Official Unofficial Power Level Discussion Thread

[ekrolo2]

I agree that SPC would wreck a non rage boosted Gohan. His power up to his max, non buff power made everyone twitchy about Gohan's odds, clearly showing he still had a lot of power left in reserve. Power that got doubled with his SSJ2 equivalent.

[Lord Beerus]

This is a really good list... buuuuuuuuuuuut... I'm gonna have to majorly disagree with SPC being stronger than SSJ2 Gohan. i'm sorry, but the gap between SSJ2 Gohan with one arm and SPC is just way too damn large. If that was the case, there would have been no beam struggle at all. SPC's kamehameha would have overpowered SSJ2 Gohan's one handed kamehameha instantly. But that wasn't the case. Hell, Gohan was holding back the whole time out of fear. I mean, if SSJ2 Gohan who had only one good arm, was majorly drained of ki and was holding back out of fear was able to stand his ground in a beam battle with SPC who was going all out, then SSJ2 Gohan at full power with both arms would have dominated SPC.

Well, I really just tried to connect all of the statements together. Gohan says he lost half of his Ki. Then Cell says he has powered-up greatly like Gohan, which, when combined with the fact that he seems like he has Super Saiyan-like states of his own, seems to hint at this stage being the equivalent of his Super Saiyan 2. And one of the Daizenshuus states that Gohan had a rage boost against Cell. Couple that with what looks like Cell toying with Gohan in the beam struggle, and you can see why I think Super Perfect Cell was stronger than a non-rage boosted Super Saiyan 2 Gohan. I think the rage boost the Daizenshuu speaks of came in when Gohan released everything after Vegeta distracted Cell, and that's what pushed him over SPC's battle power.

I certainly see what you mean. I just think that Cell was being cocky as he usually was. I mean, even when he was getting his ass kicked by SSJ2 as Perfect Cell, he was still acting like an arrogant, cocky bastard and still believed he could win even though it was obvious he couldn't. I think the beam struggle was one of thoses case. But lets be real, the BP's were totally fucked by this stage. You were literally being tugged from one side to the other in regards to who is stronger in the kamehameha beam struggle in every page. You have Cell acting very confident as he's about to win but it could be just easily passed off as arrogance, which would be completely understandable given his character. Then you have literally every other statement made by Goku and Gohan which states that Gohan is much weaker and isn't even going all out in that situation, which just undercuts any kind of hint that SPC is stronger than SSJ2 Gohan. Then you have the visual illustrations which pull you in the other direction and imply that SSJ2 Gohan is struggling in the beam battle and SPC wasn't bluffing and really may be stronger than SSJ2 Gohan and may actually win the kamehameha beam battle. Then Gohan actually tries to goes all out, he succeeds, Cell shits his pants, and kamehameha beam battle ends instantly.

God, the Android/Cell arc was just bloody confusing.

[Desassina]

[edited out]

[Khin]

Where do you guys put these people at ?

- MSSj Vegeta (Cell Games)

- Cell Junior

- Piccolo (Boo Arc)

- MSSj Goku (Cell Games)

- MSSj Kid Gohan (Cell Games)

- Goten
--- Post ROSAT

- SSj Teen Gohan
--- Post Z Sword Training

- Kaioshin

- Dabra

- Perfect Cell

[Lord Beerus]

Where do you guys put these people at ?

- MSSj Vegeta (Cell Games)

- Cell Junior

- Piccolo (Boo Arc)

- MSSj Goku (Cell Games)

- MSSj Kid Gohan (Cell Games)

- Goten
--- Post ROSAT

- SSj Teen Gohan
--- Post Z Sword Training

- Kaioshin

- Dabra

- Perfect Cell

- MSSj Vegeta (Cell Games): 1,750

- Cell Junior: 1,400

- Piccolo (Boo Arc): 1,300

- MSSj Goku (Cell Games): 2,910

- MSSj Kid Gohan (Cell Games): 4,000

- Goten
--- Post ROSAT: 2,700

- SSj Teen Gohan
--- Post Z Sword Training: 2,800

- Kaioshin: 5,300

- Dabra: 6,500

- Perfect Cell: 3,900

Yes, I think MSSJ Gohan was stronger than Perfect Cell. Not by a lot, but he was stronger. I also think Kaioshin is much stronger than people are willing to give him credit for.

[DanielSSJ]

Where do you guys put these people at ?

