Pure Boo > Evil Boo makes more narrative sense?

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Re: Pure Boo > Evil Boo makes more narrative sense?

Post by Speedster » Mon Mar 11, 2019 2:19 pm

Darkprince410 wrote:
Mon Mar 04, 2019 9:40 am
First of all, kid Buu originally produced a small ki sphere which he threw down and was deflected by a ki blast of Vegeta. Then that was followed by another (which was the same type of attack but) much larger. In all examples throughout Dragonball a larger version of the same attack was also more powerful. Even your counter-example of the Genki Dama against Freeza, is exactly an example that supports that the bigger size of an attack the more powerful it is. In fact, the Genki Dama against Freeza was compared by Kuririn to the one against Vegeta in terms of size in order to convey how much more powerful that Genki Dama was compared to back then. Kuririn opened his hands about 50cm while he estimated the one against Freeza as having a diameter over 50m (i.e. 100x bigger dimeter 1million times bigger volume). Same goes for the Genki Dama against Buu where it was getting physically larger the more power was being contributed to it. Same goes for the several Kamehameha’s (like Roshi’s smaller Kamehameha vs his full power Kamehameha, Goku’s Kaiokenx3 vs x4 Kamehameha etc, etc) and the list goes on...

So obviously the narrative of Toriyama making Kid Buu unleashing a larger version of the same attack meant it was more powerful/it had more energy. Without anything else being stated, it follows that its larger power was the reason they couldn’t counter it. Your theory of large-size attacks being undeflectable only due to their dimensions and not the power they contain is just a desperate attempt to fit your own bias instead of conceding what was actually the obvious intent, i.e. that kid Buu’s attack was a big attack that Goku and Vegeta couldn’t counter because it was too powerful. Nobody reading the manga, especially the target audience of 8-11-year old kids, would come up with your line of reasoning; a line of reasoning that is quite flawed to begin with for multiple reasons and here is why.

You claim that big-in-physical-size ki attacks can’t supposedly be deflected/countered. First, the example of the Genki Dama against Freeza is easily proven wrong as Kid Buu demonstrated later in the series that he could push back an even bigger Genki Dama. So large attacks are not undeflectable per se. The reason Freeza couldn’t deflect it was not because of its size but because because the combination of the Genki Dama’s energy and momentum it was thrown at him was more powerful than he could deflect, especially with just his bare hands. Let's not forget here that he was largely caught off guard and he couldn't counter properly by say gathering energy for a proper ki attack of his own which would be the case here (Goku turning SSJ3 and firing a Kamehameha of his own to counter kid Buu’s blast).

Also Freeza surviving the explosion was not really a testament that his 50% power level being equal or larger to the that of the Genki Dama. When the Genki Dama detonates is like a bomb explosion. Freeza only had to survive the portion of the energy that was passing towards him as per the inverse square law (Wikipedia link here). This is only a small portion of the sphere’s total energy. Also we don't know exactly how powerful that Genki Dama against Freeza was. It was definitely not weaker than what Goku gauged him to be in his 50% form. Going by the guidebooks that should be over 60million, say 70million, but I doubt he made it stronger than Freeza’s 100% (120million). So Freeza could have tapped to a power level above his 50% during the course of him struggling with surviving the attack. Also, even if none of these applies, Freeza has exceptional durability that goes beyond his power - he can get chopped into pieces and still live and can survive get beaten for an hour by a much stronger Broly and survive with minimal damage. However, you slice it, there is no evidence to support your misguided opinion that the Genki Dama against Freeza was weaker than 50% Freeza and that the reason he couldn’t stop it was because of the attack’s physical dimensions.

As for Tenshinhan’s attack against Cell I don't see where you draw any parellels. First of all it wasn’t particularly big in size so I don't know why you brought it as an example to support the supposed undeflectable nature of physically big attacks. In any event it also wasn’t 'undeflectable' to begin with. Cell was caught off guard in the first blast and found himself in the hole the attack created and a disadvantageous position. Then before having time to react properly he was getting blasted repeatedly. Still there was no need for him to deflect the attacks to survive as he was just tanking them while moving up and the last blast pushed him back when he was distracted by noticing that #18 and #16 where fleeing the scene and getting away.

Anyway this debate is getting tiring as always, so I am out. Also for those willing to go the full mile and continue my advice is when you go back and forth quoting previous posts, to put them inside spoilers (like I did above) as the previous page of this thread became literally unreadable (I doubt anybody besides the people who posted in the previous page will ever scroll all the way down to page 5).

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Re: Pure Boo > Evil Boo makes more narrative sense?

Post by Miracles » Mon Mar 11, 2019 8:19 pm

Ripper 30 wrote:
Mon Mar 11, 2019 3:23 am
Miracles wrote:
Sat Mar 09, 2019 3:58 pm
Ripper 30 wrote:
Sat Mar 09, 2019 5:55 am

Goku outright told Piccolo that he couldn't have beaten Boo even after he fought him, only to say otherwise later on.
Lets see if what you say matches up to the story...

Chapter: 476 (DBZ 282), P10.5-8, P11.1-3
Piccolo: “Goku…There’s something I want to ask you while I’ve got the chance…[ ] …That Super Saiyan 3 thing earlier…if you had gone all-out, wouldn’t you have been able to defeat Majin Boo?...How about it, am I wrong?”
Goku: “Nah, I don’t knowWhen it comes to Majin Boo’s strength, it’s like a lie…I think that I probably couldn’t have won…”
Piccolo: “…Probably? Knowing you, why didn’t you try until the very end?...Does it have to do with that energy…?”
Goku: “No…I’m no longer a human who’s particularly even supposed to be here…I shouldn’t be the one to do it. It’d be better for these young guys to solve things somehow or another…After all, some other outrageous guy might show up eventually, right? …It's a nasty gamble, but…Seeing those two super-gifted squirts, it made me want to take this gamble…”

As you can see...You are wrong again...Goku didn't give Piccolo a straight answer but left the outcome as an uncertainty. He wanted the kids to handle it really.
Yet he knew he could obliterate him. That's why he starts with "To tell you the truth" on Kaioshin planet.
Unlike that situation, nowhere in the story does it relate to Super Buu being able to waste Goku and Vegeta. That's just you.
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Re: Pure Boo > Evil Boo makes more narrative sense?

