Dragon Ball Super Strength Discussion Thread

[Kenneth La Torre]

Wait isnt God toppo the strongest character right now? He seems stronger than current level Jiren imo. Not saying Jiren isn't stronger when he gets pissed but right now I see Toppo as the top dog. He would most likely whoop goku and vegeta at the same time.

I agree that current toppo should at the very least be a bit superior to currently suppressed jiren. Toppo was stated to be at the level of current hakaishins. Unless jiren is just that much damn more powerful than even the gods of destruction (wouldn’t surprise me to be honest)

[brett wheeler]

Wait isnt God toppo the strongest character right now? He seems stronger than current level Jiren imo. Not saying Jiren isn't stronger when he gets pissed but right now I see Toppo as the top dog. He would most likely whoop goku and vegeta at the same time.

in the next episode preview vegeta fights toppo and is doing marginally well ( still apears to be loosing just not by much ), while with jiren one on one he easily gets molly whopped.

[brett wheeler]

Wait isnt God toppo the strongest character right now? He seems stronger than current level Jiren imo. Not saying Jiren isn't stronger when he gets pissed but right now I see Toppo as the top dog. He would most likely whoop goku and vegeta at the same time.

I agree that current toppo should at the very least be a bit superior to currently suppressed jiren. Toppo was stated to be at the level of current hakaishins. Unless jiren is just that much damn more powerful than even the gods of destruction (wouldn’t surprise me to be honest)

well agian jiren is taking on ssbkk( presumably times 20 ) goku, and ussb vegeta at the same time and doesn't appear out of breath at all. Meanwhile in the next episode preview toppo seems to be being pushed agiant ussb vegeta alone, so jiren even suppressed seems to be a portion above toppo.

[Kenneth La Torre]

Wait isnt God toppo the strongest character right now? He seems stronger than current level Jiren imo. Not saying Jiren isn't stronger when he gets pissed but right now I see Toppo as the top dog. He would most likely whoop goku and vegeta at the same time.

I agree that current toppo should at the very least be a bit superior to currently suppressed jiren. Toppo was stated to be at the level of current hakaishins. Unless jiren is just that much damn more powerful than even the gods of destruction (wouldn’t surprise me to be honest)

well agian jiren is taking on ssbkk( presumably times 20 ) goku, and ussb vegeta at the same time and doesn't appear out of breath at all. Meanwhile in the next episode preview toppo seems to be being pushed agiant ussb vegeta alone, so jiren even suppressed seems to be a portion above toppo.

Vegeta isn’t doing good at all in the NEP. We only see him hit toppos leg, and that’s it, then we see toppo blasting vegeta, pounding him towards the ground. Gokus voice is also of concerned in the preview.

[PushoverMediaCritic]

Koichiarator, Dyspo, Freeza, Gohan, and 17 above Hit?

Without his time manipulation techniques he's not that strong.

He's been always weaker than Blue Goku going by raw strength.

The guy I quoted never said that he was ranking them based on raw strength, and excluding techniques when ranking characters is dumb anyways.

Yeah, I'm not defending that. I straight-up forgot about Hit, and I'm sorry. He should probably be above Freeza, Gohan, and 17, but still below Koichiarator and Super Dyspo.

[Zamasu55]

Top 10 fighters in the Tournament of Power

Including multiple versions of the same character:

1. Jiren
2. UIO Goku
3. SS2 Kafla
4. Hakaishin Toppo
5. SS1 Kafla
6-7. SSB KKx20 Goku
6-7. SSB2 Vegeta
8. Anilaza
9. Koichiarator
10. Super Light-Speed Mode Dyspo

Excluding multiple versions of the same character:

1. Jiren
2. UIO Goku
3. SS2 Kafla
4. Hakaishin Toppo
5. SSB2 Vegeta
6. Anilaza
7. Super Light-Speed Mode Dyspo
8. Golden Freeza
9. Gohan
10. Android 17

Both wrong.
1) Hakaishin Toppo would smash Kafla to pieces, and is also stronger than UI Goku. Dyspo isn't weaker than Koichiarator nor is he stronger than Toppo and Hit, who lost only because Jiren trascends time.

2) The last three of the second list are wrong, Hit is stronger than them (as Jiren confirmed). So 17 needs to be replaced.

[Dragon Wukong]

What gives the impression UI Goku is weaker than Toppo?

Ultra Instinct is basically supposed to be the ultimate godly technique that not even the Gods of Destruction have mastered (beyond maybe Beerus somewhat)

[PushoverMediaCritic]

Top 10 fighters in the Tournament of Power

Including multiple versions of the same character:

1. Jiren
2. UIO Goku
3. SS2 Kafla
4. Hakaishin Toppo
5. SS1 Kafla
6-7. SSB KKx20 Goku
6-7. SSB2 Vegeta
8. Anilaza
9. Koichiarator
10. Super Light-Speed Mode Dyspo

Excluding multiple versions of the same character:

1. Jiren
2. UIO Goku
3. SS2 Kafla
4. Hakaishin Toppo
5. SSB2 Vegeta
6. Anilaza
7. Super Light-Speed Mode Dyspo
8. Golden Freeza
9. Gohan
10. Android 17

Both wrong.
1) Hakaishin Toppo would smash Kafla to pieces, and is also stronger than UI Goku. Dyspo isn't weaker than Koichiarator nor is he stronger than Toppo and Hit, who lost only because Jiren trascends time.

