Opinion of Lunch

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Opinion of Lunch

Post by BeaBumby » Mon Nov 08, 2021 10:45 am

Hiya! I'm new here, and since I have a Launch icon, (edit: not anymore lmao, but I might go back to it) whatcha think of the two of em? What do you think would've happened to them had they both stuck around? Which Launch do ya prefer?
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Re: Opinion of Launch

Post by PurestEvil » Mon Nov 08, 2021 10:49 am

I liked Launch; she was a very funny character. Unfortunately, though, I can't see what she would have done after the Saiyan saga. Even if she and Tien got together, they would have likely been sidelined like the rest of the humans anyways...
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Re: Opinion of Launch

Post by BeaBumby » Mon Nov 08, 2021 11:06 am

PurestEvil wrote: Mon Nov 08, 2021 10:49 am I liked Launch; she was a very funny character. Unfortunately, though, I can't see what she would have done after the Saiyan saga. Even if she and Tien got together, they would have likely been sidelined like the rest of the humans anyways...
yeah. yeah I miss the humans.
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Re: Opinion of Lunch

Post by Dragon Ball Ireland » Mon Nov 08, 2021 2:09 pm

Lunch is fine, I prefer the innocent version as it was nice to have a naive female character as a counterbalance to Bulma's smarts, but I can see why some would prefer the tomboy version.

I wouldn't have minded if she stuck around and stayed as another side character, although they could have had some fun gags with her sneezing everytime a character turned Super Saiyan.

At this point though, I don't see her being brought back any time soon.
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Re: Opinion of Lunch

Post by Demon Prince Piccolo » Mon Nov 08, 2021 2:32 pm

Lunch was a lot of fun and in a sense the true original Super Saiyan, just played for gags as opposed to dramatic storytelling. I even thought her naivete in her "innocent" form was funny, although it sometimes being at the expense of Roshi's perverse antics could get old. My favorite version is "bad" Lunch; her interactions with the other characters was always great, and occasionally she showed some humanity, like when Krillin died or with Tien. I can't imagine where she'd fit now, so I'd say leave her in the past, but she was cool.
The story of DRAGON BALL starts from the moment Goku met Bulma. I don't really mind the Z, so long as it's understood that it's not the true beginning of the story.

I actually prefer the Goku vs Tenshinhan and Goku vs Piccolo Jr. rivalries to the Goku vs Vegeta rivalry.

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Re: Opinion of Lunch

Post by BeaBumby » Mon Nov 08, 2021 5:23 pm

Demon Prince Piccolo wrote: Mon Nov 08, 2021 2:32 pm My favorite version is "bad" Lunch; her interactions with the other characters was always great, and occasionally she showed some humanity, like when Krillin died or with Tien.
I've always liked the idea of her softening up a bit and just being a tough chick with a temper, so I always appreciated it whenever they had her in casual situations or whenever they developed her character more (like your example with Tien)
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Re: Opinion of Lunch

Post by Ironixie » Tue Nov 09, 2021 2:02 am

I mostly liked bad launch, as good launch acts almost like Goku if he was female, not to say that I wouldn't like a female Goku but she's mainly always oblivious to her actions in some shape or form, I don't know how to define good launch outside of being the opposite of her bad self, genuinely, I can't really imagine good launch doing anything without the influence of the other characters. With bad launch, on the other hand, she'd be able to pull off a classic dragon ball adventure on her own, stealing the dragon balls or some money or whatever heist she comes up with. I also think bad launch is cuter, I like green/hazel-eyed characters.

But she's almost like Yamcha now, she cannot obtain the love she yearns for, and her friends don't always invite her to all their activities anymore. To top it off, she's a retired thief (I think).

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Re: Opinion of Lunch

Post by MyVisionity » Wed Nov 10, 2021 12:06 am

I always liked her as a side character. Toriyama probably wasn't too fond of her, which is likely why he wrote her out in the Saiyan arc. That along with Chichi being added to the cast.

There were plenty of opportunities to include her afterwards, but clearly Toei/Toriyama just weren't interested. It's a shame, considering how she just vanished when so many other longtime side characters continued to appear.

I have to say that I'm surprised that she didn't even make a return in Super, considering the style of that series. They even had Mami Koyama back as Arale, but still didn't think to include Lunch.

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Re: Opinion of Lunch

Post by Darkprince410 » Wed Nov 10, 2021 11:52 am

MyVisionity wrote: Wed Nov 10, 2021 12:06 am I always liked her as a side character. Toriyama probably wasn't too fond of her, which is likely why he wrote her out in the Saiyan arc. That along with Chichi being added to the cast.

