Why does everybody hate on Broly so much?

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Why does everybody hate on Broly so much?

Post by SlashHaiden » Thu Sep 09, 2021 6:37 pm

I have never watched any of the dragon ball content involving Broly, and I have heard of a lot of people who seem to hate him with a burning passion.

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Re: Why does everybody hate on Broly so much?

Post by Lionel » Thu Sep 09, 2021 9:10 pm

"Hate" is a strong word to use in describing the sentiments towards Broly. I myself wouldn't say I hate him but his epitomisation of the Saiyan superman model -- a concept which I dislike to begin with and wish it were subverted -- makes me feel not so inclined to support him. It should be acknowledged that the recent Broly film did try to add some dimension to his character through his interactions with members of Freeza's forces and the relatively more positive relationship he has with his father. Those qualities I can respect in him. Still, he's like one of the main poster children of a phenomenon that's became one of the flagships of the Dragonball series since the end of the Freeza arc.

It isn't that I'm necessarily opposed to the berserker model either. Uub from the fancomic "Multiverse" visually and choreographically emulated it when he pushed the instilled Kaioken technique beyond its limits and adopted traits you would recognise in someone like Broly. I actually enjoyed that in spite of the controversial spontaneity of it all. It subverted the de facto Saiyan progressional domination and turned it against Goku who he himself was shocked by and was then put on the ropes. The fact that it does have weaknesses which are clearly seen in the user makes me appreciate the phenomenon even more.

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Re: Why does everybody hate on Broly so much?

Post by Demon Prince Piccolo » Fri Sep 10, 2021 3:30 pm

I did strongly dislike Broly years ago, mainly for his fanboys who pitted him against every single character, including character's that were massively more powerful. However, I really like the character background given to the current version in Super: Broly, and I've gained an appreciation of the original Z Broly after hearing the Japanese dialogue. I even understood the appeal of the character back in the day; he immediately stands out visually as a massive, hulking brute, and the completely white pupils adds a certain terror to his appearance.
The story of DRAGON BALL starts from the moment Goku met Bulma. I don't really mind the Z, so long as it's understood that it's not the true beginning of the story.

I actually prefer the Goku vs Tenshinhan and Goku vs Piccolo Jr. rivalries to the Goku vs Vegeta rivalry.

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Re: Why does everybody hate on Broly so much?

Post by LoganForkHands73 » Fri Sep 10, 2021 6:25 pm

I believe much of the zealous hatred for Z Broly boils down to the anti-hype effect (for all the hate he gets, he's undeniably popular and iconic, which only stimulates more hatred), plus the flanderisation he got in the sequels, combined with a whole lot of Chinese whispers and misconceptions about his characters that have been passed around schoolyards and web forums since forever; the ideas that he has literally infinite power, that his only personality was screaming "KAKAROT!" and being mad because baby Goku crying kept him up at night, etc. However, most hardcore fans resent the fact that he became THE face of Dragon Ball Z for so many people, even though he's not even a 'canonical' character to Toriyama's story, resulting in him becoming ridiculously overexposed and representing the worst "MASSIVE SCREAMING MUSCLE MAN POWER LEVEL MAXIMUM" excesses of the series without any of the charm and whimsy. For many, myself included, Z Broly is a character that only works well in small doses. Unfortunately, 99% of media appearances after his debut movie exaggerate him into the dullest possible stereotyped version of himself, 'cause that's what Toei and Namco think the drooling masses like. To this day, Z Broly still appears in games, promos, theme park rides, often with zero rhyme or reason for being there... At some point, you do just want him to fuck off.

It's a shame. People forget, but Broly actually wasn't that bad in his debut movie -- I'd actually say he was one of the best developed Z Movie villains by far. He actually had a semblance of an original backstory, interesting ties to the established lore of the series, some clear if simple motivations, a compelling relationship with his abusive father, a great sadistic personality... and of course a kickass visual design that cemented his reputation as The Legendary Goddamn Super Saiyan. That's more than Tullece, Slug, Bojack, Janemba, Hirudegarn, or even Cooler IMO ever got.