Post by Ripper 30 » Mon Apr 01, 2019 7:18 am

Darkprince410 wrote:
Mon Mar 11, 2019 9:55 am
Goku explicitly stated that nothing he does works on him and he needs to gather Ki for One Minute which means he's weaker unless you think Piccolo was stronger than Raditz. You can't increase your power by gathering ki for a minute, the series has already shown it. Obviously Goku was trying to create a big Final Flash or Makankosappo type finishing attack. Only for Goku to realize after one minute that he needs even more Ki to kill Pure Boo, Goku isn't even used to ssj3 so it's not like he can be 100% right. When he states he's no match for Evil Boo he didn't even had energy to go ssj3 that's why inside Boo's body he only went ssj. It's clearly because his unwillingness to use ssj3, remember what he Told Piccolo about ssj3 being something which can only be used in afterlife and how using it in Living World like earth exhausts Goku? That's the same thing here, Goku has already proven that ssj3 is only a last resort form and he fusion over it anyway. No, the implications are different to you, because you're trying to fit all desperate headcanons here. He didn't even say confidently he can beat Boo, but he was panicked and was shocked when Vegeta asked him to gather energy. Also no, as I said you just want to believe what fits your narrative when there is no mention of Ki going down and both Goku and Vegeta admitting that they were presumptuous after seeing Pure Boo.

Kaioshin being terrible at sensing Ki is horrible headcanon, i am sorry. Do you realize Ki can fluctuate and Ki isn't a definitive scale to always tell who's gonna be the winner. After Kaioshin has seen Vegetto vs Gohan-Boo, your logic is invalid because he clearly has seen the extent of Saiyans and if has seen Gohan-Boo revert to Evil Boo then there's no reason for him to fear Pure Boo if it got weaker. Do you realize that they saw Buff Boo yet never commented on his power or anything but with Pure Boo they called him Most Difficult. Do you realize throughout DBZ, whenever someone used "Yakai" term in subject to the villains, it was always about them being stronger. Like Kaio using it for Vegeta and Nappa when talking about how they are above him or Freeza during his premonitions of Ssj using that term.


Someone's Nature can't make them Most Difficult, where are you getting these headcanons? Throughout DB, the difficulty has always been proportionate with Power and you want me to believe nonsensically Toriyama would do opposite for final villain?


Old Kaioshin says that Pure Boo is the most Troublesome Boo, and then Kibitoshin says "Yes", followed by his words saying that Boo loses power with ABSORPTION(s) since Japanese word has no Plural for that.

This reaffirms Dabura's statement about Boo rejecting the Ki from the Kaioshins despite wanting to power up Boo from fodder Tenkaichi Budokai contestants but they implied it would be disadvantageous if you tie it up with this description above. So, Boo got weaker by absorbing all the Kaioshins AS STATED DIRECTLY. You say that Dai Kaioshin is the only one who made Boo weaker but that's wrong, because the statement is very clear that all the Kaioshins weaken Boo if they're absorbed by him, and the main distinguishing factor between Dai Kaioshin and the other Kaioshins is the fact that he makes Buu controllable.

Why does being the most troublesome/difficult one matter if you aren't the strongest and why is Kibitoshin so scared if Kid Buu isn't the strongest? If Kid Buu is so useless in power like you make it seem, why does being difficult/troublesome matter at all?
Also, Boo's entire being is Kid Boo. According to Akira Toriyama, the Key to winning battle is someone's True character (Shouki). Kid Boo is the true character of his being so it's natural he's the strongest. He's not deluded by Kaioshin's goodness.

No matter what you believe, if result of absorbing 2 Kaioshins was power getting lowered then taking out that influence will result in opposite, you just try to hide it with headcanons.

Yea Gohan was able to dominate Evil Boo but Goku wanted both Gotenks and Gohan to stand a chance near Pure Boo, this means Evil Boo is strong, right? :crazy:
Only difference is Dai Kaioshin made him controllable. South Kaioshin can't even power up Boo, he's not even ssj3 tier, he can put a limiter on his power but there's no way south Kaioshin was strong enough to power up him.

Goku even said he can't beat Fat Boo so you think his statement inside Boo's body is 100 % accurate? When he isn't even trying to go ssj3 near Evil Boo. He never once said he can beat Pure Boo but only that he needs to charge ki for a minute to wipe him, and regretted not using Potara. He fired 2 Kamehamehas at Boo, told Vegeta he's not not holding back for him and comments about nothing working on pure Boo and you think Goku was not weaker than Boo? :D :D. No that's not the simplest way but your biased way too look at it. When he adds Gotenks alongside Gohan when talking about other warriors who can participate in beating Boo. He never ever mentioned about Boo's Power even going down but according to your "simplest way" it did.
Chapter: 509 (DBZ 315), P6.8, P7.1-5
Context: after Kaioshin hands Goku his Potara, but he refuses it
Goku: “…Like I thought, these…just ain’t suited for us…Even though you went out of your way to hand ‘em over…We want to fight with only our own power. I’m sorry, especially since things are so dangerous now…But [Boo] ain’t merged anymore either…“
Elder Kaioshin: “Yo-you idiot! What are you saying?! And at a time like this! It’s not like you gu-guys are in a martial arts match with Boo, you know!”
Vegeta: “…Well said, Kakarot. Just like a true…Saiyan.”
Kaioshins: “…!”
Goku: “It’s alright. I’m tellin’ ya, don’t worry. He can’t come all the way here. We’ll think up some sorta strategy. I feel bad for the aliens who will be sacrificed in the meantime, but we’ll use the dragonballs later…

He was so confident of Pure Boo being weaker that he was willing to sacrifice planets just so he can come up with his strategy to beat Boo. Great analogy friend. You're now grasping at straws when it's supposed to be a single transformation, there's nothing like Buff boo that's fandom term. Vegeta's dialogue suggest it's one single nonstop transformation. All this comes down to you assuming that they were not senseless to judge from Size which is exactly what they did here, against Freeza and against Cell, Its Toriyama's Staple Point towards the end. He did that with Kuririn talking about Freeza getting smaller and not looking strong. You think Kuririn can't sense Ki even though that's what he was doing on Namek? Then the narrative proves them wrong by performing a feat like Freeza killing dende. Vegeta commented on Cell getting smaller too and then kicked him only to realize that he's wrong. This has been an ongoing trope in the story. Ki is not definitive So it can Fluctuate up and down. It's completely hypocritical When People Say that why didn't Toriyama Wrote "Most Strongest" instead of "Most Troublesome" and then Say That Toriyama "Indicated" his ki Going down by talking about size Even though he never wrote about Ki Such, you see how biased you are?