- MSSj Vegeta (Cell Games)

- Cell Junior

- Piccolo (Boo Arc)

- MSSj Goku (Cell Games)

- MSSj Kid Gohan (Cell Games)

- Goten
--- Post ROSAT

- SSj Teen Gohan
--- Post Z Sword Training

- Kaioshin

- Dabra

- Perfect Cell

Going by units of millions

- SS Vegeta (Cell Games) - 2,000

- Cell Junior - 2,400

- Piccolo (Boo arc) - 2,000

- SS Goku (Cell Games) - 3,000

- SS Gohan (Cell Games) - 4,000

- SS Goten - 1,200
---ROSAT - 1,800

- SS Gohan (Boo arc) - 3,600
---Sword Training - 3,700

- Kaioshin - 3,000

- Dabra - 5,200

- Perfect Cell - 4,800

[Kaboom]

Where do you guys put these people at ?

SS Vegeta (Cell Games): 1,800
Cell Junior: 2,000
SS Goku (Cell Games): 2,800
SS Gohan (Cell Games): 3,500
Perfect Cell: 3,200 (Full Power: 4,800)

Piccolo (Boo arc): 1,600 (CG: 1,200)
Kaioshin: 2,500
Dabra: 3,000
SS Goten: 1,400
-- Post-RoSaT: 1,500
SS Gohan (Boo arc): 3,200
-- Post Z-Sword: 3,250

[ZombieVito]

Where do you guys put these people at ?

- MSSj Vegeta (Cell Games): 1,800

- Cell Junior: 1,800

- Piccolo (Boo Arc): 2,000 (1,950 pre TB, 1,500 CG)

- MSSj Goku (Cell Games): 2,400

- MSSj Kid Gohan (Cell Games): 3,000

- Goten: 1,600 (1,500 pre TB)
--- Post ROSAT: 2,000

- SSj Teen Gohan: 3,100 (3,000 pre TB)
--- Post Z Sword Training: 5,000

- Kaioshin: 2,800

- Dabra: 5,600

- Perfect Cell: 4,800

[dbgtFO]

Where do you guys put these people at ?

- MSSj Vegeta (Cell Games): 2,700.

- Cell Junior: 3,000.

- Piccolo (Boo Arc): 1,000.

- MSSj Goku (Cell Games): 3,600.

- MSSj Kid Gohan (Cell Games): 4,000.

- Goten: 500.
--- Post ROSAT: 5,000.

- SSj Teen Gohan: 2,000 --> 6,000.
--- Post Z Sword Training: 15,000.

- Kaioshin: 2,000.

- Dabra: 6,000.

- Perfect Cell: 5,000.

[apex_pretador]

Where do you guys put these people at ?

- MSSj Less strain Vegeta (Cell Games) 520

- Cell Junior 525

- Piccolo (Boo Arc) 760

- MSSj Goku (Cell Games) 800

- MSSj Kid Gohan (Cell Games) 880

- Goten 550
--- Post ROSAT Nearly same

- SSj Teen Gohan 750 , yes, I put him weaker than piccolo
--- Post Z Sword Training 1000

- Kaioshin 1000

- Dabra 1350

- Perfect Cell 1100

Everyone in million PL units.
Oh, and buu arc SS goku = 1 billion

[apex_pretador]

- MSSj Kid Gohan (Cell Games): 3,000

- SSj Teen Gohan: 3,100 (3,000 pre TB)

You sure you are talking about gohan?

[DanielSSJ]

- MSSj Kid Gohan (Cell Games): 3,000

- SSj Teen Gohan: 3,100 (3,000 pre TB)

You sure you are talking about gohan?

Yeah, he takes the guidebooks literally when they say that Gohan didn't get any weaker between the Cell Arc and the Boo Arc.

[ahill1]

Where do you guys put these people at ?

- MSSj Vegeta (Cell Games)

- Cell Junior

- Piccolo (Boo Arc)

- MSSj Goku (Cell Games)

- MSSj Kid Gohan (Cell Games)

- Goten
--- Post ROSAT

- SSj Teen Gohan
--- Post Z Sword Training

- Kaioshin

- Dabra

- Perfect Cell

Piccolo [Cell Games] : 280,000,000,000

Future Trunks SSJ [Cell Games] : 320,000,000,000

Vegeta SSJ [Cell Games] : 330,000,000,000

Cell Junuiors {each} : 340,000,000,000

Son Goku FPSSJ [Cell Games] : 500,000,000,000

Cell [vs Son Goku] : 550,000,000,000
~Real speed : 660,000,000,000
~Full power : 2,000,000,000,000
~Post Zenkai : 3,000,000,000,000

Son Gohan FPSSJ [Cell Games] : 660,000,000,000
~SSJ2 : 3,300,000,000,000


Boo Saga


Piccolo : 280,000,000,000

East Kaioshin : 420,000,000,000

Son Goten FPSSJ [25th Budokai] : 470,000,000,000
~Post Rosat : 590,000,000,000

Chibi Trunks FPSSJ [25th Budokai] : 480,000,000,000
~Post Rosat : 600,000,000,000

