Androids #14 and #15's deaths

[Piccolo Daimao]

Is it just me who felt that Androids #14 and #15's deaths in DBZ Movie #7 were both strange and rushed? I mean, Trunks reverts from his SS form back into normal, merely holds his sword out and #14 stupidly runs into it, exploding on contact, for some reason. Vegeta and #15 charge at each other and clash, with Vegeta falling to the ground afterwards. As #15 chuckles to himself, he starts dying (with his laughing becoming slower and deeper) until his head falls off and he explodes as well, for some reason. This may've been because of the former damage Vegeta had inflicted upon on him, the damage he'd recieved from that clash, a combination of those two, or the alcohol he'd been drinking throughout (which would be pretty stupid of him).

[Darkprince410]

#14's death wasn't quite like that though. What happened (at least how I see it) is that the two clashed together while Trunks was a Super Saiya-jin, and their positions afterward with Trunks holding his sword out and #14 having his back to him was the whole cliche of "We don't know who actually took damage from their clash" scenario. Then when #14 turns around and charges towards Trunks, the delayed reaction to the damage Trunks had inflicted on him finally kicked in, causing him to explode.

It's that old scenario where two fighters rush towards eachother only for their actual attack to not be shown (usually their attack is hidden by a flash of light), then when the light subsides, they're standing a good ways away from one another again with their backs towards one another. Eventually one of them finally succumbs to his injuries and falls unconscious/dies (sometimes after some reflective dialogue).

[Piccolo Daimao]

#14's death wasn't quite like that though. What happened (at least how I see it) is that the two clashed together while Trunks was a Super Saiya-jin, and their positions afterward with Trunks holding his sword out and #14 having his back to him was the whole cliche of "We don't know who actually took damage from their clash" scenario. Then when #14 turns around and charges towards Trunks, the delayed reaction to the damage Trunks had inflicted on him finally kicked in, causing him to explode.

It's that old scenario where two fighters rush towards eachother only for their actual attack to not be shown (usually their attack is hidden by a flash of light), then when the light subsides, they're standing a good ways away from one another again with their backs towards one another. Eventually one of them finally succumbs to his injuries and falls unconscious/dies (sometimes after some reflective dialogue).

Yeah, perhaps that happened with #15 too. It just seemed strange, since Trunks put his sword out and #14 appeared to explode just as he reached it.

[DBZGTKOSDH]

Is it the first time that a villain dies in a movie strangely with the feeling "how the hell did that happened?"

[Piccolo Daimao]

Is it the first time that a villain dies in a movie strangely with the feeling "how the hell did that happened?"

Other than maybe Gokuu's Toei Punch in DBZ Movie #8...I guess so.

[roidrage]

Is it the first time that a villain dies in a movie strangely with the feeling "how the hell did that happened?"

Other than maybe Gokuu's Toei Punch in DBZ Movie #8...I guess so.

So that's what they call it? Goku gathers the miniscule energy of his friends and combines it with his own miniscule energy (which makes no sense; none of them at full power could hurt Broli. What little energy they have left combined shouldn't do shit.) and punches Broli through the scar he received on his stomach, killing him, which also makes no sense. The wound can't reopen or serve as a "weak spot" because the attack happened to Broli as a baby and Saiyans only become stronger after a near-death experience.

I'm a very casual viewer who will accept anything a work can make sound plausible, but that plot hole is impossible not to notice. Broli could have spontaneously combusted because the movie was almost over, and it would have made just as much sense, if not more.

[FNF]

I think of Broly's death as a martial arts/samurai cliche to some extent ('determination bring great POWAAAA!','fight with honor!' etc etc). Speaking of which Tenshinhan is an embodiment of this cliche in the manga to some extent.

As for the topic, yes, their deaths were awfully rushed. Just look at the fight itself.

-Trunks and Vegeta struggle in base
-Start tanking hits before they turn SSjin
-Dominate in SSjin (I think?)
-Start struggling in SSjin
-Finish off the Androids
-Revert to base clearly battle worn
-Get back up as if they were good as new

It was a shambles and a lot of people don't realize this straight away. It was worse than the Broly fight imo. It was just that bad.

[Piccolo Daimao]

As for the topic, yes, their deaths were awfully rushed. Just look at the fight itself.

-Trunks and Vegeta struggle in base
-Start tanking hits before they turn SSjin
-Dominate in SSjin (I think?)
-Start struggling in SSjin
-Finish off the Androids
-Revert to base clearly battle worn
-Get back up as if they were good as new

It was a shambles and a lot of people don't realize this straight away. It was worse than the Broly fight imo. It was just that bad.

Yeah, I agree. They do start off dominating in SS, but I think Vegeta at least struggles a bit with #15 and falls to the ground after their clash, although #15 obviously comes off worse and explodes.

Same with Gokuu vs. #13. He struggles both in base and SS against #13.

[DBZ Mick]

I thought #14 had a cool death, Trunks strikes him and it appears to have no effect. #14 then rushes him but as he does he suddenly splits in half and explodes.


#15 was disappointing. Especially as I read in that Beckett DBZ magazine that he had a hilarious death and was waited for two years for it and it was dull.

So that's what they call it? Goku gathers the miniscule energy of his friends and combines it with his own miniscule energy (which makes no sense; none of them at full power could hurt Broli. What little energy they have left combined shouldn't do shit.) and punches Broli through the scar he received on his stomach, killing him, which also makes no sense.

