Speculation: Dende's Power Level

[Kaboom]

Except Spopovich.

Yeah, and we can guess, but we don't know how strong he is either. I think even Videl's got a PL of like at least like 20 or so from learning to use her ki, and Spopovich could very well be way stronger than her and playing around.

Regardless, looking at Dende... I just can't believe at all that someone could get their dormant power unlocked and be streaking through the sky like that yet still only have a single-digit power level. No way, that's just goofy.

"Dende's not a warrior" doesn't have to mean anything more than that he's not built or suited for fighting. Even if he has a PL of a few thousand or something, he's a little kid with a bizarre alien body and no combat skills whatsoever. That's only going to hold Goku back if they Fused. Meanwhile, combining with Mr. Satan may only increase Goku's power by a little bit at best, but at least it wouldn't freakishly mutate Goku's body or inhibit his fighting skills.

Imagine if Goku had a choice between Mr. Satan or baby Broli instead. Is he going to merge with the adult who at least has some combat skills, or is he going to screw up his mind and body by merging with a drooling, incapable infant just because of that 10,000 power level?

[Hitiro]

Guru said that Nail was the only Warrior-type Namekian on Namek. Despite this we see 3 Namekian's fighting against Freeza's men with battle powers that exceeded 3,000. So it is highly likely that Dende's battle power is in the 100's, if not 1,000's.

[RandomGuy96]

Except Spopovich.

Yeah, and we can guess, but we don't know how strong he is either. I think even Videl's got a PL of like at least like 20 or so from learning to use her ki, and Spopovich could very well be way stronger than her and playing around.

Regardless, looking at Dende... I just can't believe at all that someone could get their dormant power unlocked and be streaking through the sky like that yet still only have a single-digit power level. No way, that's just goofy.

"Dende's not a warrior" doesn't have to mean anything more than that he's not built or suited for fighting. Even if he has a PL of a few thousand or something, he's a little kid with a bizarre alien body and no combat skills whatsoever. That's only going to hold Goku back if they Fused. Meanwhile, combining with Mr. Satan may only increase Goku's power by a little bit at best, but at least it wouldn't freakishly mutate Goku's body or inhibit his fighting skills.

Imagine if Goku had a choice between Mr. Satan or baby Broli instead. Is he going to merge with the adult who at least has some combat skills, or is he going to screw up his mind and body by merging with a drooling, incapable infant just because of that 10,000 power level?

He nearly died in that fight; clearly not playing around. Oh, and what do you base Videl's power level of 20 on? She's clearly weaker than Goku in chapter 1, when his power level was 10. He was lifting cars and shrugging off pistol bullets.

Except that's exactly what happened with Spopovich. Streaks around with an aura, still needed regeneration and unlimited stamina to beat someone below 10. I don't know why Goku would call Dende "not a warrior" and opt to fuse with Mr. Satan, if Dende was literally (in actuality, not in BP) trillions of times stronger. No way, that's just goofy.

Goku never at any point referenced his species and body as a handicap. It'd make sense if he said that, but he was quite clear that he was rejecting Dende as a fusion candidate because he wasn't a fighter, i.e. he's weak. He never said "Damn, Dende is trillions of times stronger than Satan, but his Namekian physiology makes fusion impractical". Dende was an adult, by the way.

Not remotely comparable. Dende isn't a baby and doesn't suffer from a harmful physical mutation. He's also not mentally ill.

Anyway, while technically it's not completely impossible for Dende to be that strong, nothing indicates he is, and there's really no reason to think he's thay strong unless you really, really want him to be.

[Hitiro]

He nearly died in that fight; clearly not playing around. Oh, and what do you base Videl's power level of 20 on? She's clearly weaker than Goku in chapter 1, when his power level was 10. He was lifting cars and shrugging off pistol bullets.

Goku is clearly different from any normal person even before we are told that he is an alien from a planet with 10x Earth's gravity. All through the Dragon Ball story we have characters referencing his durability being well above what would be the norm for humans. Most people even going as far as to say he is a monster. So comparing Videl with Goku from the beginning of Dragon Ball is not really a fair thing to do.

[Sandubadear]

Guru said that Nail was the only Warrior-type Namekian on Namek. Despite this we see 3 Namekian's fighting against Freeza's men with battle powers that exceeded 3,000. So it is highly likely that Dende's battle power is in the 100's, if not 1,000's.

