The All-Purpose "Versus" Thread

[dragon boss z]

All right, time for another hypothetical question. Now the next one after this will be non Saiyan related, but I'm not asking that right now. What I'm asking is, how strong would Caulifla and Kale be if they achieved Super Saiyan Blue? And who would be the strongest person they would defeat? First, start with Caulifla and talk about how strong she would be, then talk about Kale, and as a bonus, talk about how strong Kefla would be as a SSB.

Caulifla would be weaker than Goku. She would probably be able to beat Gohan, and maybe Dyspo and 17 if it's a fight to the death. I think she would lose to Golden Frieza, SSR Black, Hit, and base Toppo.
Kale depends on if her berserker form gives her SSB a boost or not. If it doesn't she is at the same level as Caulifla. If it does, then she could beat everyone up to KK x20 Goku/SSB2 Vegeta/GoD Toppo/ssj2 Kefla, Anilaza probably being the strongest she could beat.

New battles
1. Jiren (Full Power/Current) vs Ssj2 Kefla, Hit, LB Vegeta, and SsjR Black (the team is working together)?
2. SsjRage Trunks vs Toppo (no destruction form)?
3. Burter vs Dyspo (same power levels)?
4. Ssjblue Vegito (Black) vs God Toppo?
5. Darbura vs 1st form Frost (U6)?

1. Jiren after an ok fight.
2. Toppo, even in base form he is current SSB level.
3. Dyspo, he seems like he would be a better fighter.
4. Vegito, I don't see Goku or Vegeta being stronger than Vegito, except maybe UI Goku.
5. Dabura, he is a little stronger imo and even if he wasn't he has his stone spit and other magic powers.

[dragonball0900]

Do you seriously believe Piccolo can't even beat a Cell jr at this time lol? Why do so many people downplay Piccolo? I could easily see him being above normal Perfect Cell in the Buu arc alone, its not lik he's never made crazy gains before.

I had seen people with this reasoning before, and I must say, there is no way that Piccolo surpassed Perfect Cell in the Buu arc at all. Remember that Gohan as a weakened SSJ (therefore much weaker than Perfect Cell) was able to pull out the Z sword from the rock, and was said that Supreme Kai couldn't do it. Then we have Supreme Kai as being way stronger than Piccolo, and Supreme Kai was amazed at Gohan, Goku and Vegeta's powers, not to mention a single ki blast of SSJ Goku scared Supreme Kai.
That means that Piccolo (Cell Games) < Piccolo (Buu arc) < Supreme Kai < SSJ Gohan (Buu arc) < SSJ Gohan (Cell Games) < Perfect Cell

Supreme Kai could easily be around MSSJ Goku from the Cell Games or weaker, with Piccolo being even way weaker than that. You have to remember that Piccolo didn't fight the Cell Jrs as well as Trunks and Vegeta. He was able to stand up, and I do see Piccolo from the Cell Games being above ASSJ Vegeta (who wrecked Semi Perfect Cell), however there is no way Piccolo is above Perfect Cell in the Buu arc, maybe in Super, but not here. Just because he made big gains before doesn't mean he have to do it now, right? Specially since he have official statements that indirectly state that Piccolo is much weaker than the SSJs, incluiding the weaker SSJ Gohan, as well as Supreme Kai. I'm not saying Piccolo from the Buu arc can't defeat a Cell Jr (but it would be very generous to say if he can defeat one), and I know it's no good to downplay a character, but we can't overplay the character either, and that's exactly what's happening with Buu saga Piccolo right now, he's downplayed and overplayed at the same time by lots of people.

(Also, if Piccolo was above Perfect Cell, then he would also be considered as a good source of energy like Gohan, Vegeta and Goku since he would be close to SSJ2s, but that's way too ridiculous).

[Helios518]

- Toppo one-shots. Vegito was already surpassed by ep. 110 Jiren. He's nothing special at this point.

No way in hell is this true lol. God Toppo at best is SSB KKx20 level judging by his lost to SSBE Vegeta. Unless you think Potara fusion is only a 20x boost (which is clearly false), Vegito Blue should stomp everyone except Jiren and UI Goku in the ToP.

I’m sure that GoD Toppo is probably in the 40 - 100x SSJB considering one of his destruction balls did more than even the Genki-Dama. On top of that, Vegeta was easily losing until he went and got some rage/pride boost.

[Ki Breaker]

Broly vs Basil

Who wins and how

[Zamasu55]

- Toppo one-shots. Vegito was already surpassed by ep. 110 Jiren. He's nothing special at this point.