Son Gohan FPSSJ : 500,000,000,000
~Post Zeta sword [FPSSJ] : 27,000,000,000,000

Dabra : 510,000,000,000

Vegeta FPSSJ : 600,000,000,000
~Post Majin : 720,000,000,000
~SSJ2 : 3,600,000,000,000

Fat Boo [Full Power] : 30,000,000,000,000

Son Goku FPSSJ : 720,000,000,000
~SSJ2 : 3,600,000,000,000
~SSJ3 : 36,000,000,000,000

[ZombieVito]

- MSSj Kid Gohan (Cell Games): 3,000

- SSj Teen Gohan: 3,100 (3,000 pre TB)

You sure you are talking about gohan?

Yeah, he takes the guidebooks literally when they say that Gohan didn't get any weaker between the Cell Arc and the Boo Arc.

It's what makes sense.

If Piccolo Daimao spent hundreds of years without training and only went from 260 to a BP > 180, then I don't see how Gohan can get any weaker in just 7 years. Especially when he's just a teenager. Hell, Daimao's decrease can be attributed to old age and not for the lack of training.

[Kaboom]

S'why I kind of struck a compromise, where Gohan lost power from the top-down. Most of his power loss was in his untrained Super Saiyan 2, while his base and SS1 powers are essentially the same.

[Lord Beerus]

It's what makes sense.

If Piccolo Daimao spent hundreds of years without training and only went from 260 to a BP > 180, then I don't see how Gohan can get any weaker in just 7 years. Especially when he's just a teenager. Hell, Daimao's decrease can be attributed to old age and not for the lack of training.

Well, Saiyans are a warrior race and have a bodies built for fighting and training. I just see Gohan getting weaker after not training for seven years as an extreme case of not maintaining their body's natural strength, just like the extreme cases of Saiyan's spiking in strength if certain requirements are met. When Saiyan train in right circumstances there are extreme benefits, and when they stop training there are extreme consequences. I mean, the whole concept of Zenkai's, Super Saiyan trasnformations and God ki show that Saiyan biology is nothing like the biology other races have, like Namekians.

[ZombieVito]

It's what makes sense.

If Piccolo Daimao spent hundreds of years without training and only went from 260 to a BP > 180, then I don't see how Gohan can get any weaker in just 7 years. Especially when he's just a teenager. Hell, Daimao's decrease can be attributed to old age and not for the lack of training.

Well, Saiyans are a warrior race and have a bodies built for fighting and training. I just see Gohan getting weaker after not training for seven years as an extreme case of not maintaining their body's natural strength, just like the extreme cases of Saiyan's spiking in strength if certain requirements are met. When Saiyan train in right circumstances there are extreme benefits, and when they stop training there are extreme consequences. I mean, the whole concept of Zenkai's, Super Saiyan trasnformations and God ki show that Saiyan biology is nothing like the biology other races have, like Namekians.

A good explanation as any but we have official sources that say he didn't get weaker so I go with that.

[Lord Beerus]

It's what makes sense.

If Piccolo Daimao spent hundreds of years without training and only went from 260 to a BP > 180, then I don't see how Gohan can get any weaker in just 7 years. Especially when he's just a teenager. Hell, Daimao's decrease can be attributed to old age and not for the lack of training.

Well, Saiyans are a warrior race and have a bodies built for fighting and training. I just see Gohan getting weaker after not training for seven years as an extreme case of not maintaining their body's natural strength, just like the extreme cases of Saiyan's spiking in strength if certain requirements are met. When Saiyan train in right circumstances there are extreme benefits, and when they stop training there are extreme consequences. I mean, the whole concept of Zenkai's, Super Saiyan trasnformations and God ki show that Saiyan biology is nothing like the biology other races have, like Namekians.

A good explanation as any but we have official sources that say he didn't get weaker so I go with that.

And the manga itself which states otherwise several times. But to each their own.

[ThePiccolo]

Where do you guys put these people at ?

(This is in units of millions)

- MSSj Vegeta (Cell Games)- 2,150

- Cell Junior- 2,300

- Piccolo (Boo Arc)- 1,800

- MSSj Goku (Cell Games)- 2,750

- MSSj Kid Gohan (Cell Games)- 3,250

- SSJ Goten- 1,000
--- Post ROSAT- 1,750

- SSj Teen Gohan- 2,850
--- Post Z Sword Training- 6,000

- Kaioshin- 2,250

- Dabra- 2,750

- Perfect Cell- 5,000

[ZombieVito]

And the manga itself which states otherwise several times. But to each their own.

All those instances when Gohan was said to be weaker was when he was a SSJ2. Daizenshuu 2 already cleared that as well.

But you are right to each their own.