Why is Movie 5 Cooler seen as stronger than Freeza?

[precita]

People say that because Cooler discovered a 4th transformation, that makes him stronger than Freeza.

Yet the moment Goku turned Super Saiyan in Movie 5, he was shown to be much more powerful than Cooler and beat him rather easily. Meanwhile when Goku was Super Saiyan on Namek, he was still shown to take a while to bring down 100% Freeza.

While Metal Cooler in Movie 6 is obviously much stronger than Freeza, I don't think Movie 5 Cooler was.

[Super Saiyan Turlast x4]

Goku said Cooler Chi is greater than Freeza's, though.

This Goku is stated to be more powerful than he was since returning from namek.

[B]

Goku's been training the entire time he's been home(for the Androids, presumably).

Also, Coola is the big brother and Freeza is the family baby that gets coddled, so Coola must be stronger if Cold didn't think he needed the extra attention. Please do not take muh headcanon away from me.

[TheDevilsCorpse]

Also, Coola is the big brother and Freeza is the family baby that gets coddled, so Coola must be stronger if Cold didn't think he needed the extra attention. Please do not take muh headcanon away from me.

Fairly certain Coola is weaker than Freeza without his Super Evolution. So, I think the implication is that Freeza was so much stronger, that Cold just didn't pay much attention to the now disappointing older brother.

[Kamiccolo9]

I always saw it as Goku getting a fairly significant near death power boost from his recovery in Movie 5, since the movie was meant to mirror the Freeza Arc. I don't have a problem with even base Cooler being stronger than Freeza.

In fact, I could have sworn that I've seen some power level page that puts base Cooler at 140 million...but it was probably fake. I like the number, though.

[Polyphase Avatron]

I'm pretty sure Cooler said something about Freeza always being ahead of him until he discovered his new transformation. So form 4 Cooler < Form 4/Max Power Freeza < Form 5 Cooler.

[SSJ2FutureGohan]

I'm pretty sure Cooler said something about Freeza always being ahead of him until he discovered his new transformation. So form 4 Cooler > Form 4/Max Power Freeza > Form 5 Cooler.

That's a dub line, and your arrows are backwards. Otherwise I agree.

[Polyphase Avatron]

I'm pretty sure Cooler said something about Freeza always being ahead of him until he discovered his new transformation. So form 4 Cooler > Form 4/Max Power Freeza > Form 5 Cooler.

That's a dub line, and your arrows are backwards. Otherwise I agree.

Oh sorry. I'll fix it.

[Hellspawn28]

Goku in Movie 5 is likely stronger then he was on Namek. Coola's 5th form seems like it could be equal to Cyborg Freeza or maybe a bit stronger. Coola said that he is stronger then his brother, but he most likely has no idea about Cyborg Freeza.

[RandomGuy96]

According to the official guides (and movie 6), Goku has already trained on Yardrat, and has also been training in preparation for the androids. So he's way stronger than he was on Namek. As a demonstration of this, Trunks easily dispatched two Freeza-level guys with one hit each, and yet plainly admitted that Goku's power was much greater than his. Goku was even stronger than that when he fought Cooler.

The one-sidedness of Cooler and Goku's fight is also exaggerated. The argument is that, since Goku tanked Cooler's punch, he must be way, way, WAY more powerful. This is ignoring that:
A. It was likely a half-assed punch, given that he was just toying with Goku, and doesn't attempt to land a serious blow after that.
B. The blast that he launches at Goku right after, which Goku also tanked, wasn't even meant to hurt Goku; just distract him.
C. Characters tank things that they shouldn't all the time in Toei.

