Legendary Golden Oozaru the "true" Super Saiyan form?

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Legendary Golden Oozaru the "true" Super Saiyan form?

Post by Bacon Skittles » Sun Apr 12, 2015 5:00 pm

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Re: Legendary Golden Oozaru the "true" Super Saiyan form?

Post by Marco Polo » Sun Apr 12, 2015 5:02 pm

Nah I'm pretty sure it's Bardock.

Image

He fought Chilled as an SSJ and Chilled survived long enough to tell his men about it. That's when the Super Saiyan legend was born.

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Re: Legendary Golden Oozaru the "true" Super Saiyan form?

Post by Dyno » Sun Apr 12, 2015 5:15 pm

Marco Polo pretty awesomely and straight to the point answered the topic's question. No need to go even further. :wink:

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Re: Legendary Golden Oozaru the "true" Super Saiyan form?

Post by bubibartra » Sun Apr 12, 2015 5:18 pm

Bacon Skittles wrote:While I don't like GT, the perfect files did have a unique piece of info stating that Saiyans could have originally been Great Apes who achieved human form. The GT perfect files also states:

"Incidentally, the Super Saiyan legend has a passage saying that they “love destruction and slaughter”, but in actuality everyone retains their reason. However, if you’ll remember, there was a form where even Goku became extremely violent!! That’s right, when he transformed into a Golden Oozaru!! Surely this brutality, destructive power, and large scale are a sign of the legend that tells that they will “love destruction and slaughter”!! One can think of the Golden Oozaru form (which includes Oozaru Baby too!!) as perhaps fit to be called the true Super Saiyan!!"

In Dragon Ball Heroes we see that Broly achieves Legendary Golden Oozaru.
Image

It's generally seen that Legendary Super Saiyan is the "true" Super Saiyan form and not some mutant form. It would fit with how the original Super Saiyan came to being so powerful.

GT and the DBZ movies seem to be in the same "dimension" as Toriyama stated that the films take place in "different dimensions."

So in the Movie/GT canon, does this mean that the absolute true Super Saiyan form is Legendary Golden Oozaru?

Vegeta never thought in a SSj Ozaru, so when at namek wants be a saiyan he is not worried for not have a tail.
Toriyama said Goten and Trunks were born without a tail because the SSJ no longer needed. The Toriyama´s SSJ not is a Ozaru
SSJ Ozaru maybe a GT legendary SSJ?
... is very inconsistent if it is considered an alternative spin off of what happened in Z but no necessarily have to include everything that happened in Z if we consider GT as a world apart.. also all Gt is inconsistent so we can consider it valid in the GT universe
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Re: Legendary Golden Oozaru the "true" Super Saiyan form?

Post by Herms » Sun Apr 12, 2015 6:30 pm

I tried to untangle this mess way back in the day. The (rather long) relevant bit:
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Re: Legendary Golden Oozaru the "true" Super Saiyan form?

Post by Bacon Skittles » Sun Apr 12, 2015 6:34 pm

Marco Polo wrote:Nah I'm pretty sure it's Bardock.

He fought Chilled as an SSJ and Chilled survived long enough to tell his men about it. That's when the Super Saiyan legend was born.
Except that's even more non-canon by even GT's standards.

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Re: Legendary Golden Oozaru the "true" Super Saiyan form?

Post by Lord Beerus » Sun Apr 12, 2015 6:38 pm

Marco Polo wrote:Nah I'm pretty sure it's Bardock.

Image

He fought Chilled as an SSJ and Chilled survived long enough to tell his men about it. That's when the Super Saiyan legend was born.
...And the legacy and tragedy of the original TV special was officially shit on.

Seriously though, why does this even exist?:
Bacon Skittles wrote:Image

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Re: Legendary Golden Oozaru the "true" Super Saiyan form?

Post by Dyno » Sun Apr 12, 2015 6:46 pm

Dragon Ball GT's standards accepts movies into his continuity. Episode of Bardock runs away from it, so no. GT is "more non-canon" than Episode of Bardock.

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Re: Legendary Golden Oozaru the "true" Super Saiyan form?

Post by fadeddreams5 » Sun Apr 12, 2015 7:13 pm

Episode of Bardock is merely a what-if story created solely for the sake of seeing SSJ Bardock in action.

I can't believe some fans would actually like to consider this canon. It shits on both the awesome tragic conclusion of the original special and the entire SSJ legend. :?
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Re: Legendary Golden Oozaru the "true" Super Saiyan form?

Post by TheDevilsCorpse » Sun Apr 12, 2015 7:17 pm

Episode of Bardock can shit on the TV Special's story, but I don't see how it does the same to the Super Saiyan legend. There is barely a legend to shit on.
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Re: Legendary Golden Oozaru the "true" Super Saiyan form?

