The All-Purpose "Versus" Thread

[Goku9001]

Mutated Zamasu (no immortality) vs UI Sign Goku (no time limit)

Round 1: 1st UI Sign Goku
Round 2: 2nd UI Sign Goku
Round 3: 3rd UI Sign Goku

Round 1: 1st UI Sign Goku: As powerful as Merged Zamasu was, he was still killed by Trunks' Genki Sword. In contrast, Jiren was effortlessly pushing back a similar attack that was propelled by someone much stronger than Trunks was. Merged Zamasu also does not benefit from having slowed down due to his large stature. With UI Omen Goku's speed, it shouldn't be a problem

Round 2 and Round 3 are easy wins for UI Omen Goku.

MUI Goku Black vs SSBE Vegeta (Granolah arc)

Beast Gohan (RoF arc) vs SSJ2 Kefla

SSJ1 Vegito (Broly film) vs Hakaishin Toppo

SSJ3 Goku (Early Android arc, no heart virus) vs Perfect Cell (can turn Super Perfect if needed)

SSJ4 Baby Vegeta vs Syn Shenron

SSB Vegeta (Cell Games) vs Buuhan

MUI Goku Black vs SSBE Vegeta (Granolah arc): Goku Black was weaker than ToP Goku so naturally, the highest Goku Black could go is Jiren. In contrast, Vegeta was competing against Granolah and Goku as the Top 3 for the strongest in the universe. This would mean Broly was no longer a factor. Granolah became the strongest and SSJBE Vegeta evolved to the point where he could defend against Granolah's attacks and even land a hit.

Beast Gohan (RoF arc) vs SSJ2 Kefla: Beast Gohan already surpassed Jiren so he would naturally beat Kefla.

SSJ1 Vegito (Broly film) vs Hakaishin Toppo: The Blue Saiyans already managed to surpass Toppo in their Blue form and Base Gogeta was already outperforming both Blue Goku and Blue Vegeta against SSJ Broly. Vegetto at worst is equal to Gogeta so Base Vegetto let alone Super Vegetto would have no issues.

SSJ3 Goku (Early Android arc, no heart virus) vs Perfect Cell (can turn Super Perfect if needed): EML suggests that Super Saiyan Grade 3 is a 10x multiplier (relative to Grade 1or 3) which is much greater than Super Saiyan 3. Grade 3 Trunks was still much weaker than Perfect Cell at Full Power so Goku would lose.

SSJ4 Baby Vegeta vs Syn Shenron : No clue.

SSB Vegeta (Cell Games) vs Buuhan: No idea. I believe the anime suggests that SSJ Goku's power was increasing during the ritual in the anime. That statement was never present in the manga and the boost may have surpassed the power of SSJ3 fusion based on Super Saiyan God allowing him to surpass Vegetto. Therefore, Blue Vegeta can take this.

[SupremeKai25]

MUI Goku Black vs SSBE Vegeta (Granolah arc)

If Toei is writing this fight, Black stomps.

In Toei continuity (Super Dragon Ball Heroes, sequel of the ToP arc written by Toei), Goku Black evolves his Super Saiyan Rosé to the point that it takes Gogeta Blue Evolved himself to put him down. Since MUI is an even higher form than that, he literally blitzes and oneshots Vegeta. Toei already made it clear that they think an evolved Black is a SSB Evolved Gogeta threat.

[sunsetshimmer]

SSJ4 Baby Vegeta vs Syn Shenron

Much stronger version of SSJ4 Goku couldn't handle Syn Shenron without going beyond limits, although Goku was heavily injured during that fight so he didn't fight at his full strength + was blind. Still, i don't think SSJ4 Baby would beat him unless we take end of GT Vegeta as a base. If it's the same Baby Vegeta from his own arc then he loses imo.

[ZombieVito]

BoG arc Base Goku [No SS or KK] vs King Cold.
BoG arc Base Vegeta [No SS] vs Namek arc Freeza [70% of FP only].
Post Z Sword Base Gohan [No SS] vs Namek arc Freeza.
Boo arc Post RoSaT SS Goten vs Cell Junior.
Super Hero SS Trunks vs CG arc SS Goku.
ToP arc Krillin vs KIbito.
RoF arc Roshi vs Saiyan arc Vegeta.
BoG arc SSG Goku vs Boo arc SS3 Vegetto.
BoG arc Enraged SS2 Vegeta vs Boohan.
Minus Bardock vs Saiyan arc Nappa.

