Frieza now stronger than Beerus?

Discussion, generally of an in-universe nature, regarding any aspect of the franchise (including movies, spin-offs, etc.) such as: techniques, character relationships, internal back-history, its universe, and more.

Moderators: General Help, Kanzenshuu Staff

Seekeroftruth
Beyond Newbie
Posts: 209
Joined: Sat Jul 25, 2020 3:25 pm

Frieza now stronger than Beerus?

Post by Seekeroftruth » Wed Aug 24, 2022 3:10 pm

Image

Given that frieza with just 4 months of training he was able to rival SSB Goku and Vegeta, it stands to reason that 10 years of training should make him exponentially more powerful. We know that Jiren rivals the GoD in his universe, and mastered UI Goku is stronger than him and a trainee angel. In turn, we know that Ultra ego vegeta is stronger than mastered UI Goku. Both of these fighters were defeated by frieza in one blow and frieza himself defeated gas with 1 attack.

Do you think that frieza is now stronger than Beerus? It would be an interesting concept of frieza no longer having anyone to keep him in check.

User avatar
DBFanTalk
Newbie
Posts: 43
Joined: Sat Dec 28, 2019 7:27 pm

Re: Frieza now stronger than Beerus?

Post by DBFanTalk » Wed Aug 24, 2022 3:36 pm

For now, we can only speculate on the power difference between Frieza and Lord Beerus. Why? Because Beerus' Full Power has yet to be confirmed. It's probably better to just assume that Beerus is stronger until proven otherwise. However, based on what we've seen so far, I imagine Frieza is now in the same echelon as Beerus.

It would be interesting to see how Frieza's new power affects his relationship with Lord Beerus. It seems he has the potential to undermine a GoD, which means Frieza could be more brazen towards him. This could foreshadow a conflict between them. The new power-up may be an incentive for Beerus to view Frieza as a potential threat.

User avatar
Hellspawn28
Patreon Supporter
Posts: 15191
Joined: Mon Sep 07, 2009 9:50 pm
Location: Maryland, USA

Re: Frieza now stronger than Beerus?

Post by Hellspawn28 » Wed Aug 24, 2022 3:52 pm

Beerus has a lot of power that we still haven't seen yet. Toriyama will probably retcon the fight in BOG and be like "Beerus was only fighting SSjG Goku at 3% of his power".
She/Her
PS5 username: Guyver_Spawn_27
LB Profile: https://letterboxd.com/Hellspawn28/

User avatar
Koitsukai
I Live Here
Posts: 4276
Joined: Tue Feb 06, 2018 5:02 pm

Re: Frieza now stronger than Beerus?

Post by Koitsukai » Wed Aug 24, 2022 4:07 pm

I guess not yet, Whis would've said something about it.

However, he better be fucking close to Beerus, by now if someone this strong is still an ant compared to Beerus this is going to start looking stupid. The moving goalpost, that isn’t actually one, cannot keep “moving” anymore, not after this arc.

User avatar
Kaboom
Moderator
Posts: 14373
Joined: Mon Jan 09, 2006 6:07 pm
Location: Funky Town
Contact:

Re: Frieza now stronger than Beerus?

Post by Kaboom » Wed Aug 24, 2022 8:37 pm

Impossible. Only other gods are allowed to be stronger than Beerus. Any time a mortal gets close, or starts receiving even vague "maybe" comparisons to Beerus, he just instantly gets 1,000x stronger to maintain his lead indefinitely. Goku and Vegeta alone would have eclipsed him 10 times over by now otherwise. :P
deviantART
FanFic: DragonBall GT Revised
[thread]
Powar Levuls: Main Series | Movies and Specials | GT
Nintendo/PSN/Steam: KaboomKrusader
ACNH Dream Address: DA-1637-4046-7415 ("SlamZone")
(Not) lost (enough) DB Super plots!
A handy video guide to Kanzenshuu-level grammar quality!

theherodjl
I Live Here
Posts: 2210
Joined: Mon Jul 13, 2015 10:12 pm
Location: The Planes of Lexington

Re: Frieza now stronger than Beerus?

Post by theherodjl » Wed Aug 24, 2022 11:27 pm

In my headcanon, Beerus has his own 'two base' deal. One, he just fights normally and uses the same general techniques that anyone with Ki or God Ki uses. Two, he is able to channel the power of destruction to a vast amplification of all of his physical capabilities as well as the ability to eradicate almost anything. For most of the series, he's used his 'first' state for many of his fights or conflicts, only using his 'second' state to end things or act as a show of force to others. At this point, I believe the characters are more than likely a match for Beerus in his first state but still fall short of being able to handle what he can put out in his second; akin to what we saw when Vegeta tried fighting Beerus at the beginning of the Granolah arc.
"Why is a raven like a writing desk?" - The Mad Hatter :think:

User avatar
Jack Bz
Regular
Posts: 532
Joined: Thu Mar 14, 2013 10:44 pm

Re: Frieza now stronger than Beerus?

