What happened in the 4th timeline?

Discussion, generally of an in-universe nature, regarding any aspect of the franchise (including movies, spin-offs, etc.) such as: techniques, character relationships, internal back-history, its universe, and more.

Moderators: Kanzenshuu Staff, General Help

User avatar
miguelnuva1
I'm pretty cozy, here...
Posts: 1995
Joined: Wed Sep 19, 2012 9:23 pm

What happened in the 4th timeline?

Post by miguelnuva1 » Fri Nov 06, 2015 1:23 am

There is a timeline where the Cell games start and Trunks is gone so what do you guys think happened there?

User avatar
dbgtFO
Kicks it Old-School
Posts: 7766
Joined: Thu Aug 26, 2010 5:07 pm
Contact:

Re: What happened in the 4th timeline?

Post by dbgtFO » Fri Nov 06, 2015 2:27 am

miguelnuva1 wrote:There is a timeline where the Cell games start and Trunks is gone so what do you guys think happened there?
That timeline has since been deleted from subsequent guidebooks IIRC(or did Chozenshuu keep it?).
In any case I don't think it makes any sense there'd be a Cell Games in another timeline. The way it was explained in Daizenshuu 7, Trunks got the blueprints for the remote control and is then killed by Cell back in his own future after disposing of #17 & #18. But you'd think he'd also get rid of the androids in the past he travelled to and if there is a Cell Games in that past it means there was another Cell, who must have come from a further timeline, than the 4 of those detailed in that image.
It's completely unsustainable and there would be no real beginning timeline.

How I view the timeline shenanigans:

User avatar
AvatarReiko
Regular
Posts: 592
Joined: Mon Dec 23, 2013 10:46 am

Re: What happened in the 4th timeline?

Post by AvatarReiko » Fri Nov 06, 2015 7:15 am

^The only Cell that should exist in the unseen timeline is the fetus in Gero lab's, but I have no doubt that Trunks would have destroyed him when he found 17's blueprints. There wouldn't have been a Future Cell in this timeline since this was the first, orginal timeline. The others all branch off from this one.

We can only infer that Trunks destroyed the Cyborgs with the remote in this timeline before returning to his own. Though, it makes you wonder if some of other events from the main timeline(Piccolo fusing with Kami, the saiyans going into the ROSAT, The Cyborgs taking their roadtrip & etc) played out since it took Bulma sometime to construct the remote. The major difference would be Cell's absence

User avatar
Sandubadear
I Live Here
Posts: 2152
Joined: Sun Mar 01, 2015 8:39 am
Location: Space Amazon

Re: What happened in the 4th timeline?

Post by Sandubadear » Fri Nov 06, 2015 12:34 pm

Trying to make sense of it, I think Timeline 4 is the first timeline to where Trunksfrom timeline 2 goes to, kills Freeza and Cold, and then goes back to his own time. When he went back to Age 767, Timeline 4 branched into Timeline 1 and 4. In timeline 4, Trunks didn't appear a second time, but he did in Timeline 1. So the Cell Games happened, but Trunks wasn't there.

But that's just trying to make sense, because my opinion is the same as dbgtFO.
"The life is the hardest video games of ever. Because you have only one life and the powers are kinda lame. And sometimes a stage takes years"

"The life is a game, the objective of the game is trying to find the objective of the game, and then, finish the game"
--by Ranely Jr

時空の主/齊天大聖
Lazy Xenoverse characters: Kuriza, Neko Majin Abra

User avatar
FoolsGil
I Live Here
Posts: 4239
Joined: Tue May 21, 2013 10:37 pm

Re: What happened in the 4th timeline?

Post by FoolsGil » Fri Nov 06, 2015 3:54 pm

:problem:

Goddamn time travel. I thought I figured it out. Then the removed source confused me with their being another Cell Game without Trunks, and then dbgtFO you made it worst when you stated there were two Cells in the Apocalypse Timeline. And then your Altered Timeline 3 theory...what?

Damn it Toriyama why did you have to be a big fan of the Terminator movies? That's right, I'm blaming them!
Dragonball Exiles Chapter One. Chapter Two In Production.

