Goku lifting cube of densest material... canon?

Sypheran · Post by **Sypheran** » Wed May 24, 2006 8:09 pm

Is the scene where Goku lifts the square yard cube of the densest material in the universe, that was given to him by Supreme Kai and which Goku uses to accidently break the Z Sword, canon?

Snail · Post by **Snail** » Wed May 24, 2006 8:13 pm

Yeap it's canon. It's featured in Volume 24 of the translated Dragonball Z manga. Viz named the material 'Klangite'.

Sypheran · Post by **Sypheran** » Wed May 24, 2006 8:19 pm

Snail wrote:Yeap it's canon. It's featured in Volume 24 of the translated Dragonball Z manga. Viz named the material 'Klangite'.

Okay, thanks... also, is it canon that the Goku/Frieza battle took only 5 mintues? Or that Nimbus has a top speed of Mach 3 or whatever?

Post by **Kaboom** » Wed May 24, 2006 8:25 pm

Sypheran wrote:Okay, thanks... also, is it canon that the Goku/Freeza battle took only 5 mintues? Or that Nimbus has a top speed of Mach 3 or whatever?

Well, Freeza did say 5 minutes. Though in both the manga and the anime, it seems to take (much) longer than that, so I think it's safe to assume that he was either guessing, or overestimated as to how much he had damaged Namek's core.

As for Kint'oun's speed; I'm not sure. I do know that it takes it a few hours to traverse a continent, but I don't know or have any numbers.

Snail · Post by **Snail** » Wed May 24, 2006 8:36 pm

It was never mentioned in the manga how fast Kinto'Un is supposed to go I beleive.

I agree with SSj Kaboom, that Frieza may have overestimated the time it took as well.

Sypheran · Post by **Sypheran** » Wed May 24, 2006 8:41 pm

Snail wrote:It was never mentioned in the manga how fast Kinto'Un is supposed to go I beleive.

I agree with SSj Kaboom, that Freeza may have overestimated the time it took as well.

I was wondering about Nimbus because on a DBZ card, where the show quote is, it has a quote saying that "Flying Nimbus has a top speed of Mach 3" or something like that...

DaemonCorps · Post by **DaemonCorps** » Wed May 24, 2006 9:49 pm

Sypheran wrote:
Snail wrote:It was never mentioned in the manga how fast Kinto'Un is supposed to go I beleive.

I agree with SSj Kaboom, that Freeza may have overestimated the time it took as well.
I was wondering about Nimbus because on a DBZ card, where the show quote is, it has a quote saying that "Flying Nimbus has a top speed of Mach 3" or something like that...

The quote was probably from the dub version of the anime.

tarsonis · Post by **tarsonis** » Thu May 25, 2006 9:24 am

I think you guys are confusing canon with filler. If it's in the anime, it's canon. If it's something in the anime and not in the manga, it's filler.

Duo · Post by **Duo** » Thu May 25, 2006 5:51 pm

The Manga version is pretty loyal to the "5 minute" boundries. It does stretch it, but Freeza also states "it seems to be taking a bit longer...but you only have a couple minutes left! - tops!" so he even points out the stretch.

I don't think this thread will be open much longer. I know just about everything thats canon and non-canon so PM me should this thread get closed and I'll answer any questions on the subject you might have.

Olivier Hague · Post by **Olivier Hague** » Thu May 25, 2006 10:17 pm

tarsonis wrote:I think you guys are confusing canon with filler. If it's in the anime, it's canon.

That's a matter of point of view. Do you consider Garlic Jr. "canon", for example?

Post by **desirecampbell** » Thu May 25, 2006 10:39 pm

Olivier Hague wrote:
tarsonis wrote:I think you guys are confusing canon with filler. If it's in the anime, it's canon.
That's a matter of point of view. Do you consider Garlic Jr. "canon", for example?

tarsonis wrote:If it's something in the anime and not in the manga, it's filler.

Olivier Hague · Post by **Olivier Hague** » Thu May 25, 2006 11:15 pm

He also said "if it's in the anime, it's canon". And since filler is in the anime, that would logically mean that filler is canon, according to him.

So I asked, even stuff like Garlic Jr.? Do you consider that filler part "canon"? Despite the fact it's a sequel to a movie that can't possibly fit in the storyline? That would be some weird "canon", in my opinion.

Saiyan · Post by **Saiyan** » Thu May 25, 2006 11:24 pm

What I think he meant to say was that "If it's in the manga, it's canon, and if it's in the anime and not in the manga, it's filler."

