Watching Super, I can honestly appreciate the concepts introduced in GT.

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MajinPopo
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Watching Super, I can honestly appreciate the concepts introduced in GT.

Post by MajinPopo » Tue Aug 17, 2021 4:10 pm

I really like the notion of the Black Star Dragon Balls, and the ultimate sacrifice of Goku as retribution for the overuse and misuse of the Dragon Balls. It does cast Goku in a Christ-like light, with him literally "dying for your sins" but still existing in this nebulous state between death and life in a way that is functionally and spiritually different to the usual resurrection stuff.

Regardless of that interpretation or your thoughts on it, the notion that the Dragon Balls shouldn't be misused and that there are actual consequences of doing so that directly impact our protagonists, is a GOOD one. It adds so much to the lore.

I think it's highlighted to me because I've watched Super where our objectively immoral "heroes" seem to have a monopoly on wishes. I don't like the idea that Bulma and co. can so easily gather the Dragon Balls and have them as game prizes amongst their Motley Crew of outcasts and weirdoes.

They basically installed a child as a new God on Earth and now uses his creations as novelties for their own arbitrary reasons in a show of wealth and power. They're directly in contact with some pretty high tier Gods too, and it's just weird. I actually WANT the protagonists to face consequences for their foolish actions.

Ideally I'd like to see Toyotaro and Toriyama tackle the morality subject in a similar way to GT. If they can re-do Broly, they can re-do concepts like Black Star Dragon Balls. I know that Toriyama probably enjoys having immoral characters and isn't one to tackle subjects like morality and love too hard, I feel like there really should be a divine retribution that actually acts as a force of Good. A sort of Anti-Zamasu if you will.

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Re: Watching Super, I can honestly appreciate the concepts introduced in GT.

Post by Yosheets » Sun Aug 29, 2021 12:11 pm

The concepts in GT (outside of Super #17) are great. The execution of them fall completely flat, however.

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Re: Watching Super, I can honestly appreciate the concepts introduced in GT.

Post by BWri » Sun Aug 29, 2021 1:15 pm

Yeah, I'm pretty tired of Goku and co. having access to all this power at no consequence to just do as they please. I think it holds them back from truly growing as characters for one and for another, it makes them wildly unlikable to me. It also makes things kind of boring which is why I feel we're getting the same story arcs over and over.
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Re: Watching Super, I can honestly appreciate the concepts introduced in GT.

Post by Jord » Tue Sep 07, 2021 9:22 am

It's a shame we never saw anybody else gathering the dragon balls without having evil intentions. It really feels like they are the Dragon Ball crew's own personal property

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Re: Watching Super, I can honestly appreciate the concepts introduced in GT.

Post by Peach » Tue Sep 07, 2021 9:07 pm

I love the concepts in GT.

The tuffles getting their revenge. Baby. Super 17. Hell on Earth. The Shadow Dragons. Super Saiyan 4. The Black Star Dragon Balls. The ending was incredible too.

The execution was just a little bad, particularly after the Baby saga. And the English version having horrible ambient music and horrible voice directing makes things even worse. I would love to see some of these ideas redone in the future. Hell on Earth for instance could resurrect the Dragon Ball rogue gallery and permanently bring back characters like zarbon, dodoria, nappa, raditz, and the ginyu force if they left Earth instead of all getting killed.

I think GT would be remembered more fondly if it ended at the Baby saga. Or if it was done as a series of well paced, well animated movies.

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Re: Watching Super, I can honestly appreciate the concepts introduced in GT.

Post by Demon Prince Piccolo » Tue Sep 07, 2021 11:40 pm

I love the concepts in GT, especially Baby and the idea that overuse of the Dragon Balls actually has consequences. And even with faulty execution, I found myself enjoying GT in Japanese.
The story of DRAGON BALL starts from the moment Goku met Bulma. I don't really mind the Z, so long as it's understood that it's not the true beginning of the story.

I actually prefer the Goku vs Tenshinhan and Goku vs Piccolo Jr. rivalries to the Goku vs Vegeta rivalry.

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Re: Watching Super, I can honestly appreciate the concepts introduced in GT.

Post by Wizard Sesame » Wed Sep 08, 2021 11:25 am

I enjoy the concepts, as well. My favorite is the idea of evil dragon balls. Having a monkey's paw situation in Dragon Ball to monitor the usage of dragon balls would be a fantastic storyline.

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Demon Prince Piccolo
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Re: Watching Super, I can honestly appreciate the concepts introduced in GT.

Post by Demon Prince Piccolo » Wed Sep 08, 2021 12:07 pm

How could I have forgotten Golden Oozaru and SSJ4? Aside from the original SSJ, these are my favorite transformations in all of Dragon Ball. My only wish is that the animation had depicted them in more dynamic fashion.
The story of DRAGON BALL starts from the moment Goku met Bulma. I don't really mind the Z, so long as it's understood that it's not the true beginning of the story.

I actually prefer the Goku vs Tenshinhan and Goku vs Piccolo Jr. rivalries to the Goku vs Vegeta rivalry.

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Re: Watching Super, I can honestly appreciate the concepts introduced in GT.

Post by Anonymous Friend » Wed Sep 08, 2021 5:06 pm

The Z crew are pretty much the only people with the means to quickly gather the Dragonballs. And when they do, it's only used for good. like bringing back the dead, and saving the world. Plus this group has given their lives saving the world many times. And they've only really used as a last resort.

I can see the point about overuse, and it could be a decent plot point done better.,
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