Unpopular DB opinions

[ABED]

So instead of having Goku evolve in someway, your suggestion is to put other characters in the driver seat this deep into the story? If there's anything I'm practically dogmatic about, it's my dislike of swaping main characters after a substantial run in a long running story. I'm hard pressed to think of a time where it actually worked. You either end the story, find a way to evolve the character, or find new situation to put the character in. I'm inclined to think the last idea works best here as I also don't think characters have to constantly evolve for a story to remain interesting.

I think there is a big difference between raising up a popular supporting character and dropping in some random to be the main character.

Goku's only evolution after Namek was when he died against Cell and realized he was a danger magnet. This story beat could have happened after Namek.

Here's the thing, we are all looking at this with massive hindsight. I'm willing to bet a large portion of the current Dragon Ball fanbase wasn't even alive when it was coming out originally. Maybe when it was coming out originally people were Goku hungry. Now I feel people have grown to love the supporting cast and realized that it's not really "the Goku show" and more an ensemble. With this kind of thinking you can see how the story could have gone had X character been permanently removed or if X character had been moved up to central.

A common thing I see across all social media is people being vocal about how they want other characters to get the lime light. I think this is entirely possible without completely removing Goku.

The trouble with Dragon Ball, unlike american comics, is if a popular side character gets popular enough they will usually get their own story. I'm not sure if this happens in manga but It seems like it's far less often

The fan base is hungry for a Vegeta story. A Trunks story. A Gohan story. A Piccolo Story. There is no reason these things couldn't exist. They just don't.

There is a difference and while one is more preferable, but I still don't think either is a good idea long term.

DB isn't an ensemble. It's not about these characters and their lives. It's how they revolve around Goku and his story. I wouldn't use social media as any sort of barometer of what creators should do with their story even if to make something more popular. People are good at telling you how they feel, but they are not great at offering up solutions. Putting someone in the drivers seat that doesn't belong there is a case of "be careful what you wish for."

[omegacwa]

]There is a difference and while one is more preferable, but I still don't think either is a good idea long term.

DB isn't an ensemble. It's not about these characters and their lives. It's how they revolve around Goku and his story. I wouldn't use social media as any sort of barometer of what creators should do with their story even if to make something more popular. People are good at telling you how they feel, but they are not great at offering up solutions. Putting someone in the drivers seat that doesn't belong there is a case of "be careful what you wish for."

I believe that Toriyama, or Toyotaro, or Toei, or whoever appointed could do an entire Arc that revolved around Vegeta going to planet Sadala and helping them with some kind of conflict that doesn't involve Goku whatsoever and it would be successful.
Or another Future Trunks story where he is away from the main group.

I think having the opinion that Dragon Ball is only successful because of Goku isn't correct. The characters who surround Goku are also super popular. That's why i suggested the idea of doing spin offs or side stories. It's worked before with the Trunks special and Bardock Special and Movie 9. It freshens things up.

[WittyUsername]

Maybe it’s because I’ve never been crazy about Vegeta, but I can’t say I have much interest in him getting an entire arc to himself. I don’t hate him, but I think he worked better as a villain/unholy ally. I don’t see any reason why Dragon Ball should suddenly become his story. It’s the same reason why, despite how much I disliked Resurrection ‘F’, I never had a problem with Goku getting the kill.

[ABED]

I never once was arguing that Goku was the ONLY reason DB is successful or the other gem which is no DB story can be successful without him. What I am saying is Goku should be the lead of DB. He doesn't need to be in every scene, or even every episode, but the story is primarily about him. I don't know how much clearer I can make that.

[MasenkoHA]

Goku's only evolution after Namek was when he died against Cell and realized he was a danger magnet.

Not true. In Buu saga he learned his sons were fucking useless and he would have put his hopes and dreams on some third world impoverish village boy that was reincarnated from a bubblegum demon.

If that’s not character evolution I don’t know what is.

. Now I feel people have grown to love the supporting cast and realized that it's not really "the Goku show" and more an ensemble

But it is the Goku show, it’s not an ensemble. Goku is the main character. Other characters have varying degrees of prominence and for a brief period it was Gohan’s show but for 98 percent of the story it is the Goku show.

The fan base is hungry for a Vegeta story. A Trunks story. A Gohan story. A Piccolo Story. There is no reason these things couldn't exist. They just don't.

Vegeta is basically the second main character in Super and was very prominent from the Saiyajin saga onward

Trunks had his own tv special and was a key character in the Cell saga

Gohan has had plenty of time to shine

Piccolo fared better than most during the Z portion.

Plenty of other characters had the limelight. It’s not mutually exclusive to have a main character and other characters having time to shinez

[Izanagi]

Bowlcut Gohan was just kind of generic. I prefer teen Gohan (actual teen not what Funimation thinks is a teen) from the Boo era or Saiyajin saga Gohan.

Boo era Gohan is probably my second favorite version of the character and an upgrade from the Cell Games. He adopts a persona that isn't crying all the time, and takes after Goku's love for competition. I also found his Great Saiyaman hijinks enjoyable. His early Boo arc self is one of the few times I actually took an interest in the character. I'd say more Great Saiyaman is needed.