I always thought it was because Goku hit his scar AND Broly was close to needing to discharge his ki (like he did earlier in the movie). Movie #8 makes the case that Broly's power grows too overwhelming for him to contain in his LSSJ form and he needs to discharge it ocassionally. He needed to do it at the time Goku punched him with the Toei Punch and exploded due to it being too much.

[Kingdom Heartless]

Toei didn't seem to mind using that cliche. They used it at least one other time that I can think of (Yamucha vs. the wolf guy) and something similar in Movie 5, though it didn't result in defeat.

[Piccolo Daimao]

Toei didn't seem to mind using that cliche. They used it at least one other time that I can think of (Yamucha vs. the wolf guy) and something similar in Movie 5, though it didn't result in defeat.

Wait, what? When did Yamcha fight a wolf guy? And what happened in DBZ Movie #5?

[In Brightest Day]

Toei didn't seem to mind using that cliche. They used it at least one other time that I can think of (Yamucha vs. the wolf guy) and something similar in Movie 5, though it didn't result in defeat.

Wait, what? When did Yamcha fight a wolf guy? And what happened in DBZ Movie #5?

I believe it was during the 21st Budokai preliminaries. It was one of the Budokai's anyway, but I'm pretty sure it was the 21st.

[Kingdom Heartless]

Toei didn't seem to mind using that cliche. They used it at least one other time that I can think of (Yamucha vs. the wolf guy) and something similar in Movie 5, though it didn't result in defeat.

Wait, what? When did Yamcha fight a wolf guy? And what happened in DBZ Movie #5?

I believe it was during the 21st Budokai preliminaries. It was one of the Budokai's anyway, but I'm pretty sure it was the 21st.

Yep.

And in Movie #5, Sauzer and Piccolo rushed at each other in a similar fashion.

[Piccolo Daimao]

I haven't seen the anime in full, so that explains it. And yeah, I forgot about that part. Piccolo just got his shirt torn a bit.

[Dabooyaka]

Super Gogeta killing Jamemba is the most rushed, piece of crap death I've ever seen. The androids were bad, but not THAT bad.

[Mystic Gohan]

I thought #14 had a cool death, Trunks strikes him and it appears to have no effect. #14 then rushes him but as he does he suddenly splits in half and explodes.


#15 was disappointing. Especially as I read in that Beckett DBZ magazine that he had a hilarious death and was waited for two years for it and it was dull.

So that's what they call it? Goku gathers the miniscule energy of his friends and combines it with his own miniscule energy (which makes no sense; none of them at full power could hurt Broli. What little energy they have left combined shouldn't do shit.) and punches Broli through the scar he received on his stomach, killing him, which also makes no sense.

I always thought it was because Goku hit his scar AND Broly was close to needing to discharge his ki (like he did earlier in the movie). Movie #8 makes the case that Broly's power grows too overwhelming for him to contain in his LSSJ form and he needs to discharge it ocassionally. He needed to do it at the time Goku punched him with the Toei Punch and exploded due to it being too much.

Yeah i don't understand why this theory is dismissed. Nothing goes against it imo. Then it can get rid of this ridiculous hax people have on the so called "Toei Punch".

[Super Vegetto]

Its funny how Toei makes every dbz movie predictable...they whait till the end to transform but first its like they need to test the villian by fighting in base,,second is that Spirit bomb kills every villian and third is that some villians will die by one hit,,i never undertood how did Goku killd Broly and Hirudegarn since he was no match for them,,only way was Spirit Bomb but it seams they didnt whanted Goku to use the same attack almost every movie where he is the last one standing...btw Hirudegarn has some weak point like when he is mad and after he kicks he is off guard which doesnt make sence to kill someone,,its like he is on billions but after attack which draws his energy he is on millions and Gokus dragon fist had enough power to go trough him...well thats movie logic since Frieza didnt died by Spirit bomb or characters dont transform till they got beating...toei made Goku ssj3 stronger than Vegito is our eyes same goes for Kid buu > Buuhan...

[Piccolo Daimao]

Super Gogeta killing Jamemba is the most rushed, piece of crap death I've ever seen. The androids were bad, but not THAT bad.

Are you serious? I didn't know anyone disliked Gogeta killing Janemba. Unlike what the anime does, it didn't drag things out and just cuts the crap with Gogeta defeating Janemba before he could do anything else. If he knows he's much stronger than him, why would he waste time toying around with him? Not to mention that it would lose the impact and awesomeness of Gogeta and his short scene. Everything had been building up to that scene, and it was a fitting climax for Gogeta to come in, all bad-ass, and then not waste any time delivering a combo and then finishing him off with his "Soul Punisher".

This is part of the reason why I prefer Gogeta to Vegetto. Toriyama should've just ignored DBZ Movie #12 and gone with Gogeta anyway, since Potara seemed incredibly contrived, had none of the interesting drawbacks (also a trend for transformations) that Metamorian Fusion had, and it was hard to believe that the East Kaioushin and Kibito somehow didn't know about it.

The Androids and Broli's deaths are rushed because of how strange and unbelievable they were. They reuse the same cross-clash method to kill off the Androids in an entirely uninteresting way. I mean, "delayed damage"? What the fuck is that? I know they're Androids, but it's like they may as well have just spontaneously combusted without anyone hitting him just so they could hurry the movie up for #13 to merge them and power up.

Same with Broli. Read roidrage's post.

[Mystic Gohan]

I also prefer gogeta to vegito. I think the potara was a cheap way of gaining power. All the power of fusion with none of the side-effects? That's freaking stupid.

[hleV]

All the power of fusion with none of the side-effects? That's freaking stupid.

Except that the Potara Fusion is supposed to be permanent.