Wow :clap: :clap: another new headcanon. Do you know how wrong you are? Goku actually saw Semi-Perfect Cell once already and he Saw Evil Boo too. You're just believing what you want to instead of what's presented. He was obviously image training with the strongest forms. It's funny how you make the argument of "most familiar" because you know your logic will debunked here. Yea that's because he was little worn out by fighting Pure Boo so obviously he would have lost stamina. He was recharging Ki there and never did he mentioned about "i could have beaten boo if I was successful in gathering Ki", him wanting Gohan and gotenks to fight together says something. It was all about final finishing move.

You are making your own DB, Genki-Dama takes little bit of Ki according to manga only. When Kuririn asked Goku about Genki-Dama, Goku explicitly told him that it is the Ki he gathered from earth.
Goku: “Hey! So it was the Genki-Dama you were thinking of!? It-it’s no use! Against Boo, no matter how much we gathered little bits of ki from all the Earthlings…”
Vegeta: “I told you, right? That those guys on Earth should take responsibility every now and then…! It won’t be just little bit. We’ll gather ki from them right up to their limits!


The Super Genki Dama was about taking Ki right up to their limit which means Gohan also gave all of his Ki.

Does Goku's Youki or Shouki change since he was a kid? No. Did Goku get stronger? Yes. Is Genki the only trait left that changed? Yes. So more Genki means more power. What is a power level? It counts ki. And a human has a power level of 5 and turtle has a power level of 0.001. This means that trees and the ocean DO have a power level but is far too small individually to measure. Hence "Ki" to their limit.actually they did say lend me your power when charging it up.

Goku took little bit of Ki according to his own admission in Saiyan arc when explaining Genki Dama to him.

Genki and ki are the same thing. Vegeta/Goku said they are gathering ki up to their limits for Kid boo as it's explicitly stated.

If you think they only took Genki in Boo arc Genki-Dama then You are trying to fit your baseless headcanon. Goku even mentioned explicitly that Gohan sent his Ki.

Kibitoshin was exhausted not because he was drained of energy but because his good health was taken :D :D :D :D I Wish there were some fans with objective opinions, only then they would find this statement hilarious.

Everytime in Z whenever someone talks about a villain being more difficult (Yakai) it was due to the Power but magically Toriyama will this time make Boo more difficult than all boo but weaker :D :D :D

It's simple, Pure Boo was stated in manga as well as the anime to be quote 'More trouble' end quote then Evil Boo right after the mention of his Ki going up and not being refuted by anyone.As well as Boo having the Kaioshins inside him still bringing down his power. You are on purpose missing the point. Do you realize Viz changed the things like totally removing the part about absorptions making Boo weaker? They added some bs about Boo eating souls but the souls taming him giving everyone the wrong impression that he wasn't weakened only tamed.

Your headcanons never fail to amuse me.

If Toriyama wanted that then he would have drawn atleast 3 chapter long one-on-one fight but Goku instantly realizes that no matter what he does boo keeps coming back with zero damage and then regrets not using potara saying he acted cool. Do you see the point? Your assumptions are based on bad headcanons because it's never even stated that Boo's ki went down, Goku never even told that his excuse to refuse potara was weakening of Boo but Fair fight and Saiyan pride thing. Then he even says that he will think of some plan while Boo destroys planets, not a single implication of Boo being weak.

You're just not willing to let go your bias, Toriyama clearly puts enough evidence to say Pure Boo is above Evil Boo. Final form of the villain being strongest like everytime in DBZ ruins the Narrative :D :D :D. If Toriyama wanted to Kill Gohan and Gotenks because of that, then he would not make them available few chapters later only for both exhausted characters to refuse easy solution. If Gohan was enough Goku would not have agreed with Vegeta and called Gohan to finish Boo but that wasn't the case. Goku actually praised Vegeta just after he told him it was useless, you think Goku of all people would forget Gohan?
Speedster wrote:
Mon Mar 11, 2019 2:19 pm
Darkprince410 wrote:
Mon Mar 04, 2019 9:40 am
First of all, kid Buu originally produced a small ki sphere which he threw down and was deflected by a ki blast of Vegeta. Then that was followed by another (which was the same type of attack but) much larger. In all examples throughout Dragonball a larger version of the same attack was also more powerful. Even your counter-example of the Genki Dama against Freeza, is exactly an example that supports that the bigger size of an attack the more powerful it is. In fact, the Genki Dama against Freeza was compared by Kuririn to the one against Vegeta in terms of size in order to convey how much more powerful that Genki Dama was compared to back then. Kuririn opened his hands about 50cm while he estimated the one against Freeza as having a diameter over 50m (i.e. 100x bigger dimeter 1million times bigger volume). Same goes for the Genki Dama against Buu where it was getting physically larger the more power was being contributed to it. Same goes for the several Kamehameha’s (like Roshi’s smaller Kamehameha vs his full power Kamehameha, Goku’s Kaiokenx3 vs x4 Kamehameha etc, etc) and the list goes on...

So obviously the narrative of Toriyama making Kid Buu unleashing a larger version of the same attack meant it was more powerful/it had more energy. Without anything else being stated, it follows that its larger power was the reason they couldn’t counter it. Your theory of large-size attacks being undeflectable only due to their dimensions and not the power they contain is just a desperate attempt to fit your own bias instead of conceding what was actually the obvious intent, i.e. that kid Buu’s attack was a big attack that Goku and Vegeta couldn’t counter because it was too powerful. Nobody reading the manga, especially the target audience of 8-11-year old kids, would come up with your line of reasoning; a line of reasoning that is quite flawed to begin with for multiple reasons and here is why.

You claim that big-in-physical-size ki attacks can’t supposedly be deflected/countered. First, the example of the Genki Dama against Freeza is easily proven wrong as Kid Buu demonstrated later in the series that he could push back an even bigger Genki Dama. So large attacks are not undeflectable per se. The reason Freeza couldn’t deflect it was not because of its size but because because the combination of the Genki Dama’s energy and momentum it was thrown at him was more powerful than he could deflect, especially with just his bare hands. Let's not forget here that he was largely caught off guard and he couldn't counter properly by say gathering energy for a proper ki attack of his own which would be the case here (Goku turning SSJ3 and firing a Kamehameha of his own to counter kid Buu’s blast).

