Kai Episode 97 (27 March 2011)

[Puto]

...he isn't doing Zarbon. That's J. Michael Tatum, who frankly, is amazingly awesome. Kindly do some research please.

[SylentEcho]

...he isn't doing Zarbon. That's J. Michael Tatum, who frankly, is amazingly awesome. Kindly do some research please.

I wasn't talking about Kai, sorry. Oh and Tatum isn't better than Dobson IMO, he just has a better script to work with. About Sabat, I stand by my earlier post.

[linkdude20002001]

Of course, you're probably referring to his voice work...and I disagree. He's given up several roles, and made several of his voices much more natural. Guess we could have him give up Recoome and call it even, lol.

His Vegeta is horrible. Rough and grouchy doesn't fit the cool-headed prince. And yes, replacing ReaCoom is a must! O_o

His other voices are fine. But Vegeta+Piccolo+Yamcha is too much. The voices sound too alike at times. There's a point where Vegeta's laughing as Gohan gets hit, and it appears as though Piccolo is laughing 'cause that's who's on screen. That kind of problem shouldn't happen.

[VegettoEX]

Let's try to keep this on-topic, folks. Not a particularly huge reason to be debating the worth of certain English dub roles when that cast is nowhere near this point in the series yet, anyway. There are other, more appropriate threads if you'd like to get into that.

[Flamzeron]

I wonder if they will do a "second season" sort of thing with the Buu arc sometime in the future?

[Ashura]

Looking at the debate about how this could be the end, or how we could get one more episode; I was taking a look at original Z last night, you know, and came upon the episode where Trunks goes back to the future. The animation on that episode is not even the B-team... it's like the C-team who got lazy and had their buddies come and fill in for them.

I forgot how much the animation quality wavers during the Cell stuff. It makes me wonder if people would be extremely disappointed when/if episode 98 actually came out, because the final episode would be horrendously animated. It also makes me wonder if that's the reason why they decided to end on 97 instead. They took a look at the footage and deemed it not worth airing, perhaps.

[JulieYBM]

Looking at the debate about how this could be the end, or how we could get one more episode; I was taking a look at original Z last night, you know, and came upon the episode where Trunks goes back to the future. The animation on that episode is not even the B-team... it's like the C-team who got lazy and had their buddies come and fill in for them.

I forgot how much the animation quality wavers during the Cell stuff. It makes me wonder if people would be extremely disappointed when/if episode 98 actually came out, because the final episode would be horrendously animated. It also makes me wonder if that's the reason why they decided to end on 97 instead. They took a look at the footage and deemed it not worth airing, perhaps.

Episode #194 was key animated by Uchiyama Masayuki (also the animation supervisor) and Kobara Tai'ichirô. Even though they've been doing episodes since the first arc of Dragon Ball they really, really got terrible in this arc. I guess it's because Saeki Tetsuya and Shida Naotoshi left the team so Uchiyama had to start key animating himself, which means more work to do for two people in a short amount of time. It's a shame, really, because his episodes use to be pretty decent.

[Hujio]

I forgot how much the animation quality wavers during the Cell stuff. It makes me wonder if people would be extremely disappointed when/if episode 98 actually came out, because the final episode would be horrendously animated. It also makes me wonder if that's the reason why they decided to end on 97 instead. They took a look at the footage and deemed it not worth airing, perhaps.

Well first, that's not at all why they decided not to air episode 98. It was because all of the programming had gotten delayed a week due to the massive earthquakes, and they decided to stick with their original announcement of when Toriko would premiere. Second, if they truly didn't air it because of its poor animation quality, then I could name at least 20 episodes of Kai that never should have seen the light of day either. Trust me, animation quality was not much of a concern.

[Ashura]

Well first, that's not at all why they decided not to air episode 98. It was because all of the programming had gotten delayed a week due to the massive earthquakes, and they decided to stick with their original announcement of when Toriko would premiere. Second, if they truly didn't air it because of its poor animation quality, then I could name at least 20 episodes of Kai that never should have seen the light of day either. Trust me, animation quality was not much of a concern.

I know all about the disaster and Toriko and them sticking to the start date. Re-reading what I said does imply I thought the whole thing was a mystery, so to clarify I meant more that the animation quality could've weighed in as a factor as to why they ultimately decided not to air it.

It's not as though the choice not to air the final episode was a 1:1 'oh, we said Toriko starts here so that's that.' That's not how business works. There was debate, there were people talking about what they should do. It goes up and down a chain of execs and gets approved or denied. The person in charge likely went to his team, talked it out, and everyone usually has different opinions on things. Ultimately choices like that come down to more than one reason and person.

I'm just imagining the conversation went something like:

'So.. what are we going to do about the DB Kai/Toriko situation?'
'We could delay it a week.'
'Hrm, but it pretty much ends on episode 97, and Toriko will probably bring in more money.'
'True...'
'Plus the final episode doesn't look that great anyway. Have you seen it?'

or even

'So.. what are we going to do about the DB Kai/Toriko situation?'
'Well, just look at the last episode. Why should we air this? It pretty much ends in the last episode anyway.'

