Cell's near-death power-up boost?

[TheAldella]

Okay, so if this has been done before, I'm really sorry, but this is bugging me, and I hear no one bring it up. Cell blew himself up, and got a power boost from it. But on Namek, Vegeta specifically asks Krillin to blast him because the wounds to fuel a power boost can NOT be self-inflicted. How does that work??

[Saiga]

Goku also gives himself zenkai on the way to Namek, blasting himself with his own Kamehamehas. What Vegeta says is something like "it won't work if I do it myself" which might mean he can't injure himself the way he's wanting Kuririn to.

[Hitiro]

I don't believe it was the fact that self-inflicted attacks can't give a Zenkai boost. But rather that self-inflicted attacks weren't deadly enough to give a big Zenkai boost. The reason Vegeta asks Kuririn to do it is because if Vegeta tried to nearly kill himself he wouldn't be able to go through with it and thus the Zenkai would be minimal. It's like trying to strangle yourself, you wouldn't be able to because your body would react and prevent you from going through with it. Goku had many Zenkai's on the way to Namek but Goku could never fire a blast that would leave a gaping hole in his body to give him a big Zenkai. They were all mini Zenkai's from being suitably hurt. Cell gaining a huge Zenkai is because he used his bomb. Something he couldn't prevent from doing major damage.

[kazamino]

I don't believe it was the fact that self-inflicted attacks can't give a Zenkai boost. But rather that self-inflicted attacks weren't deadly enough to give a big Zenkai boost. The reason Vegeta asks Kuririn to do it is because if Vegeta tried to nearly kill himself he wouldn't be able to go through with it and thus the Zenkai would be minimal. It's like trying to strangle yourself, you wouldn't be able to because your body would react and prevent you from going through with it. Goku had many Zenkai's on the way to Namek but Goku could never fire a blast that would leave a gaping hole in his body to give him a big Zenkai. They were all mini Zenkai's from being suitably hurt. Cell gaining a huge Zenkai is because he used his bomb. Something he couldn't prevent from doing major damage.

Bolded for emphasis...

This is my natural assumption as well

[DBZGTKOSDH]

Cell & Goku got a near-death power-up from self-inflicted injuries, but their aim wasn't to get a near-death power-up. So, I guess that self-inflicted injuries don't give a near-death power-up, unless you are not injuring yourself on purpose to get a power-up.

[dbgtFO]

Cell & Goku got a near-death power-up from self-inflicted injuries, but their aim wasn't to get a near-death power-up. So, I guess that self-inflicted injuries don't give a near-death power-up, unless you are not injuring yourself on purpose to get a power-up.

That sounds pretty stupid to me. It sounds like it is a sentient being like: "You ain't getting any near-death power-up from me, cheating like that!"
It isn't impossible Toriyama could have thought like that, but seriously it seems other non-sensical to me.

I find the explanations offered above far more logical.

[DBZGTKOSDH]

We saw Goku & Cell getting near-death power-ups accidentally, and Vegeta saying that he can't get a near-death power-up by hurting himself. So, I can't reach a different conclusion, other than "plot-hole". But yeah, the idea is that the Saiyans' bodies prevent them from getting stronger through cheating.

The only other explanation that I see is Hituro's, which I would agree with, if we hadn't seen Ginyu landing a deadly hit to himself. I doubt that Vegeta wouldn't be brave enough to hit himself like Ginyu did.

[Pantalones]

Ginyu's probably a special case, though, considering his body-swapping ability.

Most characters can't just jump into a different body if their current one is injured, and nobody knows how long Ginyu's been bouncing from one body to the next (it's implied that the purple guy isn't his original body), so it's possible he's just been doing that for so long that he doesn't really care what happens to a current body (at least if there's no other way out of a situation than discarding it) and as a result no longer has that unconscious inability-to-mortally-wound-himself-on-purpose reaction that most characters would have.

It's almost along the same lines as how Piccolo, Cell, and Buu don't react nearly as much to serious wounds (at least the ones they can regenerate from) as other characters would--since they can just grow it back instantly, and they've gotten used to that fact, it's not as big of a deal to them. And though Cell does seem legitimately surprised when somebody manages to hit him with something that blasts a chunk out of him, yeah, but it always seems like his shock is mainly "holy crap a weakling like you is actually able to make a blast that powerful!?" rather than "holy crap I've got a chunk blasted out of me, I'm injured, panic!" And Buu just doesn't give a crap when someone blows him up, since he's been regenerating for millions of years. XD

[Hitiro]

The only other explanation that I see is Hituro's, which I would agree with, if we hadn't seen Ginyu landing a deadly hit to himself. I doubt that Vegeta wouldn't be brave enough to hit himself like Ginyu did.