Also Freeza surviving the explosion was not really a testament that his 50% power level being equal or larger to the that of the Genki Dama. When the Genki Dama detonates is like a bomb explosion. Freeza only had to survive the portion of the energy that was passing towards him as per the inverse square law (Wikipedia link here). This is only a small portion of the sphere’s total energy. Also we don't know exactly how powerful that Genki Dama against Freeza was. It was definitely not weaker than what Goku gauged him to be in his 50% form. Going by the guidebooks that should be over 60million, say 70million, but I doubt he made it stronger than Freeza’s 100% (120million). So Freeza could have tapped to a power level above his 50% during the course of him struggling with surviving the attack. Also, even if none of these applies, Freeza has exceptional durability that goes beyond his power - he can get chopped into pieces and still live and can survive get beaten for an hour by a much stronger Broly and survive with minimal damage. However, you slice it, there is no evidence to support your misguided opinion that the Genki Dama against Freeza was weaker than 50% Freeza and that the reason he couldn’t stop it was because of the attack’s physical dimensions.

As for Tenshinhan’s attack against Cell I don't see where you draw any parellels. First of all it wasn’t particularly big in size so I don't know why you brought it as an example to support the supposed undeflectable nature of physically big attacks. In any event it also wasn’t 'undeflectable' to begin with. Cell was caught off guard in the first blast and found himself in the hole the attack created and a disadvantageous position. Then before having time to react properly he was getting blasted repeatedly. Still there was no need for him to deflect the attacks to survive as he was just tanking them while moving up and the last blast pushed him back when he was distracted by noticing that #18 and #16 where fleeing the scene and getting away.

Anyway this debate is getting tiring as always, so I am out. Also for those willing to go the full mile and continue my advice is when you go back and forth quoting previous posts, to put them inside spoilers (like I did above) as the previous page of this thread became literally unreadable (I doubt anybody besides the people who posted in the previous page will ever scroll all the way down to page 5).
[/spoiler]
No point in telling them, they are hell bent on their headcanons of Super Boo > Kid Boo due to Goku saying he gathered Ki close to full power but lost the stored up Ki and him saying he will be done in by Super Boo.
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Re: Pure Boo > Evil Boo makes more narrative sense?