So yeah, I'm not trying to say it was the MAIN reason, or even 99.9% of the reason, but I do imagine someone at some point looked at it and said, you know what? Maybe we really don't need to air this one, it's not that good anyway.

And I agree... there's tons of stuff in there that I'm like, wow, they reaired this as 'new'?

[Fionordequester]

Does anyone else think that SSJ Trunk's kind of looks like Guile at some points in his fight with Cell in that Episode Hujio posted?

[Hujio]

'So.. what are we going to do about the DB Kai/Toriko situation?'
'Well, just look at the last episode. Why should we air this? It pretty much ends in the last episode anyway.'

So yeah, I'm not trying to say it was the MAIN reason, or even 99.9% of the reason, but I do imagine someone at some point looked at it and said, you know what? Maybe we really don't need to air this one, it's not that good anyway.

While that sounds great, I'll just reiterate, I guarantee that the "look" of the the episode had nothing to do with their decision not to air it. The decision was solely based on Toriko's premiere. For you see, Toriko had to premiere on April 3rd, as it was part of an hour-long crossover special with One Piece. This special had been in the works for some time, and if you're at all familiar with One Piece, this is really the only place the special would fit. In this part of One Piece the main storyline has ended and is about to start a months worth of flashback episodes. Rather than screwing over One Piece by airing episode 98 of Kai and then putting this special one episode into the flashback episodes, which would make no sense and really screw up the series' continuity, they decided to screw over Kai, since it was already ending anyway. So like I said, it's really all because of the earthquake and yes, they basically decided, "We said Toriko starts here, so that's that".

I know it doesn't sound as cool as some sort of artsy discussion taking place in the Toei executive offices, but reality isn't always that cool. Sorry.

[Ashura]

It's not really artsy so much as it's a business discussion. I know it's a bit of a cop-out to say, but unless you were actually there you really don't know what all they discussed. (And if there was public discussion, go ahead and prove me wrong. The one thing I did read was there was discussion about is how long they should wait to bring back anime at all in some instances, though. That, and the HD-CAM shortage.)

What you say is probably true as being the major deciding factor (Toriko and One Piece having a crossover that HAD to air together - that one I wasn't aware of though. I knew Toriko was going to start, but not about the crossover), but it's rarely just one thing like that that runs through these guys heads. That's really not how business works; there's very few times it shakes out as simply as you describe.

I really understand what you're saying, and I guess I'm just a little bit frustrated by the fact that in a lot of discussions here people figure there's always one huge factor that goes into all these companies' choices, when usually it's more often than not a multitude of them. I guess that's the point I'm trying to make, even if you're likely 100% on the money about what the major factor was.

[Cipher]

I know this isn't exactly the Episode 98 Discussion thread, but since it's going in that direction anyway, has anyone thought about what exactly Episode 98 would consist of?

It's not like they have two Z episodes to splice together this time. I'm having trouble picturing this in any way that wouldn't make it an exact re-airing of Z episode 194. I suppose there could be some sort of wrap-up montage, but even then, there's not a lot of material they can actually cut from 194.

[Savage68]

I speculated on that a while ago, too. My best guess was that there'd be a montage of DB and Z clips (or maybe just Z), or if we're really lucky, we'd get some sort of acknowledgment of the events that transpire after the Android Arc (but not spoiling everything about Boo, in case Kai is *somehow* picked back up) is over and done with to wrap everything nicely.

[Puto]

They could include some sort of "flashback" to the Trunks Special, too.

[SRB2Unleashed]

I always imagined 98 having Trunks saving his timeline then the other half being a "prolouge" to the Buu saga with flashbacks leading up to a few minutes of episode 200 DBZ as a open-ending incase Kai comes back someday.

[InfernalVegito]

Since I don't want to open a new thread for this I will ask it here.

Was episode 97 really the definitive last episode of Kai? I know they wanted to show the Boo Arc as well but the disastrous earthquake prevented it. So I mean will they maybe continue it some time in the future or is it dead end once and for all?

[JulieYBM]

Since I don't want to open a new thread for this I will ask it here.

Was episode 97 really the definitive last episode of Kai? I know they wanted to show the Boo Arc as well but the disastrous earthquake prevented it. So I mean will they maybe continue it some time in the future or is it dead end once and for all?

The last home video releases will have episode #98, but it's listed only as an extra episode and not #98.

[InfernalVegito]

Since I don't want to open a new thread for this I will ask it here.

Was episode 97 really the definitive last episode of Kai? I know they wanted to show the Boo Arc as well but the disastrous earthquake prevented it. So I mean will they maybe continue it some time in the future or is it dead end once and for all?

The last home video releases will have episode #98, but it's listed only as an extra episode and not #98.

So what does that mean precisely? That it's over?

[VegettoEX]

Let me just run a couple quick links by you .

http://www.daizex.com/#2011_03_03

http://www.daizex.com/#2011_03_27

http://www.daizex.com/#2011_05_09

http://www.kanzentai.com/features.php?id=kai_evolution