[Almighty Majin]

BoG arc Base Goku [No SS or KK] vs King Cold.
BoG arc Base Vegeta [No SS] vs Namek arc Freeza [70% of FP only].
Post Z Sword Base Gohan [No SS] vs Namek arc Freeza.
Boo arc Post RoSaT SS Goten vs Cell Junior.
Super Hero SS Trunks vs CG arc SS Goku.
ToP arc Krillin vs Kibito.
RoF arc Roshi vs Saiyan arc Vegeta.
BoG arc SSG Goku vs Boo arc SS3 Vegetto.
BoG arc Enraged SS2 Vegeta vs Boohan.
Minus Bardock vs Saiyan arc Nappa.

1. I am of the opinion that King Cold is stronger than Namek Freeza since I consider him comparable to Mecha Freeza who I think is decently stronger than he was on Namek so I think King Cold wins. Goku's only real hope here is tricking Cold with IT and using the Spirit Bomb, which Cold is not letting him use.

2. Vegeta has this.

3. I don't think post-Z-Sword Gohan is stronger than base BoG Goku so he loses.

4. If we go by the DBS manga, a rusty SSJ Goten and Trunks are able to hold their own (albeit with some struggling) against three Cell Jr.'s each. This is a stronger Goten so he should definitely win.

5. If Goten and Trunks have been training since the ToP arc, then I think Super Hero Goten and Trunks should be stronger than their post-RoSaT selves so I think Trunks wins.

6. Krillin wins easily.

7. Going by what we see in RoF, Roshi looks to be around Saiyan Saga Piccolo or Nappa levels which means he'll only win if he uses the Mafuba or if he does a limit breaking Max Power Kamehameha. There is also the possible narrative implication that Roshi is actually stronger than Chiaotzu and Yamcha which in that case, Roshi easily wins.

8. This one is tricky, but when Goku mentioned SSJG > Fusion, he likely just meant Super Vegetto without considering a hypothetical SSJ3 Vegetto. Seeing as this is BoG vs Buu Saga, Goku goes from SSJ3 <<< Gohan to SSJ3 > Gohan. As a result, Buu Saga Vegetto is likely losing, although I think a BoG Vegetto would win.

9. I have BoG SSJ3 Goku at roughly Buutenks level and this version of Vegeta is much stronger than that so he might win if he can end it as quickly as possible.

10. If Bardock is determined enough, he can win this.

[Koitsukai]

BoG arc Base Goku [No SS or KK] vs King Cold.
BoG arc Base Vegeta [No SS] vs Namek arc Freeza [70% of FP only].
Post Z Sword Base Gohan [No SS] vs Namek arc Freeza.
Boo arc Post RoSaT SS Goten vs Cell Junior.
Super Hero SS Trunks vs CG arc SS Goku.
ToP arc Krillin vs KIbito.
RoF arc Roshi vs Saiyan arc Vegeta.
BoG arc SSG Goku vs Boo arc SS3 Vegetto.
BoG arc Enraged SS2 Vegeta vs Boohan.
Minus Bardock vs Saiyan arc Nappa.

1) There might be a PL-quote about Cold that I'm forgetting, but I feel Freeza was the strongest in the universe including his father, so I'd put Cold below 100M. In this case, I can see a 90-ish M Goku winning this through pure skills alone. I'm also confident he doesn't have higher forms in store since he never attempted to transform vs Trunks.

2) That's an 84M Freeza. Goku was probably damn close to that by the Buu arc, by BoG, I think both saiyans are mid-80Ms at the very least. Even if Geets is below Freeza, his determination, skills and hatred towards him would get the job done. I think he could still win this being at 78-80M.

3) I can only see Gohan winning this if it's against 70% Freeza. Against FP Freeza, he cannot do much.

4) Goten has this. That was his peak, and we've seen a less sharp Goten hold his own against more than one Cell Jr.

5) They are supposed to be quite rusty by SH, I guess this new arc will shed some light on where they actually stand, so as of now I'll go with them being weaker than in Z, so Goku should take this one.

6) Good match. We have no clue about Kibito, he was seen sparring with Zamasu and being quite decent at it, too. Although, Zamasu was probably holding back. Krilin has the edge due to being the better fighter, I would put my money on him, but it should be a close one.

7) I cannot see RoF Roshi powering up and shaking the planet like Geets did. Roshi has improved, otherwise he would've been killed, but I doubt he is at 20,000. Vegeta can always turn into an ozaru, so Roshi would need to be many times stronger to put him down before Geets can pull out his winning card.