Meanwhile, the rest of the fight, as brief as it was, doesn't portray a vast difference in power. Goku rushes Cooler and lands a three-hit combo. Cooler staggers and is apparently hurt, yet is not significantly injured (contrast his brother after one solid hit from Goku). He laughs it off and carries on normally. Cooler decides to skip the whole fight and just launches his strongest attack, which he generated quickly and without visible strain. Goku struggles with it for a while before countering with his own energy attack. A "beam struggle" ensues in which Goku's Kamehameha overpowers the Supernova and Cooler is killed. However, Goku is left so depleted by the struggle that he can't maintain Super Saiyan, can't defend himself from a half-dead Salza, and can't even stand. If Piccolo hadn't stepped in, Goku would have died.

That doesn't really imply that Cooler is weaker than the guy who was way weaker than the guy who couldn't do crap to Goku's finger.

[FoolsGil]

It is definitely possible for Cooler to be stronger than Freeza and still lose to Super Saiyan. Super Saiyan is a 50x multiplier-That is a large gap of power from base. Freeza at 100% probably could have been beaten at a multiplier of 35 for example, and 5th form Cooler could have beaten at multiplier of 40, but because Super Saiyan automatically goes up to 50, both would still be crushed.

Now yes, having the 5th Form be equal to Super Saiyan would have been a better fight to watch, but even so it's still easy to point out how Cooler is stronger than Freeza.

[Polyphase Avatron]

He was also confident he could beat the person who killed his brother.

[Son Edo]

My head is dusty on this movie. I assume it's something like

Final form Coola > Full power 4th form Freeza > Full power 4th form Coola.

[Speedster]

I always assumed that the movie was a what-if scenario. What if Goku never stayed to train at planet Yardrat and came back to Earth directly with the Dragonballs when Porunga asked him. He did stay of course 130 days until that wish was made so he did learn the instant transmission technique which we know he could use in movie 6. Having not trained to master his SSJ from explains why in the movie he could not turn Super Saiyan at will and had to come to the brink of losing his friends to spontaneously transform.

Of course Goku could have increased the power level of his base form via a Zenkai boost and/or training on Earth (for whatever period of time had passed) resulting to the power level of his SSJ form to increase as well. If we accept that the multiplier is x50 going from 3million to 3.4million for his base would result his SSJ to be 170 million. Cooler's 4th form might had been like 100 million and his 5th form 130million (he said in the movie he discovered this transformation that gave him the EDGE over his little brother - this doesn't imply that their gap was big but rather if they fought each other he would eventually win even that meant to struggle a bit).

[precita]

The thing is when Goku goes Super Saiyan in the film, he doesn't act like its an all new transformation at all. Also none of the other characters wonder why Goku is a Super Saiyan, they all just accept it. Nobody comments on it.

Feels like Goku could have went Super Saiyan all throughout the film but prefered to fight Cooler in his base form for some stupid reason.

[Polyphase Avatron]

I always just saw it as an inconsistency - in the manga/anime when he returns to Earth he can go SSJ at will, but in the movie he was unable to control it yet like on Namek.

[RandomGuy96]

I always just saw it as an inconsistency - in the manga/anime when he returns to Earth he can go SSJ at will, but in the movie he was unable to control it yet like on Namek.

This happens in EVERY movie. Goku holds back when he has no reason to, and only uses his full power after he's been dominated for a while. Movie 7 is just as bad as Movie 5 in this regard.

[Geekdom101]

I always just saw it as an inconsistency - in the manga/anime when he returns to Earth he can go SSJ at will, but in the movie he was unable to control it yet like on Namek.

This happens in EVERY movie. Goku holds back when he has no reason to, and only uses his full power after he's been dominated for a while. Movie 7 is just as bad as Movie 5 in this regard.

Yes every movie villain is JUST AS STRONG as they need to be for that time. Cooler can't touch movie 12 Goku.

[SuicidalZerg]

The way I see it, is that while the "Multiplier" might be 50x, that's 50x their current strength. Goku was actually quite drained immediately before his first SSJ transformation in his fight with Freeza, due to taking a long, drawn-out pounding. I doubt he was any where near as tired when he fought Coola, thus the increase in strength.

[Captain Strawberry]

Base Goku in Movie 5 would probably whoop Frieza especially with Kaioken.