Post by Dyno » Sun Apr 12, 2015 7:21 pm

Dragon Ball Minus shits even more on the TV Special than what Episode of Bardock does (if it even does, of course).

Stopping to think about it, DevilsCorpse is right, there is barely a legend about it. So... Whatever.
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Re: Legendary Golden Oozaru the "true" Super Saiyan form?

Post by Marco Polo » Sun Apr 12, 2015 7:21 pm

fadeddreams5 wrote:Episode of Bardock is merely a what-if story
Just like GT.

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Re: Legendary Golden Oozaru the "true" Super Saiyan form?

Post by ekrolo2 » Sun Apr 12, 2015 7:47 pm

Episode of Bardock was made to "explain" why Bardock suddenly had SSJ in one of the newer games (can't remember which one), it's just there for that and no other reason. It wasn't meant to make sense or fit into "canon" (fucking kill me before the use of this term does). As for if the actual topic of this thread and not that ugh, c word, what the true Super Saiyan is ultimately comes down to the fans. It's got so many possibilities that you really just pick one you like best and try to make sense of it however you can.
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Re: Legendary Golden Oozaru the "true" Super Saiyan form?

Post by fadeddreams5 » Sun Apr 12, 2015 7:47 pm

TheDevilsCorpse wrote:but I don't see how it does the same to the Super Saiyan legend. There is barely a legend to shit on.
Exactly. It's ambiguous, and should stay that way.

I mean, it's one thing to go out of your way to explore it by introducing an entirely new era, world, and civilization, as well as characters to go along with it, but another to basically zap an already established character into the past, rehash plot, and lazily make him the SSJ of legend for the sake of "Goku's dad...*slurp*...is the original SSJ...*slurp*...so cool...*slurp* like Goku...*slurp*...my hero. *gag*"
Marco Polo wrote:
fadeddreams5 wrote:Episode of Bardock is merely a what-if story
Just like GT.
That too, I guess.
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Re: Legendary Golden Oozaru the "true" Super Saiyan form?

Post by Dyno » Sun Apr 12, 2015 7:59 pm

And Tarble exists only to celebrate Shonen Jump's anniversary, you know. :yawn: "Origin" does not set anything.

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Re: Legendary Golden Oozaru the "true" Super Saiyan form?

Post by Lord Beerus » Sun Apr 12, 2015 8:03 pm

Dyno wrote:Dragon Ball Minus shits even more on the TV Special than what Episode of Bardock does (if it even does, of course).
No. Episode Of Bardock is way, way, way worse. People tend to forget that the events of Dragon Ball Minus predate the events of the TV special. All that would really needed to be changed in the TV special is editing out any scene of baby Goku and you're golden. 95% of the story in the TV special stays intact and it can fit seamlessly in with Dragon Ball Minus. Episode Of Bardock takes away from everything that made the TV special so tragic by negating his death and effectively taking away his poignant last minutes epiphany that Goku would be the one to defeat Freeza.

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Re: Legendary Golden Oozaru the "true" Super Saiyan form?

Post by Dyno » Sun Apr 12, 2015 8:07 pm

Well, it's that, or I should say/pick Dragon Ball Online then. The point is: Bardock simply can't stop in his fight against Freeza without more development.

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Re: Legendary Golden Oozaru the "true" Super Saiyan form?

Post by TheDevilsCorpse » Sun Apr 12, 2015 8:16 pm

There are more problems between Minus and the TV Special than just baby Goku. They really are two different Bardocks. You may be able to reconcile their personalities, but there are more potential discrepancies from more basic aspects of the story; like TV Special Bardock being oblivious to Freeza, while Minus Bardock knows that bastard is up to something.
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Re: Legendary Golden Oozaru the "true" Super Saiyan form?

Post by Dyno » Sun Apr 12, 2015 8:25 pm

That is not necessarily a contradiction, I think. You know, during the Planet Meat events, you could say Bardock just confirms what he thinks through Dodoria.

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Re: Legendary Golden Oozaru the "true" Super Saiyan form?

Post by Lord Beerus » Sun Apr 12, 2015 8:32 pm

TheDevilsCorpse wrote:There are more problems between Minus and the TV Special than just baby Goku. They really are two different Bardocks. You may be able to reconcile their personalities, but there are more potential discrepancies from more basic aspects of the story; like TV Special Bardock being oblivious to Freeza, while Minus Bardock knows that bastard is up to something.
Well, the first thing we see in Dragon Ball Minus is Bardock battling and exterminating a race, so Bardock is still a planet conquering, mass murdering, space pirate at the end of the day and that is how he still portrayed in the TV special. Bardock just shows less apathy Goku in DB- than he does in the TV special. I don't really that huge of difference between DB- Bardock and FOG Bardock.

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