Reason for Goku Black's Power Up after fighting Goku the first time

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Hulk10
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Reason for Goku Black's Power Up after fighting Goku the first time

Post by Hulk10 » Sat Dec 07, 2019 3:50 pm

I wonder what the precise reason for Black being more powerful than Goku and Vegeta was. I think it might have been due to the fact he had been fighting a lot more than Goku and Vegeta had after he first fought Goku. The manga suggested that the Saiyan Power was the reason.
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Re: Reason for Goku Black's Power Up after fighting Goku the first time

Post by Miracles » Sat Dec 07, 2019 5:29 pm

It's Zenkai.
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Re: Reason for Goku Black's Power Up after fighting Goku the first time

Post by Hulk10 » Sat Dec 07, 2019 6:15 pm

Zenkai is a fandom name. Not an official one.
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Re: Reason for Goku Black's Power Up after fighting Goku the first time

Post by Thani » Sat Dec 07, 2019 6:33 pm

Well, Zenkai IS Saiyan Power, just the name the fandom adopted. Black got stronger as he fought. In the manga it works as intendeed, but it's broken in the anime since he doesn't need to get to death's door to come back stronger.

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Re: Reason for Goku Black's Power Up after fighting Goku the first time

Post by Hulk10 » Sat Dec 07, 2019 6:37 pm

Yes that's true that Zenkai is the name that the fandom have adopted but I disagree with you on the Saiyan Power working as it should in the manga.
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Re: Reason for Goku Black's Power Up after fighting Goku the first time

Post by Miracles » Sat Dec 07, 2019 7:47 pm

Hulk10 wrote:
Sat Dec 07, 2019 6:15 pm
Zenkai is a fandom name. Not an official one.
We know they get boosts from/after near death/battles.
"The fool hath said in his heart, There is no God."~Psalm 14:1

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Re: Reason for Goku Black's Power Up after fighting Goku the first time

Post by Hulk10 » Sat Dec 07, 2019 8:09 pm

Miracles wrote:
Sat Dec 07, 2019 7:47 pm
Hulk10 wrote:
Sat Dec 07, 2019 6:15 pm
Zenkai is a fandom name. Not an official one.
We know they get boosts from/after near death/battles.
Yes but Zenkai isn't the official name and official name is what I'm focusing on right now.
"We became like friends, we became like good friends." Broly to Cheelai and Lemo about his fur pelt.

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Re: Reason for Goku Black's Power Up after fighting Goku the first time

Post by Dbzfan94 » Sat Dec 07, 2019 10:24 pm

Hulk10 wrote:
Sat Dec 07, 2019 8:09 pm
Miracles wrote:
Sat Dec 07, 2019 7:47 pm
Hulk10 wrote:
Sat Dec 07, 2019 6:15 pm
Zenkai is a fandom name. Not an official one.
We know they get boosts from/after near death/battles.
Yes but Zenkai isn't the official name and official name is what I'm focusing on right now.
There isn’t one

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Re: Reason for Goku Black's Power Up after fighting Goku the first time

Post by Hulk10 » Sat Dec 07, 2019 11:44 pm

Dbzfan94 wrote:
Sat Dec 07, 2019 10:24 pm
Hulk10 wrote:
Sat Dec 07, 2019 8:09 pm
Miracles wrote:
Sat Dec 07, 2019 7:47 pm

We know they get boosts from/after near death/battles.
Yes but Zenkai isn't the official name and official name is what I'm focusing on right now.
There isn’t one
Not a precise one as far as I know.
"We became like friends, we became like good friends." Broly to Cheelai and Lemo about his fur pelt.

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Re: Reason for Goku Black's Power Up after fighting Goku the first time

Post by Lionel » Sat Dec 07, 2019 11:50 pm

The idea I personally use to try and rationalise it is that the soul, Zamasu's, was already a deity by nature with exceptional potential and strength for his capacity. If you combine that with the anatomy of someone like Goku, it seems reasonable to conclude that the result would be extraordinary.

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Re: Reason for Goku Black's Power Up after fighting Goku the first time

Post by Hulk10 » Sun Dec 08, 2019 12:05 am

Hmm interesting personal theory.
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Re: Reason for Goku Black's Power Up after fighting Goku the first time

Post by Miracles » Sun Dec 08, 2019 1:13 am

Hulk10 wrote:
Sat Dec 07, 2019 8:09 pm
Miracles wrote:
Sat Dec 07, 2019 7:47 pm
Hulk10 wrote:
Sat Dec 07, 2019 6:15 pm
Zenkai is a fandom name. Not an official one.
We know they get boosts from/after near death/battles.
Yes but Zenkai isn't the official name and official name is what I'm focusing on right now.
I see.
"The fool hath said in his heart, There is no God."~Psalm 14:1

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Re: Reason for Goku Black's Power Up after fighting Goku the first time

Post by SupremeKai25 » Sun Dec 08, 2019 6:15 am

Because Zamasu was already a prodigy and fighting genius, so he managed to synchronize perfectly with Goku's powerful body. He was also able to grow stronger through pain. When he first fought Goku he was only fighting Super Saiyan 2 Goku, but after getting kicked and punched several times he unlocked a new height of power and could damage a Super Saiyan Blue in just his base form. Then when he got Rosé he basically became stronger than everyone else because his mortal body fully embraced his divine soul, which granted him an even more amazing power.
My form is justice. And my form is the world. Worship me. Give praise unto me. Me, the beautiful, the sublime... Me, the invincible, the almighty and divine... All hail Zamasu.

