Information on Super Saiyan 4's power

[p-hyvo]

I think you meant Gogeta being tens of times stronger than a normal SS4, also tens of times only goes up to 100x, so that means SS4 Gogeta is about 100x stronger than SS4 Goku + SS4 Vegeta

Fusion is A + B x 100.. or 1x2x100 = x200, and when that fusion becomes SS3 then that makes it x400 more. so with SS3 Vegito is about 1x2x100x400 = x80,000.. meaning that SS3 Vegito is x80,000 stronger than either base Goku or Base Vegeta. Super Saiyan 4 transformation is compared in power to SS3 and Vegito together and the context shows it is referring to the full possible power of Vegito in the Buu Saga which would be SS3 Vegito.. so Super Saiyan 4 gives about 80,000x base power level, for Gohan that figure would be higher due to the fact he has higher potential, meaning SS4 is about 20x the power of GGA which is about 10x the power of SS3.

I was talking about gogeta, why you brought up vegetto? He has nothing to do with this.
Plus, in the various editions of gt perfect files editors uses both tens and dozens to describe the strength of vegeta on top of a ssj4, and by combining both then could mean anyway between x20 and x192 .
100 is not hundreds, so any number until 190 falls into the "tens" category.
Plus, if gogeta is tens/dozens of times stronger than a normal ssj4, you can't do (a+b) x190, but just b x190 (it's metamor fusion the factor is the weakest member since the strongest has to lower his level to match the weakest's)

[QuakingStar]

post me a link to the translation of super saiyan 4 vegeta from the perfect files then because I don't remember that at all

[QuakingStar]

Also I just went through Herms GT and fusion posts here and on twitter, he only says tens of times for fusion potara and dance and not hundreds ever. Tens of times is literally up to 100x, google it if you don't believe me. Also if the users have to match each others power in base for fusion dance, then its still the same as taking one persons power and mutiplying it by two and THEN multiplying it by 100 for fusion meaning that makes them 200x stronger than before in base form alone which makes sense since Vegito immediately transformed to SS to fight Gohan Buu in the manga. So I am right on that. Meaning SS Vegito would be 200x50=10,000x stronger than base goku or base vegeta, and SS3 Vegito would be 200x400=80,000x stronger than them and SS4 is compared to that so SS4 itself is around 80,000 stronger than the users base form hence why it is called the Ultimate Form in the series at the time and they included Fusion and Potential Unleashed in that statement.

[Hugo Boss]

“Tens of times” is just a way of saying the result is far greater than a sum. It’s not supposed to be interpreted literally, to give a formula or for you to think it can’t be greater than hundreds. There is no established limit to how strong it can be, it doesn’t even mean that.

So far, the Super Exciting Guide is the only source that gives a formula, as it describes Potara/Metamoran Fusion or rather AB’s battle power to be A’s battle power x B’s battle power. Unfortunately, since you don’t have A’s and B’s battle powers you can’t tell how strong AB is.

[QuakingStar]

Japan uses Tens of times which literally has an upper limit, which is 100, they could of said tens of hundreds of times or tens of thousands of times or any other phrase but they didn't. Tens of times means at least 20, and up to 100.

[p-hyvo]

“Tens of times” is just a way of saying the result is far greater than a sum. It’s not supposed to be interpreted literally, to give a formula or for you to think it can’t be greater than hundreds. There is no established limit to how strong it can be, it doesn’t even mean that.

So far, the Super Exciting Guide is the only source that gives a formula, as it describes Potara/Metamoran Fusion or rather AB’s battle power to be A’s battle power x B’s battle power. Unfortunately, since you don’t have A’s and B’s battle powers you can’t tell how strong AB is.

A x B is far more not to take literally, is much less probable than "tens of times".
At least, "tens of times" colud work, while A x B just cant.
Try to make power levels using that, you'll se that it doesn't work at all and that it is impossible and hyperbolic.
That's an hyperbole , just to imply that it is far greater than a sum.
Plus, in Japan A X B doesn't imply a multiplication of powers, "x" can mean "and" , so it's like "Goku and vegeta makes vegetto" , not "Goku times vegeta makes vegetto" .
It isn't to be taken literally or as mathematical formula at all

[Polyphase Avatron]

The problem with multiplying power levels is that it depends on what scale you use. For example, if we were to say that 50,000 PL = 1 Kili, then two fighters with 50,000 PL each would fuse to form a fighter with 2,500,000,000 PL, or 50,000 Kilis. But if we go by the Kili scale instead, 1 x 1 = 1, so there would be no boost at all.

[Hugo Boss]

“Tens of times” is just a way of saying the result is far greater than a sum. It’s not supposed to be interpreted literally, to give a formula or for you to think it can’t be greater than hundreds. There is no established limit to how strong it can be, it doesn’t even mean that.

So far, the Super Exciting Guide is the only source that gives a formula, as it describes Potara/Metamoran Fusion or rather AB’s battle power to be A’s battle power x B’s battle power. Unfortunately, since you don’t have A’s and B’s battle powers you can’t tell how strong AB is.