The comparison probably was with Super Vegito in mind, which is the only fusion we know, and Toriyama probably didn't even think there could've been a SS3 Vegito. Even if that was the case, SSG is a whole new world according to Goku, so at least on par with SS2 Vegito, I'd say it's above that. Factoring in Vegito's hubris and a short-live form like SS3, soon enough SSG Goku will get the upper hand, even if he is below him.

9) My money is on Geets. Gotenks and Gohan were easily disposed, sure they probably were weaker than in the Buu arc, but still a Super Buu-ish level of power is something Beerus can fingerflick away, something I guess Super Vegito could also pull. Vegeta's rage really put him way ahead, so even if he cannot defeat Buuhan, he is not going down easily.
If we consider stuff from the FT arc, like Vegeta's SS2 being way above SS3 Goku and SS Black, with that gap between Goku and himself, he destroys Buuhan.

10) Bardock should win this one with his saiya pride power of sorts. Nappa can summon that as well, but he needed Vegeta to walk him through it. On his own, he is too dumb to collect himself, focus, and improve.
With Vegeta by Nappa's side, it'd be a close fight, but I have Bardock coming up on top.

[GreatSaiyaman123]

MUI Goku Black vs SSBE Vegeta (Granolah arc)

Beast Gohan (RoF arc) vs SSJ2 Kefla

SSJ1 Vegito (Broly film) vs Hakaishin Toppo

SSJ3 Goku (Early Android arc, no heart virus) vs Perfect Cell (can turn Super Perfect if needed)

SSJ4 Baby Vegeta vs Syn Shenron

SSB Vegeta (Cell Games) vs Buuhan

Black because he's stupidly powerful in base.

Kefla one shots. I imagine Beast Gohan at such an early point in the series would be scrapping SSJG level at best, while Kefla is UI Sign level.

Vegetto one shots. Toppo is only some 20x SSJB level since he got defeated by SSJBE Vegeta after a pride boost, while Vegetto is at least 50x since SSJ Gogeta (Who's at most = to Vegetto) stalemated SSJ Broly who was SSJB level in base/Ikari.

Perfect Cell stomps with the level he used on Vegeta. He's definitely much more than just a measly 8x Pre Rosat SSJs. SSJ3 Goku would be like, Super Vegeta level at best.

Yi Xing Long one shots. I can't remember if this is actually suggested somewhere or just a fan theory, but I think Vegeta kept Baby Vegeta's power since he was the strongest Z Fighter after Goku against Super 17, meaning SSJ4 Baby Vegeta should be the same as real SSJ4 Vegeta. At best Baby Vegeta is somewhat stronger than SSJ4 is a potential unlock, but I don't think it would make much difference if any.

Vegeta wins. SSJB is like; 4,000x SSJ1 (SSJ3 is 8x SSJ1, SSJG I assume is 10x SSJ3 and Blue is 50x God) and I don't think Gohan-Boo is that powerful.

Let's have some fun with some DBZ: Supersonic Warriors what-if characters:

1. Piccolo (Fused with King Piccolo) vs SSJ3 Gotenks

Context: This version of Piccolo was able to fight evenly with Super Buu, but couldn't quite win against him and had to resort to using the Mafuba.

2. Krillin vs Potential Unleashed Gohan (Buu Saga)

Context: This version of Krillin trained with Goku before the Cell Games and was taught the Kaioken and the Spirit Bomb which allowed him to destroy Perfect Cell. 7 years later, this version of Krillin is strong enough to fight Super Buu and even muster all his power (calling upon strength from Goku in the afterlife like Gohan did) in order to destroy Super Buu completely.

3. Immortal Freeza vs Dabura

Context: This version of Freeza managed to achieve immortality via the Dragon Balls and defeated the Androids and even Perfect Cell.

1. I remember this what if. Pretty cool one. Gotenks might be stronger than Super Boo but I think he still loses since he lacks experience, and if fusion time is taken into account I doubt Gotenks will get the upperhand and win within 5 minutes.

2. Kuririn wins. He's much weaker in hand to hand combat, but going by their fight in Super I think Kuririn would outsmart Gohan here again, specially because Gohan always gets cocky in his strongest forms.

3. I don't know this what if. Did Freeza train? Or was he just powered up by immortality? I don't think immortality can beat the stone spit, and Freeza is definitely falling for the stone spit. Dabra wins.

