJG Kid Goku vs Namek Freeza
SSJB Kid Goku vs Android 18
Kaio-ken x20 SSJB Kid Goku vs SSJ2 Kid Gohan
UIO Kid Goku vs Fat Boo
MUI Kid Goku vs SSJ Gotenks

He wins the first 4 and loses the rest