Post by Darkprince410 » Tue Apr 02, 2019 2:10 am

Goku explicitly stated that nothing he does works on him and he needs to gather Ki for One Minute which means he's weaker unless you think Piccolo was stronger than Raditz. You can't increase your power by gathering ki for a minute, the series has already shown it. Obviously Goku was trying to create a big Final Flash or Makankosappo type finishing attack. Only for Goku to realize after one minute that he needs even more Ki to kill Pure Boo, Goku isn't even used to ssj3 so it's not like he can be 100% right. When he states he's no match for Evil Boo he didn't even had energy to go ssj3 that's why inside Boo's body he only went ssj. It's clearly because his unwillingness to use ssj3, remember what he Told Piccolo about ssj3 being something which can only be used in afterlife and how using it in Living World like earth exhausts Goku? That's the same thing here, Goku has already proven that ssj3 is only a last resort form and he fusion over it anyway. No, the implications are different to you, because you're trying to fit all desperate headcanons here. He didn't even say confidently he can beat Boo, but he was panicked and was shocked when Vegeta asked him to gather energy. Also no, as I said you just want to believe what fits your narrative when there is no mention of Ki going down and both Goku and Vegeta admitting that they were presumptuous after seeing Pure Boo.
You're trying to desperately fit headcanon into the mix here. The narrative is simple and straightforward, but you're trying to insert unsupported opinions and beliefs into the mix. Goku readily said the reason that he needed more time to recharge after the minute passed is because he was beginning to lose power rather than maintain it. He never got back up to 100%, which is all he said he needed to fire off a blast capable of destroying Buu. Neither Kamehameha he fired at Buu beforehand was at full power (his own words), and by the time he decided to try that approach, he needed the minute to charge himself back up. Likewise, Goku readily had more than enough energy to go Super Saiyan 3 while inside Buu's body. He just knew it wouldn't matter because Buu was simply too strong for him. After all, he had plenty of power to do so on Kaioushin's planet only minutes later, and that was with a living body.
Kaioshin being terrible at sensing Ki is horrible headcanon, i am sorry. Do you realize Ki can fluctuate and Ki isn't a definitive scale to always tell who's gonna be the winner. After Kaioshin has seen Vegetto vs Gohan-Boo, your logic is invalid because he clearly has seen the extent of Saiyans and if has seen Gohan-Boo revert to Evil Boo then there's no reason for him to fear Pure Boo if it got weaker. Do you realize that they saw Buff Boo yet never commented on his power or anything but with Pure Boo they called him Most Difficult. Do you realize throughout DBZ, whenever someone used "Yakai" term in subject to the villains, it was always about them being stronger. Like Kaio using it for Vegeta and Nappa when talking about how they are above him or Freeza during his premonitions of Ssj using that term.
It's not horrible headcanon, given that it's clearly shown time and time again. Likewise, it's clear that they called him the most troublesome because of his personality and nature, not his strength.
Someone's Nature can't make them Most Difficult, where are you getting these headcanons? Throughout DB, the difficulty has always been proportionate with Power and you want me to believe nonsensically Toriyama would do opposite for final villain?
Yes, his nature can, and it very well did. Look at the first thing that Pure Buu did after he formed. He went to try and destroy the Earth. The other forms of Buu could be reasoned with to some extent, but Pure Buu couldn't, and that's what made him so dangerous.
Old Kaioshin says that Pure Boo is the most Troublesome Boo, and then Kibitoshin says "Yes", followed by his words saying that Boo loses power with ABSORPTION since Japanese word has no Plural for that.
Rou Kaioushin asked if Pure Buu was the most troublesome based on what Kibitoshin had told him beforehand, and what Kibitoshin had told him beforehand made no mention of Buu's power being affected by his absorptions, just his change in demeanor following absorbing Dai Kaioushin. Therefore, he is asking if Pure Buu is the most troublesome because his demeanor and nature has changed, that's it. He can't be asking if Pure Buu is the most troublesome because of his strength because Kibitoshin's told him nothing about his strength, and Kibitoshin responding that he is correct means that he is correct because of his nature.
Why does being the most troublesome/difficult one matter if you aren't the strongest and why is Kibitoshin so scared if Kid Buu isn't the strongest? If Kid Buu is so useless in power like you make it seem, why does being difficult/troublesome matter at all?
Because, as said above, his uncontrollable nature makes him that much more dangerous. He can't be reasoned with, and he went to destroy the planet instantly after forming. If that doesn't make someone more troublesome, even if they're weaker, then I don't know what would.
No matter what you believe, if result of absorbing 2 Kaioshins was power getting lowered then taking out that influence will result in opposite, you just try to hide it with headcanons.
Only the Dai Kaioushin weakened him. South Kaioushin increased his strength given all the information provided.
Only difference is Dai Kaioshin made him controllable. South Kaioshin can't even power up Boo, he's not even ssj3 tier, he can put a limiter on his power but there's no way south Kaioshin was strong enough to power up him.
Prove that he isn't Super Saiyan 3 tier. There's nothing saying that he isn't Super Saiyan 3 tier (the Z Sword doesn't, as it's not stated that he had ever tried to remove it). Only the Dai Kaioushin was indicated to have weakened Buu, and given that South Kaioushin did not affect Buu negatively, then absorbing him made him stronger.
Goku even said he can't beat Fat Boo so you think his statement inside Boo's body is 100 % accurate? When he isn't even trying to go ssj3 near Evil Boo. He never once said he can beat Pure Boo but only that he needs to charge ki for a minute to wipe him, and regretted not using Potara. He fired 2 Kamehamehas at Boo, told Vegeta he's not not holding back for him and comments about nothing working on pure Boo and you think Goku was not weaker than Boo? :D :D. No that's not the simplest way but your biased way too look at it. When he adds Gotenks alongside Gohan when talking about other warriors who can participate in beating Boo. He never ever mentioned about Boo's Power even going down but according to your "simplest way" it did.
Goku did indeed say he couldn't beat Fat Buu, but then later said he was lying. He never indicated or even suggested he was lying when it came to his statement about Evil Buu though. Neither Kamehameha he fired at Buu was at full power (his own words), and he indicated that charging his ki back up to 100% (not an overcharged blast like the Final Flash or anything like that) would be enough to beat Buu. And he implied heavily that Buu's power went down, as he felt confident they had a chance against him, when before they had no chance against Evil Buu. It's your headcanon that he was talking about Buu's size at that moment (and it'd go completely out of character for him to be judging Buu on his size rather than ki)
He was so confident of Pure Boo being weaker that he was willing to sacrifice planets just so he can come up with his strategy to beat Boo. Great analogy friend. You're now grasping at straws when it's supposed to be a single transformation, there's nothing like Buff boo that's fandom term. Vegeta's dialogue suggest it's one single nonstop transformation. All this comes down to you assuming that they were not senseless to judge from Size which is exactly what they did here, against Freeza and against Cell, Its Toriyama's Staple Point towards the end. He did that with Kuririn talking about Freeza getting smaller and not looking strong. You think Kuririn can't sense Ki even though that's what he was doing on Namek? Then the narrative proves them wrong by performing a feat like Freeza killing dende. Vegeta commented on Cell getting smaller too and then kicked him only to realize that he's wrong. This has been an ongoing trope in the story. Ki is not definitive So it can Fluctuate up and down. It's completely hypocritical When People Say that why didn't Toriyama Wrote "Most Strongest" instead of "Most Troublesome" and then Say That Toriyama "Indicated" his ki Going down by talking about size Even though he never wrote about Ki Such, you see how biased you are?
Vegeta's dialogue establishes that it was multiple transformations, not a single one, as he even says "it looks like he's intending another transformation". I am saying that Goku has never once judged an individual based on his size or physical appearance when he was able to sense their ki. I know others have done so before, so I'm not going to say that there's no precedent for it being done at all in the franchise, but I am saying that GOKU has never done it before, so him suddenly doing so now would be out of character. Goku has always been shown to be one that judges by ki first, and only judges them by physical appearance if he can't sense their ki, so his confidence in their chances with Buu can only be interpreted as sensing he's weaker than he was before.
Wow :clap: :clap: another new headcanon. Do you know how wrong you are? Goku actually saw Semi-Perfect Cell once already and he Saw Evil Boo too. You're just believing what you want to instead of what's presented. He was obviously image training with the strongest forms. It's funny how you make the argument of "most familiar" because you know your logic will debunked here. Yea that's because he was little worn out by fighting Pure Boo so obviously he would have lost stamina. He was recharging Ki there and never did he mentioned about "i could have beaten boo if I was successful in gathering Ki", him wanting Gohan and gotenks to fight together says something. It was all about final finishing move.
Read what I said. He never fought either Cell's second form or Evil Buu. The forms we see Goku image training against are the only forms of those particular enemies he fought. And yes, he did. He said that he'd need a minute to gather the necessary energy to wipe Buu out, and that energy would be his 100% power (not anything higher), and again, I've told you what
Does Goku's Youki or Shouki change since he was a kid? No. Did Goku get stronger? Yes. Is Genki the only trait left that changed? Yes. So more Genki means more power. What is a power level? It counts ki. And a human has a power level of 5 and turtle has a power level of 0.001. This means that trees and the ocean DO have a power level but is far too small individually to measure. Hence "Ki" to their limit.actually they did say lend me your power when charging it up.
No, genki isn't the only trait left, because, as said many times now, there aren't just three elements that make up ki. Toriyama just used those three as examples of some of the elements, not all of them. It'd be no different than saying "including such cars as Corvettes, Camaros, and Jaguars". Are those three the only three kinds of car there are? No. Just three examples of cars that are out there. In the same way, Toriyama only mentioned those three as examples of some of the elements there. So there are more elements that can grow alongside the three mentioned, and therefore genki is not the sole component in ki that makes someone stronger.
Genki and ki are the same thing. Vegeta/Goku said they are gathering ki up to their limits for Kid boo as it's explicitly stated.
No, they aren't. Genki is just one of many elements that make up ki, and mentioning "ki" in relation to the Genki Dama is in reference to genki, not total ki. When Vegeta is talking about them donating ki to their limits, he's meaning their genki, leaving all their other elements there. Same for Goku SPECIFICALLY asking them to donate their genki.
Kibitoshin was exhausted not because he was drained of energy but because his good health was taken :D :D :D :D I Wish there were some fans with objective opinions, only then they would find this statement hilarious.
Given that that's what factually and objectively happened, I don't see why you're making smiley faces about it.
It's simple, Pure Boo was stated in manga as well as the anime to be quote 'More trouble' end quote then Evil Boo right after the mention of his Ki going up and not being refuted by anyone.As well as Boo having the Kaioshins inside him still bringing down his power. You are on purpose missing the point. Do you realize Viz changed the things like totally removing the part about absorptions making Boo weaker? They added some bs about Boo eating souls but the souls taming him giving everyone the wrong impression that he wasn't weakened only tamed.
I'm not going off Viz's translations. I'm going solely off the original manga, and yes, it is simple. Pure Buu is the most troublesome due to his nature, as the Dai Kaioushin, the only one that weakened him, also tamed him and made him controllable. Goku indicated a power drop when Pure Buu formed, as the South Kaioushin had strengthened him (as all normal absorptions do). This is the most simple and straightforward way to look at the course of events, without trying to insert unsupported headcanon into the mix.
If Toriyama wanted that then he would have drawn atleast 3 chapter long one-on-one fight but Goku instantly realizes that no matter what he does boo keeps coming back with zero damage and then regrets not using potara saying he acted cool. Do you see the point? Your assumptions are based on bad headcanons because it's never even stated that Boo's ki went down, Goku never even told that his excuse to refuse potara was weakening of Boo but Fair fight and Saiyan pride thing. Then he even says that he will think of some plan while Boo destroys planets, not a single implication of Boo being weak.
Goku maintained that he believed he could defeat Pure Buu on his own though, despite establishing before, without contradiction, that he couldn't beat Evil Buu, even with Vegeta's help. It's headcanon that he wasn't including Super Saiyan 3 into his rationale there as far as being unable to defeat Evil Buu , and a power decrease doesn't need to be stated when it's heavily implied multiple times. Likewise, why would Goku indicate defeating Pure Buu with the Potaras would be even easier than it would be defeating Evil Buu with them if Pure Buu was stronger?
You're just not willing to let go your bias, Toriyama clearly puts enough evidence to say Pure Boo is above Evil Boo. Final form of the villain being strongest like everytime in DBZ ruins the Narrative :D :D :D. If Toriyama wanted to Kill Gohan and Gotenks because of that, then he would not make them available few chapters later only for both exhausted characters to refuse easy solution. If Gohan was enough Goku would not have agreed with Vegeta and called Gohan to finish Boo but that wasn't the case. Goku actually praised Vegeta just after he told him it was useless, you think Goku of all people would forget Gohan?
I'm not being biased. I'm going off the facts as they're provided. There's no legitimate evidence that Pure Buu is above Evil Buu, and plenty saying otherwise. If Gohan or Gotenks wasn't enough to defeat Buu, why would Goku have suggested it in the first place? Why didn't Vegeta call him an idiot for having such an idea (when he's done so every other time Goku's had an idea that he felt wouldn't work)? The choice of the Genki Dama over Gohan and Gotenks had NOTHING to do with their chances of beating Buu, but because Vegeta felt that Earth's population needed to handle things on their own for once. This is the sole truth of the matter. Anything else is unsupported headcanon.