Now that brings us to Super Broly, which was basically Toriyama taking the good potential the original version had and reinventing him into a much more sympathetic and endearing character who's not actually evil at all. Effectively, the exact opposite of what the Toei and Namco bigwigs think makes Broly so successful as a brand. Of course, Super Broly retains the superficial crowdpleasing stuff like the MAXIMUM POWAH and Super Saiyan forms, so he gets an enormous amount of hype from the fanbase, which in turn breeds more hate and ironically more nostalgia for Z Broly. I'd personally say Super Broly is 100% the superior version no contest, but some people aren't as keen on the fact that he doesn't talk as much and his perceived "beta bitch" personality. Some people just hate him because he's yet another Broly.

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Re: Why does everybody hate on Broly so much?

Post by Polyphase Avatron » Fri Sep 10, 2021 9:49 pm

They hate him because he's a destructive murderer who commits genocide, and even his new version is a dangerous uncontrollable berserker. King Vegeta also hated him because he had a higher PL than his son.

(Since this is the in-universe forum, I figured I'd answer why characters in-universe hate him).
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Re: Why does everybody hate on Broly so much?

Post by GatoF » Fri Sep 10, 2021 10:50 pm

Hate? I think the fanbase overall loves all versions of him except bio-broly

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Re: Why does everybody hate on Broly so much?

Post by SlashHaiden » Fri Sep 10, 2021 11:38 pm

Polyphase Avatron wrote: Fri Sep 10, 2021 9:49 pm (Since this is the in-universe forum, I figured I'd answer why characters in-universe hate him).
Whoops, posted in the wrong forum.

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Re: Why does everybody hate on Broly so much?

Post by Peach » Sat Sep 11, 2021 1:20 am

Stupidest motivation ever. He hates Goku because he remembers him crying as a baby?

The reboot definitely improved Broly. But there's still a lot of issues. I don't like how Broly is still kind of an idiot and how Frieza can trick him with his father's death so easily. He's a bit too similar to Tarzan - so much so that it's on the nose. I miss the sadistic aspects to his personality. Not a big fan of his green armor either.

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Re: Why does everybody hate on Broly so much?

Post by theherodjl » Sat Sep 11, 2021 4:22 am

Because classic Broly was written by a fanboy for fanboys. He's overpowered, is a sadistic, laughing maniac, and fucks shit up for an hour in each of his appearances. There's nothing to him except looking flashy & cool. It doesn't make for a great character or compelling storytelling though.
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Re: Why does everybody hate on Broly so much?

Post by Nagyzöld » Sat Sep 11, 2021 10:03 am

Peach wrote: Sat Sep 11, 2021 1:20 am Stupidest motivation ever. He hates Goku because he remembers him crying as a baby?
Well and Beerus destroys planets based on not serving him good enough food.

I can't say I hate Broly, more like it leaves me completely unaffected. But to answer the question, I think he's widely hated because he's overpowered and as per vox populi, uninteresting. My unpopular opinion though is that he's still more interesting than the new generations of Saiyans.

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Re: Why does everybody hate on Broly so much?

Post by PurestEvil » Sat Sep 11, 2021 11:05 am

Contrarianism and assumptions. I went into Movie 8 expecting to ridicule Broly, but my eyes were opened at how not bad his motivation was (although the film conveyed it pretty weakly).
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Re: Why does everybody hate on Broly so much?

Post by Alruneia » Sat Sep 11, 2021 12:29 pm

"Everybody" is a strong word, especially nowadays. Before DBS: Broly, though, Broly was pretty much considered to have one of the most obnoxious fanbases out there as far as single characters go. The sense of him being overrated, overhyped and forced by annoying fans made a lot of people in the fandom start to hate him just out of contrarianism and spite. (Not that this is the only reason, but it's a reason.) But these days the dynamic has changed, just like Broly himself has changed, thanks to the introduction of Super's Broly. You don't really see as much of that old obnoxious fanbase behaviour as you used to (well, at least I don't), and in turn, there's less hate, too.
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Re: Why does everybody hate on Broly so much?