User avatar
Hellspawn28
Namekian Warrior
Posts: 14019
Joined: Mon Sep 07, 2009 9:50 pm
Location: Maryland, USA

Re: What happened in the 4th timeline?

Post by Hellspawn28 » Fri Nov 06, 2015 5:50 pm

Anyone thinks that DBZ Movie 7 (Super Android 13!) could be set in the 4th timeline? I think it could because: #17 and #18 where never seen or mention again in DBZ Movie 7. If the Z find the blueprints of the cyborgs in this timeline and use it to create a remote control, allowing them to destroy #16, #17 and #18 then they are likely dead before #13, #14 and #15 show up. Due to the time travel nature (time paradox), #13-#15 only exist in this timeline and not in the other timelines. If Cell games happen much later and Cell is still a larva at this rate then it can explain why there is no mention of Cell whatsoever in the movie.
PS4 username: Guyver_Spawn_27
MAL Profile: http://myanimelist.net/profile/Hellspawn28
Steam: http://steamcommunity.com/id/GS27/

User avatar
Sandubadear
I Live Here
Posts: 2152
Joined: Sun Mar 01, 2015 8:39 am
Location: Space Amazon

Re: What happened in the 4th timeline?

Post by Sandubadear » Fri Nov 06, 2015 6:10 pm

Hellspawn28 wrote:Anyone thinks that DBZ Movie 7 (Super Android 13!) could be set in the 4th timeline? I think it could because: #17 and #18 where never seen or mention again in DBZ Movie 7. If the Z find the blueprints of the cyborgs in this timeline and use it to create a remote control, allowing them to destroy #16, #17 and #18 then they are likely dead before #13, #14 and #15 show up. Due to the time travel nature (time paradox), #13-#15 only exist in this timeline and not in the other timelines. If Cell games happen much later and Cell is still a larva at this rate then it can explain why there is no mention of Cell whatsoever in the movie.
Movie 7 could happen in the timeline that the original Future Trunks went to, got the remote control, then went back to his time and was killed by Cell (who then created timeline 1 and 2).

It's not Timeline 4, though, since according to Daiz7, the Cell Games happened in Age 767.
"The life is the hardest video games of ever. Because you have only one life and the powers are kinda lame. And sometimes a stage takes years"

"The life is a game, the objective of the game is trying to find the objective of the game, and then, finish the game"
--by Ranely Jr

時空の主/齊天大聖
Lazy Xenoverse characters: Kuriza, Neko Majin Abra

Truhan
Beyond-the-Beyond Newbie
Posts: 363
Joined: Tue Apr 14, 2015 7:42 pm

Re: What happened in the 4th timeline?

Post by Truhan » Fri Nov 06, 2015 8:37 pm

There's a fan fiction-y theory that uses an infinite loop, in which:

a) Trunks is allowed to depart to the past and warn Goku, and the Z Fighters win. Meanwhile, Cell kills Trunks, the one who arrived, and goes back in time.
b) Cell arrives at the past and develops into Perfect Cell, but gets killed by Gohan. Trunks departs to his future and kills Cell, allowing his younger self to depart.

Trunks kills Cell because he was warned by the one who is about to kill him. In the end, there is one Cell who never departs, while Trunks dies by the hands of another.

User avatar
dbgtFO
Kicks it Old-School
Posts: 7766
Joined: Thu Aug 26, 2010 5:07 pm
Contact:

Re: What happened in the 4th timeline?

Post by dbgtFO » Sat Nov 07, 2015 3:59 am

FoolsGil wrote::problem:

Goddamn time travel. I thought I figured it out. Then the removed source confused me with their being another Cell Game without Trunks, and then dbgtFO you made it worst when you stated there were two Cells in the Apocalypse Timeline. And then your Altered Timeline 3 theory...what?

Damn it Toriyama why did you have to be a big fan of the Terminator movies? That's right, I'm blaming them!
Yeah it's a clusterfuck and sorry for any confusion my theories might cause :lol:
I just tried to look at things logically(knowing full well that logic is pretty much thrown out the window) and realized it didn't make a whole lot of sense to me and so see this as my head-canon as that makes the most sense to me.