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Re: Pure Boo > Evil Boo makes more narrative sense?

Post by Ripper 30 » Tue Apr 02, 2019 6:01 am




You are on purpose missing the point. Goku told Vegeta that if he doesn't go Full Power then the universe is doomed then he reconfirmed it to Vegeta that he has not been holding back and Boo keeps coming back no matter what he does.
Right after tanking Goku's best attack (SSJ3 kamehameha), he delays his regeneration and spawns dancing and trolling around, clearly indicating he doesn't take Goku SSJ3 serious.

It is unlikely that he was just fooling around in that one sole instance. It would not make sense for Pure Boo to go 100% and then randomly just stop taking Goku serious, especially after an attack of that magnitude. If anything, that attack would worry/enrage Pure Boo to truly go mad and destroy the universe. But he didn't, because all of those warriors on the Kaioshin planet were a joke to him.

Even if Pure Boo was going 100% the entire time, it doesn't change the fact that Boo without Kaioshin restricting/taming him (Pure Boo) is stronger and more dangerous than Boo with Kaioshin restricting/taming him (Evil Boo).


That's a clear proof that, Pure Boo > Goku. Even, the guides which you use say even a Full Power Goku in one-on-one fight can't beat Boo.


Context > Simple statement in void. This statement inside Evil Boo's body appeared when the audience was under the impression that even Fat Boo is above Ssj3 Goku. So this is no surprise. Goku is just rehashing what he implied, and afterwards his childish demeanour did all of that just to convince Vegeta to fuse, similar to how he wanted to fuse against Fat Boo despite having more power already.
Chapter: 509 (DBZ 315), P11.4-6
Context: as Goku prepares to fight Boo
Goku: “Alrii~~iight. I’d better go all out right from the start…! If we get done in, then the entire universe will go ‘poof’…”
Vegeta: “Let me see this ‘Super Saiyan 3’ thing with my own eyes…”
Goku: “Is that alright? You just might not get your turn…I can say this now, but the truth is that with that Fat Boo, I would have been able to defeat him at the time with Super Saiyan 3…However, I wanted the young guys to manage something…For the Earth’s sake too…”


Goku being above Pure Boo is also wrong because charging up till full power is superior to Goku himself. Similar to Piccolo and the Makankosappo. Also, Pure Boo got underestimated by Goku either way, so this is null. If you're only using one statement, I'd advice you check the rest

How can a Kamehameha not be at Full Power when he's fresh and just started? That makes no sense. Considering how he told Vegeta he's not holding back. Also, you're wrong, he wanted to try and gather as much ki as possible because that was the last resort. He already Told Elder Kaioshin that he want to beat Boo with his own power and Vegeta crushed one Potara earring. It's not like they had any other choice, he was going for a final move. Again back to headcanons, Goku thinks he will be done in by Evil Boo if he goes out yet only goes ssj when he appears near him because it's useless so let's die even though he was ssj3 near Gotenks-Boo? :clap: :clap:

It's horrible headcanon, it's your own logic that magically Kibitoshin forgets how to sense Ki and both Kaioshins will stop celebrating after Evil Boo gets weaker :D :D

Goku literally admitted he can't do anything with Pure Boo's blast. If Pure Boo was so much weaker, Goku would have tried to counter it in ssj3 instantly like he turned into that near Gotenks-Boo. Throughout the whole show Goku had never shown such fear, when Piccolo was gonna blow up the audience at Tenkaichi Budokai, Goku countered it. When Vegeta was gonna blow up earth with Gyallic-Ho Goku countered it, when Cell tried to do a Kamehameha Goku countered it, but with Pure Boo he was so scared due to immense Power that he admitted defeat there and instead was trying to run. Don't bring up the Size argument because it's the power of the attack which matters, for example, when Vegeta launched that comparatively smaller Ki blast on Freeza, it had enough power to destroy Namek. Big attack can be countered if the other person is powerful enough.