Post by Jack Bz » Thu Aug 25, 2022 4:44 am

I think ultra ego was meant to be the ultimate goal-post moving technique to explain Beerus' position.

Vegeta is a total novice with it, but he's repeatedly said that with the form his power is unbounded. Beerus being a master of it probably means his power level can just arbitrarily increase in battle situations.

The idea that UI Goku is literally nowhere near Beerus is still annoying to me.

User avatar
Trouser
Beyond-the-Beyond Newbie
Posts: 439
Joined: Fri Mar 09, 2018 9:02 am
Location: Capsule Corp.

Re: Frieza now stronger than Beerus?

Post by Trouser » Thu Aug 25, 2022 6:58 am

Of course not. Beerus' power is going to be retconed again so he can remain the strongest.
"If it means having to live under your control, I'd rather be dead!" - Trunks
English is not my first language, if I've made a mistake, please, feel free to correct me. It will help, thanks.

User avatar
Zephyr
I Live Here
Posts: 4021
Joined: Sat Mar 27, 2010 9:20 pm

Re: Frieza now stronger than Beerus?

Post by Zephyr » Thu Aug 25, 2022 11:42 am

Whis being his martial arts teacher suggests that Beerus trains.

BWri
I'm, pretty, cozy, here...
Posts: 1712
Joined: Mon May 02, 2016 1:56 pm
Contact:

Re: Frieza now stronger than Beerus?

Post by BWri » Sat Aug 27, 2022 3:23 pm

Koitsukai wrote: Wed Aug 24, 2022 4:07 pm I guess not yet, Whis would've said something about it.

However, he better be fucking close to Beerus, by now if someone this strong is still an ant compared to Beerus this is going to start looking stupid. The moving goalpost, that isn’t actually one, cannot keep “moving” anymore, not after this arc.
They'll keep kicking the can until they're ready to pull the trigger. I don't see anything wrong with it either. Him being surpassed doesn't really do much for the story unless we get to see it directly like with Roshi vs. Tenshinhan.

I do hope they contextualize it in the story. Off-screen training would be a neat development for Beerus, just like it was for Roshi in DB. Probably for the same reasoning plus him just wanting to remain better than Goku and Vegeta.
Zephyr wrote: Thu Aug 25, 2022 11:42 am Whis being his martial arts teacher suggests that Beerus trains.
Exactly! Just not in front of Goku and Vegeta.
Big fan of the characters of Dragon Ball, all of them, especially formerly prominent sub-characters. -__-

theherodjl
I Live Here
Posts: 2210
Joined: Mon Jul 13, 2015 10:12 pm
Location: The Planes of Lexington

Re: Frieza now stronger than Beerus?

Post by theherodjl » Sat Aug 27, 2022 10:57 pm

Zephyr wrote: Thu Aug 25, 2022 11:42 am Whis being his martial arts teacher suggests that Beerus trains.
Yes...but then Whis has also confirmed that Beerus spends a lot of time sleeping, snacking, and watching anime. The fact that we, the viewers, have yet to see Beerus train with Whis the way that Goku & Vegeta do suggests that he might do it once in a blue moon. Maybe just enough as to not slip in intensity.
"Why is a raven like a writing desk?" - The Mad Hatter :think:

User avatar
Peach
OMG CRAZY REGEN
Posts: 882
Joined: Mon Feb 03, 2020 8:57 am

Re: Frieza now stronger than Beerus?

Post by Peach » Wed Aug 31, 2022 4:37 am

Possibly. The Oracle Fish did have a premonition that the power balance in the universe was about to change. The Oracle Fish not recognizing Gas seems to suggest the premonition was about someone else.

There was also that line in Super Hero about Broly being safe from Frieza on Beerus' planet. And it was suggested that Broly and Beerus are on par with each other in the Broly film...

User avatar
ATA
Beyond Newbie
Posts: 120
Joined: Wed Aug 10, 2022 5:40 pm
Location: Daybreak Town

Re: Frieza now stronger than Beerus?

Post by ATA » Wed Aug 31, 2022 8:13 pm

On a scale 1-10

Black Freeza is a 6. Beerus is 12.

We won't see Beerus get surpassed until either Boruto has a timeskip, Super gets pass End of Z, or Pan has offsprings(GT excluded).
May Your Heart Be Your Guiding Key

God Vegeta
Newbie
Posts: 10
Joined: Sat May 16, 2015 9:50 am

Re: Frieza now stronger than Beerus?

Post by God Vegeta » Thu Sep 01, 2022 3:18 pm

Toriyama stated in an interview (I think Volume F) that no matter what Freeza did, he would never match Beerus.

User avatar
VegettoEX
Kanzenshuu Co-Owner & Administrator
Posts: 17541
Joined: Sat Jan 10, 2004 3:10 pm
Location: New Jersey
Contact:

Re: Frieza now stronger than Beerus?