My problem is there has to be another timeline, where "Main" Future Trunks comes from, but going through the steps, there is no need for that timeline to exist in the first place, at least going by the conventional idea, that new timelines are split off the ones you come from.

Hopefully I illustrate my problem better here(lifted from one of my previous posts on the subject):

User avatar
Bacon Skittles
Beyond Newbie
Posts: 131
Joined: Tue Feb 04, 2014 4:21 pm

Re: What happened in the 4th timeline?

Post by Bacon Skittles » Sat Nov 07, 2015 5:35 pm

Image

User avatar
Saiga
Kicks it Old-School
Posts: 8291
Joined: Mon Oct 31, 2011 8:36 pm
Location: Space Australia

Re: What happened in the 4th timeline?

Post by Saiga » Sat Nov 07, 2015 11:56 pm

Sandubadear wrote:Trying to make sense of it, I think Timeline 4 is the first timeline to where Trunksfrom timeline 2 goes to, kills Freeza and Cold, and then goes back to his own time. When he went back to Age 767, Timeline 4 branched into Timeline 1 and 4. In timeline 4, Trunks didn't appear a second time, but he did in Timeline 1. So the Cell Games happened, but Trunks wasn't there.

But that's just trying to make sense, because my opinion is the same as dbgtFO.
This is what I believe as well, as time travel creates alternate timelines - one that the time traveller arrives in, and one that is unaffected by the time travel. This happens when both Cell and Trunks go back in time the first time.

Logically, the second trip Trunks makes should have also created a split. The timeline we see, and the timeline as it would have continued without Trunks arriving. Trunks' presence really isn't necessary for the events to lead to the Cell Games, so there you have the Cell Games timeline without Trunks.
I'm re-watching Dragon Ball GT in full on my blog. Check it out if you're interested in my thoughts on the series as I watch through it!

User avatar
OkamiTakahashi
Newbie
Posts: 42
Joined: Fri Sep 19, 2014 12:19 pm

Re: What happened in the 4th timeline?

Post by OkamiTakahashi » Mon Nov 09, 2015 10:30 am

Honestly, I'm not sure what to think of timelines and canon nowadays. People on this forum claim there is no canon, and tend to split canon up into more and more branches than I care for, depending on whether it was manga, anime, written by Toriyama or not, etc. Whatever happened to the official timelines put out by Toriyama and Toei? There's one in the Battle of Gods guidebook everyone always ignores because it has GT events in it, and then you have the portion of the timeline established by the DBH site and manga. And then supposedly you have Ultimate Tenkaiichi, Xenoverse and Online, and Xenoverse seems to claim GT was created through Trunks' time travelling, but how on Earth does that even make any sense? Yes, I understand some timeline branches were created when Trunks came to defeat Frieza and Cell, but how would that even create the GT timeline- which then everything else would have followed? I'm just flat-out confused.

Somebody PLEASE explain to me how all this even makes any sense anymore- especially with Towa and Mira now being in Heroes- the Time Patrollers of Xenoverse and Online should have erased all records of their interferance and therefore it doesn't make sense to suddenly add them in with a new form that was never used in their actual games. All I ask is for a simple, clear and concise timeline that is not split into nonsensical branches that depend upon who wrote it or what form of media it was- just a timeline that explains HOW Trunks' time travel supposedly makes GT its own branch, and HOW Towa and Mira end up in Heroes. That's some confusing meta shit there. :crazy:

User avatar
Hellspawn28
Namekian Warrior
Posts: 14019
Joined: Mon Sep 07, 2009 9:50 pm
Location: Maryland, USA

Re: What happened in the 4th timeline?

