PlayStation 5 and the future of DBZ games..

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Re: PlayStation 5 and the future of DBZ games..

Post by Anonymous Friend » Thu Mar 17, 2022 6:44 pm

Lukmendes wrote: Sun Mar 13, 2022 1:53 am
Honestly, if another company were to make a team style DBFZ, Capcom might be a better choice, they have far more experience with these kinds of games, though if they do it like MvC, it'd be a broken mess, but it could be a fun broken mess.

Taking it off Arcsys' hands would be a questionable decision though, considering Arcsys is the reason DBFZ became so big, at best, they could outsource someone else to make cutscenes, because the animation arcsys comes up has a budget of 2 dollars and a team effort of people being paid even less, it's inexcusably terrible.
DBZAOTA482 wrote: Thu Mar 10, 2022 7:35 pm The producer has made it known they're not adding rollback netcode to the current game. Besides, adding it to the sequel is a simpler solution than rebuilding the game with it.
Should've just have added rollback to begin with, 'cause really, it's just stupid so many fighters didn't have it for so long considering the technology is over 15 years old...
Funny thing, I suggested on this very site way back when MvC3 was active that DBZ needed a fighting game styled like that. Everyone here shot that down. The Hyper DBZ came around and a year later FighterZ.

Arcsys isn't the only competent fighting game company out there. They juts happened to be the first to make an actually competitive on using the franchise. Beyond all the flair and references, this really isn't much difference from Capcom's Marvel titles or you know the stuff most other 2D anime fighters have been doing for two decades.

The thing with rollback is that japanese devs, who make the majority of fighter games, cater to japanese players who still have robust arcades on their relatively small island (compared to the rest of the world), therefor they mainly focus on arcades and console are someone an afterthought. And even still, when they use online, they don't have much of a problem on their small island. That's one plus for Covid, many industries have had to change how they do business.
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Re: PlayStation 5 and the future of DBZ games..

Post by Lukmendes » Thu Mar 17, 2022 7:36 pm

Anonymous Friend wrote: Thu Mar 17, 2022 6:44 pm Funny thing, I suggested on this very site way back when MvC3 was active that DBZ needed a fighting game styled like that. Everyone here shot that down. The Hyper DBZ came around and a year later FighterZ.
Honestly, I still find the very idea of DBFZ to be weird, characters mostly fight by themselves in DB, making a game where team is the focus is an odd choice.

I still find it very ironic that Arcsys made a fighting game for Persona, which's an RPG franchise where you fight in teams, and made the fighter into a 1vs1 fighter, and them they made a fighting game about DB that is team based... Seriously ironic lol.
Arcsys isn't the only competent fighting game company out there. They juts happened to be the first to make an actually competitive on using the franchise.
I hear that Super Dragon Ball Z is a pretty good competitive game, even if the game has the Virtua Fighter syndrome of looking meh, and that's specially bad for a flashy franchise like DB.

And yeah, Arcsys is definitely not the only one being competent out there, specially now that SNK returned.
Beyond all the flair and references, this really isn't much difference from Capcom's Marvel titles or you know the stuff most other 2D anime fighters have been doing for two decades.
And it's specially weird if you compare with Arcsys' other stuff, because they like weird gameplay to a point that Blazblue has a puddle that shoots bees as a functional character.

Compared to their other titles, DBFZ is bland since a lot of characters play similarly, and compared to Marvel vs Capcom, it's also kinda bland with how safe they played with the movesets, though over time other characters got beefed up at least, Zamasu's flight is even worth a damn now from what I hear.
The thing with rollback is that japanese devs, who make the majority of fighter games, cater to japanese players who still have robust arcades on their relatively small island (compared to the rest of the world), therefor they mainly focus on arcades and console are someone an afterthought. And even still, when they use online, they don't have much of a problem on their small island. That's one plus for Covid, many industries have had to change how they do business.
The whole thing about Japan's connection being so good that companies don't bother with better netcode is a lie, and post Corona there was at least one Japanese tournament that looked pretty bad with how the game was playing, and while part of the reason it was because they were playing in a PS4 (There's higher input delay), the delay based connection wouldn't help too.

Makes sense the arcade scene being so active is part of the reason Japanese companies don't bother much with better connections, but I feel a bigger reason for it is just not wanting to change, Japanese culture can be rather stubborn in accepting change, and a company can be even worse with this (And Nintendo is the most obvious example of being stubborn with how terrible their online services are), not to mention, rollback netcode is basically a delay based netcode with more options on top of it, meaning, it's harder and more expensive to implement it, and companies can be rather cheap in wanting to waste money, combine that with them actually not wanting to change, and, yeah...

