I think its time to admit that Toyotaro is a terrible writer.

[JewyB]

Muting someone because you disagree with them is pathetic, and I never made any insults.

I... I mean...

[kemuri07]

Goku is someone one could call an antihero.

Freeza was just helping so that he could get resurrected; there was nothing heroic about him, although I do think he isn't a coward.

Just because DBS managed to make him likeable, doesn't mean he is antihero.

Goku. Is. Not. A. Anti-hero.

He is a hero full stop.

[UI Peter]

Goku is someone one could call an antihero.

Freeza was just helping so that he could get resurrected; there was nothing heroic about him, although I do think he isn't a coward.

Just because DBS managed to make him likeable, doesn't mean he is antihero.

Goku. Is. Not. A. Anti-hero.

He is a hero full stop.

Yes. Goku even at his most selfish is nowhere near an anti-hero.

Characters like Vegeta in most of Z, Saiyan Saga Piccolo, Hit and 90s Bardock are the real anti-heroes of the series.

[theherodjl]

Muting someone because you disagree with them is pathetic, and I never made any insults.

I... I mean...

What? He didn't insult anyone. He made a truely objective argument as well as one of the most in-depth observations about another person's lack of character & civility on this forum that I've ever seen.

[JewyB]

What? He didn't insult anyone. He made a truely objective argument as well as one of the most in-depth observations about another person's lack of character & civility on this forum that I've ever seen.

Pathetic is my favourite compliment, for example, your attempt to show talk around him insulting someone before saying he didnt insult anyone is very pathetic, good job!

[UI Peter]

What? He didn't insult anyone. He made a truely objective argument as well as one of the most in-depth observations about another person's lack of character & civility on this forum that I've ever seen.

Pathetic is my favourite compliment, for example, your attempt to show talk around him insulting someone before saying he didnt insult anyone is very pathetic, good job!

I said what he did was pathetic, not he himself.

[JewyB]

I said what he did was pathetic, not he himself.

And people are defined by their actions.

Its the same baseless defence of "i called what you did stupid, i didn't call you stupid". Everyone knows what you were implying, you're just not honest enough to admit it and now hiding behind semantics instead of at least having the integrity to back your own words.

Kinda makes it worse in my opinion, but i wont say anything more on the matter, he's muted you anyways and its between the two of you.

[Mad Swami]

Not going to stop anyone from having an opinion on one version of Super or the other, but I am ... pretty baffled by propping up the anime and putting down the manga specifically on a shared criteria of "repeating things from Z in a shallow way" as a negative.

Were we watching the same Super anime?

Exactly! The anime does it too. Vegeta's final explosion, Piccolo guarding Gohan, that stupid poacher thing, and like Vegeta Gohan is just redoing his previous arc.

[UI Peter]

I said what he did was pathetic, not he himself.

And people are defined by their actions.

Its the same baseless defence of "i called what you did stupid, i didn't call you stupid". Everyone knows what you were implying, you're just not honest enough to admit it and now hiding behind semantics instead of at least having the integrity to back your own words.

Kinda makes it worse in my opinion, but i wont say anything more on the matter, he's muted you anyways and its between the two of you.

This is a weak argument. So are you saying you can't criticized a person's actions and opinions without bashing a person? This sounds like yet another attempt to block out criticism at all cost. Its a very over-sensitive thing to do.

[Mad Swami]

I do find it interesting though because the DBS Broly movie had an absolutely shallow cling to Z nostalgia but because it looked great no one minds.



Gogeta has no point in this movie. He is just there for fan service. I loved the film and fight scene but I acknowledge it only exists for me to go "Awesome just like that other thing! Wow Gogeta!"

[UI Peter]

I do find it interesting though because the DBS Broly movie had an absolutely shallow cling to Z nostalgia but because it looked great no one minds.



Gogeta has no point in this movie. He is just there for fan service. I loved the film and fight scene but I acknowledge it only exists for me to go "Awesome just like that other thing! Wow Gogeta!"

Gogeta is there because Goku couldn't go MUI at will at that point, so they needed some other way to take out Broly.

[JulieYBM]

Who's Sadala Elite and what same post?

Good one. I don't know why you're feigning, but this took me maybe 5 minutes:

Android 21 is overall the best Modern DB character (aka anyone introduced since Yo Son Goku & Friends in 2008), and is more likeable than 90% of the classic cast.

Shallot & Android 21 are better characters than 99% of the canon modern characters (anyone introduced since Battle of Gods) and 90% of the classic cast.

2 Base Theory is a debunked myth. Its nothing more than just a headcanon excuse to downplay certain characters

2 Base Theory is nothing more than an excuse to downplay certain characters

Mr. Satan (from a writing standpoint) is the most underrated character in the franchise, and ties with Vegeta as the best writen character of the Buu Saga

Buu Saga Vegeta is easily the greatest written character in the whole franchise.