Post by Hellspawn28 » Tue Nov 10, 2015 10:35 am

If you change one thing then another timeline is made. In that other timeline, someone did something to create a another new timeline. Time Travel can work in strange ways.
PS4 username: Guyver_Spawn_27
MAL Profile: http://myanimelist.net/profile/Hellspawn28
Steam: http://steamcommunity.com/id/GS27/

User avatar
LuckyCat
Advanced Regular
Posts: 1215
Joined: Wed Sep 24, 2014 6:28 pm
Location: The Sacred Land
Contact:

Re: What happened in the 4th timeline?

Post by LuckyCat » Tue Nov 10, 2015 12:58 pm

Daizenshuu's History 4 is a real headscratcher. Trunks would had to have left that timeline before Cell from timeline 3 appeared, which means Bulma and co. found a way to shut off the androids without knowledge of Cell or the lab.
Cipher wrote:The first and last word on Super's animation problems and why they exist.
(Have we transcended language to the point where we only communicate in YouTube links now? The talking has already been done for us.)

buutenks
I'm pretty cozy, here...
Posts: 1884
Joined: Mon Mar 30, 2015 10:42 am

Re: What happened in the 4th timeline?

Post by buutenks » Tue Nov 10, 2015 1:54 pm

So in conclusion,there r 4 beerus and 4 whis and 4 champas and 4 vados.All from different time lines.

Well i guess even if cell had won and blew up the solar system,he would have gotten his butt kicked by beerus lol.

User avatar
Angelus
I'm pretty cozy, here...
Posts: 1966
Joined: Thu Feb 23, 2012 1:19 am
Location: Dragonball Multiverse
Contact:

Re: What happened in the 4th timeline?

Post by Angelus » Tue Nov 10, 2015 2:59 pm

Wait so... the Trunks that killed Mecha Frieza and King Cold in the main story, is the same one that got killed by Imperfect Cell? And so the Future Trunks that came back in the Androids Saga and participated in the Cell Games is a different Future Trunks?

User avatar
Sandubadear
I Live Here
Posts: 2152
Joined: Sun Mar 01, 2015 8:39 am
Location: Space Amazon

Re: What happened in the 4th timeline?

Post by Sandubadear » Tue Nov 10, 2015 3:20 pm

Angelus wrote:Wait so... the Trunks that killed Mecha Freeza and King Cold in the main story, is the same one that got killed by Imperfect Cell? And so the Future Trunks that came back in the Androids Saga and participated in the Cell Games is a different Future Trunks?
No... the Trunks killed by Cell went to another timeline that went similar to the main timeline, but there wasn't any time-travelling Cell there, so he got the remote control, went to his own time and killed the Androids, and then was killed by Cell.

In my opinion, Timeline 4 is more like this:
The first timeline to where Trunksfrom timeline 2 goes to, kills Freeza and Cold, and then goes back to his own time. When he went back to Age 767, Timeline 4 branched into Timeline 1 and 4. In timeline 4, Trunks didn't appear a second time, but he did in Timeline 1. So the Cell Games happened, but Trunks wasn't there.
"The life is the hardest video games of ever. Because you have only one life and the powers are kinda lame. And sometimes a stage takes years"

"The life is a game, the objective of the game is trying to find the objective of the game, and then, finish the game"
--by Ranely Jr

時空の主/齊天大聖
Lazy Xenoverse characters: Kuriza, Neko Majin Abra

User avatar
90sDBZ
I'm pretty cozy, here...
Posts: 1962
Joined: Tue Dec 18, 2012 11:34 am
Location: UK

Re: What happened in the 4th timeline?

Post by 90sDBZ » Wed Nov 11, 2015 8:28 pm

I think I have an answer for there being a second Cell Games Timeline. Maybe the Trunks who gets killed by Imperfect Cell had only gone back in time once. Maybe he somehow got a hold of the Android blueprints in his own timeline after initially returning from killing Frieza, and was about to go back in time with the shutdown device to save Goku and the others from having to fight the Androids in the first place. Now seeing as he got killed by Cell before he could do this, things in that past would have played out similarly to the main story, except with the absence of Trunks. I'm guessing Vegeta would have insisted on training alone in the rosat, would have come out and done all the same things he does in the main story, and Cell would have told him about the Cell Games instead of Trunks. I think this works anyhow.

Post Reply