Though to be fair it's not just Japanese companies with this problem, Mortal Kombat returned in 9 and they didn't bother with rollback too, and as I said before, rollback has been around for a while, though at least I think they implemented it around MKX's life span, but still shouldn't have needed to wait this long, and Japanese companies definitely shouldn't need something like Corona to happen to have rollback be more widespread lol.

Oh well, unless Namco is super stubborn and doesn't want to bank Arcsys into implementing rollback (Which's, not impossible, the "rollback" in Tekken 7 is so terrible it might as well not be there, and Soul Calibur VI, a game released after Tekken 7, doesn't have it at all), DBFZ2 is likely gonna have it, whenever they release it lol.
jjgp1112 wrote: Sat Mar 12, 2022 12:08 am My man, all Goku had to do was go SSJ3 and shock Vegeta so much the M on his head would have turned into an L and Buu would have never happened.

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Re: PlayStation 5 and the future of DBZ games..

Post by Anonymous Friend » Fri Mar 18, 2022 4:30 pm

Lukmendes wrote: Thu Mar 17, 2022 7:36 pm
Anonymous Friend wrote: Thu Mar 17, 2022 6:44 pm Funny thing, I suggested on this very site way back when MvC3 was active that DBZ needed a fighting game styled like that. Everyone here shot that down. The Hyper DBZ came around and a year later FighterZ.
Honestly, I still find the very idea of DBFZ to be weird, characters mostly fight by themselves in DB, making a game where team is the focus is an odd choice.

I still find it very ironic that Arcsys made a fighting game for Persona, which's an RPG franchise where you fight in teams, and made the fighter into a 1vs1 fighter, and them they made a fighting game about DB that is team based... Seriously ironic lol.
Goku and Piccolo vs Raditz
Tien, Choatzu, Krillin, Piccolo, and Gohan vs Nappa
Goku, Yarjirobe, Krillin, and Gohan vs Vegeta
Vegeta, Krillin, and Gohan vs Ginyu Force
Goku vs Jiece and Burter
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Vegeta, Gohan, Krillin, and Later Piccolo vs Freeza
Trunks vs Freeza, Cold, and their forces
Vegeta, Trunks, and Tien vs 17 and 18
Everyone at the Cell Games vs Cell Juniors

I'm just stopping here because I haven't rewatched the post Cell stuff in quite some time. The entire franchise has always had group fights. Although, the deciding outcome was usually a one on one, except a couple movies where there's a group beam attack.
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Re: PlayStation 5 and the future of DBZ games..

Post by Lukmendes » Fri Mar 18, 2022 6:14 pm

Anonymous Friend wrote: Fri Mar 18, 2022 4:30 pm Goku and Piccolo vs Raditz
Tien, Choatzu, Krillin, Piccolo, and Gohan vs Nappa
Goku, Yarjirobe, Krillin, and Gohan vs Vegeta
Vegeta, Krillin, and Gohan vs Ginyu Force
Goku vs Jiece and Burter
Krillin , Gohan and Vegeta vs Jiece and Ginyu as Goku
Vegeta, Gohan, Krillin, and Later Piccolo vs Freeza
Trunks vs Freeza, Cold, and their forces
Vegeta, Trunks, and Tien vs 17 and 18
Everyone at the Cell Games vs Cell Juniors

I'm just stopping here because I haven't rewatched the post Cell stuff in quite some time. The entire franchise has always had group fights. Although, the deciding outcome was usually a one on one, except a couple movies where there's a group beam attack.
A lot of those are more desperate fights, and in a lot of cases they became one on one during those very fights at some point or another (Funnily enough the Vegeta fight was the opposite), generally the strongest of each side, but yeah, of those fights you listed, only one I can't say it had any real team usage is Trunks vs Freeza/Cold, the soldiers were just random mooks killed in one page, and Trunks took care of Freeza and Cold one at a time, you made a good point anyways, even if I still find it weird that DBFZ is a bit too much about team building, but hey, guess that's just me lol.
jjgp1112 wrote: Sat Mar 12, 2022 12:08 am My man, all Goku had to do was go SSJ3 and shock Vegeta so much the M on his head would have turned into an L and Buu would have never happened.

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Re: PlayStation 5 and the future of DBZ games..