Makes more sense, no?

Olivier Hague · Post by **Olivier Hague** » Thu May 25, 2006 11:57 pm

Yes, that would make a lot more sense.

tarsonis · Post by **tarsonis** » Fri May 26, 2006 12:04 am

All I'm saying is that anything that appears in the series is canon, if you're talking about the series. If you're talking about the manga, then anything not in it would be non-canon. Filler is still canon if you're talking about the anime as a whole and not mentioning the manga. Am I making sense?

It appears I have gotten this thread off-topic.

Olivier Hague · Post by **Olivier Hague** » Fri May 26, 2006 12:24 am

tarsonis wrote:All I'm saying is that anything that appears in the series is canon, if you're talking about the series. If you're talking about the manga, then anything not in it would be non-canon. Filler is still canon if you're talking about the anime as a whole and not mentioning the manga. Am I making sense?

...
Sorry, you lost me. ^_^;

Are you saying that you consider there are two "canons": a "manga canon" and an "anime canon"?
If so... Well, I'm not sure how that's really pertinent. I mean, what would not be "canon" at all in any way, then? The movies? The video games?

tarsonis · Post by **tarsonis** » Fri May 26, 2006 12:36 am

The 13 movies and Playdia video are not canon. I'm not really sure how else to explain..desirecampbell, you know what I mean right?

Post by **desirecampbell** » Fri May 26, 2006 12:55 am

Olivier Hague wrote:
tarsonis wrote:All I'm saying is that anything that appears in the series is canon, if you're talking about the series. If you're talking about the manga, then anything not in it would be non-canon. Filler is still canon if you're talking about the anime as a whole and not mentioning the manga. Am I making sense?
...
Sorry, you lost me. ^_^;

Are you saying that you consider there are two "canons": a "manga canon" and an "anime canon"?
If so... Well, I'm not sure how that's really pertinent. I mean, what would not be "canon" at all in any way, then? The movies? The video games?

The best way to think about 'canon' in DragonBall is to use a tired structure (like Star Wars canon).

There are a series of 'levels'. Each level supersedes any information from a lower level that contradicts it. For instance, in the manga Super Saiyan hair is a deep gold colour, but in the anime it is nearly white - the manga's version is taken as "more canonical".

1. Kanzenban manga - re-edited, and fixed - better than original - by Toriyama himself.

2. tankobon manga - original work, but contains errors and omissions corrected in the Kanzenban.

3. Original Japanese Anime, based on manga - DragonBall, DragonBall Z, Trunks special - disregarding filler. This includes instances that are derived directly from the manga, but are changed somehow (like the SSj hair colour, Goku's gi colour, when Pilaf shows up, and the friggin week that was the Freeza fight).

4. Original Japanese Anime not based on manga, produced by Toei for the series - DB/DBZ filler, DragonBall GT, Bardock special, GT Special. This includes any animation made for the series, but not based on any direct manga counterpart. Like the Garlic Jr saga, the driving episode, Yamcha, Tien, Piccolo, and Krillin helping out at the Cell games.

5. Original Japanese DB/DBZ movies - produced by Toei, but not meant to 'fit' into the series' storyline.

6. Original Video Animation for video games, game shows, fire safety videos, commercials, etc. - produced by Toei, but absolutely not supposed to represent the events of the story in any way.

7. Games (video, card, board, etc) - nothing taken from any game-based mechanics or story should be taken as literal to the story.

--------
You'll notice that I specifically mentioned the original Japanese animation there, and no other country's dubs. Replications of the original animation and script should never be taken as canon. The only time a dub is ever taken as any kind of authority is when it is equivalent to the original animation.

I think that's pretty good

-edit-

tarsonis wrote:The 13 movies and Playdia video are not canon. I'm not really sure how else to explain..desirecampbell, you know what I mean right?

Heh *looks up* I think so. I might have confused myself though

Son Goku · Post by **Son Goku** » Sun May 28, 2006 8:29 am

See, the only problem with the above is the fact that the movie villans appeared in GT.

But, I believe that an explanation for that is that they were killed in... other ways...

Xyex · Post by **Xyex** » Sun May 28, 2006 12:16 pm

Son Goku wrote:See, the only problem with the above is the fact that the movie villans appeared in GT.

But, I believe that an explanation for that is that they were killed in... other ways...

No, the explanation is that GT takes place in the movie universe.

Kanzenshuu

Goku lifting cube of densest material... canon?

Goku lifting cube of densest material... canon?

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