2) The last three of the second list are wrong, Hit is stronger than them (as Jiren confirmed). So 17 needs to be replaced.

1) Way I see it, KKx20 Goku and SSB2 Vegeta are close to the level of Hakaishin, and UIO Goku, Kafla, and Jiren are all above that level.

2) As I mentioned in the post right above yours, I just forgot about Hit. I can't see Hit beating either Koichiarator or Super Dyspo, since the former is equal to SSB Goku and Vegeta combined and is a robot, so no pressure points, and the latter is a super form of someone he was already having trouble with.

[Legion]

Kefla is not above Hakaishin level, not even close. Same current UI Goku.

Toppo of course is>>Kefla.

[brett wheeler]

I agree that current toppo should at the very least be a bit superior to currently suppressed jiren. Toppo was stated to be at the level of current hakaishins. Unless jiren is just that much damn more powerful than even the gods of destruction (wouldn’t surprise me to be honest)

well agian jiren is taking on ssbkk( presumably times 20 ) goku, and ussb vegeta at the same time and doesn't appear out of breath at all. Meanwhile in the next episode preview toppo seems to be being pushed agiant ussb vegeta alone, so jiren even suppressed seems to be a portion above toppo.

Vegeta isn’t doing good at all in the NEP. We only see him hit toppos leg, and that’s it, then we see toppo blasting vegeta, pounding him towards the ground. Gokus voice is also of concerned in the preview.

still to land shots at all is amazingly impressive, and from the title of the episode we can conclude the concern was more for the method vegetas life risking attack is giong to be. I say vegeta is close to hakiashin level and a good bit above ssbkk goku ( ssbkk goku isnt no weakling tho obviously ), this is also indicated by the fact golden frieza was absolute fodder to toppo while vegeta will get some shots in. All the evidence that vegeta will be able to hold his own and land shots combined combined with the fact vegeta by himself might be able to land 1 or 2 shots on current jiren ( unless some major bs was in play ) shows jiren is at least somewhat more powerful than current toppo ( probably not by much in all honesty maby 10-20% difference ).

[brett wheeler]

Kefla is not above Hakaishin level, not even close. Same current UI Goku.

Toppo of course is>>Kefla.

kefla being above GoD lvl is a hell no, but current ui goku is probably at GoD lvl. I come to this conclusion just because goku is able to dodge ssj2 kefla with absolute ease, the only problem with it was he cant attack with its full power, but once he focused the energy from the form into one attack ( the kamehameha ) he blew her away easily, showing the amount of power the form possesses. Since I dont think the GoDs are hundreds upon hundreds times stronger than kefla, ui gokus power display makes sense to him being GoD lvl.

[TheSaiyanGod]

well agian jiren is taking on ssbkk( presumably times 20 ) goku, and ussb vegeta at the same time and doesn't appear out of breath at all. Meanwhile in the next episode preview toppo seems to be being pushed agiant ussb vegeta alone, so jiren even suppressed seems to be a portion above toppo.

Vegeta isn’t doing good at all in the NEP. We only see him hit toppos leg, and that’s it, then we see toppo blasting vegeta, pounding him towards the ground. Gokus voice is also of concerned in the preview.

still to land shots at all is amazingly impressive, and from the title of the episode we can conclude the concern was more for the method vegetas life risking attack is giong to be. I say vegeta is close to hakiashin level and a good bit above ssbkk goku ( ssbkk goku isnt no weakling tho obviously ), this is also indicated by the fact golden frieza was absolute fodder to toppo while vegeta will get some shots in. All the evidence that vegeta will be able to hold his own and land shots combined combined with the fact vegeta by himself might be able to land 1 or 2 shots on current jiren ( unless some major bs was in play ) shows jiren is at least somewhat more powerful than current toppo ( probably not by much in all honesty maby 10-20% difference ).

The fact that Vegeta apparently is at the same level as Goku SSB KK x20 now does not mean that in the next episode he can not be of the same level as Toppo.
In fact, we have never seen all of Vegeta's power with his new transformation, so we can not state exactly what his level is.