There were plenty of opportunities to include her afterwards, but clearly Toei/Toriyama just weren't interested. It's a shame, considering how she just vanished when so many other longtime side characters continued to appear.

I have to say that I'm surprised that she didn't even make a return in Super, considering the style of that series. They even had Mami Koyama back as Arale, but still didn't think to include Lunch.
No, Lunch was written out to "correct" a perceived absence of the character that didn't really exist. He somehow had thought he forgot about her, and wrote her out to explain that perceived absence.

And he did intend to have her appear again during the Buu arc, but chose not to for some unknown reason. #17's appearance in the manga was originally meant to be her.

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Re: Opinion of Lunch

Post by PurestEvil » Wed Nov 10, 2021 11:53 am

Darkprince410 wrote: Wed Nov 10, 2021 11:52 am And he did intend to have her appear again during the Buu arc, but chose not to for some unknown reason. #17's appearance in the manga was originally meant to be her.
Good thing the anime did that idea some justice
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Re: Opinion of Lunch

Post by BeaBumby » Wed Nov 10, 2021 6:11 pm

Darkprince410 wrote: Wed Nov 10, 2021 11:52 am
MyVisionity wrote: Wed Nov 10, 2021 12:06 am I always liked her as a side character. Toriyama probably wasn't too fond of her, which is likely why he wrote her out in the Saiyan arc. That along with Chichi being added to the cast.

There were plenty of opportunities to include her afterwards, but clearly Toei/Toriyama just weren't interested. It's a shame, considering how she just vanished when so many other longtime side characters continued to appear.

I have to say that I'm surprised that she didn't even make a return in Super, considering the style of that series. They even had Mami Koyama back as Arale, but still didn't think to include Lunch.
No, Lunch was written out to "correct" a perceived absence of the character that didn't really exist. He somehow had thought he forgot about her, and wrote her out to explain that perceived absence.

And he did intend to have her appear again during the Buu arc, but chose not to for some unknown reason. #17's appearance in the manga was originally meant to be her.
could youuuuuu elaborate?
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Re: Opinion of Lunch

Post by Koitsukai » Wed Nov 10, 2021 7:32 pm

What if Lunch was actually representing an affair he had, and when she dumped him, since he couldn't kill her off because she knows she is Lunch, and he is still crazy about her and that'd be in poor taste, he wrote her off and pretended he had forgotten about her?

Maybe her failed Buu arc comeback was a brief revival of that romance that ended up going nowhere.

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Re: Opinion of Lunch

Post by Darkprince410 » Wed Nov 10, 2021 8:47 pm

BeaBumby wrote: Wed Nov 10, 2021 6:11 pm
could youuuuuu elaborate?
Toriyama, in an interview he did for the US release of Shonen Jump, said this regarding Lunch:
I noticed that Lunch disappeared after Raditz came, what was she doing?

To tell you the truth, I totally forgot about her at one point. And then I remembered her after a while and I had to think of a reason why she disappeared. So I made it seem as if she was running after Tenshinhan.
However, she wasn't actually gone for any real length of time. Somehow, despite the fact that Lunch had appeared up to the very final chapter of the 23rd Budoukai, within two chapters of the manga Toriyama had somehow thought that he had forgotten about her, and thus wrote in an explanation for her disappearance in the chapter where Bulma came to Roshi's at the start of the Saiyan arc.

Only two chapters take place between the end of the 23rd Budoukai, amounting to two weeks of real world time (the end of the 23rd Budoukai was September 27th, 1988, and her being written out was October 8th, 1988). So he somehow perceived a major absence for the character when none existed, and then indicated he had forgotten about her, when in truth he hadn't, so he wrote in an explanation for that absence.

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Re: Opinion of Lunch

Post by BeaBumby » Wed Nov 10, 2021 8:56 pm

Darkprince410 wrote: Wed Nov 10, 2021 8:47 pm
BeaBumby wrote: Wed Nov 10, 2021 6:11 pm
could youuuuuu elaborate?
Toriyama, in an interview he did for the US release of Shonen Jump, said this regarding Lunch:
I noticed that Lunch disappeared after Raditz came, what was she doing?

To tell you the truth, I totally forgot about her at one point. And then I remembered her after a while and I had to think of a reason why she disappeared. So I made it seem as if she was running after Tenshinhan.
However, she wasn't actually gone for any real length of time. Somehow, despite the fact that Lunch had appeared up to the very final chapter of the 23rd Budoukai, within two chapters of the manga Toriyama had somehow thought that he had forgotten about her, and thus wrote in an explanation for her disappearance in the chapter where Bulma came to Roshi's at the start of the Saiyan arc.