What I didn't like however was that Gohan, who did absolutely nothing throughout the Majin Boo saga, got what was probably the biggest power-up ever just by sitting in front of an old man for a bunch of hours and get Boo's ass handed to him while Goku and Vegeta, who spend years training failed and got killed.

I’m not because Yamucha is a bore. People can whine about him becoming the franchise butt monkey but it’s seriously the best thing to happen to his character.
Before that he was pretty bland even when he was quasi important in pre-Z Dragon Ball.

I'm all for Yamcha being a gag character, seeing as that's how the Japanese fanbase labelled him. But in terms of powerlevel, I see no reason why the writers are bringing Roshi back on Yamcha's stead. Roshi himself states Yamcha surpassed him, God praises him and he trained at Kaio's for months.

He CRIED over Freeza killing their race and begged Goku to kill Freeza so he can die by a Saiyajin’s hand. Saying he gave zero fucks about his race in the Namek saga is so false it’s not even funny

Vegeta was bullshitting and appealing to Goku's sense of morality during his death scene. He wanted Goku to kill Freeza to prove that the Saiyans are the strongest, so he tried to paint himself as a victim and started rattling on about "This man murdered your parents Kakarrot! Kill him for them!" He never cared about Freeza killing his race, he just hated that he was manipulated and subjugated. You're not supposed to believe his "We Saiyans did everything he wanted us to and he still killed us" bullshit.


Furthermore, Goku called him out.


Vegeta is proud of being a Saiyan. He's proud of his own ancestry and the warrior status that comes with it, but that doesn't mean he cares about his race. Those two concepts might overlap, but they're not one in the same.

[sintzu]

I believe that Toriyama, or Toyotaro, or Toei, or whoever appointed could do an entire Arc that revolved around Vegeta going to planet Sadala and helping them with some kind of conflict that doesn't involve Goku whatsoever and it would be successful.

I think the eventual Sadal arc will revolve around Vegeta, although Goku and possibly others from U7 will still be part of it.

[MajinMan]

I don’t understand the excitement for a Vegeta focused Sadala arc. People have been saying that it’s going to happen and it’s going to be so cool, but I just don’t get it. What would even be the story? Vegeta goes on a field trip to Sadala, and then what? A random bad guy comes and they fight? I don’t see much potential for it to be an arc. If let’s say Vegeta visited Sadala for some reason during another arc, I would be much more satisfied.

[Scsigs]

I don’t understand the excitement for a Vegeta focused Sadala arc. People have been saying that it’s going to happen and it’s going to be so cool, but I just don’t get it. What would even be the story? Vegeta goes on a field trip to Sadala, and then what? A random bad guy comes and they fight? I don’t see much potential for it to be an arc. If let’s say Vegeta visited Sadala for some reason during another arc, I would be much more satisfied.

The reason people would be excited for it is the lore building that could happen from it with Vegeta & the U6 inhabitants comparing notes on their histories. We actually know very little about the Saiyans, Sadala, & Planet Vegeta once you start thinking about it. They were warriors who could control & manipulate ki that could turn into giant apes with the help of a full moon creating Blutz Waves & they were wiped out by Frieza. They also had a legend about the Super Saiyan. However, we actually don't know anything about their history as a people. Sadala is the first lore building thing for the Saiyans as a people since the original Frieza arc. I don't think that it's any surprise GT created Baby as an enemy created by people killed by the Saiyans to avenge them. The lore could be very fascinating if Toriyama gives it & tells a story with it. Hell, with Broly being canonized & rebooted in the last movie, he might've gotten the ball rolling on doing something like that, which is why, if I remember correctly, they set up the possibility in Super.

TL;DR? World building that can be fascinating.

[sintzu]

Vegeta goes on a field trip to Sadala, and then what? A random bad guy comes and they fight? I don’t see much potential for it to be an arc.

This describes every DB arc, but we know there's more to them than that. We were told that Sadal, unlike U7's planet, is a peaceful one that helps protect the universe, but what if there's more to it ? what if it has a dark history even worse than U7's planet ? Vegeta could decide to live there only to be confronted by a random guy who was wronged by the Saiyans, leading to him having to pick between "his" people and who they're trying to wipe out.

[Neo-Makaiōshin]

The reason people would be excited for it is the lore building that could happen from it with Vegeta & the U6 inhabitants comparing notes on their histories. We actually know very little about the Saiyans, Sadala, & Planet Vegeta once you start thinking about it. They were warriors who could control & manipulate ki that could turn into giant apes with the help of a full moon creating Blutz Waves & they were wiped out by Frieza. They also had a legend about the Super Saiyan. However, we actually don't know anything about their history as a people. Sadala is the first lore building thing for the Saiyans as a people since the original Frieza arc. I don't think that it's any surprise GT created Baby as an enemy created by people killed by the Saiyans to avenge them. The lore could be very fascinating if Toriyama gives it & tells a story with it. Hell, with Broly being canonized & rebooted in the last movie, he might've gotten the ball rolling on doing something like that, which is why, if I remember correctly, they set up the possibility in Super.