No way in hell is this true lol. God Toppo at best is SSB KKx20 level judging by his lost to SSBE Vegeta. Unless you think Potara fusion is only a 20x boost (which is clearly false), Vegito Blue should stomp everyone except Jiren and UI Goku in the ToP.

You're deluded. Suppressed Jiren was stated to be far more powerful than everyone that has appeared before and God Toppo is clearly beyond that.

[dragonball0900]

Broly vs Basil

Who wins and how

Movie 10 Broly takes this easily. He's above SSJ2 Gohan, probably comparable to Super Perfect Cell, who is not that far below Good Buu, who I have him as equal to SSJ2 Goku or a bit higher. And given how Good Buu didn't take Basil seriously. It seems Broly at least from Movie 10 would win.

Movie 8 Broly though, that's different. I have him around the Perfect Cell that fought Goku and Gohan (initially), since the Z fighters weren't their Cell Games counterpart (with Vegeta and Trunks using ASSJ, and Goku being the strongest saiyan out of all of them). I don't remember that much of Basil's strength in the Tournament of Power, but I think it was said that he and his brothers were the strongest of Universe 9. So he should be somewhere above base saiyans at best (which I have them already at Cell Games Goku level at this point, given how much they trained over the years), but way weaker than SSJs. That would mean Basil has a chance against Movie 8 Broly. I'd say Basil takes that one.

[kn83]

- Toppo one-shots. Vegito was already surpassed by ep. 110 Jiren. He's nothing special at this point.

No way in hell is this true lol. God Toppo at best is SSB KKx20 level judging by his lost to SSBE Vegeta. Unless you think Potara fusion is only a 20x boost (which is clearly false), Vegito Blue should stomp everyone except Jiren and UI Goku in the ToP.

You're deluded. Suppressed Jiren was stated to be far more powerful than everyone that has appeared before and God Toppo is clearly beyond that.

You're deluded if you think God Toppo> Suppressed Jiren when SSB KKx20 Goku couldn't even make Suppressed Jiren flinch, while God Toppo lost to someone equal to that Goku.

[Zamasu55]

No way in hell is this true lol. God Toppo at best is SSB KKx20 level judging by his lost to SSBE Vegeta. Unless you think Potara fusion is only a 20x boost (which is clearly false), Vegito Blue should stomp everyone except Jiren and UI Goku in the ToP.

You're deluded. Suppressed Jiren was stated to be far more powerful than everyone that has appeared before and God Toppo is clearly beyond that.

You're deluded if you think God Toppo> Suppressed Jiren when SSB KKx20 Goku couldn't even make Suppressed Jiren flinch, while God Toppo lost to someone equal to that Goku.

Goku got stronger since then. Do you even watch the show?

[dragon boss z]

You're deluded. Suppressed Jiren was stated to be far more powerful than everyone that has appeared before and God Toppo is clearly beyond that.

You're deluded if you think God Toppo> Suppressed Jiren when SSB KKx20 Goku couldn't even make Suppressed Jiren flinch, while God Toppo lost to someone equal to that Goku.

Goku got stronger since then. Do you even watch the show?

There is really no logical explanation for Goku to have gotten in stronger after a few minutes. To me it just seems Jiren was nerfed since 110. 17 did an ok job fighting the powered up Jiren and 17 was weaker than base Goku. These are just inconsistencies involving different writers. I believe GOD Toppo would probably beat kkx20 Goku, but Goku would put up a fight. And Toppo probably couldn't defeat any version of Jiren TBH.

[Zamasu55]

You're deluded if you think God Toppo> Suppressed Jiren when SSB KKx20 Goku couldn't even make Suppressed Jiren flinch, while God Toppo lost to someone equal to that Goku.

Goku got stronger since then. Do you even watch the show?

There is really no logical explanation for Goku to have gotten in stronger after a few minutes. To me it just seems Jiren was nerfed since 110. 17 did an ok job fighting the powered up Jiren and 17 was weaker than base Goku. These are just inconsistencies involving different writers. I believe GOD Toppo would probably beat kkx20 Goku, but Goku would put up a fight. And Toppo probably couldn't defeat any version of Jiren TBH.

No, he got stronger.
Just compare ep.123's fight with 109's.

[Helios518]

You're deluded if you think God Toppo> Suppressed Jiren when SSB KKx20 Goku couldn't even make Suppressed Jiren flinch, while God Toppo lost to someone equal to that Goku.

Goku got stronger since then. Do you even watch the show?