Post by Anonymous Friend » Fri Mar 18, 2022 7:02 pm

Lukmendes wrote: Fri Mar 18, 2022 6:14 pm
Anonymous Friend wrote: Fri Mar 18, 2022 4:30 pm Goku and Piccolo vs Raditz
Tien, Choatzu, Krillin, Piccolo, and Gohan vs Nappa
Goku, Yarjirobe, Krillin, and Gohan vs Vegeta
Vegeta, Krillin, and Gohan vs Ginyu Force
Goku vs Jiece and Burter
Krillin , Gohan and Vegeta vs Jiece and Ginyu as Goku
Vegeta, Gohan, Krillin, and Later Piccolo vs Freeza
Trunks vs Freeza, Cold, and their forces
Vegeta, Trunks, and Tien vs 17 and 18
Everyone at the Cell Games vs Cell Juniors

I'm just stopping here because I haven't rewatched the post Cell stuff in quite some time. The entire franchise has always had group fights. Although, the deciding outcome was usually a one on one, except a couple movies where there's a group beam attack.
A lot of those are more desperate fights, and in a lot of cases they became one on one during those very fights at some point or another (Funnily enough the Vegeta fight was the opposite), generally the strongest of each side, but yeah, of those fights you listed, only one I can't say it had any real team usage is Trunks vs Freeza/Cold, the soldiers were just random mooks killed in one page, and Trunks took care of Freeza and Cold one at a time, you made a good point anyways, even if I still find it weird that DBFZ is a bit too much about team building, but hey, guess that's just me lol.
Until you said something, I always remembered most fight for their 1v1 resolutions.


But anyways ... Video games gotta video game.
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Re: PlayStation 5 and the future of DBZ games..

Post by Jord » Mon Mar 21, 2022 10:38 am

To be fair, you can fight one on one, or handicap matches. They should explore this more in a sequel, with a little more care given to balance. (If you pick one character, the damage you take should be way less)

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Re: PlayStation 5 and the future of DBZ games..

Post by Anonymous Friend » Tue Mar 22, 2022 6:53 pm

Jord wrote: Mon Mar 21, 2022 10:38 am To be fair, you can fight one on one, or handicap matches. They should explore this more in a sequel, with a little more care given to balance. (If you pick one character, the damage you take should be way less)
Street Fighter Alpha had Dramatic Battles and the Capcom vs SNK had their ratios. While there was mostly balance when just doing 3v3, changing health and attack values can only break that.
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Re: PlayStation 5 and the future of DBZ games..

Post by Lukmendes » Tue Mar 22, 2022 7:03 pm

Jord wrote: Mon Mar 21, 2022 10:38 am To be fair, you can fight one on one, or handicap matches. They should explore this more in a sequel, with a little more care given to balance. (If you pick one character, the damage you take should be way less)
If the assist system remains the same, then a 1vs3 would need to give a ridiculous amount of buffs for using only one player to even stand a chance, considering that assists are used to control the neutral, it, probably wouldn't be worth it, and balancing such mechanics sounds like a colossal headache, 'cause balancing fighters is hard enough to begin with.

The game's team based and it's better to remain that way, and leave stuff like 1vs3 to boss fights.
jjgp1112 wrote: Sat Mar 12, 2022 12:08 am My man, all Goku had to do was go SSJ3 and shock Vegeta so much the M on his head would have turned into an L and Buu would have never happened.

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Re: PlayStation 5 and the future of DBZ games..

Post by Jord » Wed Mar 23, 2022 3:10 am

Lukmendes wrote: Tue Mar 22, 2022 7:03 pm
Jord wrote: Mon Mar 21, 2022 10:38 am To be fair, you can fight one on one, or handicap matches. They should explore this more in a sequel, with a little more care given to balance. (If you pick one character, the damage you take should be way less)
If the assist system remains the same, then a 1vs3 would need to give a ridiculous amount of buffs for using only one player to even stand a chance, considering that assists are used to control the neutral, it, probably wouldn't be worth it, and balancing such mechanics sounds like a colossal headache, 'cause balancing fighters is hard enough to begin with.

The game's team based and it's better to remain that way, and leave stuff like 1vs3 to boss fights.
Balance would be a pain in the neck but 2 on 2 or 1 vs 1 matches should be possible to balance.

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Re: PlayStation 5 and the future of DBZ games..