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Re: Reason for Goku Black's Power Up after fighting Goku the first time

Post by DragonBallFoodie » Sun Dec 08, 2019 11:02 am

Isn't that a Saiyan's trait to increase their power through combat?
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Re: Reason for Goku Black's Power Up after fighting Goku the first time

Post by SupremeKai25 » Sun Dec 08, 2019 1:26 pm

DragonBallFoodie wrote:
Sun Dec 08, 2019 11:02 am
Isn't that a Saiyan's trait to increase their power through combat?
Yes. Vegeta even remarks how in the Tournament of Power every Saiyan (even those of Universe 6) managed to break their limits. Black was a unique case because Zamasu was also a prodigy and fighting genius, so he could truly unleash the full potential of that body.
My form is justice. And my form is the world. Worship me. Give praise unto me. Me, the beautiful, the sublime... Me, the invincible, the almighty and divine... All hail Zamasu.

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Re: Reason for Goku Black's Power Up after fighting Goku the first time

Post by Hulk10 » Sun Dec 08, 2019 1:32 pm

SupremeKai25 wrote:
Sun Dec 08, 2019 6:15 am
Because Zamasu was already a prodigy and fighting genius, so he managed to synchronize perfectly with Goku's powerful body. He was also able to grow stronger through pain. When he first fought Goku he was only fighting Super Saiyan 2 Goku, but after getting kicked and punched several times he unlocked a new height of power and could damage a Super Saiyan Blue in just his base form. Then when he got Rosé he basically became stronger than everyone else because his mortal body fully embraced his divine soul, which granted him an even more amazing power.
I find it hard to believe that Goku's mortal body 'fully' embraced Zamasu's divine sould.
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Re: Reason for Goku Black's Power Up after fighting Goku the first time

Post by ankokudaishogun » Sun Dec 08, 2019 2:06 pm

Hulk10 wrote:
Sun Dec 08, 2019 1:32 pm
I find it hard to believe that Goku's mortal body 'fully' embraced Zamasu's divine sould.
that explicitly stated having happened in the manga.
Each time Black got hurt and then recovered, his Saiyan body strengthened(procedure generally known in the fandom as "Zenkai") by getting more accustomed to Zamasu's soul

in the anime, IMHO the reverse happened: Zamasu's soul\mind found the "key" to fully synch with Goku's body by fighting him as Black.
This resulted into, fundamentally, "Saiyan beyond God" Black who then stacked Super Saiyan on it becoming Rosé.

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Re: Reason for Goku Black's Power Up after fighting Goku the first time

Post by Hulk10 » Sun Dec 08, 2019 2:10 pm

ankokudaishogun wrote:
Sun Dec 08, 2019 2:06 pm
Hulk10 wrote:
Sun Dec 08, 2019 1:32 pm
I find it hard to believe that Goku's mortal body 'fully' embraced Zamasu's divine sould.
that explicitly stated having happened in the manga.
Each time Black got hurt and then recovered, his Saiyan body strengthened(procedure generally known in the fandom as "Zenkai") by getting more accustomed to Zamasu's soul

in the anime, IMHO the reverse happened: Zamasu's soul\mind found the "key" to fully synch with Goku's body by fighting him as Black.
This resulted into, fundamentally, "Saiyan beyond God" Black who then stacked Super Saiyan on it becoming Rosé.
I know its stated that way doesn't mean it makes sense.
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Re: Reason for Goku Black's Power Up after fighting Goku the first time

Post by SupremeKai25 » Sun Dec 08, 2019 3:10 pm

ankokudaishogun wrote:
Sun Dec 08, 2019 2:06 pm
Hulk10 wrote:
Sun Dec 08, 2019 1:32 pm
I find it hard to believe that Goku's mortal body 'fully' embraced Zamasu's divine sould.
that explicitly stated having happened in the manga.
Each time Black got hurt and then recovered, his Saiyan body strengthened(procedure generally known in the fandom as "Zenkai") by getting more accustomed to Zamasu's soul

in the anime, IMHO the reverse happened: Zamasu's soul\mind found the "key" to fully synch with Goku's body by fighting him as Black.
This resulted into, fundamentally, "Saiyan beyond God" Black who then stacked Super Saiyan on it becoming Rosé.
I don't think the process itself is meant to be different between anime and managa, because ultimately it's about the divine soul of Zamasu and the mortal body of Goku becoming one thanks to the use of Zenkai. This also aligns with Sean Schemmel's interpretation of the Rosé form; he believes that Super Saiyan Rosé is Zamasu's own divine power channeling more and more through Goku's body, which is also why Black's voice in his Rosé form changes to closely match Zamasu's.
My form is justice. And my form is the world. Worship me. Give praise unto me. Me, the beautiful, the sublime... Me, the invincible, the almighty and divine... All hail Zamasu.

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Re: Reason for Goku Black's Power Up after fighting Goku the first time

Post by DragonBallFoodie » Sun Dec 08, 2019 4:39 pm

The implication is that Goku's body is what makes him the strongest warrior in the universe. Well, Goku was always lucky.
"Don't take pleasure in destruction!" / "I will not let you destroy my world!"
A true hero goes beyond not the limits of power, but the limits that divide countries and people.

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