Well, was it a deadly hit? I think Goku could have continued to live in Ginyu's body. I would also attribute Ginyu's attack on himself to do with his mental constitution. Like Pantalones says, it isn't like he feared damaging his body because he had the ability to jump bodies. And I also don't think he was quite right in the head.

I mean there are individuals out there who are perfectly capable of doing self-harm to their bodies. But it isn't a huge number of people, it takes a special kind of messed up person to do it. The majority of the population would be reluctant to go through with it.

[DBZGTKOSDH]

Ginyu's hit wasn't deadly, but it could have been. Why wouldn't he be able to fire a ki blast through his chest while his fist was already inside? And I don't think that Vegeta would be scared of the pain this would cause him.

[Hitiro]

Ginyu's hit wasn't deadly, but it could have been. Why wouldn't he be able to fire a ki blast through his chest while his fist was already inside? And I don't think that Vegeta would be scared of the pain this would cause him.

Well I don't think Vegeta is scared of the pain, but scared of hurting himself to the point of death. Vegeta gets scared a lot through the manga though. Giving up because he can't win and he thinks he's going to die. It even reduces him to tears against Freeza when he realises he can't win. But that is my opinion.

[DBZGTKOSDH]

Well I don't think Vegeta is scared of the pain, but scared of hurting himself to the point of death. Vegeta gets scared a lot through the manga though. Giving up because he can't win and he thinks he's going to die. It even reduces him to tears against Freeza when he realises he can't win. But that is my opinion.

I'm not saying that Vegeta is fearless, I'm saying that he is fearless in this specific case. What he wanted was to hurt himself to the point of near-death, so if he had no choice but to do it by himself, then I believe he would do it.

[hleV]

We saw Goku & Cell getting near-death power-ups accidentally, and Vegeta saying that he can't get a near-death power-up by hurting himself. So, I can't reach a different conclusion, other than "plot-hole".

I wouldn't be so quick to depict it as a plothole. What characters say isn't infallible and it could easily be assumed that Vegeta simply didn't know what he was talking about. Just like the asspulled theory of there being a requirement of pure heart for the ascension to SS.

[DBZGTKOSDH]

I wouldn't be so quick to depict it as a plothole. What characters say isn't infallible and it could easily be assumed that Vegeta simply didn't know what he was talking about.

From an out-of-universe point of view, Toriyama wouldn't put it there if it wasn't meant to be true.

Just like the asspulled theory of there being a requirement of pure heart for the ascension to SS.

(Nit-picking) It's tranquil heart, not pure.

[SingleFringe&Sparks]

I still think Perfect Cell should have gotten at least half of a Zenkai boost on the account of having to regenerate. Technically it should be a near death state. After Goku blew his torso apart and after he was consumed by Gohan's Super Kamehameha the first time. Those should have given him boosts if we are comparing it too the logic used on Namek for Goku and Ginyu as well as Vegeta and Krillin.

We saw Goku & Cell getting near-death power-ups accidentally, and Vegeta saying that he can't get a near-death power-up by hurting himself. So, I can't reach a different conclusion, other than "plot-hole".

I wouldn't be so quick to depict it as a plothole. What characters say isn't infallible and it could easily be assumed that Vegeta simply didn't know what he was talking about. Just like the asspulled theory of there being a requirement of pure heart for the ascension to SS.

You'd think that it shouldn't matter how their bodies are injured for them to get Zenkai's. When you cut yourself your skin still heals regardless if it was you who did it on pupose or an external influence. Healing is healing. People would argue why they couldn't just exploit it to get boosts, but it wouldnt make them warriors to rely on that. It would only make sense for Cell to exploit it by his autohealing if Toriyama considered it the same way.

Though I take Goku being pure of heart enabiling him to go SSJ just a character hype tool and not a real explaination. It was just to make Goku seem legendary and the hero as opposed to Freeeza and Vegeta at the time. To me SSJ is just a Super-Zenkai.