TL;DR? World building that can be fascinating.

But that's not a story, that's just in-universe trivia exposition.

[ABED]

The reason people would be excited for it is the lore building that could happen from it with Vegeta & the U6 inhabitants comparing notes on their histories. We actually know very little about the Saiyans, Sadala, & Planet Vegeta once you start thinking about it. They were warriors who could control & manipulate ki that could turn into giant apes with the help of a full moon creating Blutz Waves & they were wiped out by Frieza. They also had a legend about the Super Saiyan. However, we actually don't know anything about their history as a people. Sadala is the first lore building thing for the Saiyans as a people since the original Frieza arc. I don't think that it's any surprise GT created Baby as an enemy created by people killed by the Saiyans to avenge them. The lore could be very fascinating if Toriyama gives it & tells a story with it. Hell, with Broly being canonized & rebooted in the last movie, he might've gotten the ball rolling on doing something like that, which is why, if I remember correctly, they set up the possibility in Super.

TL;DR? World building that can be fascinating.

But that's not a story, that's just in-universe trivia exposition.

Thank you!

[Soppa Saia People]

Boo era Gohan is probably my second favorite version of the character and an upgrade from the Cell Games. He adopts a persona that isn't crying all the time, and takes after Goku's love for competition. I also found his Great Saiyaman hijinks enjoyable. His early Boo arc self is one of the few times I actually took an interest in the character. I'd say more Great Saiyaman is needed.

boo arc gohan is far and wide the best version of him i think. he's such a fun character at the start, from his high school stuff and training with goten, and especially the great saiyaman stuff. he makes the beginning of the arc for me. i also really love how he interacts with all the characters, it's some great stuff. and on the minor stuff, i really love his purple gi, it's a great look for him.

What I didn't like however was that Gohan, who did absolutely nothing throughout the Majin Boo saga, got what was probably the biggest power-up ever just by sitting in front of an old man for a bunch of hours and get Boo's ass handed to him while Goku and Vegeta, who spend years training failed and got killed.

and yes ultimate gohan is probably the dumbest power up in the whole series. it's ridiculously unearned and it ends up as nothing, he's there for some chapters and than hes gone again. you can have gohan fight boo but too give him such a unearned and such a huge power up, and than not even do much with him is just stupid.

[ABED]

I don't think that's an unpopular opinion. However, this one is - Great Saiyaman era Gohan is super boring. The one note joke goes on and on, and it's not even that funny to begin with.

[Soppa Saia People]

yea i know to that first part, i just wanted to talk about it lol.

[MasenkoHA]

Unpopular opinion?

I don’t have an issue with Gohan’s massive power up being unearned. Because A. Unlike Goku, Gohan was inherently super strong due to hybrid genetics so it’s not like he wasn’t already born into it B. He got his ass handed to him anyways. If he got this massive power up and then saves the day okay sure that would be lame but the one it was played out it was basically a fake out. No different than when Piccolo was stronger than Freeza for 5 seconds after assimilating with Nail.

[Soppa Saia People]

i suppose i would be more fine with it if the story didn't spend so much time on it. and i didn't really know people had a issuse with the piccolo and nail stuff besides the nail is total useless besides that purpose. i guess it's a bit pointless but it wasn't bulit up like this was gonna be the thing that saves everybody.

[DHM211]

Not sure if this is unpopular in general or just on this forum but I really enjoyed Resurrection ‘F’, epscially the special edition(that sadly never saw a home release).

[ABED]

The power up doesn't bother me for the reasons stated, and I like that so many of these power ups didn't work on Buu but the Genki Dama finally did. I wish he hadn't done that beat so many times in the same arc, but overall it was a nice subversion of expectations.

[Scsigs]

The reason people would be excited for it is the lore building that could happen from it with Vegeta & the U6 inhabitants comparing notes on their histories. We actually know very little about the Saiyans, Sadala, & Planet Vegeta once you start thinking about it. They were warriors who could control & manipulate ki that could turn into giant apes with the help of a full moon creating Blutz Waves & they were wiped out by Frieza. They also had a legend about the Super Saiyan. However, we actually don't know anything about their history as a people. Sadala is the first lore building thing for the Saiyans as a people since the original Frieza arc. I don't think that it's any surprise GT created Baby as an enemy created by people killed by the Saiyans to avenge them. The lore could be very fascinating if Toriyama gives it & tells a story with it. Hell, with Broly being canonized & rebooted in the last movie, he might've gotten the ball rolling on doing something like that, which is why, if I remember correctly, they set up the possibility in Super.

TL;DR? World building that can be fascinating.

But that's not a story, that's just in-universe trivia exposition.

I mean, yes, but you can build a good story around it that has a lot of meaning & is good. The Bardock special is really good because it does expansion on some things but is also a great tragedy about Goku's dad & the Saiyans that the writers based off of some details already given. Granted, Minus is also built around the same concept & it sucked, but it's more in the execution of things as well.