Post by ObnoxiousNamek » Tue Apr 05, 2022 8:36 pm

Lukmendes wrote: Thu Mar 17, 2022 7:36 pm Compared to their other titles, DBFZ is bland since a lot of characters play similarly, and compared to Marvel vs Capcom, it's also kinda bland with how safe they played with the movesets, though over time other characters got beefed up at least, Zamasu's flight is even worth a damn now from what I hear.
This seems to be a big criticism i hear about the game? Everyone has a KI blast attack etc Should they give Arcsys more free reign to play around with movesets to diffrentiate the characters instead of trying to play it safe with manga and anime references only?

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Re: PlayStation 5 and the future of DBZ games..

Post by Modern_Dingus » Mon Apr 11, 2022 12:55 pm

I'm still waiting for Dragon Ball games to expand the Universe. If we're saving important stuff for the Manga / Anime / Movies, that's okay with me. But I do think they should start fleshing out Dragon Ball's World and Lore with games. I've brought up the idea of a game where you play as Saiyans during the reign of King Cold / Frieza, you have access to flying and basic Ki Blasts but you need to use the cool technology or resort Great Ape form for really intense moments; it'd be all about conquering planets and selling them off, all of which could give us a glimpse into the Saiyan Society.

But I'd also love something that heavily features Toriyama's Vehicles designs; something on Earth; maybe it's time for Dragon ball to take a shot at a Battle Royale now that the dust has settled in that genre. It'd be kinda cool to have an Open World where you stumble onto opponents then fight in a sort of Budokai 3-D arena style.

Just more than Fighting games and RPG's, I'd just like them to try new things.
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Re: PlayStation 5 and the future of DBZ games..

Post by budokaifanatic007 » Tue Apr 19, 2022 1:06 pm

I wonder if Shueisha making games now will affect DBZ games , maybe an in house DBZ game in the future?
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Re: PlayStation 5 and the future of DBZ games..

Post by Grimlock » Tue Apr 19, 2022 1:13 pm

Modern_Dingus wrote: Mon Apr 11, 2022 12:55 pmI'm still waiting for Dragon Ball games to expand the Universe. If we're saving important stuff for the Manga / Anime / Movies, that's okay with me. But I do think they should start fleshing out Dragon Ball's World and Lore with games.
Isn't that what Dragon Ball Online and Xenoverse did, as well as Heroes is doing (and a little bit with Dragon Ball FighterZ)? I'd say they also have important stuff, mainly Dragon Ball Online, of course.
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Re: PlayStation 5 and the future of DBZ games..

Post by Modern_Dingus » Tue Apr 19, 2022 10:22 pm

Grimlock wrote: Tue Apr 19, 2022 1:13 pm
Modern_Dingus wrote: Mon Apr 11, 2022 12:55 pmI'm still waiting for Dragon Ball games to expand the Universe. If we're saving important stuff for the Manga / Anime / Movies, that's okay with me. But I do think they should start fleshing out Dragon Ball's World and Lore with games.
Isn't that what Dragon Ball Online and Xenoverse did, as well as Heroes is doing (and a little bit with Dragon Ball FighterZ)? I'd say they also have important stuff, mainly Dragon Ball Online, of course.
My problem with that is it's not as consistent/easily accessible;

Dragon Ball Online is cool, but is officially discontinued, it's also missing large chunks of between End of Z and it's Start.

Xenoverse is alright, but it's not really adding to the lore, just kinda Mira, Towa, and Fu messing around, none of which ends up making a difference.

Heroes is also mostly non-canon stuff that just ends up being cool fight fanservice.

FighterZ ( if canon ) is a nice start, but again, nothing really comes of it, Kakarot kind of does this, but I'd still like to see it taken further.

I'd like to see Z-Fighter Backstories, Saiyan Society, Roshi / Shen's training, not just more "New Hair Color + New Ultra Powerful Guy" but I'm aware that some of this should probably be tackled by specials / the manga, I'd just like to see Dragon Ball do NEW things.
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Re: PlayStation 5 and the future of DBZ games..

Post by MCDaveG » Wed Apr 20, 2022 5:00 am

Getting Dragon Ball game that starts with the first chapter of manga and first series and goes well into Z might be just my wet dream.
Also based on the history, that we only got one game on Wii up to King Piccolo and two handheld titles.

If Kakarot had that complete journey, it would be my most fav game just because of that.
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Re: PlayStation 5 and the future of DBZ games..