BoG arc Base Goku [No SS or KK] vs King Cold.
BoG arc Base Vegeta [No SS] vs Namek arc Freeza [70% of FP only].
Post Z Sword Base Gohan [No SS] vs Namek arc Freeza.
Boo arc Post RoSaT SS Goten vs Cell Junior.
Super Hero SS Trunks vs CG arc SS Goku.
ToP arc Krillin vs KIbito.
RoF arc Roshi vs Saiyan arc Vegeta.
BoG arc SSG Goku vs Boo arc SS3 Vegetto.
BoG arc Enraged SS2 Vegeta vs Boohan.
Minus Bardock vs Saiyan arc Nappa.

Goku wins. I have him behind just by enough to lose vs 100% Freeza (100 million) while I imagine Cold is more in 50% Mecha Freeza's range (75 million) since they were lumped together and that's probably where Freeza was at when he arrived on Earth.

They're both the same, though I have 70% Freeza a tiny bit stronger (100.8 million). All in all Freeza just barely manages to win here based on the small power advantage and other factors.

Gohan one shots. I'm not sure if he was a match for Fat Boo since Goku doesn't answer, but he's definitely much stronger than Goku based on how they hold the sword. I'd say he's at least Namek SSJ Goku level.

I'll go with Goten. Gohan was worried the kids could surpass him soon, so I think Post Rosat boys = Boo Saga Gohan is a good bet.

Daizenshuu 2 says the EoZ boys haven't had any explosive growth since their childhood. So while Trunks probably is stronger, his lack of experience is so blatant it might even be a stomp in Goku's favour.

Kibito was only a match for Base Gohan (and maybe not even that going by how he failed to even budge the Z Sword) while Kuririn outright gave Gohan a run for his money. I don't remember if Kuririn won, but I bet he still beats Kibito after a hard fight.

Roshi beats Vegeta by waving his hand like he did with Yamcha, but Vegeta dies instead of being knocked away. He kicked Tien around like a bitch before the ToP. He's up there with Kuririn in the tens of millions.

Goku, duh. Even BoGs SSJ3 Vegetto would lose to Initial SSJG Goku.

I'll give it to Vegeta, but it would be fairly close and I could see Boo winning without absorption or candy beam. Still give it to Vegeta because of how savage he was when enraged though. That Garlic Gun would vaporize Boo.

Bardock. Going by the Granolah Saga Bardock seems to have gotten a fair Zenkai against Gas and is maybe even comparable to his old OVA self.

[Goku9001]

BoG arc Base Goku [No SS or KK] vs King Cold.
BoG arc Base Vegeta [No SS] vs Namek arc Freeza [70% of FP only].
Post Z Sword Base Gohan [No SS] vs Namek arc Freeza.
Boo arc Post RoSaT SS Goten vs Cell Junior.
Super Hero SS Trunks vs CG arc SS Goku.
ToP arc Krillin vs KIbito.
RoF arc Roshi vs Saiyan arc Vegeta.
BoG arc SSG Goku vs Boo arc SS3 Vegetto.
BoG arc Enraged SS2 Vegeta vs Boohan.
Minus Bardock vs Saiyan arc Nappa.

BoG arc Base Goku [No SS or KK] vs King Cold: On one hand, Base Goku is stated to be below Frieza. On the other hand, we have a statement of the Base Kids being on par with Android 18, the Adult Base Saiyans remaining confident against Piccolo and only expressing concerns after Piccolo forfeits against Kaioshin, and the Super anime explicitly placing Rusty Base Gohan above Piccolo. I think there's enough evidence here to believe that Base Goku would win handily.

BoG arc Base Vegeta [No SS] vs Namek arc Freeza [70% of FP only]: Same reason as above.

Post Z Sword Base Gohan [No SS] vs Namek arc Freeza: Same reason as above.

Boo arc Post RoSaT SS Goten vs Cell Junior: The Super manga explicitly shows both Goten and Trunks squaring off against all 7 Cell Juniors. I'm not sure if those Cell Juniors also had gotten stronger through their training with 17 but their ability to handle a few Cell Juniors individually would naturally mean that SSJ Goten (Post) should win this.

Super Hero SS Trunks vs CG arc SS Goku: Did Trunks grow stronger since the Tournament of Power? If so, Trunks wins. If not, then Goku edges out through his superior skill and battle experience.

ToP arc Krillin vs KIbito: ToP Kuririn was capable of outsmarting Base Gohan with strategies that Goku actually implemented against Jiren. Base Gohan was testing Kuririn but Kuririn still managed to overwhelm him and prevent Base Gohan from escaping the situation whereas Kibito was proven to be below Base Gohan by his inability to even hold the Z Sword let alone swing it. Kuririn wins.