There is really no logical explanation for Goku to have gotten in stronger after a few minutes. To me it just seems Jiren was nerfed since 110. 17 did an ok job fighting the powered up Jiren and 17 was weaker than base Goku. These are just inconsistencies involving different writers. I believe GOD Toppo would probably beat kkx20 Goku, but Goku would put up a fight. And Toppo probably couldn't defeat any version of Jiren TBH.

This is the correct explaination. Idk how someone could say Goku and Vegeta have gotten stronger (besides new forms) without jumps in logic.

[kn83]

17(ToP) vs Hit(ToP), both have prep time
18(ToP) vs Piccolo(ToP)
SSR Trunks vs Aniraza

[kn83]

You're deluded if you think God Toppo> Suppressed Jiren when SSB KKx20 Goku couldn't even make Suppressed Jiren flinch, while God Toppo lost to someone equal to that Goku.

Goku got stronger since then. Do you even watch the show?

There is really no logical explanation for Goku to have gotten in stronger after a few minutes. To me it just seems Jiren was nerfed since 110. 17 did an ok job fighting the powered up Jiren and 17 was weaker than base Goku. These are just inconsistencies involving different writers. I believe GOD Toppo would probably beat kkx20 Goku, but Goku would put up a fight. And Toppo probably couldn't defeat any version of Jiren TBH.

No, 17 is not weaker than Base Goku. 17 was also holding back when he fought SSB Goku, everything points to 17 being SSB level (likely above current Golden Frieza by feats)

[DB▪Magnum-Expert]

17(ToP) vs Hit(ToP), both have prep time

Hit might win considering he's preparing against 17 in which he might develop a trump card to beat him, otherwise 17

SSR Trunks vs Aniraza

Aniraza Roflstomps

[AvatarReiko]

Hypothetical Fusions

Kamicollo vs 100% FF Frieza(Namek) -- Fuses with Kami instead of Nail
Kamicollo vs SSJ Goku(Android arc) -- Kami + Nail
Kamicollo(23rd Budokai) vs Vegeta, Raditz & Nappa Ape forms restricted
Kamicollo(Kami+Nail) vs Vegito(Pre-Ginyu Goku & Vegeta)

Z and Super

SSJ Goku Black vs SSJ3 Goku -- Anime
Mystic Gohan(TOP) vs SSJG Goku (BOG)
Hit vs Base Kalfa -- time cage restricted
SSJG Goku vs SSJ Vegito & Buuhan -- Team have 1 hrs prep time
Fat Buu vs SSJ2 Goku, Majin Vegeta, SSJ2 Gohan (Buu Saga)
SSJ Goku, SSJ Vegeta(Buu saga) vs FP Perfect Cell
SSJ CabbaTOP vs SSJ VegitoBuu Saga)

Movies

SSJG3 Trunks(CG) vs Base Bojack
Cell Jrs vs Bojack's gang -- Excluding Bojack
Genki Dama SSJ Goku(Movie 7) vs Imperfect Cell(Humans absorbed)
Cyborg 14 & 15 vs Imperfect Cell(Nikki Town)
Full Power Slug vs 2nd Form Frieza(Namek)
SSJ Broly vs FP Bojack and Gang

GT

SSJ3 Kid Goku(tail) vs Baby Vegeta 2 --Goku can sustain SSJ3
SSJ Gohan vs SSJ Goten, SSJ Trunks

Have fun!

[Zamasu55]

Z and Super

SSJ Goku Black vs SSJ3 Goku -- Anime
Mystic Gohan(TOP) vs SSJG Goku (BOG)
Hit vs Base Kalfa -- time cage restricted
SSJG Goku vs SSJ Vegito & Buuhan -- Team have 1 hrs prep time
Fat Buu vs SSJ2 Goku, Majin Vegeta, SSJ2 Gohan (Buu Saga)
SSJ Goku, SSJ Vegeta(Buu saga) vs FP Perfect Cell
SSJ CabbaTOP vs SSJ VegitoBuu Saga)

Movies

SSJG3 Trunks(CG) vs Base Bojack
Cell Jrs vs Bojack's gang -- Excluding Bojack
Genki Dama SSJ Goku(Movie 7) vs Imperfect Cell(Humans absorbed)
Cyborg 14 & 15 vs Imperfect Cell(Nikki Town)
Full Power Slug vs 2nd Form Frieza(Namek)
SSJ Broly vs FP Bojack and Gang

GT

SSJ3 Kid Goku(tail) vs Baby Vegeta 2 --Goku can sustain SSJ3
SSJ Gohan vs SSJ Goten, SSJ Trunks

Have fun!