Post by VegettoEX » Thu Sep 01, 2022 3:46 pm

God Vegeta wrote: Thu Sep 01, 2022 3:18 pm Toriyama stated in an interview (I think Volume F) that no matter what Freeza did, he would never match Beerus.
Sure, but Toriyama is under no obligation to stick with ideas. This is something I see a lot of fans get hung up on: just because he had a thought or opinion on matters many years ago, it doesn't mean he will necessarily follow through with that when it comes down to it later on. Additionally, it's not just Toriyama writing this modern material, so the overall writers' room may ultimately have other ideas.
:: [| Mike "VegettoEX" LaBrie |] ::
:: [| Kanzenshuu - Co-Founder/Administrator, Podcast Host, News Manager (note: our "job" titles are arbitrary and meaningless) |] ::
:: [| Website: January 1998 |] :: [| Podcast: November 2005 |] :: [| Fusion: April 2012 |] :: [| Wiki: 20XX |] ::

User avatar
Xeogran
I Live Here
Posts: 3056
Joined: Thu Aug 23, 2012 10:04 am
Contact:

Re: Frieza now stronger than Beerus?

Post by Xeogran » Thu Sep 01, 2022 4:09 pm

I fully believe that Black Frieza is either close to, or surpassed Beerus by now. For all intents and purposes, Beerus NEVER fought UI Goku to show us how well he can handle him. The cat is only dunking on SSB Vegeta in each training segment we get now, while UI Goku trains with Whis who's much superior to Beerus.

Black Frieza one-shotted a much stronger version of UI Goku than from when the Granolah arc started and also one-shotted UE Vegeta at that because why not flex some more.

Visually he's already done a more impressive feat than Beerus had ever showcased.

User avatar
Peach
OMG CRAZY REGEN
Posts: 882
Joined: Mon Feb 03, 2020 8:57 am

Re: Frieza now stronger than Beerus?

Post by Peach » Thu Sep 01, 2022 10:22 pm

Xeogran wrote: Thu Sep 01, 2022 4:09 pm I fully believe that Black Frieza is either close to, or surpassed Beerus by now. For all intents and purposes, Beerus NEVER fought UI Goku to show us how well he can handle him. The cat is only dunking on SSB Vegeta in each training segment we get now, while UI Goku trains with Whis who's much superior to Beerus.

Black Frieza one-shotted a much stronger version of UI Goku than from when the Granolah arc started and also one-shotted UE Vegeta at that because why not flex some more.

Visually he's already done a more impressive feat than Beerus had ever showcased.
It does seem very "Dragon Ball" to have them surpass Beerus, without it ever coming up. Like, maybe a threat so powerful and diabolical surfaces, they ask for Beerus to intervene. Only for him to reveal they surpassed him years ago. :D

I think a much more interesting question- Is Frieza stronger than Beast Gohan? The promotional material stuff seem to hype up Gohan to be the strongest character in DB right now. With the Cell Max-Gohan fight being called the most powerful fight in history- which would include fights like Goku vs. Jiren, Gogeta vs. Broly, and Goku vs. Beerus.

User avatar
Xeogran
I Live Here
Posts: 3056
Joined: Thu Aug 23, 2012 10:04 am
Contact:

Re: Frieza now stronger than Beerus?

Post by Xeogran » Fri Sep 02, 2022 5:32 am

Peach wrote: Thu Sep 01, 2022 10:22 pm I think a much more interesting question- Is Frieza stronger than Beast Gohan? The promotional material stuff seem to hype up Gohan to be the strongest character in DB right now. With the Cell Max-Gohan fight being called the most powerful fight in history- which would include fights like Goku vs. Jiren, Gogeta vs. Broly, and Goku vs. Beerus.
Well the movie released before the Black Frieza chapter, and of course the promo material couldn't spoil this twist or even take it into account. Nothing is set in stone yet.

User avatar
Galan007
Regular
Posts: 666
Joined: Sat Oct 11, 2014 9:34 pm

Re: Frieza now stronger than Beerus?

Post by Galan007 » Fri Sep 02, 2022 8:45 am

Peach wrote: Wed Aug 31, 2022 4:37 am Possibly. The Oracle Fish did have a premonition that the power balance in the universe was about to change. The Oracle Fish not recognizing Gas seems to suggest the premonition was about someone else.
Despite knowing that Black Freeza had just effortlessly dropped Gas+UI Goku+UE Vegeta, Whis still didn't seem entirely convinced that he was "the strongest warrior" as prophesied by Oracle Fish, and further suggested that said warrior may have already emerged elsewhere in the universe.

Personally, my money is still on Oob. Per the Moro arc, we know he has an absolutely gargantuan amount of latent God ki at his disposal(the energy he casually donated was enough to take Goku from depleted base, back to MUI+.) So I suspect that once Oob masters his power, he could very well end up being "the strongest"... Which would also help reconcile Goku fangirling over him during the EoZ chapters and whatnot.

User avatar
Ashur
Beyond Newbie
Posts: 138
Joined: Wed Mar 02, 2022 6:48 am

Re: Frieza now stronger than Beerus?

Post by Ashur » Sat Sep 24, 2022 6:50 am

I like to think that this will come up in the story and Frieza will show himself stronger than Beerus, but this will happen years from now :D

Post Reply