How many times more powerful is Mystic Gohan than his SSJ2?

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Angelus
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How many times more powerful is Mystic Gohan than his SSJ2?

Post by Angelus » Mon Nov 09, 2015 11:03 pm

According to you? Cell Games SSJ2, that is.

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Re: How many times more powerful is Mystic Gohan than his SS

Post by FoolsGil » Mon Nov 09, 2015 11:10 pm

Well fanon dictates the powerup is SSJ3 level without all the side effects, so SSJ2Gohan < Mystic Gohan = SSJ3 Goku

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Re: How many times more powerful is Mystic Gohan than his SS

Post by Angelus » Mon Nov 09, 2015 11:20 pm

Canon Mystic Gohan is way more powerful than canon SSJ3 Goku.

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Re: How many times more powerful is Mystic Gohan than his SS

Post by Darkprince410 » Mon Nov 09, 2015 11:33 pm

At an extreme bare minimum, which is if his post Rou Kaioushin power-up level was equal to that of Ssj3 Goku, then it'd be over 4x that of his Ssj2 form. In actuality, depending on how powerful one considered his power-up to be, you could be looking at many tens to many hundreds of times stronger than his Ssj2 form.

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Re: How many times more powerful is Mystic Gohan than his SS

Post by dario03 » Tue Nov 10, 2015 1:51 am

I would guess most people would have him some where between 4 and 3000 times as strong. Good example of why you just gotta love Dragon Ball power level estimates :)

Personally I lean more toward the 60x range (but I've never been one to try for exacts).
Last edited by dario03 on Tue Nov 10, 2015 1:59 am, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: How many times more powerful is Mystic Gohan than his SS

Post by Jeff Styles » Tue Nov 10, 2015 1:55 am

Depending on what you put as the SSJ Multiplier.
Base Gotenks(post ROSAT)>SSJ3 Goku
SSJ-50x
SSJ2-100x
SSJ3-400x

Ultimate Gohan could be 1.5x than SSJ3 Gotenks.

SSJ3 Goku, 4x stronger than SSJ2 Kid Gohan.

4x400=16,00x1.5=2,400x
I feels bad for Goku.

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Re: How many times more powerful is Mystic Gohan than his SS

Post by miguelnuva1 » Tue Nov 10, 2015 2:32 am

The Lowest I ever got was 500x stronger than Goku so 2000x his CG self.

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Re: How many times more powerful is Mystic Gohan than his SS

Post by Khin » Tue Nov 10, 2015 6:01 am

SSJ3 Goku is nowhere near as Ultimate Gohan.

For the multiplyer i think

Enraged SSJ2 Kid Gohan = 6

SSJ2 Goku = 7

SSJ3 Goku = 28

SSJ Gotenks(Pre ROSAT) = 30

SSJ Gotenks(Post ROSAT) = 40

SSJ3 Gotenks = 320

Ultimate Gohan = 450

Thats the way i see it,Ultimate Gohan is a 75x SSJ2 or 7,500x Base

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Re: How many times more powerful is Mystic Gohan than his SS

Post by LightBing » Tue Nov 10, 2015 12:40 pm

I have him 4,8 times stronger than his Cell Games version. SSJ3 Goku is less than half of Ultimate Gohan's power.

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Re: How many times more powerful is Mystic Gohan than his SS

Post by ekrolo2 » Tue Nov 10, 2015 3:42 pm

About 20 times by my current estimate. I have SSJ2 Gohan at 7.5 billion at his absolute apex during the CGs, Super Buu & SSJ3 Gotenks at a 120 billion. SSJ3 Goku is at 30 billion.
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Re: How many times more powerful is Mystic Gohan than his SS

Post by The Monkey King » Tue Nov 10, 2015 4:46 pm

Got him about 60 x stronger.

I put Post Z-Sword training Gohan and Goku on the same level
I think SSJ3 Gotenks to be 10 x stronger than SSJ3 Goku
Then Ultimate Gohan is roughly 1.5 x stronger than Gotenks
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Re: How many times more powerful is Mystic Gohan than his SS

Post by Lord Beerus » Tue Nov 10, 2015 6:37 pm

I have Mystic Gohan at least x20 stronger than SSJ2 Cell Games Gohan.

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Re: How many times more powerful is Mystic Gohan than his SS

Post by Hitiro » Tue Nov 10, 2015 7:34 pm

If SSJ Gotenks(pre-RoSaT) was only just a little stronger than SSJ2 Vegeta that would put him at 2x stronger than SSJ3 Goku as a SSJ3. The bare minimum for Gohan to completely destroy Boo giving that would be 25% more power. Thus he should be something like 10x-15x stronger than his CG self. Obviously varying in how strong Gotenks got by training in the RoSaT.