Post by JulieYBM » Sat Sep 11, 2021 12:32 pm

I know I used to do it because I used to think that I was being a Real Artist by only liking Deep and Well Written Characters.

Then I got a job working 40+ hours a week and realized everything is dumb and stupid and life is too short to not just do what you like and that art isn't a competition.

Then like two years later I realized that I was a bi girl and I could, like, just eroticize Broli. 😇😇😇😇
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Re: Why does everybody hate on Broly so much?

Post by ABED » Sat Sep 11, 2021 1:25 pm

Nagyzöld wrote: Sat Sep 11, 2021 10:03 am
Peach wrote: Sat Sep 11, 2021 1:20 am Stupidest motivation ever. He hates Goku because he remembers him crying as a baby?
Well and Beerus destroys planets based on not serving him good enough food.

I can't say I hate Broly, more like it leaves me completely unaffected. But to answer the question, I think he's widely hated because he's overpowered and as per vox populi, uninteresting. My unpopular opinion though is that he's still more interesting than the new generations of Saiyans.
Beerus destroys things because he's a god of DESTRUCTION. It's his reason for living.

Some of it is contrarianism and overexposure. A one note villain isn't inherently bad writing, but he kept getting brought back and it quickly wore out its welcome.
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Re: Why does everybody hate on Broly so much?

Post by Demon Prince Piccolo » Sat Sep 11, 2021 2:01 pm

I don't think the term contrarianism fully applies to why a lot of fans actually disliked Z Broly. Contrarianism is a position taken specifically in order to go against the popular attitude, not necessarily because of any inherent dislike. A lot of dislike for Broly grew specifically from how obnoxious his fanboys could be and how "Broly could solo everybody else in Z" (and that he's not a Toriyama creation at that), not from the inherent need to take a opposite position. That's not to say some weren't being contrarian, though. I'd say contrarianism applies more to people disliking characters like Goku and Vegeta.

Maybe I'm being pedantic though lol.
The story of DRAGON BALL starts from the moment Goku met Bulma. I don't really mind the Z, so long as it's understood that it's not the true beginning of the story.

I actually prefer the Goku vs Tenshinhan and Goku vs Piccolo Jr. rivalries to the Goku vs Vegeta rivalry.

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Re: Why does everybody hate on Broly so much?

Post by Nagyzöld » Sat Sep 11, 2021 3:05 pm

ABED wrote: Sat Sep 11, 2021 1:25 pm
Nagyzöld wrote: Sat Sep 11, 2021 10:03 am
Peach wrote: Sat Sep 11, 2021 1:20 am Stupidest motivation ever. He hates Goku because he remembers him crying as a baby?
Well and Beerus destroys planets based on not serving him good enough food.
Beerus destroys things because he's a god of DESTRUCTION. It's his reason for living.
I emphasized again the point here. Nobody was talking about actions, but about motivation.

Yes, it's Beerus' job to destroy things. But you can destroy things as a god in order to punish wicked people or if the sake of the universal balance calls for it. Or you can be Beerus and destroy just because they don't satisfy your taste buds. See any difference?

Same with Broly. You can hate Kakarrot because his great power tickles your Saiyan pride (which wouldn't be a first) or because you see him as a threat. Or you can be Broly and hate him 'cuz he was an annoying baby.

I wanted to point out that he's not the only one to do stupid shit for stupid reasons and the hate for him JUST from this perspective is a bit stretched.

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Re: Why does everybody hate on Broly so much?

Post by ABED » Sat Sep 11, 2021 3:34 pm

Nagyzöld wrote: Sat Sep 11, 2021 3:05 pm
ABED wrote: Sat Sep 11, 2021 1:25 pm
Nagyzöld wrote: Sat Sep 11, 2021 10:03 am

Well and Beerus destroys planets based on not serving him good enough food.
Beerus destroys things because he's a god of DESTRUCTION. It's his reason for living.
I emphasized again the point here. Nobody was talking about actions, but about motivation.

