Official levels from Jump. Finally Cell's and Buu's saga

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Official levels from Jump. Finally Cell's and Buu's saga

Post by goldsaint13 » Thu Jun 30, 2011 3:00 pm

:) Hi to you all!!!

It has been a while... :P


I wanted to discuss them with you because this is the most competent Dragon Ball forum around and this revelation could put an end to many endless debates...


If you have already discussed the matter just send me to the right topic and close this one, but I didn't find another topic on this...



It seems that a Jump scan confirmed many levels from the Cell's and Buu's saga that has been hard even to guess until now...


This is the little scan:

Image

The larger one:

http://images2.wikia.nocookie.net/__cb2 ... epower.JPG



8) :shock: Amazing...



As the most expert among you will see, they are not values just randomly guessed...


They are written with the aid of 2 basic criteria:


The first:

They keep into account the already known fact of Super Saiyan forms multipliers...
So SSJ3 is SSJ2 x4 and SSJ2 is SSJ1 x2...

And this is ok...


But there is a amazing definition there... :mrgreen:


The second:

This scan basically defines the measure conversion from Kili, the measure used by Babidi's counter, and the Freezer's army famous Scouter...

Now we just know that:

1 KILI = 1.000.000 IN SCOUTER MEASURE


Scouters are done to measure relatively low powers and they explode with too high levels, even the advanced ones...
Babidi uses a way bigger measure because he has to deal with SSJ FP and SSJ2 power ranges to gain the energy to wake up Majin Buu...


So as Goku SSJ FP was 3000 Kili he is 3.000.000.000 in power level and Yakon is 800.000.000 because he was 800 Kili...


Beside this clear thing we can also notice some interesting things... I'll try to list them up...



- Finally the so long (while pointelss) debate with Goku's fanboys that claimed Goku to be stronger than Gotenks, that is absurd, is ended...
SSJ3 Goku is listed as 24.000.000.000 and SSJ3 Gotenks is easily calculated as 32.000.000.000, equal to Super Buu and multipling his SSJ form x8...

- The previous point may bring to assume that Kid Buu is equal to SSJ3 Goku and then 24.000.000.000 as well...

- The level of Fat Buu is not listed but could be the difference between Kid Buu and Super Buu, 8.000.000.000... Majin Vegeta SSJ2 and Goku SSJ2 are 6.000.000.000 and they can't beat him... It's fitting...

- As I always said, Goku has not improved as raw battle power from Cell's to Buu's saga... His power up came only from having gained SSJ2 and SSJ3 but his power was the same that during Cell Games if we considers only SSJ1 FP... That's implied by the fact that he said to Vegeta that it was pointless for him (Goku) to return into the Room of Spirit and Time because he couldn't get any stronger, he was at the limit, while Vegeta (that was not Full Power yet) could...

- Cell Games SSJ FP Gohan is listed as 2.500.000.000, but it's not the angered form, because we know that the level of SSJ2 Cell Games Gohan is more or less the same as SSJ2 Goku and Majin Vegeta, so 6.000.000.000...

- I'm surprised to see that King Cold is only 90.000.000... Freezer said that his father could knock him down faster that Goku Kaiohken x20 and this fits with that definition...

- Android's saga SSJ Vegeta is 200.000.000, as Piccolo said he overmatched Goku, but he remembered Goku as being 150.000.000, they didn't knew how strong he would have been without the illness...

- Super Vegeta Dai Ni Dankai is stated as 1.000.000.000... That means Ascended Super Saiyan could be around base SSJ x4...

- Perfect Cell is 4.000.000.000... Stronger than SSJ Goku but weaker than SSJ2 Gohan...
It's fitting with Darbula claiming that a power of 4000 Kili was not enough to overcome him... And Darbula being equal to Cell is also 4.000.000.000 that are 4000 Kili...

- SSJ1 Gotenks is quite lower than I expected... As SSJ3 he easily outlclasses most characters but as SSJ1 he is as strong as Cell and Darbula? :?
Possibly Goku planned to make Gotenks a SSJ2 to beat Fat Buu because he would be 8.000.000.000 that is possibly equal to Fat Buu...

- Ginew Squad middle members are not exactly equal but as I supposed, they are mostly like Nail around 40.000...

- Most of the other levels are taken from the manga or previous Daizenshuus and Jump issues...



:D So... What do you think about these possibly epochal revelations?
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Re: Official levels from Jump. Finally Cell's and Buu's saga

Post by Nineteen » Thu Jun 30, 2011 3:10 pm

I thought I recalled this being outed as a fake a long time ago? I could be mistaken.
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Re: Official levels from Jump. Finally Cell's and Buu's saga

Post by Savage68 » Thu Jun 30, 2011 3:11 pm

I think this has come up once or twice before, with similar reactions and insight.

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Re: Official levels from Jump. Finally Cell's and Buu's saga

Post by goldsaint13 » Thu Jun 30, 2011 3:16 pm

Nineteen wrote:I thought I recalled this being outed as a fake a long time ago? I could be mistaken.
:D I really want to know if they are official or fake instead...