RoF arc Roshi vs Saiyan arc Vegeta: I would say Roshi wins based on his performances in the Tournament of Power. The manga makes it a clear point that his skill enables him to perform much higher than his battle power suggests. He also has the Mafuba which Saiyan Arc Vegeta has no way to deal with.

BoG arc SSG Goku vs Boo arc SS3 Vegetto: Goku stated that Vegetto didn't have a chance against Beerus yet was confident in Super Saiyan God. He even claimed that this power exceeded his own expectations. God Goku > Battle of Gods Vegetto > Buu Saga Vegetto.

BoG arc Enraged SS2 Vegeta vs Boohan: Enraged Vegeta easily. Suppressed Beerus was presented as Goku's strongest opponent to date and Enraged Vegeta easily overwhelmed him.

Minus Bardock vs Saiyan arc Nappa: No idea. The movie places him at a battle power close to 10000 but I'm not aware of how Minus handles him.

[Peach]

Beast Gohan and Orange Piccolo vs. Goku and Vegeta

[ZombieVito]

Beast Gohan and Orange Piccolo vs. Goku and Vegeta

This is a very interesting fight that I hope one day happens.

Piccolo is the weakest of the 4 but Gohan is the strongest so it's really a toss up who wins.

I say Piccolo and Gohan since they are the superior teammates.

[Peach]

Beast Gohan and Orange Piccolo vs. Goku and Vegeta

This is a very interesting fight that I hope one day happens.

Piccolo is the weakest of the 4 but Gohan is the strongest so it's really a toss up who wins.

I say Piccolo and Gohan since they are the superior teammates.

I hope it happens too. Imagine Piccolo using the Hellzone Grennade on Goku. Setting up an attack that Goku can't dodge with Ultra Instinct.

It doesn't seem like Orange Piccolo is weaker though? Like, he seems on their level and stuff. Idk, maybe it's just me.

[ZombieVito]

I hope it happens too. Imagine Piccolo using the Hellzone Grennade on Goku. Setting up an attack that Goku can't dodge with Ultra Instinct.

It doesn't seem like Orange Piccolo is weaker though? Like, he seems on their level and stuff. Idk, maybe it's just me.

He's UI level but on the lower end. Remember that in the movie he couldn't beat a weakened Cell Max and didn't even attempt to do it with a Senzu bean. If I would put it unto numbers it would be something like this:

Beast Gohan: 10

Cell Max: 9
-- Damaged: 6

SSFP Broly: 9
UI Goku: 8.5
UE Vegeta: 8.5

Orange Piccolo: 5
-- Weakened: 4

[Peach]

I hope it happens too. Imagine Piccolo using the Hellzone Grennade on Goku. Setting up an attack that Goku can't dodge with Ultra Instinct.

It doesn't seem like Orange Piccolo is weaker though? Like, he seems on their level and stuff. Idk, maybe it's just me.

He's UI level but on the lower end. Remember that in the movie he couldn't beat a weakened Cell Max and didn't even attempt to do it with a Senzu bean. If I would put it unto numbers it would be something like this:

Beast Gohan: 10

Cell Max: 9
-- Damaged: 6

SSFP Broly: 9
UI Goku: 8.5
UE Vegeta: 8.5

Orange Piccolo: 5
-- Weakened: 4

Was Cell Max ever scaled to Goku and Vegeta in the movie? I can't remember if he was or not

[Goku9001]

I hope it happens too. Imagine Piccolo using the Hellzone Grennade on Goku. Setting up an attack that Goku can't dodge with Ultra Instinct.

It doesn't seem like Orange Piccolo is weaker though? Like, he seems on their level and stuff. Idk, maybe it's just me.

He's UI level but on the lower end. Remember that in the movie he couldn't beat a weakened Cell Max and didn't even attempt to do it with a Senzu bean. If I would put it unto numbers it would be something like this:

Beast Gohan: 10

Cell Max: 9
-- Damaged: 6

SSFP Broly: 9
UI Goku: 8.5
UE Vegeta: 8.5

Orange Piccolo: 5
-- Weakened: 4

Was Cell Max ever scaled to Goku and Vegeta in the movie? I can't remember if he was or not

All that is said is that Goku and Vegeta may not have been able to defeat Cell Max. Most take that to be referring to the current Blue Saiyans.

[ZombieVito]

I hope it happens too. Imagine Piccolo using the Hellzone Grennade on Goku. Setting up an attack that Goku can't dodge with Ultra Instinct.

