Did Vegeta attack the rest of Frieza's empire in the manga?

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Angelus
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Did Vegeta attack the rest of Frieza's empire in the manga?

Post by Angelus » Sat Nov 22, 2014 11:26 am

I'm starting to re-read certain chunks of the manga and I just realized that Vegeta, in the manga, was not shown to fly off back to space after he and everyone else was transported to Earth by Porunga. Not even after Porunga said that Goku did not want to come back to Earth yet, which would imply, that Goku was out training in space (at least in the mind of Vegeta). In the anime, this led Vegeta to fly off back to space to look for remnants of Frieza's remaining empire but then he comes back to Earth after a while WITHOUT becoming a Super Saiyan.

However, after it was shown in the anime that Vegeta was training on some asteroid or something, that's when he turned Super Saiyan. Was this ever shown in the manga? Was there mention that he destroyed the remnants of Frieza's empire around that time? I'm scrolling through chapters of the Androids saga where Vegeta is a SSJ against the Fat Android but I can't find anything about Vegeta and that asteroid or finishing off Frieza's empire. Am I missing a few reads?
Last edited by Angelus on Sat Nov 22, 2014 12:08 pm, edited 2 times in total.

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Re: Did Vegeta destroy the rest of Freeza's empire in the ma

Post by Marco Polo » Sat Nov 22, 2014 11:37 am

Remnants of Freeza's empire still existed afterwards, as seen in the JSAT Special and the upcoming Fukkatsu no 'F', so I'm going to say no.

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Re: Did Vegeta destroy the rest of Freeza's empire in the ma

Post by Angelus » Sat Nov 22, 2014 11:46 am

Yes, but those characters were made after the manga ended. If the manga ended in the Frieza arc and the Cell arc was never made, then it would be true that the Red Ribbon Army was fully destroyed. But since the Cell arc was made, it was clear that there were remnants of the Red Ribbon Army: Dr. Gero and his androids. Likewise, we always know that Vegeta and Goku were the only remaining full-blooded Saiyans around. Until of course the 2008 Son Goku and friends Return movie came out, and the Turles and Broly movies before that.

Anyways did it actually show in the manga that Vegeta trained or went after remnants of Frieza's empire in the manga? Not necessarily total annihilation of remanants of Frieza's empire.

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Re: Did Vegeta attack the rest of Freeza's empire in the man

Post by Gaffer Tape » Sat Nov 22, 2014 12:04 pm

No. None of that was shown in the manga. Vegeta was never shown to leave earth ever again after being transported there by the Dragon Balls (except for that business on Babidi's ship).
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Re: Did Vegeta attack the rest of Freeza's empire in the man

Post by Angelus » Sat Nov 22, 2014 12:10 pm

So Vegeta became a SSJ on while training for 3 years on Earth?

Strange. He would have been sensed by everyone for his first time transforming. Yet everyone got so surprised that he was a SSJ in the Androids saga.

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Re: Did Vegeta attack the rest of Freeza's empire in the man

Post by hleV » Sat Nov 22, 2014 12:13 pm

A movie/one-shot about Vegeta's actual, non-filler ascension to Super Saiyan and riddance of Freeza empire's remnants would be interesting. It probably didn't happen, though. Even DBO, which was supervised by Toriyama, has Freeza empire's remnants up and running.

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Re: Did Vegeta attack the rest of Freeza's empire in the man

Post by Marco Polo » Sat Nov 22, 2014 12:16 pm

Angelus wrote:So Vegeta became a SSJ on while training for 3 years on Earth?

Strange. He would have been sensed by everyone for his first time transforming. Yet everyone got so surprised that he was a SSJ in the Androids saga.
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Re: Did Vegeta attack the rest of Freeza's empire in the man

Post by rereboy » Sat Nov 22, 2014 12:18 pm

Angelus wrote:So Vegeta became a SSJ on while training for 3 years on Earth?

Strange. He would have been sensed by everyone for his first time transforming. Yet everyone got so surprised that he was a SSJ in the Androids saga.
We hardly see his training during those three years. Its entirely possible that he actually left the Earth for some time to train, we simply don't know all that he did. As such we also don't know if them not sensing SSJ is a plothole or not.

What is actually a plothole is no one sensing Trunks or Goten turning SSJ when they first did it because regarding those we can safely assume they were on Earth.

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Re: Did Vegeta attack the rest of Freeza's empire in the man

Post by Marco Polo » Sat Nov 22, 2014 12:21 pm

rereboy wrote:What is actually a plothole is no one sensing Trunks or Goten turning SSJ when they first did it because regarding those we can safely assume they were on Earth.
Maybe Vegeta just assumed it was Gohan, and vice versa.