They are actually a lot fitting to be fake...


I searched through the topics but I didn't go too backwards with the topics...
Savage68 wrote:I think this has come up once or twice before, with similar reactions and insight.
I'm going to read these threads... I want to know more... Thanks... :wink:
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Re: Official levels from Jump. Finally Cell's and Buu's saga

Post by Herms » Thu Jun 30, 2011 3:19 pm

goldsaint13 wrote::D So... What do you think about these possibly epochal revelations?
It's a blatant fake, or possibly some fan work that people mistakenly took as something official. But it's definitely nothing from Jump or any other official product.
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Re: Official levels from Jump. Finally Cell's and Buu's saga

Post by Adamant » Thu Jun 30, 2011 3:21 pm

Nineteen wrote:I thought I recalled this being outed as a fake a long time ago? I could be mistaken.
Not fake, but a fan chart of all officially given battle powers and all powers that can be calculated through officially given information (though these involve just assuming a couple unstated things, like exactly how the kili scale works, and thus end being merely "official if you make these particular assumptions").
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Re: Official levels from Jump. Finally Cell's and Buu's saga

Post by Herms » Thu Jun 30, 2011 3:31 pm

Adamant wrote:Not fake, but a fan chart of all officially given battle powers and all powers that can be calculated through officially given information (though these involve just assuming a couple unstated things, like exactly how the kili scale works, and thus end being merely "official if you make these particular assumptions").
It's possible, although there are some things about it that make it seem like it was made by someone with limited Japanese skills or familiarity with the Japanese version (Ma Junior being called "Piccolo Junior", Oozaru called Oozaru henshin-tai, the suspicious lack of any but the bare minimum amount of text), which brings up the question of why someone like that would be trying to put something together in Japanese if not to pass it off as something official. But there's probably no way to say for sure and it doesn't really matter either way as long as people know it's not official.
Last edited by Herms on Thu Jun 30, 2011 3:43 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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Re: Official levels from Jump. Finally Cell's and Buu's saga

Post by goldsaint13 » Thu Jun 30, 2011 3:32 pm

Herms wrote: It's a blatant fake, or possibly some fan work that people mistakenly took as something official. But it's definitely nothing from Jump or any other official product.
So is there the 100% confirmation that it's not from an official issue?
Adamant wrote: Not fake, but a fan chart of all officially given battle powers and all powers that can be calculated through officially given information (though these involve just assuming a couple unstated things, like exactly how the kili scale works, and thus end being merely "official if you make these particular assumptions").
The most important thing there is the "1 Kili = 1.000.000" thing...


With that assumption it's a lot easier to have levels, considering also the SSJ multipliers...


But that wouldn't be enough anyway... If they are official ok... Otherwise they are not official and although they may be even more or less well done, they are still not official anyway...
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Re: Official levels from Jump. Finally Cell's and Buu's saga

Post by goldsaint13 » Thu Jun 30, 2011 3:33 pm

Herms wrote:as long as people know it's not official.
:P As long as we know that, there's not much more to say...

I find those levels well done anyway... But this means nothing on the officiality side...
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Re: Official levels from Jump. Finally Cell's and Buu's saga

Post by Herms » Thu Jun 30, 2011 3:49 pm

goldsaint13 wrote:So is there the 100% confirmation that it's not from an official issue?
Well, you've kind of got that in reverse. What you should ask is whether there's any evidence that it is from an official release, and there is none of any sort. The scan itself says nothing about Jump and does not even look like a page from Weekly or V-Jump. People who say this comes from Jump have offered no evidence to support the claim. If it's not from Jump then that pretty much just leaves official guide books, and while I don't personally own any of the post-SEG books like Ultimate Battle Collection or Golden Warrior, Hujio and others on the board do and according to them it's not in any of those books.
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Re: Official levels from Jump. Finally Cell's and Buu's saga

Post by goldsaint13 » Thu Jun 30, 2011 3:58 pm

Herms wrote: Well, you've kind of got that in reverse. What you should ask is whether there's any evidence that it is from an official release, and there is none of any sort. The scan itself says nothing about Jump and does not even look like a page from Weekly or V-Jump. People who say this comes from Jump have offered no evidence to support the claim. If it's not from Jump then that pretty much just leaves official guide books, and while I don't personally own any of the post-SEG books like Ultimate Battle Collection or Golden Warrior, Hujio and others on the board do and according to them it's not in any of those books.
:P Knowing that you are aware of any issue published, I decided to ask you because I'm the first one in doubt of this scan to be official or not...

Knowing that it's not from a Guide... Couldn't it be from a magazine?

Mine is just a question... To just be 100% sure...


And also couldn't it be from a pre-SEG book?

The SSJ multipliers could actually be firstly published on a previous book as battle powers...

Maybe a book came out saying Goku's Battle powers in the various forms (like SSJ = 3 billions, SSJ2 = 6 billions and SSJ3 = 24 billions) and the SEG listed the actualy multiplier rules that are assumed from those Battle Powers...

I'm only reverting the order of things to make sure that the unofficiality of the scan is ensured...

