Should they bring Nail back?

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MajinPopo
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Should they bring Nail back?

Post by MajinPopo » Tue Aug 17, 2021 1:56 pm

Nail was a nice story function. It acted as a power boost for Piccolo and allowed Piccolo to experience his culture for the first time.

However, since there's now a seemingly insurmountable power gap that won't ever be shortened, is there any real benefit to Piccolo having Nail within him?

Dende's up on the lookout with nobody but Popo. Piccolo kind of acts like a guide for Dende and has a relation to him through his incorporation of Nail.

But since Vegeta learned Spirit Fission and can tear apart fused beings, would anyone care to see the extraction of Nail from his body, putting him in a role as another Fighter-type Namekian and/or physical defender of the Lookout? Or at the very least a buddy for Dende.

You gotta feel bad for the kid, essentially being kidnapped after a genocide and put into service as an arbitrary God for a planet simply so some fighters can keep a monopoly on wishes.

Would this simply be redundant? Would it result in less for Piccolo to do, or more?

Alternately, given Piccolo Jr's vagabond nature and existence as a fractured being, would it be a better story if this became one of Piccolo's defining traits? That he travels around and picks up other lost Namekian souls and absorbs them? That is, a re-contextualization of Piccolo as a "good" version of Cell. That he essentially "saves" them and incorporates them into his own being? Rather than undoing the fusion thing, you go completely the opposite direction and have MORE FUSION.

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TobyS
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Re: Should they bring Nail back?

Post by TobyS » Tue Aug 17, 2021 6:43 pm

MajinPopo wrote: Tue Aug 17, 2021 1:56 pm Nail was a nice story function. It acted as a power boost for Piccolo and allowed Piccolo to experience his culture for the first time.

However, since there's now a seemingly insurmountable power gap that won't ever be shortened, is there any real benefit to Piccolo having Nail within him?

Dende's up on the lookout with nobody but Popo. Piccolo kind of acts like a guide for Dende and has a relation to him through his incorporation of Nail.

But since Vegeta learned Spirit Fission and can tear apart fused beings, would anyone care to see the extraction of Nail from his body, putting him in a role as another Fighter-type Namekian and/or physical defender of the Lookout? Or at the very least a buddy for Dende.

You gotta feel bad for the kid, essentially being kidnapped after a genocide and put into service as an arbitrary God for a planet simply so some fighters can keep a monopoly on wishes.

Would this simply be redundant? Would it result in less for Piccolo to do, or more?

Alternately, given Piccolo Jr's vagabond nature and existence as a fractured being, would it be a better story if this became one of Piccolo's defining traits? That he travels around and picks up other lost Namekian souls and absorbs them? That is, a re-contextualization of Piccolo as a "good" version of Cell. That he essentially "saves" them and incorporates them into his own being? Rather than undoing the fusion thing, you go completely the opposite direction and have MORE FUSION.
Its an interesting topic.

Piccolo used to be, and should still be competitive with Goku, vegeta and his undeserved popularity kinda ruined that imo.

However the more people he absorbs to stay relavent that kinda hurts him as an individual, its like hes cheating to stay relavent.

I've thought for ages on how to sqaure that circle.

One theory I came up with is that Namekians were much more powerful, when they first arrived from their other dimension, and we can see they can be corrupted.... so perhaps as a safety measure the original Namekians actually split themselves Kami style, so no one Namek was able to conquer the universe if he went bad, and allowed them to repopulate their numbers sooner.

As a result this kinda fragments their souls to some degree, and limits their ability to use God or GoD ki, or UI or anything like that.

Therefore Piccolo absorbing a few more Namekians is to restore him to being a true full Namek, like he should have been all along.
This is why the Son of Kataz was able to split so long ago, he had a vestigal racial memory of this like he did the dragonballs.

You flip the script so hes not cheating to keep up, he's actually been handicapped this whole time and has done well to keep up as much as he had!

Enter Piccolo the Dragon God!

Or something like that...
Yamcha almost certainly did not cheat on Bulma:
He was afraid of Women, Bulma was the flirty one.
Yamcha wanted to get married (it was his gonna be his wish)
He suggested they settle down in the Trunks saga.
Alternate future Trunks is not a reliable source.
Toriyama wanted new SSJ Kids and not make new characters.

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Polyphase Avatron
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Re: Should they bring Nail back?