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Re: Did Vegeta attack the rest of Freeza's empire in the man

Post by rereboy » Sat Nov 22, 2014 12:23 pm

Marco Polo wrote:
rereboy wrote:What is actually a plothole is no one sensing Trunks or Goten turning SSJ when they first did it because regarding those we can safely assume they were on Earth.
Maybe Vegeta just assumed it was Gohan, and vice versa.
Its possible, but there's a vast difference in power between them so its not very likely, I think.

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Re: Did Vegeta attack the rest of Freeza's empire in the man

Post by Angelus » Sat Nov 22, 2014 12:25 pm

Or do they have to actually "sense out" someone to be able to detect it? Gohan wasn't able to sense Tien after all, in the Buu saga.. . that's why Tien wasn't invited to the tournament. I don't know why Tien would intentionally hide his ki like that. Imperfect Cell hid his ki intentionally to avoid being spotted. But why Tien or Chiaotzu?

Verdict stands, no scenes or implications in the manga show that Vegeta went back to outer space to either solely train or, as part of training or fun, go after the remnants, but not all, of Frieza's empire?

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Re: Did Vegeta attack the rest of Freeza's empire in the man

Post by rereboy » Sat Nov 22, 2014 12:28 pm

They all automatically sensed Freeza when he came close to Earth and he was weaker than a SSJ, so they don't have to be trying to feel Ki.

And yes, there's nothing on the manga saying that he did or that he didn't.

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Re: Did Vegeta attack the rest of Freeza's empire in the man

Post by Eire » Sat Nov 22, 2014 12:49 pm

hleV wrote:A movie/one-shot about Vegeta's actual, non-filler ascension to Super Saiyan and riddance of Freeza empire's remnants would be interesting. It probably didn't happen, though. Even DBO, which was supervised by Toriyama, has Freeza empire's remnants up and running.
Remnants, not empire as a whole.
Since whole organisation was based on leader's strenght and charisma alone I wouldn't be suprised if his death was followed by civil war among generals, trying to get their piece of cake. For real life counterpart look at the Alexander's empire that had literally fallen into pieces- most of the kingdoms.were fairly short lived, but Ptolemaic dynasty made themselves comfortable in Egypt and were proud to remid abiur their beginning even centuries.latter.
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Re: Did Vegeta attack the rest of Freeza's empire in the man

Post by dbgtFO » Sat Nov 22, 2014 2:32 pm

I suggested in the DB2015 thread, that Vegeta may have done so in the alternate timelines, justifying a lack of reborn Freeza there, but didn't in the main timeline, because he was busy training for the androids.
That's what I like to think.

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Re: Did Vegeta attack the rest of Freeza's empire in the man

Post by Regarder » Sat Nov 22, 2014 2:38 pm

It's still possible Toriyama came up with it. Maybe there's a note from Toriyama to the anime staff that we'll never see.

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Re: Did Vegeta attack the rest of Freeza's empire in the man

Post by Angelus » Sat Nov 22, 2014 3:09 pm

dbgtFO wrote:I suggested in the DB2015 thread, that Vegeta may have done so in the alternate timelines, justifying a lack of reborn Freeza there, but didn't in the main timeline, because he was busy training for the androids.
That's what I like to think.
Do you mean mecha frieza?

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Re: Did Vegeta attack the rest of Freeza's empire in the man

Post by dbgtFO » Sat Nov 22, 2014 3:16 pm

Angelus wrote:
dbgtFO wrote:I suggested in the DB2015 thread, that Vegeta may have done so in the alternate timelines, justifying a lack of reborn Freeza there, but didn't in the main timeline, because he was busy training for the androids.
That's what I like to think.
Do you mean mecha Freeza?
No, I'm talking about this new revived Freeza. I doubt those guys would be around in the alternate timelines(and of course there wouldn't be Earth DBs anyway).

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Re: Did Vegeta attack the rest of Freeza's empire in the man

Post by Bussani » Sat Nov 22, 2014 4:29 pm

I think ki sensing is a bit like hearing. You don't have to actively be listening out for noise to hear a sound, especially if it's loud or out of nowhere. But at the same time, if you're distracted by something, someone can talk directly to you without you really hearing them. It's also possible to get used to a sound to the point that it becomes white noise and you don't notice it at all anymore.

There are lots of times characters don't notice a ki when it's right in front of them (e.g. bad guy has just been caught in a blast and everyone is excited, except Piccolo who points out his ki hasn't fallen at all--the white noise effect, maybe?), other times where character A can't sense character B despite trying to (e.g. Gohan trying to sense Videl, but can't until she starts fighting, presumably because her ki is too subtle), and yet other times where character A can sense character B despite their ki being tiny (e.g. Goku being able to pick out Bulma's ki, even though he commented it was tough).

Anyway, Goten and Trunks's Super Saiyan going undetected by anyone does seem like the oddest one. There's also the fact that only Gohan and Piccolo seem to know how strong Goku should be when he fights #19. If they saw his full power during training, shouldn't everyone else on Earth have felt it, too?
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