A x B is far more not to take literally, is much less probable than "tens of times".
At least, "tens of times" colud work, while A x B just cant.
Try to make power levels using that, you'll se that it doesn't work at all and that it is impossible and hyperbolic.
That's an hyperbole , just to imply that it is far greater than a sum.
Plus, in Japan A X B doesn't imply a multiplication of powers, "x" can mean "and" , so it's like "Goku and vegeta makes vegetto" , not "Goku times vegeta makes vegetto" .
It isn't to be taken literally or as mathematical formula at all

I suggest you read the responses on this thread. I stand with what it is in the Battle Power Guide.

[QuakingStar]

Ok and that's you. I'm going to go by what Herms discussed on twitter which was how they repeatedly use tens of times, by what the most recent sourse says(DBSuper says tens of times).

[Hugo Boss]

Ok and that's you. I'm going to go by what Herms discussed on twitter which was how they repeatedly use tens of times, by what the most recent sourse says(DBSuper says tens of times).

I don’t understand how exactly you assume Herms is telling you “tens of times” has a cap. I literally posted a link with his in-depth responses of what the staff wrote in the Battle Power guide.

[QuakingStar]

A+B x 100 is still multiplying the twos battle power together, but say we go by it as only being A x B instead.. that means that SS4 is astronomically more powerful than 80,000x battle power, which since Goku and Vegeta each have power levels probably in the late millions to early billions in base form that means for example that fusion is probably 1000000x1000000 equal the fused character who then goes SS making them 50x stronger, then ss2 making them 2x as strong as that, and then ss3 making them 4x as strong as that and Super Saiyan 4 is supposed to be right there with a full power fusion( a SS3 Vegito is the comparison used) with fusion only being possibly stronger making Super Saiyan 4 have a multiplier that can't even be quantified without a calculator and I find that to be bullshit altogether. Also if Keflas power really was the twos seperate powers multiplied together than Legendary SS Kefla should have swatted SSBKaioken x20 Goku with a finger instantly. I prefer to go by what Vados says in the anime and the manga, which is later information and seems to fit more accurately. Two warriors powers added together and then multiplied tens of times. A+Bx100 is STILL multuplying the two users powers together and Vados states that is the method, so I would go by that.

[Hugo Boss]

making Super Saiyan 4 have a multiplier that can't even be quantified without a calculator and I find that to be bullshit altogether.

That’s exactly the reason Battle Powers aren’t being used anymore, they can’t be measured. I don’t understand why you think Potara official multiplier is bullshit while you use the Super Saiyan multipliers that come from the same guidebook.

Anyway, “tens of times” doesn’t contradict AxB, it’s just not as pedantic. For comparison, those are the same words Zamas uses to describe Goku’s Super Saiyan power-up. It’s intentionally a vague description.

[QuakingStar]

Of course he used it to describe goku's SS power-up because 50x still falls in the 20x-100x range. I already explained why I say the axb flat out multiplier is bullshit. Vados explains it in Super, manga and anime, which I have literally already said twice. No new information has changed regarding SS1-2-3's multipliers but their is new information on fusion given by manga and anime, so I go by that. You don't want to because you are sticking to the old axb formula

[Hugo Boss]

their is new information on fusion given by manga and anime, so I go by that. You don't want to because you are sticking to the old axb formula

There is no new information. I don’t even know where you are assuming that from. Tens of times doesn’t a have a digit-limit. And if it was only up to 100-fold Base Kafla wouldn’t be stronger than SS3 Goku, let alone SSGod Goku. And Base Gogeta wouldn’t be stronger than SSGod Goku.

[QuakingStar]

tens of times does have a limit, in Japan it is between 20 and 100. I literally explained that already.

[Hugo Boss]

tens of times does have a limit, in Japan it is between 20 and 100. I literally explained that already.

According to who?! This doesn’t make any sense.

[QuakingStar]

In Japan tens of times is multiples of 10 which goes from 20-100. tens of hundreds, tens of thousands, and tens of millions etc all speak for the higher variations that you can guess which is which.

[Hugo Boss]

In Japan tens of times is multiples of 10 which goes from 20-100. tens of hundreds, tens of thousands, and tens of millions etc all speak for the higher variations that you can guess which is which.

Not only in Japan, I think tens of times is universally viewed as multiples of 10. The confusion I’m seeing here is that you seem to be under the impression that you can’t have more than 9 tens. If you have 20 tens you have 2 hundreds and so on. Tens of times doesn’t necessarily mean you only can have between 2 and 9 and after that point start using hundreds.

[QuakingStar]

I know that but the phrase in Japan tens of times, I've only ever seen it used to mean up to 100, when they mean more in Japan they will usually say tens of hundreds, tens of thousands etc.

[Hugo Boss]

I know that but the phrase in Japan tens of times, I've only ever seen it used to mean up to 100, when they mean more in Japan they will usually say tens of hundreds, tens of thousands etc.

That is very subjective though. “Tens of times” is vague enough that it can be literally at between 20 and 99 or countless times more. There is no established limit to how much tens we are talking about and it wouldn’t make sense either. It’s an empty guess.