Post by Polyphase Avatron » Tue Aug 17, 2021 8:44 pm

TobyS wrote: Tue Aug 17, 2021 6:43 pm
MajinPopo wrote: Tue Aug 17, 2021 1:56 pm Nail was a nice story function. It acted as a power boost for Piccolo and allowed Piccolo to experience his culture for the first time.

However, since there's now a seemingly insurmountable power gap that won't ever be shortened, is there any real benefit to Piccolo having Nail within him?

Dende's up on the lookout with nobody but Popo. Piccolo kind of acts like a guide for Dende and has a relation to him through his incorporation of Nail.

But since Vegeta learned Spirit Fission and can tear apart fused beings, would anyone care to see the extraction of Nail from his body, putting him in a role as another Fighter-type Namekian and/or physical defender of the Lookout? Or at the very least a buddy for Dende.

You gotta feel bad for the kid, essentially being kidnapped after a genocide and put into service as an arbitrary God for a planet simply so some fighters can keep a monopoly on wishes.

Would this simply be redundant? Would it result in less for Piccolo to do, or more?

Alternately, given Piccolo Jr's vagabond nature and existence as a fractured being, would it be a better story if this became one of Piccolo's defining traits? That he travels around and picks up other lost Namekian souls and absorbs them? That is, a re-contextualization of Piccolo as a "good" version of Cell. That he essentially "saves" them and incorporates them into his own being? Rather than undoing the fusion thing, you go completely the opposite direction and have MORE FUSION.
Its an interesting topic.

Piccolo used to be, and should still be competitive with Goku, vegeta and his undeserved popularity kinda ruined that imo.

However the more people he absorbs to stay relavent that kinda hurts him as an individual, its like hes cheating to stay relavent.

I've thought for ages on how to sqaure that circle.

One theory I came up with is that Namekians were much more powerful, when they first arrived from their other dimension, and we can see they can be corrupted.... so perhaps as a safety measure the original Namekians actually split themselves Kami style, so no one Namek was able to conquer the universe if he went bad, and allowed them to repopulate their numbers sooner.

As a result this kinda fragments their souls to some degree, and limits their ability to use God or GoD ki, or UI or anything like that.

Therefore Piccolo absorbing a few more Namekians is to restore him to being a true full Namek, like he should have been all along.
This is why the Son of Kataz was able to split so long ago, he had a vestigal racial memory of this like he did the dragonballs.

You flip the script so hes not cheating to keep up, he's actually been handicapped this whole time and has done well to keep up as much as he had!

Enter Piccolo the Dragon God!

Or something like that...
Wouldn't that mean that Saonel and Pirina (the universe 6 Namekians who fused with their entire race) should have been far more powerful than they were?
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TobyS
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Re: Should they bring Nail back?

Post by TobyS » Wed Aug 18, 2021 9:00 am

Polyphase Avatron wrote: Tue Aug 17, 2021 8:44 pm
TobyS wrote: Tue Aug 17, 2021 6:43 pm
MajinPopo wrote: Tue Aug 17, 2021 1:56 pm Nail was a nice story function. It acted as a power boost for Piccolo and allowed Piccolo to experience his culture for the first time.

However, since there's now a seemingly insurmountable power gap that won't ever be shortened, is there any real benefit to Piccolo having Nail within him?

Dende's up on the lookout with nobody but Popo. Piccolo kind of acts like a guide for Dende and has a relation to him through his incorporation of Nail.

But since Vegeta learned Spirit Fission and can tear apart fused beings, would anyone care to see the extraction of Nail from his body, putting him in a role as another Fighter-type Namekian and/or physical defender of the Lookout? Or at the very least a buddy for Dende.

You gotta feel bad for the kid, essentially being kidnapped after a genocide and put into service as an arbitrary God for a planet simply so some fighters can keep a monopoly on wishes.

Would this simply be redundant? Would it result in less for Piccolo to do, or more?

Alternately, given Piccolo Jr's vagabond nature and existence as a fractured being, would it be a better story if this became one of Piccolo's defining traits? That he travels around and picks up other lost Namekian souls and absorbs them? That is, a re-contextualization of Piccolo as a "good" version of Cell. That he essentially "saves" them and incorporates them into his own being? Rather than undoing the fusion thing, you go completely the opposite direction and have MORE FUSION.
Its an interesting topic.

Piccolo used to be, and should still be competitive with Goku, vegeta and his undeserved popularity kinda ruined that imo.

However the more people he absorbs to stay relavent that kinda hurts him as an individual, its like hes cheating to stay relavent.