It doesn't seem like Orange Piccolo is weaker though? Like, he seems on their level and stuff. Idk, maybe it's just me.

He's UI level but on the lower end. Remember that in the movie he couldn't beat a weakened Cell Max and didn't even attempt to do it with a Senzu bean. If I would put it unto numbers it would be something like this:

Beast Gohan: 10

Cell Max: 9
-- Damaged: 6

SSFP Broly: 9
UI Goku: 8.5
UE Vegeta: 8.5

Orange Piccolo: 5
-- Weakened: 4

Was Cell Max ever scaled to Goku and Vegeta in the movie? I can't remember if he was or not

Gohan says that they might have not been able to beat Cell Max.

[PJ The Grey]

I hope it happens too. Imagine Piccolo using the Hellzone Grennade on Goku. Setting up an attack that Goku can't dodge with Ultra Instinct.

It doesn't seem like Orange Piccolo is weaker though? Like, he seems on their level and stuff. Idk, maybe it's just me.

He's UI level but on the lower end. Remember that in the movie he couldn't beat a weakened Cell Max and didn't even attempt to do it with a Senzu bean. If I would put it unto numbers it would be something like this:

Beast Gohan: 10

Cell Max: 9
-- Damaged: 6

SSFP Broly: 9
UI Goku: 8.5
UE Vegeta: 8.5

Orange Piccolo: 5
-- Weakened: 4

Is this current Superhero Broly that you have slightly above Goku and Vegeta, or is this the Broly we saw in DBS Broly? It makes sense for him to be stronger cause of the statements with him and Cell Max, but I'm not sure, since Goku and Vegeta were competing for strongest in the universe title in the granolah arc, and broly wasn't in the equation



On another note, if Frieza from the Namek Arc unlocked the Black form, with no training but no stamina drain either, how far would he get here?

1. Piccolo (android arc, fused with kami)
2. Super Vegeta
3. Super Perfect Cell
4. Fat Buu
5. SSJ3 Gotenks
6. Buuhan
7. Super Vegito (Z)
8. Super Saiyan God Goku (BoG)
9. Golden Frieza (RoF)
10. Hit (no killing techniques)


Bonus: For the second gauntlet, this is what if Frieza unlocked the Black form during the 4 months of training in RoF? No stamina drain again:

1. Hit (no killing techniques)
2. Rosé and Zamasu
3. Hakaishin Toppo
4. UI Omen (3rd time)
5. Jiren (limit broken)
6. Moro 73

[ZombieVito]

Is this current Superhero Broly that you have slightly above Goku and Vegeta, or is this the Broly we saw in DBS Broly? It makes sense for him to be stronger cause of the statements with him and Cell Max, but I'm not sure, since Goku and Vegeta were competing for strongest in the universe title in the granolah arc, and broly wasn't in the equation

Doesn't Goku tell Vegeta in the movie that they still need to surpass Broly?

[FPSSJ4_Goku]

I hope it happens too. Imagine Piccolo using the Hellzone Grennade on Goku. Setting up an attack that Goku can't dodge with Ultra Instinct.

It doesn't seem like Orange Piccolo is weaker though? Like, he seems on their level and stuff. Idk, maybe it's just me.

He's UI level but on the lower end. Remember that in the movie he couldn't beat a weakened Cell Max and didn't even attempt to do it with a Senzu bean. If I would put it unto numbers it would be something like this:

Beast Gohan: 10

Cell Max: 9
-- Damaged: 6

SSFP Broly: 9
UI Goku: 8.5
UE Vegeta: 8.5

Orange Piccolo: 5
-- Weakened: 4

Why is Broly stronger than Goku and Vegeta? If UE Vegeta was on par with (and was initially throwing around) Granolah, and he wished to be the strongest mortal, then would that not place him above Broly and the others, with only Gas and Black Freeza being above him?

[ZombieVito]

Why is Broly stronger than Goku and Vegeta? If UE Vegeta was on par with (and was initially throwing around) Granolah, and he wished to be the strongest mortal, then would that not place him above Broly and the others, with only Gas and Black Freeza being above him?

Because Goku said so in Super Hero.

[Galan007]

Gohan says that they might have not been able to beat Cell Max.

After the battle had concluded, didn't Piccolo also state that they couldn't have won if Gamma #2 hadn't used his kamikaze move to weaken Cell..? Potentially implying that not even Beast Gohan was stronger than a FP Cell Max?