But know I see Mr. Satan as the 2nd best written character of the Buu saga

That's just in addition to your overreliance on putting your responses inside quotes (in bold) when you're replying to longer posts instead of outside as is normal, using "smh" constantly at the end of sentences, frequenting the same few threads, and posting the exact same image links.

But again, I don't play this game with people who can't conduct themselves on a forum and regularly insult other users with ad hominem attacks. I'm putting you on mute so I don't have to interact with you anymore.

If anyone else needs me to elaborate further on DB-related posts I've made, I'd be more than happy to do so.

Those quotes you used are common opinions, and again, you dodged my arguments because you can't refute them and admit you're wrong. Muting someone because you disagree with them is pathetic, and I never made any insults.

Just replying to openly disagree with this last sentence. Nobody ia owed a platform or an ear. Muting people isn't somehow 'losing', it's getting on with your life.

[Kataphrut]

I do find it interesting though because the DBS Broly movie had an absolutely shallow cling to Z nostalgia but because it looked great no one minds.



Gogeta has no point in this movie. He is just there for fan service. I loved the film and fight scene but I acknowledge it only exists for me to go "Awesome just like that other thing! Wow Gogeta!"

Gogeta is there because Goku couldn't go MUI at will at that point, so they needed some other way to take out Broly.

If that's the case, why waste an hour trying to learn the dance when it probably would have taken less than a minute for Goku to teleport to the Land of the Kais to grab some earrings?

There was no in-universe logical reason, they just wanted to have Gogeta in the movie.

[Matches Malone]

I loved the film and fight scene but I acknowledge it only exists for me to go "Awesome just like that other thing! Wow Gogeta!"

That's exactly why it exists, as it was more or less based off of 3 older properties, Broly's first movie, Fusion Reborn, & the Bardock special. It looks amazing, but I really wish these resources and effort went into something original instead.

[kemuri07]

DBS: Broly is shameless in its fanservice. But it's also one of the main reasons why it works: it knows what you want and is all too willing to give it to you. Broly aspires to be nothing more than a wrestling match between Goku/Vegeta and Broly. That's it. It's simple and that's why it works.

Fanservice does not only mean attempting 1:1 recreation of scenes from older media.

[Matches Malone]

DBS: Broly is shameless in its fanservice. But it's also one of the main reasons why it works: it knows what you want and is all too willing to give it to you.

I agree with this, but I also wish they gave us something we didn't know we wanted until we got it.

[Dragon Wukong]

*snip*

That's brilliant detective work. And certainly something to keep an eye out for in the future.

Anyhow, whether Toyotaro is considered a good writer ultimately depends on what one values in a story. How much does a call-back or reference devalue the quality of something? Do certain similarities with prior arcs ruin it? Even if done for the sake of subversion from what may be viewed as typical? It depends on the viewer I suppose. I quite like the Moro arc though.

[precita]

I don't understand why people like Fused Zamasu splitting into multiple copies of himself in the manga climax. Not only is it something we've seen before (Cooler movie), but it's also kinda boring? In the anime it felt like Zamasu became this omnipotent energy being taking over the planet itself, there was no way to fight him anymore and the stakes were so high Zeno erasing everything felt like it had to happen. In the manga there's just an army of Zamasu clones, and Zeno wiping everything out just doesn't have the same impact. Besides that it feels like Trunks literally does nothing in the manga, he doesn't have a single moment of victory like the anime gives him.

Besides that all the build-up stuff the anime did in the arc was much better, with Trunks meeting Gohan's family and sleeping at their house, all the kid Trunks/Future Trunks moments, the explanation of the time rings and the stuff at Bulma's place. It really felt like they spent time getting Trunks integrated with the current cast whereas the manga just stays in the future for the latter half of the arc.

[SupremeKai25]

Ironically the "Clone Zamasu" plot point might have worked better in the anime. It would've tied into the clone ability that Goku Black displayed in ep. 64:



An endless army of clones that cannot be destroyed and constantly regenerate, all of which are controlled by the original Goku Black. Reminds you of something?

[Mad Swami]

Ironically the "Clone Zamasu" plot point might have worked better in the anime. It would've tied into the clone ability that Goku Black displayed in ep. 64:



An endless army of clones that cannot be destroyed and constantly regenerate, all of which are controlled by the original Goku Black. Reminds you of something?

That's a really good idea. I liked the army of Zamasus a lot more than....him becoming the universe.... Plus it would have been way more interesting to see Vegito (Gogeta in a perfect world due to thematically fitting better) vs the Zamasus. However in saying that Merged Zamasu would have to be nerfed in the anime. Or maybe just by the time he uses that power. In the Anime if each Zamasu was as strong as the og than you'd just need Zeno and we'd have the same stupid ending all over again.