Yes, it's Beerus' job to destroy things. But you can destroy things as a god in order to punish wicked people or if the sake of the universal balance calls for it. Or you can be Beerus and destroy just because they don't satisfy your taste buds. See any difference?

Same with Broly. You can hate Kakarrot because his great power tickles your Saiyan pride (which wouldn't be a first) or because you see him as a threat. Or you can be Broly and hate him 'cuz he was an annoying baby.

I wanted to point out that he's not the only one to do stupid shit for stupid reasons and the hate for him JUST from this perspective is a bit stretched.
That IS his motivation. His motive for destroying things is because he is a destroyer. It's his job. Why does James Bond save the world? It's his job.

He doesn't just destroy that world because his tastebuds weren't satisfied, it may not have helped but he does destroy to keep balance. Both are true at the same time.
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Re: Why does everybody hate on Broly so much?

Post by Demon Prince Piccolo » Sat Sep 11, 2021 3:49 pm

Beerus loving food (and destroying planets if he didn't like it) was added to flesh out his personality. It wasn't his motivation for destroying them, he was going to destroy them regardless. His job duty is to destroy planets. If he loved the food he would spare the planet.

Movie 8 Broly's entire motivation is to kill Kakarot because baby Kakarot's crying annoyed him. I can't really think of any personality traits. You can like/dislike one or the other (or both), but they're two very different things.
The story of DRAGON BALL starts from the moment Goku met Bulma. I don't really mind the Z, so long as it's understood that it's not the true beginning of the story.

I actually prefer the Goku vs Tenshinhan and Goku vs Piccolo Jr. rivalries to the Goku vs Vegeta rivalry.

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Re: Why does everybody hate on Broly so much?

Post by goku the krump dancer » Sat Sep 11, 2021 3:57 pm

JulieYBM wrote: Sat Sep 11, 2021 12:32 pm I know I used to do it because I used to think that I was being a Real Artist by only liking Deep and Well Written Characters.
I think this was the mindset of most Broly haters back then and honestly that's common amongst the fandom as a whole, all it takes is for someone to decently articulate an unpopular opinion then before you know it, every try hard is regurgitating the same talking points.

Broly has always been WAY more popular than disliked, its just that the people who hate him so vehemently are the vocal minority.

That said, the Budokai 3 opening only served to push him harder than Movie's 8 or 10 by having him trade blows with Gogeta.
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Re: Why does everybody hate on Broly so much?

Post by Demon Prince Piccolo » Sat Sep 11, 2021 5:15 pm

goku the krump dancer wrote: Sat Sep 11, 2021 3:57 pm
JulieYBM wrote: Sat Sep 11, 2021 12:32 pm I know I used to do it because I used to think that I was being a Real Artist by only liking Deep and Well Written Characters.
I think this was the mindset of most Broly haters back then and honestly that's common amongst the fandom as a whole, all it takes is for someone to decently articulate an unpopular opinion then before you know it, every try hard is regurgitating the same talking points.

Broly has always been WAY more popular than disliked, its just that the people who hate him so vehemently are the vocal minority.

That said, the Budokai 3 opening only served to push him harder than Movie's 8 or 10 by having him trade blows with Gogeta.
I know Broly is the subject, but ironically Goku has become the new stomping ground for Dragon Ball fans (heck, even down to casual anime fans who likely haven't even watched all of Dragon Ball) to do this with these days. I get not liking him in Super, but you see people left and right going out of their way to paint all iterations of Goku as a terrible character nowadays. At least it seems that way to me. The "bad" traits are brought up constantly while the traits that made him a beloved character aren't acknowledged.
The story of DRAGON BALL starts from the moment Goku met Bulma. I don't really mind the Z, so long as it's understood that it's not the true beginning of the story.

I actually prefer the Goku vs Tenshinhan and Goku vs Piccolo Jr. rivalries to the Goku vs Vegeta rivalry.

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