Those 3 Namekians were also Warrior-types. See this post, it says there are 3 Warrior-types in Muuri's village. The Grand Elder doesn't say Nail is the only Warrior-type, he says he is the only "true Warrior", meaning he is different from the other ones.

Spoiler:

[RandomGuy96]

He nearly died in that fight; clearly not playing around. Oh, and what do you base Videl's power level of 20 on? She's clearly weaker than Goku in chapter 1, when his power level was 10. He was lifting cars and shrugging off pistol bullets.

Goku is clearly different from any normal person even before we are told that he is an alien from a planet with 10x Earth's gravity. All through the Dragon Ball story we have characters referencing his durability being well above what would be the norm for humans. Most people even going as far as to say he is a monster. So comparing Videl with Goku from the beginning of Dragon Ball is not really a fair thing to do.

Of course his durability is well beyond the average human's. He had a power level of 10. Also "he's really tough", "he's not normal", "he's a monster", etc. are just stock phrases for describing someone with a high power level.

[Hitiro]

Guru said that Nail was the only Warrior-type Namekian on Namek. Despite this we see 3 Namekian's fighting against Freeza's men with battle powers that exceeded 3,000. So it is highly likely that Dende's battle power is in the 100's, if not 1,000's.

Those 3 Namekians were also Warrior-types. See this post, it says there are 3 Warrior-types in Muuri's village. The Grand Elder doesn't say Nail is the only Warrior-type, he says he is the only "true Warrior", meaning he is different from the other ones.

Spoiler:

I'm well aware of this information but I prefer to ignore the Daizenshuu on this part because Guru states that Nail is the only Warrior-type Namekian on Namek. And I can accept that because A) The race was nearly wiped out so it would be common sense for Guru to birth Dragon Clan Namekians as they are the only ones who can reproduce and create Dragon Balls and B) the Dragon Clan were already pretty strong any way. I mean if you look at the child of Kattatz, who was of the Dragon Clan, Guru states that if they remained as one they wouldn't have lost to the Saiyan's. That already puts one Dragon Clansman above 20,000+. They are also a peaceful race so I would think Guru thought they wouldn't need a Warrior-Type but on the safe side created one just in case.

In my opinion Manga > Databooks in this regard. Which is what I think about most information unless there is no evidence against the Databooks to say otherwise. But in this case we have a statement from both Guru and Nail stating he was the only Warrior-Type to exist on Namek.

Also, the image you provided isn't translated very well. Because Herms has translated this line on site straight from Japanese and it actually says:

Chapter: 285 (DBZ 91), P14.2
Context: talking to Freeza
Great Elder: “Nail won’t be as easy to defeat as you imagine…He’s the only Warrior-type Namekian on this planet. Things won’t go as they have with the Namekians you people have killed.”

Also:

Chapter: 286 (DBZ 92), P5.1-2
Freeza: "Hoh! This is incredible! Your battle power has risen to 42,000. I see, you truly do seem to be completely different than all the Namekians up to now. I’m surprised…This is a magnificent battle power! I can see why you’re called a Warrior-type. It’s enough to make me want you for an underling."

And finally:

Chapter: 295 (DBZ 101), P1.4, P2.1-5, P3.1
Nail: “I-I’m astonished…I don’t know what kind of training you’ve done, but you’ve acquired unbelievable power…Still, it’s unfortunate…If you had only returned to the original, single Namekian you were, you might have been able to defeat even Freeza…”
Piccolo: “Are you saying that if I merged with God once again, my power would even surpass Freeza!?”
Nail: “Th-that’s right…I was overwhelmingly defeated by Freeza, but I should have a good comprehension of his abilities…[ ] So merge with me…! I’m also the only fighting-type Namekian on this planet…[ ] That’s right…Your power will become many times greater…”
Piccolo: “…You’re not lying, are you?”
Nail: “If you think so, you can just go get killed by Freeza…”

He nearly died in that fight; clearly not playing around. Oh, and what do you base Videl's power level of 20 on? She's clearly weaker than Goku in chapter 1, when his power level was 10. He was lifting cars and shrugging off pistol bullets.

Goku is clearly different from any normal person even before we are told that he is an alien from a planet with 10x Earth's gravity. All through the Dragon Ball story we have characters referencing his durability being well above what would be the norm for humans. Most people even going as far as to say he is a monster. So comparing Videl with Goku from the beginning of Dragon Ball is not really a fair thing to do.