- Ssj Goku Black doesn't exist in the anime.
- Even though it doesn't make any sense, Gohan. This is Super.
- Hit wins even without time cage.
- They can prepare all they want, SsjG Goku still stomps.
- Even if they worked together, they wouldn't be able to beat Buu.
- The duo most likely makes it.
- Is this serious? Vegito one-shots.

- Base Bojack still easily wins.
- They're probably even, but I give the win to the Bojack's gang because of their paralyzing threads.
- The Genkidama, no doubt here.
- Cell. Yeah, those two gave Vegeta and Trunks some trouble, but they can't overcome Cell's regeneration. They'd lose after a while.
- Slug was stated to be stronger than Freeza. Which one? I don't know.
- Broly.

- Still Baby.
- Gohan is on another level.

[Spider-Man]

#18(ToP) vs Pan(GT)

[GreatSaiyaman123]

Kamicollo vs 100% FF Frieza(Namek) -- Fuses with Kami instead of Nail

Nail stated Kamiccolo might be able to beat 1st form Freeza... You can see where this is going.

Kamicollo vs SSJ Goku(Android arc) -- Kami + Nail

Piccolo from which part of the series? If it's from Freeza, Base Goku stomps.

Kamicollo(23rd Budokai) vs Vegeta, Raditz & Nappa Ape forms restricted

Guru stated Kami split his power in two when he divided, so logically fusing would be a 2x boost. Kamiccolo beats Raditz, but Nappa wrecks him.

Kamicollo(Kami+Nail) vs Vegito(Pre-Ginyu Goku & Vegeta)

Piccolo stomps.

SSJ Goku Black vs SSJ3 Goku -- Anime

Base Black was already marginally stronger than SSJ3 Goku... SSJ is overkill.

Mystic Gohan(TOP) vs SSJG Goku (BOG)

Gohan stomps.

SSJG Goku vs SSJ Vegito & Buuhan -- Team have 1 hrs prep time

They can prepare for a whole year and Goku still kills them with his aura.

Fat Buu vs SSJ2 Goku, Majin Vegeta, SSJ2 Gohan (Buu Saga)

Piccolo said Boo could take down an army of SSJ2s and Piccolo agreed. Add how many SSJ2s you want, Fat Boo will solo them all day.

SSJ Goku, SSJ Vegeta(Buu saga) vs FP Perfect Cell

Perfect Cell is on a league of his own. He stomps them.

SSJ CabbaTOP vs SSJ VegitoBuu Saga)

Base Cabba finger clicks.

SSJG3 Trunks(CG) vs Base Bojack

Trunks is too slow... He loses. If speed issues are ignored them he probably stomps and can even put up a fight with Super Bojack.

Cell Jrs vs Bojack's gang -- Excluding Bojack

They were actually able to overhelm SSJ Gohan by a bit, so Bojack Gang stomps.

Genki Dama SSJ Goku(Movie 7) vs Imperfect Cell(Humans absorbed)

I think it's a pretty close match. It could go either way, but i'm willing to give it to Goku.

Cyborg 14 & 15 vs Imperfect Cell(Nikki Town)

The duo wins. Cell was marginally above SSJ Vegeta, and the cyborgs were able to fight almost evenly with Trunks and Vegeta.

Full Power Slug vs 2nd Form Frieza(Namek)

Slug is stated to be stronger than Freeza, so he wins. 3rd form Freeza would be a better match IMO.

SSJ Broly vs FP Bojack and Gang

Bojack wins. Broly is marginally above SSJ Goku from Boo Arc, whereas Bojack is the movie counterpart of Cell and probably isn't leagues below FP Cell.

[jeffbr92]

SSJ Goku Black vs SSJ3 Goku -- Anime

- Ssj Goku Black doesn't exist in the anime.

Don't be lazy man, it's not like you cannot compare manga SSJ Black vs. Anime SSJ3 Goku.

[dragon boss z]

Goku got stronger since then. Do you even watch the show?

There is really no logical explanation for Goku to have gotten in stronger after a few minutes. To me it just seems Jiren was nerfed since 110. 17 did an ok job fighting the powered up Jiren and 17 was weaker than base Goku. These are just inconsistencies involving different writers. I believe GOD Toppo would probably beat kkx20 Goku, but Goku would put up a fight. And Toppo probably couldn't defeat any version of Jiren TBH.

No, 17 is not weaker than Base Goku. 17 was also holding back when he fought SSB Goku, everything points to 17 being SSB level (likely above current Golden Frieza by feats)

I meant base Toppo not Goku, my bad. And I disagree with feats putting 17 above Frieza, at least not in power. His barrier and unlimited stamina could possibly give him the win though.