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Re: How many times more powerful is Mystic Gohan than his SS

Post by STH » Thu Jul 20, 2017 7:39 am

FoolsGil wrote:Well fanon dictates the powerup is SSJ3 level without all the side effects, so SSJ2Gohan < Mystic Gohan = SSJ3 Goku
:thumbup:
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Re: How many times more powerful is Mystic Gohan than his SS

Post by LowRyder2005 » Thu Jul 20, 2017 11:19 am

ekrolo2 wrote:About 20 times by my current estimate. I have SSJ2 Gohan at 7.5 billion at his absolute apex during the CGs, Super Buu & SSJ3 Gotenks at a 120 billion. SSJ3 Goku is at 30 billion.
Interesting. I have similar numbers in my still-completely-arbitrary power levels: SS2 Gohan at 7.5, Majin Vegeta at 11.5, SS3 Goku is at 45, my SS3 Gotenks is at 156 and my Ultimate Gohan is at 200. :)
If SSJ Gotenks(pre-RoSaT) was only just a little stronger than SSJ2 Vegeta that would put him at 2x stronger than SSJ3 Goku as a SSJ3.
If you interpret the Daizenshuu's words very literally you'd need to have Gotenks weaker than Vegeta pre-ROSAT. Perhaps you meant that?

That being said, although the translation of that entry - reported in the old website - was mentioning Gotenks "surpassing" Vegeta (hence implying Vegeta had been "ahead") after training, I tend to think that there's a distinct possibility those words may be translated as "Gotenks' power eclipsed Vegeta's and the others'" after the ROSAT. In short, lending credence the idea that Super Saiyan Gotenks was already stronger than Majin Vegeta right off the bat and that Gotenks just became much, much stronger afterwards - which definitely fits better in the context of the story and all the characters' implications about Gotenks' might.

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Re: How many times more powerful is Mystic Gohan than his SS

Post by Darkprince410 » Thu Jul 20, 2017 3:03 pm

STH wrote:
FoolsGil wrote:Well fanon dictates the powerup is SSJ3 level without all the side effects, so SSJ2Gohan < Mystic Gohan = SSJ3 Goku
:thumbup:
The topic was inactive for nearly two years. There was no need to bump it at all, much less to contribute nothing to it but an emote. Necroposting is heavily frowned upon on here.

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Re: How many times more powerful is Mystic Gohan than his SSJ2?

Post by nickzambuto » Thu Jul 20, 2017 5:41 pm

I think that Gotenks' power is vastly overestimated, and this therefore inflates the power scaling of the whole Boo arc. It's never actually stated definitively that SSJ1 Gotenks is stronger than SSJ3 Goku. That's become a very widespread myth. In reality, all we have is vague, varying confidence from Goku and Piccolo that a fusion between Goten and Trunks can save the world. Sometimes Goku acted like he was positive, but a few times, he seemed a little more hesitant. And there's always the possibility that he anticipated further training, assistance, and any other number of factors when assessing that fusion would be the ticket to saving the world, we can't just assume he outright meant "Gotenks will immediately be stronger than Boo."

Since the Daizenshuu has that comment implying Vegeta as Gotenks' superior pre-ROSAT, the only concrete comparison we have for SSJ1 Gotenks is that he's at least as strong as Majin Vegeta. So SSJ2 Gotenks would be half as strong as SSJ3 Goku, but SSJ3 Gotenks would be twice as strong as SSJ3 Goku. That's at the bare minimum, assuming SSJ1 Gotenks is equal to Majin Vegeta rather than superior, but even so, I think it's the most reasonable and conservative estimate.

Think of it like this:

Goten, Trunks and Gohan - 8
Vegeta - 9
Goku - 10
Majin Vegeta - 10
Goten and Trunks post ROSAT - 9
Gotenks - 18

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Re: How many times more powerful is Mystic Gohan than his SSJ2?

Post by miguelnuva1 » Thu Jul 20, 2017 5:57 pm

nickzambuto wrote:I think that Gotenks' power is vastly overestimated, and this therefore inflates the power scaling of the whole Boo arc. It's never actually stated definitively that SSJ1 Gotenks is stronger than SSJ3 Goku. That's become a very widespread myth. In reality, all we have is vague, varying confidence from Goku and Piccolo that a fusion between Goten and Trunks can save the world. Sometimes Goku acted like he was positive, but a few times, he seemed a little more hesitant. And there's always the possibility that he anticipated further training, assistance, and any other number of factors when assessing that fusion would be the ticket to saving the world, we can't just assume he outright meant "Gotenks will immediately be stronger than Boo."

Since the Daizenshuu has that comment implying Vegeta as Gotenks' superior pre-ROSAT, the only concrete comparison we have for SSJ1 Gotenks is that he's at least as strong as Majin Vegeta. So SSJ2 Gotenks would be half as strong as SSJ3 Goku, but SSJ3 Gotenks would be twice as strong as SSJ3 Goku. That's at the bare minimum, assuming SSJ1 Gotenks is equal to Majin Vegeta rather than superior, but even so, I think it's the most reasonable and conservative estimate.