Only two chapters take place between the end of the 23rd Budoukai, amounting to two weeks of real world time (the end of the 23rd Budoukai was September 27th, 1988, and her being written out was October 8th, 1988). So he somehow perceived a major absence for the character when none existed, and then indicated he had forgotten about her, when in truth he hadn't, so he wrote in an explanation for that absence.
Soooooo L(a)unch was screwed over for no good reason?
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Re: Opinion of Lunch

Post by MyVisionity » Wed Nov 10, 2021 11:19 pm

The reason most likely is that Toriyama just had zero interest in the character, if not outright hated her.

Even if it were true that Lunch was forgotten, like I said before Toriyama and Toei had plenty of opportunities to bring her back during the original series but never did. They just weren't interested. The Genki Dama scene was only a cameo. I'm talking about a proper return.

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Re: Opinion of Lunch

Post by Demon Prince Piccolo » Thu Nov 11, 2021 12:06 am

MyVisionity wrote: Wed Nov 10, 2021 11:19 pm The reason most likely is that Toriyama just had zero interest in the character, if not outright hated her.

Even if it were true that Lunch was forgotten, like I said before Toriyama and Toei had plenty of opportunities to bring her back during the original series but never did. They just weren't interested. The Genki Dama scene was only a cameo. I'm talking about a proper return.
I think the former is more likely. I doubt he hated her; she just didn't really suit where the story was going anymore. That said, it's not a stretch for me that Toriyama forgot Lunch. It actually seems pretty plausible.
The story of DRAGON BALL starts from the moment Goku met Bulma. I don't really mind the Z, so long as it's understood that it's not the true beginning of the story.

I actually prefer the Goku vs Tenshinhan and Goku vs Piccolo Jr. rivalries to the Goku vs Vegeta rivalry.

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Re: Opinion of Lunch

Post by MyVisionity » Thu Nov 11, 2021 12:21 am

For more on this subject, including some reasoning for why Toriyama may never have actually forgotten about Lunch, see the Rumor Guide section on Characters from the Kanzenshuu website:

https://www.kanzenshuu.com/rumor/characters/

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Re: Opinion of Lunch

Post by Demon Prince Piccolo » Thu Nov 11, 2021 1:43 am

MyVisionity wrote: Thu Nov 11, 2021 12:21 am For more on this subject, including some reasoning for why Toriyama may never have actually forgotten about Lunch, see the Rumor Guide section on Characters from the Kanzenshuu website:

https://www.kanzenshuu.com/rumor/characters/
Very interesting article, thanks for sharing. I just read the whole thing. What it sounds like to me is that Toriyama didn't literally "forget" Lunch, nor did he intentionally write her out of the story. It sounds like he didn't have much of anything for her to do, so he came up with a reason why she wasn't present (chasing after Tenshinhan). And has his story progressed (especially with Tien having a more dimiished role as the series went on/us not seeing any whereabouts of Tien's personal life), Lunch was kind of naturally but unintentionally phased out.

I did enjoy her filler in the Saiyan saga (easily the saga of Z with the best filler), and I love that the anime included her during the Genki Dama. I wonder if 17 saying "...Hmph…It’s been a long time since I’ve heard his voice too…” can be explained by him hearing Goku from when Cell had him absorbed...which is honestly pretty disturbing. Obviously that's just headcanon to explain the unchanged dialogue that was originally meant for Lunch.
The story of DRAGON BALL starts from the moment Goku met Bulma. I don't really mind the Z, so long as it's understood that it's not the true beginning of the story.

I actually prefer the Goku vs Tenshinhan and Goku vs Piccolo Jr. rivalries to the Goku vs Vegeta rivalry.

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Re: Opinion of Lunch

Post by DragonBallFoodie » Thu Nov 11, 2021 6:12 pm

I thought Lunch was a nice enough character, combining both sweet and badass in one funny and pretty package.

I wish Toriyama hadn't omitted her and allowed her more mileage in the show. Heck, she even appeared in the Tarble special and the Kakarot video game.
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Re: Opinion of Lunch

Post by BeaBumby » Sun Nov 21, 2021 12:15 am

A part of me doesn't want her to return, as I fear the writers will revert her character back to "mean crime lady"

though iirc she did have some depth in dbz: kakarot so I do have some hope (and by that I mean she wasn't constantly pissed)
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