I don't like to think that the battle powers are those and then discover that they are fake... :D

Like many shocked people that can't believe SSJ Goku to be 150 millions and not 15 millions like in that famous mistranslation... :lol:
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Re: Official levels from Jump. Finally Cell's and Buu's saga

Post by Herms » Thu Jun 30, 2011 4:38 pm

goldsaint13 wrote:Knowing that it's not from a Guide... Couldn't it be from a magazine?
Again, there's no reason to think it is. The image itself gives no indication of being from a magazine and looks very little like something from a magazine. There's no introduction paragraph or explanations for anything beyond simple names and labels. There are plenty of people following Weekly and V-Jump closely (and there's not much chance of something like this running anywhere other than Jump), so why did none of them notice this thing when it ran? There's all sorts of evidence that it never appeared in any magazine, and no evidence that it did.
And also couldn't it be from a pre-SEG book?
I own every guide book up to the SEGs, and it's not in any of them.
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Re: Official levels from Jump. Finally Cell's and Buu's saga

Post by goldsaint13 » Fri Jul 01, 2011 12:10 am

Herms wrote: Again, there's no reason to think it is. The image itself gives no indication of being from a magazine and looks very little like something from a magazine. There's no introduction paragraph or explanations for anything beyond simple names and labels. There are plenty of people following Weekly and V-Jump closely (and there's not much chance of something like this running anywhere other than Jump), so why did none of them notice this thing when it ran? There's all sorts of evidence that it never appeared in any magazine, and no evidence that it did.
Well, the introduction paragraph could have been on the previous page, anway if all that bought Weekly and V-Jump never noticed it, it's unlikely that the page is real...
Added to this, the numbers are written in western manner, and it's suspicious...

It has to be said that if it's a fake, it's well done, not only in the contents but also in the shape... If you notice the larger image, you'll see that it's actually a scan from a paper sheet... Not a collage made with the PC and never printed... So they first printed it, then scanned it again... So, very good work for a probably fake...
I own every guide book up to the SEGs, and it's not in any of them.
Oh... Then it's clear...
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Re: Official levels from Jump. Finally Cell's and Buu's saga

Post by Olivier Hague » Fri Jul 01, 2011 12:37 am

goldsaint13 wrote:if all that bought Weekly and V-Jump never noticed it, it's unlikely that the page is real...
On top of everything Herms said already (and that should be more than enough), there isn't a single furigana on that page, and you can bet there would be, in an official Dragon Ball-related article by the Shûeisha.
As fake as can be.

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Re: Official levels from Jump. Finally Cell's and Buu's saga

Post by goldsaint13 » Fri Jul 01, 2011 2:18 am

Olivier Hague wrote: On top of everything Herms said already (and that should be more than enough), there isn't a single furigana on that page, and you can bet there would be, in an official Dragon Ball-related article by the Shûeisha.
As fake as can be.
Yes, those little writings above other kanjis... I actually never see a japanese writing without them... That's more trait of fakeness than the number written in the western way... :mrgreen:

:cry: Too bad though...

I believed it was real and to finally have the levels from the later sagas... At least a few of them, or more at least, the key to guess them like the conversion Kili ---> Battle Power... :|
That would have been resolutive...


Wel... No one can deny that SSJ2 Goku is 6000 Kili and SSJ3 Goku is 24.000 Kili though... :P




:( But how much is a Kili?
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Re: Official levels from Jump. Finally Cell's and Buu's saga

Post by Fox666 » Fri Jul 01, 2011 8:15 am

It was never stated if Kili is proportional to battle powers, so you can deny. We don't have much information about Kili, so we can't say anything for real.

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Re: Official levels from Jump. Finally Cell's and Buu's saga

Post by funrush » Fri Jul 01, 2011 4:00 pm

I read somewhere that a power level of one million was equal to one kili. I don't know if it was official though.

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Re: Official levels from Jump. Finally Cell's and Buu's saga

Post by dbgtFO » Fri Jul 01, 2011 4:26 pm

funrush wrote:I read somewhere that a power level of one million was equal to one kili. I don't know if it was official though.
It wasn't.

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Re: Official levels from Jump. Finally Cell's and Buu's saga

Post by Nineteen » Fri Jul 01, 2011 4:40 pm

Honestly, the only problems I have with that list are the bottom row. I've got the following:

"Super" Vegeta/"USSJ" Vegeta: ~ 625,000,000
Perfect Cell: ~ 1,200,000,000
Super Perfect Cell: ~ 2,000,000,000
FPSSJ Goku: ~ 950,000,000
SSJ1 Gohan: ~ 1,150,000
SSJ2 Gohan: ~ 2,300,000,000
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Re: Official levels from Jump. Finally Cell's and Buu's saga

Post by Fox666 » Fri Jul 01, 2011 5:13 pm

I, on the other hand, think you are heavily underestimating the power-ups from the Cell saga. There have been many many many instances which a character is unchartered from the others attack and that sort of thing. Besides seems like you forget that Vegeta was astonished by half of Goku's Ki. :P
Last edited by Fox666 on Fri Jul 01, 2011 5:20 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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