Of course his durability is well beyond the average human's. He had a power level of 10. Also "he's really tough", "he's not normal", "he's a monster", etc. are just stock phrases for describing someone with a high power level.

Even people on par with his ability stated his durability was beyond anything they ever witnessed. I mean it's fair enough for someone like Bulma or regular humans to state that his durability is monstrous. But we get the same phrases from people like Kame-sennin, Kuririn, Tenshinhan and even Piccolo. All of which were either around the same strength as or above during Goku's fights with them or others. It hardly seems natural for anybody who is supposed to be similar in terms of power to say these sorts of things unless he is in fact abnormal.

[Sandubadear]

I see. Still, by the time Nail said he's the "only fighting-type on this planet", all other Namekians were killed except for Dende and the Grand Elder, so it's still possible that there were other warriors, but right now, Nail is the only one.

[Kamiccolo9]

To be fair, when the Great Elder and Nail said those things, practically every other Namekian was dead.

[Hitiro]

I see. Still, by the time Nail said he's the "only fighting-type on this planet", all other Namekians were killed except for Dende and the Grand Elder, so it's still possible that there were other warriors, but right now, Nail is the only one.

To be fair, when the Great Elder and Nail said those things, practically every other Namekian was dead.

The way it was worded suggests that he won't be as easy as the other Namekian's because he is a Warrior-Type Namekian. It loses all meaning if this isn't the first time Freeza, or by proxy his men, will be fighting one. It doesn't really make sense for him to say that Freeza is going to have trouble against him because he is the only Warrior-Type left. Likewise, why would Guru be suggesting things would be different against this Warrior-Type Namekian if there were others that had already been killed? I can understand if it was like you said. That he was a "true" Warrior-Type. Would it have not made more sense for Guru to say "It won't be the same as before, this is the strongest Warrior-Type." If Freeza and his men had thought others before?

But the way the lines are constructed only suggest that Nail is the only one of his people and that because he is the only Warrior-Type he is special in terms of fighting ability. It really seems like a silly statement for Guru to make unless it meant that he truly was the only Warrior-Type even when all the other Namekian's were alive. It's basically like saying "You've defeated dozens of other Warrior-Types but it will be different this time because he is the only Warrior-Type left." Whereas "It'll be different this time because you'll be facing a Warrior-Type." makes more sense.

Basically, Guru gives the reason that Nail is going to be a hard time for Freeza because he is the only Warrior-Type. Otherwise if he wasn't then the reason Guru should have given is that he is the strongest Warrior-Type if there were others, even if they are now dead.

I know in the Anime with English dub they actually make Nail the strongest Warrior-Type. And the lines actually fit with what you're saying. But in Japanese Manga it seems to point to him being literally the only one even before his whole race was wiped out.

[ahill1]

Dende = 28

[dbzfan7]

Weaker than Mr. Satan. I believe Goku was going to choose Mr. Satan over Dende, so I think he must be stronger.

[Hitiro]

Weaker than Mr. Satan. I believe Goku was going to choose Mr. Satan over Dende, so I think he must be stronger.

Well Goku states that it is probably no use with fusing with Dende because he isn't a warrior. So it doesn't necessarily have to be about battle power. The Rou Kaioshin sacrificed a lot of his strength by fusing with a non-fighter. If it is to be believed that he was like the other Kaioshin who were above Freeza then his power must have dropped a significant amount for him to not be able to deflect a weak Ki blast from Goku who Beerus says wouldn't be able to beat Freeza unless he transforms.

[dbzfan7]

Weaker than Mr. Satan. I believe Goku was going to choose Mr. Satan over Dende, so I think he must be stronger.

Well Goku states that it is probably no use with fusing with Dende because he isn't a warrior. So it doesn't necessarily have to be about battle power. The Rou Kaioshin sacrificed a lot of his strength by fusing with a non-fighter. If it is to be believed that he was like the other Kaioshin who were above Freeza then his power must have dropped a significant amount for him to not be able to deflect a weak Ki blast from Goku who Beerus says wouldn't be able to beat Freeza unless he transforms.