Post by Grimlock » Wed Apr 20, 2022 6:31 am

Modern_Dingus wrote: Tue Apr 19, 2022 10:22 pmMy problem with that is it's not as consistent/easily accessible;

Dragon Ball Online is cool, but is officially discontinued, it's also missing large chunks of between End of Z and it's Start.
I don't know what you mean. We have a thread telling you what happened in between the series and its beginning. We see that lots of things happened. It's easily accessible by finding TheDevilsCorpse's signature. The links are there.
Modern_Dingus wrote: Tue Apr 19, 2022 10:22 pmXenoverse is alright, but it's not really adding to the lore, just kinda Mira, Towa, and Fu messing around, none of which ends up making a difference.
Then I think you only played the game to do battles and didn't pay attention to anything else. A lot is added through dialogues (most during battles, so it's understandable you'd miss them, but even so). Xenoverse even manages to do better what the "main series" couldn't do it, if that's "not adding to the lore", I don't know what is.
Modern_Dingus wrote: Tue Apr 19, 2022 10:22 pmHeroes is also mostly non-canon stuff that just ends up being cool fight fanservice.
There is no canon in this franchise, but it's not like you can't find anything interesting in the fanservice.
Modern_Dingus wrote: Tue Apr 19, 2022 10:22 pmI'd just like to see Dragon Ball do NEW things.
I think exploring the concept of alternate dimension/Multiverse is still new, and we can even draw some parallels between Dragon Ball and Marvel now, spotting the differences in the way they handle this and such.
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Re: PlayStation 5 and the future of DBZ games..

Post by Super Saiyan Turlast x4 » Fri Apr 22, 2022 1:33 am

When it comes to future DB games, I'd like to see another 2D fighting game. Basically a FighterZ 2. I haven't played DBFZ consistently in yrs, but I'd be lying if I said the game wasn't a dream come true for me. I definitely would like to see the formula improved on instead of it being a 1 time thing.

Another game I'd like to see is an RPG akin to Attack of the Saiyans. That's something I've been wanting to see for ages on console.
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Re: PlayStation 5 and the future of DBZ games..

Post by MCDaveG » Sun Apr 24, 2022 1:11 pm

I would actually love a new fighter, but more traditional one like Guilty Gear. Once you exploit chain combos in FighterZ, the game loses it’s appeal quickly and becomes chore in online play. Also, Guilty Gear has more quirks and combat mechanics, including more options of guard. But I guess that classic fighter will make even more people complaining and the player base will be low.
No win/win situation here.
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Re: PlayStation 5 and the future of DBZ games..

Post by Yuli Ban » Tue Apr 26, 2022 1:58 am

MCDaveG wrote: Wed Apr 20, 2022 5:00 am Getting Dragon Ball game that starts with the first chapter of manga and first series and goes well into Z might be just my wet dream.
Also based on the history, that we only got one game on Wii up to King Piccolo and two handheld titles.

If Kakarot had that complete journey, it would be my most fav game just because of that.
Sadly that was never an option solely because Kakarot made the baffling decision to have battles only ever take place while flying.

More to the point, it felt like Kakarot was meant to be a game solely about the Saiyan and Freeza arcs that got stretched out to the entirety of Z late in development. Original DB would have been great to see in high definition, but I don't think it was ever once intended to be anything but a slice of the entire series. As much as I also would love to have seen it be all of the story, I think diluting it too much would have broken the whole experience. Which I'd sad because I can think of many good ways to keep a game set over the entirety of Dragon Ball feeling fresh without growing repetitive, but it'd take time that Bamco never seems to let their studios have.
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Re: PlayStation 5 and the future of DBZ games..

Post by miguelnuva1 » Tue Apr 26, 2022 8:23 pm

Yuli Ban wrote: Tue Apr 26, 2022 1:58 am
MCDaveG wrote: Wed Apr 20, 2022 5:00 am Getting Dragon Ball game that starts with the first chapter of manga and first series and goes well into Z might be just my wet dream.
Also based on the history, that we only got one game on Wii up to King Piccolo and two handheld titles.

If Kakarot had that complete journey, it would be my most fav game just because of that.
Sadly that was never an option solely because Kakarot made the baffling decision to have battles only ever take place while flying.

More to the point, it felt like Kakarot was meant to be a game solely about the Saiyan and Freeza arcs that got stretched out to the entirety of Z late in development. Original DB would have been great to see in high definition, but I don't think it was ever once intended to be anything but a slice of the entire series. As much as I also would love to have seen it be all of the story, I think diluting it too much would have broken the whole experience. Which I'd sad because I can think of many good ways to keep a game set over the entirety of Dragon Ball feeling fresh without growing repetitive, but it'd take time that Bamco never seems to let their studios have.
What makes you think it was only suppose to be Saiyan and Frieza?

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