I've thought for ages on how to sqaure that circle.

One theory I came up with is that Namekians were much more powerful, when they first arrived from their other dimension, and we can see they can be corrupted.... so perhaps as a safety measure the original Namekians actually split themselves Kami style, so no one Namek was able to conquer the universe if he went bad, and allowed them to repopulate their numbers sooner.

As a result this kinda fragments their souls to some degree, and limits their ability to use God or GoD ki, or UI or anything like that.

Therefore Piccolo absorbing a few more Namekians is to restore him to being a true full Namek, like he should have been all along.
This is why the Son of Kataz was able to split so long ago, he had a vestigal racial memory of this like he did the dragonballs.

You flip the script so hes not cheating to keep up, he's actually been handicapped this whole time and has done well to keep up as much as he had!

Enter Piccolo the Dragon God!

Or something like that...
Wouldn't that mean that Saonel and Pirina (the universe 6 Namekians who fused with their entire race) should have been far more powerful than they were?
It never said they fused with their entire race you are probably getting mixed up with DBM. It was just some unspecified amount of volunteers.

And in the manga we don't know if they fused with anyone, probably not. In fact given that it didn't appear in both mediums they probably didn't and it was purely a Toei embellishment that Toriyama isn't beholden to.
Yamcha almost certainly did not cheat on Bulma:
He was afraid of Women, Bulma was the flirty one.
Yamcha wanted to get married (it was his gonna be his wish)
He suggested they settle down in the Trunks saga.
Alternate future Trunks is not a reliable source.
Toriyama wanted new SSJ Kids and not make new characters.

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MasenkoHA
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Re: Should they bring Nail back?

Post by MasenkoHA » Wed Aug 18, 2021 9:56 am

What was Nail’s personality again?


Oh right he didn’t have one.

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Re: Should they bring Nail back?

Post by PurestEvil » Wed Aug 18, 2021 11:37 am

What the heck would he do? He wasn’t even a major side character like Kami-sama!
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Re: Should they bring Nail back?

Post by BWri » Wed Aug 18, 2021 5:07 pm

He should be returned as a guardian on New Namek. I was never really attached to Nail like that, but if Kibito is valuable enough to wish for the Kai to defuse with, I think Nail should be given a similar respect.
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Re: Should they bring Nail back?

Post by theherodjl » Wed Aug 18, 2021 6:20 pm

Piccolo should find a way to let Kami & Nail manifest outside his body yet still remain attached on an inherent level. Like allowing a shadowy clone of Nail to appear and attack with him while Kami could act as a lookout for his blindspots.
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Re: Should they bring Nail back?

Post by SlashHaiden » Thu Sep 09, 2021 6:32 pm

I feel like Nail should be brought back, even if he's only used as a friend for Dende. I think that it would be kind of nice to see something nice happen to what I call "utility characters" (e.g. Bulma, Dende), as they are normally overshadowed by the main cast.

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Re: Should they bring Nail back?

Post by Lionel » Thu Sep 09, 2021 9:00 pm

Is that even possible at this point? Nail was fully assimilated into Piccolo and it appears like his consciousness dissipated with only his strength, memories and perhaps elements of his personality meshing together with the darker manifestation of the Child of Katas. Were there a subconcious desire which resonated in Piccolo's mind for Nail to separate and rejoin his people then I suspect he would oblige then. However, Vegeta was being awfully presumptive and arrogant to presume that Piccolo can be easily divided like sliced bread. One of the Namekians he had assimilated with was a fragmented manifestation himself and not organically created.

I can't see what the benefit would be to the story unless the Namekians or Dende's sense of isolation from fellow Namekians became a focal point and Piccolo felt inclined to oblige by returning their prime native Namekian warrior.

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Re: Should they bring Nail back?

Post by Demon Prince Piccolo » Wed Sep 15, 2021 2:40 pm

Honestly, Nail was Piccolo Lite; in other words, Piccolo minus the edge. I liked him, but he didn't have that much to distinguish him from Piccolo. And he's assimilated with Piccolo, so...I don't really see a story function to having them separate again. The only way I'd want it is if it meant Piccolo got some of his Saiyan Saga-savagery back...but it wouldn't feel genuine.
The story of DRAGON BALL starts from the moment Goku met Bulma. I don't really mind the Z, so long as it's understood that it's not the true beginning of the story.

I actually prefer the Goku vs Tenshinhan and Goku vs Piccolo Jr. rivalries to the Goku vs Vegeta rivalry.

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