Think of it like this:

Goten, Trunks and Gohan - 8
Vegeta - 9
Goku - 10
Majin Vegeta - 10
Goten and Trunks post ROSAT - 9
Gotenks - 18
The daiz says base Gotenks is weaker than Majin Vegeta, it says something completely different for SSJ Gotenks.

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Re: How many times more powerful is Mystic Gohan than his SSJ2?

Post by LowRyder2005 » Thu Jul 20, 2017 7:01 pm

miguelnuva1 wrote:
nickzambuto wrote:I think that Gotenks' power is vastly overestimated, and this therefore inflates the power scaling of the whole Boo arc. It's never actually stated definitively that SSJ1 Gotenks is stronger than SSJ3 Goku. That's become a very widespread myth. In reality, all we have is vague, varying confidence from Goku and Piccolo that a fusion between Goten and Trunks can save the world. Sometimes Goku acted like he was positive, but a few times, he seemed a little more hesitant. And there's always the possibility that he anticipated further training, assistance, and any other number of factors when assessing that fusion would be the ticket to saving the world, we can't just assume he outright meant "Gotenks will immediately be stronger than Boo."

Since the Daizenshuu has that comment implying Vegeta as Gotenks' superior pre-ROSAT, the only concrete comparison we have for SSJ1 Gotenks is that he's at least as strong as Majin Vegeta. So SSJ2 Gotenks would be half as strong as SSJ3 Goku, but SSJ3 Gotenks would be twice as strong as SSJ3 Goku. That's at the bare minimum, assuming SSJ1 Gotenks is equal to Majin Vegeta rather than superior, but even so, I think it's the most reasonable and conservative estimate.

Think of it like this:

Goten, Trunks and Gohan - 8
Vegeta - 9
Goku - 10
Majin Vegeta - 10
Goten and Trunks post ROSAT - 9
Gotenks - 18
The daiz says base Gotenks is weaker than Majin Vegeta, it says something completely different for SSJ Gotenks.
The Daizenshuu states nothing about which form is referring about, and there are also no conflicting other entries to speak of. The only relevant bit of information is contained within Gotenks' single entry, or Gotenks' biography in the character-related guidebook.

According to the most readily-available translation - which I'm almost positive was made by Herms - it is simply stated that, thanks to his training in the ROSAT, Gotenks obtained a strength increase that made him "surpass Vegeta and the others". Obviously, this is the logical equivalent of "Gotenks was weaker than Vegeta before the training, and became stronger after". Some people do tend to rationalize this as "welp, maybe it's talking about base Gotenks; that's also the fact that there's a picture of his base form there". A pretty contrived rationalization, nevertheless, notwithstanding that aforementioned pic is arguably only there for illustration purposes, as there're no other "Super Saiyan Gotenks" or "Super Saiyan 3 Gotenks" bios and the face of base Gotenks is there, most likely, for the same reasons Goku or Gohan are depicted in their normal states.

Moving on, I've also seen another - somewhat less-reputable - site hosting a translation that recited something like "Gotenks' strength eclipsed Vegeta's and the others'" after the ROSAT, which made me think that maybe the translation at hand might have missed something. The two terms are similar, but only "surpass" holds the notion of... well, going from weaker to stronger. I'd have more faith in Herms' renowned skills, but you never know. It's kind of obvious Gotenks' strength being higher than Vegeta's before the training tends to have much more sense in the context of the story, given that all characters have sensed Super Saiyan 3 Goku's ki, Fat Buu's ki (which is vastly above Majin Vegeta's), and yet they all spend considerable time being in awe of both base Gotenks' and Super Saiyan Gotenks' strength - not even starting with the slight absurdity of Piccolo worrying about speed, when there'd be the much more pressing issue of Gotenks' sheer power not being nearly enough.

EDIT: That's the other translation. Seems like I remembered wrong, and this one just mentions Gotenks' strength eclipsing Vegeta's. So yeah, one of the two has definitely a mistake somewhere.
[His.] "Character in which Goten and Trunks use Fusion and combine. He was born through Fusion, taught to Goten and Trunks by Gokuu as a last resort, for the purpose of defeating Majin Boo, who boasted absolute strength. After going through numerous failures, the combining was eventually successful. The two of them confined themselves in the Room of Spirit and Time and rushed to carry out their training as Gotenks. As a result, they leveled up to a strength that eclipses even Vegeta [sic]. However, they were taken in by the Boo who had absorbed his good self and powered up."
Luckily, I found scans of the original, so if anyone of the more Japanese-savvy users wanted to take a stab at clarifying things...

[spoiler]ImageImage[/spoiler]

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Re: How many times more powerful is Mystic Gohan than his SSJ2?

Post by PerhapsTheOtherOne » Thu Jul 20, 2017 9:44 pm

Based on my own estimates, taking into account the original manga and Super's anime, Ultimate Gohan is approximately 20 times stronger................... than SS3's 400x multiplier.

Which would mean 80x stronger than SS2's 100x multiplier.

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