Pure Boo's first attack was weaker that's why ssj Vegeta countered it then he launched a more powerful which Goku said was beyond them and this was said even before it was launched.

Just because he can blow planets doesn't make him Most Difficult if any unfused warrior can beat him. Why would he be called Difficult if Gohan can finish him. If that's the case why would Elder Kaioshin try to give his 2 cents on Genki Dama plan but not even mention Gohan and why will the whole Universe become so dumb that they won't mention Gohan to Goku telepathically?

The absorptions made Boo weaker. The word used in this case is "吸収" which does mean "absorption" and you can't make a plural out of it, but it becomes a plural with the context.

The term "absorption", whether written plural in English or not, could mean plural in context. An example is when some food product ad says "nutrient absorption", it doesn't mean the absorption of a single nutrient, but it means the entire process of nutrient absorption, therefore it acts as a plural in context but grammatically it remains singular

Plurals are found in japanese, but one thing is that Japanese doesn't pluralize words when they're already understood from the context
Like when they say Gakusei which can mean student or students or them saying Gakuseitachi which means students. Another one is Hito meaning person or persons and Hitobito meaning Persons or people.

I've also opened Japanese sites to check on this and if all turns out right, so yes, there ARE plurals, but they are usually understood in just the context itself

Here's an example in English: "I ate fish"

Did I eat only one fish? Two fish? Three? Ten? All of that doesn't matter. The general case is that I ate "Fish", and that's about it

It becomes vague. However, when there's specification in context, it becomes differnet

As we said before, "absorption", being singular can also refer to a plural picture as the example given. The context here refers to ALL the absorptions.

"through absorption" goes as simple as it gets. It generalizes the idea that through the entire process of absorption, he got weaker.

Which means, there is no "specific Kaioshin" it refers to at all. To say it does would be nitpicking on your part. In fact, even herms (who knows more than us in Japanese) has interpreted the term as "absorptions".

The thing is, Dai Kaioshin's effect according to the Manga was ONLY making him more controllable. Which means in terms of dangerousness, Buff Boo = Pure Boo but Fat Boo is different. Therefore, "most troublesome" refers to most powerful. Herms also once admitted that this "troublesome" notion could be translated as most "strongest" depending on the context, but he decided to translate it verbatim in one of his videos with geekdom101.
Chapter: 508 (DBZ 314), P4.2-7
Kaioshin: “In m…my era there were five Kaioshins…until they were defeated by the Majin Boo that the wizard Babidi created…I was the youngest and most powerless one, but I somehow survived, with only heavy injuries…But the other four fell to Boo…First, two were killed…the North Kaioshin and the West Kaioshin….And then the South Kaioshin, the burliest and strongest one, was…somehow absorbed by Boo….. “
Elder Kaioshin: …And he became that huge Boo from before? “
Kaioshin: “…Yes…Next to be absorbed was the fat but kind and gentle Dai-Kaioshin….The Majin Boo that Bibidi created was evil itself, a failed creation that even Bibidi himself couldn’t handle, but by absorbing the Dai-Kaioshin, he somehow become controllable…. “
Elder Kaioshin: “…So he was finally completed…Which is to say…that this current…small Majin Boo…is the initial…mo…most troublesome one…”
Kaioshin: “….Yes…the heart which he gained by going so far as to lower his power through absorption(s)…has returned once again to the way it was…he has no self-control whatsoever…he has become evil itself…”


Look bud, no matter how much desperation a super boo supporter might show, they lose infront of this.

In fact, Dabra admitted that Kaioshin energy is not allowed for Boo's absorptions. Yeah, that's just too much from you. Now you will resort to some new headcanon which defies all logic.

We already have enough evidences:

-With no Kaioshin influence, Pure Boo is the strongest incarnation of Boo
-Kaioshin says that the absorption of Kaioshins lowered his power, in response to "most troublesome"
In itself, it's vague to just say it refers to Power, but with exterior evidence and/or implications, you'll realize it's about power. Very obvious.

-Gohan's and everyone else's Ki is not enough to beat Pure Boo but Gohan pummeled Evil Boo

-Vegeta says that if Pure Boo were to come again, no one can stop him despite Gotenks and Gohan being alive

self explanatory. Anyone can see what this proves.


None of your headcanons based on "information provided" make any sense.



why whas there no Kaioshin present in Boo when Goku and Vegeta saved the others and noted the sudden power increase? Why would Boo revert to his Buff ("stronger" :roll: state) and then purposely become weaker, when the parts for the composition still remained inside of him? And finally, Isn't Evil Boo just Pure Evil Boo in control with Good Boo's added power, meaning he wasn't much stronger than Good Boo originally was?
You assume South Kaioshin was extremely strong only because you believe Evil Boo is stronger than Pure Boo, but there's nothing implying South Kaioshin was stronger than Gohan SS1. So, you have to :
-ignore the implications of majin powers not getting boosted by Kaioshins, like when Dabra explicitly saying that they can't take any energy from kaioshins but rest are still an option, potara wearing up due to atmosphere inside boo's body, these all imply that Kaioshin magic does not blend with majin
- suppose South Kaioshin didn't try to pull out the Z-Sword for no reason at all
- suppose South Kaioshin was equal or stronger than Pure Boo even though there's not even a single hint.
Actually, you're making an assumption based on... nothing

Kaioshins mentioned that no one was able to pull it and even Kibito said that a mortal can't pull a sword which even Kaioshins failed to pull. Yea South Kaioshin who is strongest among Kaioshin totally never tried it despite him being the best contender to do it :D :D

Given that South Kaioshin is never commented on making Boo stronger, you can't make up plot points.