And even based on NEP it's hard to say anything, after all it showed little of the fight between Vegeta and Toppo (only Vegeta hitting 1 attack and Toppo 2), and NEP are usually confusing

[brett wheeler]

Vegeta isn’t doing good at all in the NEP. We only see him hit toppos leg, and that’s it, then we see toppo blasting vegeta, pounding him towards the ground. Gokus voice is also of concerned in the preview.

still to land shots at all is amazingly impressive, and from the title of the episode we can conclude the concern was more for the method vegetas life risking attack is giong to be. I say vegeta is close to hakiashin level and a good bit above ssbkk goku ( ssbkk goku isnt no weakling tho obviously ), this is also indicated by the fact golden frieza was absolute fodder to toppo while vegeta will get some shots in. All the evidence that vegeta will be able to hold his own and land shots combined combined with the fact vegeta by himself might be able to land 1 or 2 shots on current jiren ( unless some major bs was in play ) shows jiren is at least somewhat more powerful than current toppo ( probably not by much in all honesty maby 10-20% difference ).

The fact that Vegeta apparently is at the same level as Goku SSB KK x20 now does not mean that in the next episode he can not be of the same level as Toppo.
In fact, we have never seen all of Vegeta's power with his new transformation, so we can not state exactly what his level is.

And even based on NEP it's hard to say anything, after all it showed little of the fight between Vegeta and Toppo (only Vegeta hitting 1 attack and Toppo 2), and NEP are usually confusing

this is true, it is hard to tell the depths of the new forms power but toppo in the final shot of the NEP when charging his hakia seems to be a little stressed, also vegeta being on the lvl of ssbkk is a little sketchy, he is probably more powerful by a bit ( not 5-10 times stronger but probably 2-3 times) as this is his limit breaking power and supposed to be the equivalent to at least an unperfected UI ( probably not as strong but close enough UI is probably 2-3 times that ) and UI is definitely stronger than ssbkk.

[pacz360]

Koichiarator, Dyspo, Freeza, Gohan, and 17 above Hit?

Without his time manipulation techniques he's not that strong.

He's been always weaker than Blue Goku going by raw strength.

He knock goku outta of ssjb in the mini arc so no he's not weaker in raw strength

[ZombieVito]

What gives the impression UI Goku is weaker than Toppo?

Ultra Instinct is basically supposed to be the ultimate godly technique that not even the Gods of Destruction have mastered (beyond maybe Beerus somewhat)

It was called Ultra Instinct "Omen" for a reason.

It's not completed/mastered yet.

He knock goku outta of ssjb in the mini arc so no he's not weaker in raw strength

A direct unguarded hit to the heart did that.

Hit is not stronger than Blue Goku.

[Bullza]

Hit is considerably weaker than Super Saiyan Blue Goku and Golden Frieza. The Dyspo fight made that very clear.

[Hakaishin Liquir]

Hit is considerably weaker than Super Saiyan Blue Goku and Golden Frieza. The Dyspo fight made that very clear.

In episode 104, we saw Dyspo beating SSG Goku, and then Hit destroyed Dyspo later on in that episode when they were both on an even playing field. The only thing that the Dyspo fight made very clear was that Hit is only SSG level without his techniques, unless you're one of those people who refuses to admit that Final Form Freeza is SSG level.

[ZombieVito]

Hit is considerably weaker than Super Saiyan Blue Goku and Golden Frieza. The Dyspo fight made that very clear.

In episode 104, we saw Dyspo beating SSG Goku, and then Hit destroyed Dyspo later on in that episode when they were both on an even playing field. The only thing that the Dyspo fight made very clear was that Hit is only SSG level without his techniques, unless you're one of those people who refuses to admit that Final Form Freeza is SSG level.

FF Freeza can't be god level.

[Bullza]

In episode 104, we saw Dyspo beating SSG Goku, and then Hit destroyed Dyspo later on in that episode when they were both on an even playing field. The only thing that the Dyspo fight made very clear was that Hit is only SSG level without his techniques, unless you're one of those people who refuses to admit that Final Form Freeza is SSG level.

As I pointed out before.

1. Dyspo punched Hit in the face and Hit was knocked down, injured from the blow. Dyspo punched Golden Frieza in the face and it did not.

2. Dyspo was so fast that Hit couldn't even see him move. Golden Frieza was faster than Dyspo.

[pacz360]

[/img]

What gives the impression UI Goku is weaker than Toppo?

He knock goku outta of ssjb in the mini arc so no he's not weaker in raw strength

A direct unguarded hit to the heart did that.


Hit is not stronger than Blue Goku.

https://i.makeagif.com/media/1-21-2018/UHx5A6.gif

Yeah no

Hit is considerably weaker than Super Saiyan Blue Goku and Golden Frieza. The Dyspo fight made that very clear.

In episode 104, we saw Dyspo beating SSG Goku, and then Hit destroyed Dyspo later on in that episode when they were both on an even playing field. The only thing that the Dyspo fight made very clear was that Hit is only SSG level without his techniques, unless you're one of those people who refuses to admit that Final Form Freeza is SSG level.

Hit literally traded blows with ssjb goku
Dyspo only did shit when the former had Intel on Hits timeskip and muscle vibration
When Hit figure him out it was a one sided ass whooping to the point Dyspo could barely stand
Seriously WTF am I'm reading here