I'd think battle power is all he needs. I'm pretty sure if Dende was more powerful, he'd have picked Dende since he needs all the power he can get. Also that old witch Elder Kaioshin fused with was probably weak and only good magical abilities. Dende's abilities could make him greater than Mr. Satan, but his raw power is probably less. Kinda like Babidi having great magic power that Kaioshin feared, but he's actually really weak normally. I remember the dub saying something like Dende's height would hurt Goku like hell, whatever that means.

[Hitiro]

Weaker than Mr. Satan. I believe Goku was going to choose Mr. Satan over Dende, so I think he must be stronger.

Well Goku states that it is probably no use with fusing with Dende because he isn't a warrior. So it doesn't necessarily have to be about battle power. The Rou Kaioshin sacrificed a lot of his strength by fusing with a non-fighter. If it is to be believed that he was like the other Kaioshin who were above Freeza then his power must have dropped a significant amount for him to not be able to deflect a weak Ki blast from Goku who Beerus says wouldn't be able to beat Freeza unless he transforms.

I'd think battle power is all he needs. I'm pretty sure if Dende was more powerful, he'd have picked Dende since he needs all the power he can get. Also that old witch Elder Kaioshin fused with was probably weak and only good magical abilities. Dende's abilities could make him greater than Mr. Satan, but his raw power is probably less. Kinda like Babidi having great magic power that Kaioshin feared, but he's actually really weak normally. I remember the dub saying something like Dende's height would hurt Goku like hell, whatever that means.

If Dende is not a warrior it could effect him adversely just like having someone with a low battle power might. I see no reason why Dende, who has had his potential unlocked and was bursting around Namek at high speeds, something Videl was incapable of. Yet you believe Mr. Satan > Dende > Videl when we have statements putting Videl > Mr. Satan?

Furthermore. Goku only makes reference to strength in regard to Mr. Satan. All he says about Dende is that he isn't a warrior. If status had nothing to do with it then shouldn't he have also said something along the same lines as what he said about Mr. Satan? Surely if Dende is weaker then he would have said so rather than just referring to him not being a combat orientated individual.

[dbzfan7]

I'm not going to argue this. I interpret Goku's statement as Mr. Satan ultimately being the superior option. You interpret it differently. THE END!

[DanielSSJ]

I've thought it over and I can see how Dende would be more powerful than Mr Satan, but be a less viable option for fusion. Anyway, as far as his actual power level goes. Pre-Unlocked Dende is a 10, aka as strong as BoDB Goku. I can see how a non-fighting type Namekian child with Ki training could be about as strong as an untrained low class Saiyan child. After getting his power unlocked, I generally put him at about 1,000, though I can see him being as strong as 5,000 by the time of the Boo Arc.

[Hitiro]

I've thought it over and I can see how Dende would be more powerful than Mr Satan, but be a less viable option for fusion. Anyway, as far as his actual power level goes. Pre-Unlocked Dende is a 10, aka as strong as BoDB Goku. I can see how a non-fighting type Namekian child with Ki training could be about as strong as an untrained low class Saiyan child. After getting his power unlocked, I generally put him at about 1,000, though I can see him being as strong as 5,000 by the time of the Boo Arc.

This is a bit of a necro-post. It should really be avoided. I don't think Dende would be 10 considering the average battle power on Namek is in the 1,000's anyway. If you follow the manga the only Warrior-Type was 48,000 and the Dragon Clan Namekians topped out at 3,000. So he is definitely more likely in the 100's at the start.

[Herms]

It's a bit hasty to say what the "average" BP on Namek was, with the few examples we get.

I think this whole topic just demonstrates again the problem with getting hung up on BP numbers and treating characters with the same or similar numbers as interchangeable. The way I see it, if a character doesn't know how to fight, then they won't be able to fight, no matter what number pops up when you point a scouter at him. Dende presumably has a physically strong body by nature, but I think that would just result in weird situations where his opponent can't physically hurt him while he's unable to fight back.

[Sandubadear]

Goku chose to fuse with Mr Satan because fusing with Dende would bring more cons than pros. He didn't know martial arts, and fusing with him would make the Dragon Balls stop existing. Vegeta and Nappa weren't surprised that a Namekian killed Raditz because they are supposed to be all strong, and they didn't know jack about Warrior/Dragon Clan. Now I don't believe Dende could have defeated Raditz in his first appearance. First he was still a kid and second he's not a fighter like Piccolo Daimao and Kami. After being unlocked he probably could if he used some smartass technique.