Context: after Kaioshin hands Goku his Potara, but he refuses it
Goku: “…Like I thought, these…just ain’t suited for us…Even though you went out of your way to hand ‘em over…We want to fight with only our own power. I’m sorry, especially since things are so dangerous now…But [Boo] ain’t merged anymore either…“
Elder Kaioshin: “Yo-you idiot! What are you saying?! And at a time like this! It’s not like you gu-guys are in a martial arts match with Boo, you know!”
Vegeta: “…Well said, Kakarot. Just like a true…Saiyan.”
Kaioshins: “…!”
Goku: “It’s alright. I’m tellin’ ya, don’t worry. He can’t come all the way here. We’ll think up some sorta strategy. I feel bad for the aliens who will be sacrificed in the meantime, but we’ll use the dragonballs later…”

Goku was so much confident of beating Pure Boo that he was going to sacrifice the entire universe to come up with a plan to beat him :crazy:

Wait, what? So my statement based on direct evidence of them talking about their size only is headcanon but your assumptions about them referring to his ki but never bringing it up is not headcanon? :D :D :D

No its not out of character, Goku also mocked Freeza for his height and said that he never expected Freeza to be a runt then he also thought Freeza with 50% power was bluffing only to find out he wasn't when Freeza tanked Kaioken times 20 Kamehameha. Ki isn't definitive and it can fluctuate.


Goku never talks about increase or decrease in power without mentioning Ki and you think he for some reason would forget about it and when Elder Kaioshin asks him why he wants to fight one-on-one, he would not even bother mentioning the ki drop. Pure Boo was definitely suppressing his Ki that's why Goku and Vegeta freaked out after Pure Boo screames. Then, Goku despite having ssj3 admit he can't do anything with Pure Boo's blast, in Freeza arc we already saw that you can deflect big planet blowing blast if you're stronger than the opponent, as Freeza demonstrated with kicking Vegeta's attack intended at blowing Namek along with Freeza. Goku was giving his all with Pure Boo, he told Vegeta before and after fighting Pure Boo that he's not gonna hold back.

Absolutely wrong and horrendous argument. Akira Toriyama said that someone might have ZERO GENKI but still have high energy and move around. However, if your Ki is taken "your own life force energy", you start getting tired and reach your end. Daizenshuu 7 says Super Genki Dama takes in Ki and NOT Genki.

In Saiyan and Namek arc, He took the "Energy" within these plants, which can also translate to "Ki". Second, even if he took the "Genki" of those plants, it isn't taking their "heath", it's taking the energy which holds their entire being together. Plants have Ki, they have a LIFE FORCE. Ki is someone's life force and that's all. Genki is someone's health.

Genki is a concept, and you can't take a concept and materialize it into a Ki blast. That's just laughable. Genki can also mean "Ki" depending on the context, but in general terms, "Ki" means someone's life force while Genki doesn't.

Daizenshuu 4 says it collects Ki AND Genki, therefore debunking your entire remark LOL. Also, Goku usually screams "give me your power" by saying "chikara" {パワー} which is a relative term to Ki in DBZ

Genki just means health and not energy. Example: 元気ですか (Genki desu ka) means "How are you".

It just describes someone as being energetic, or lively. Ki, on the other hand means this:

the circulating life force whose existence and properties are the basis of much Chinese philosophy and medicine.

Ki is someone's life force, therefore it takes Ki.

Ki Blasts shoot Ki, not Genki (for example) and Genki Dama is a type of Ki attack.

Goku describes Genki-Dama as "Ki that i have collected from the earth" and then Kuririn comments it as "that's tremendous Ki"

It's Ki, Kaio told Goku that it's a technique which takes little bit of Energy from surroundings

Gen ki is basic origin of life force. The origin of Ki.

Now you are on purpose interpreting Vegeta's statements wrong.


Nope, you are interpreting it wrong, if Kaioshin absorptions made Boo weaker than removing their influence wil make him strong without any limitation.

Goku never said he could have definitely beaten Boo if it wasn't for Ssj3 drain. That's your new headcanon, if he fought Evil Boo and was cornered he would have done the same thing as Pure Boo.


Goku goes ssj3 near Gotenks-Boo but you think he will not go ssj3 to defend himself against even weaker form? Do you realise you are getting nowhere with your arguments? Goku already told Piccolo about ssj3 being something suited for afterlife and how it can exhaust the user in living World.

You intentionally ignore the clear evidence of Pure Boo being weaker due to absorptions but make up your own Canon about boo being weaker even though Goku never even implied anything like that. He even told that he was fighting Boo due to fair fight thing and because of saiyan pride because Boo was by himself, Evil Boo still had Fat Boo inside him like gotenks, Gohan and Piccolo giving him powers.

With Pure Boo he had nothing to lose, no need to care about earth getting blown up and afterlife being more suitable environment for ssj3 than earth. Throughout the arc Goku has been hiding ssj3 and only used it as last resort but this time he wanted to test it without any thing holding him back. Even in Daizenshuu the reasoning isn't due to Pure Boo being weaker but because his One-on-one Saiyan Blood stirs. After all that's what Goku does with strongest DBZ villain, fighting one-on-one. Like with Vegeta, Final Form Freeza or Cell. It's no different here. He even told Elder Kaioshin that Potara aren't suited for saiyans and how they like to do things with their own power and then apologized for being selfish too.


Read the Manga with that bad bias you have, there are enough evidence.

If Gohan was strong enough why would Goku want both Gohan and Gotenks to fight together? Why even call Gotenks when Goku doesn't call for extra people if one is enough, as he has proved that :
Goku concerning Pure Boo : "i know you are gonna get Gohan and Gotenks so that they can fight too"

Goku concerning Piccolo-Boo : "Cheh…I’m a little disappointed. This way, Gohan will be able to beat-you even on his own…"



Worth it ≠ Capable of beating them. Goku wanted both Gohan and Gotenks to come fight WITH GOKU, VEGETA, GOOD BOO and the other guys. Vegeta still thought they will lose and Goku later on says if the Genki-Dama loses, then no one can stop him. Why would Vegeta call Goku idiot for bringing 2 warriors even more stronger than both of them?

If Gohan was easy solution then Goku would not have agreed with Vegeta and called Gohan anyway, considering he saw Gohan's power up. But the fact that Goku went with Genki-Dama despite being exhausted says that Gohan wasn't enough. Goku never thought Gohan can alone kill Boo and mentioned Gotenks name along with Gohan and didn't even hinted at one is enough but having them join the battle too.

Your arguments are headcanons dude.

I wish someone objective would come and see your arguments. Anyone who knows Pure Boo is strongest Unfused Boo atleast knows this.
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Re: Pure Boo > Evil Boo makes more narrative sense?

Post by Kaboom » Tue Apr 02, 2019 7:46 am

This thread was inactive for almost a month, and if it's only going to continue with more of the same "you poor biased plebs and your silly headcanons not giving me an echo chamber" over and over instead of any real conversation, then it's better off not continuing at all.

Free warning, let's try to treat our peers with respect, even when in disagreement.
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