Akira Toriyama getting cancelled (not really: contextless, disingenuous social media videos)

[Seekeroftruth]

Some links discussing the matter

https://youtu.be/DyFuyyQ6tX8
https://youtu.be/SW1NgiWR5k4

So people are going after Toriyama for a response made in an interview 30 years ago. Essentially he was asked what type of old timer he would like to be and he basically said he would like to be like master Roshi and peep on his daughter in the bathroom. Another reason people are going after him is for a one shot children's manga he did in 1987, title lady red, that showcased a female getting raped in a cab.



Now, this info is circulating around social media sites and a lot of people are clamouring for his cancellation/removal from the DB franchise. Could this be one of the reason for the passing of the torch over to his son Sasuke toriyama?

[Adamant]

Interesting. Mind explaining exactly who "people" are and why they think that THEM suddenly discovering the existence of a well known interview and one-shot is some sort of massive deal that changes everything? Are they billionaire shareholders in Shueisha or something?

(also, Lady Red wasn't a children's manga)

[JEFFMAN219]

Smh cancel culture is a joke like seriously.

[PurestEvil]

This is a total joke lmao. There’s no way Shueisha or TOEI would drop Toriyama because he drew a sexist manga in a bygone sexist period.

[VegettoEX]

Random people find and re-find these widely available, widely known, widely discussed interview comments and manga works over and over and over — which makes sense because there are always new fans coming in — but there’s never any *actual* action taken by anyone of any significance, generally because the folks are *so* new that they don’t have the necessary context to discuss these works… and/or because there’s not any actual action worth taking.

Cancel culture isn’t real: the subjects of actual, genuine criticism simply *don’t like* the fact that they’re (finally) being held accountable for their bullshit, and simultaneously, there are rarely (ever? at all?) any actual long-lasting ramifications even when they *are* called out.

See, incredibly relevant example in this exact authorial space: Nobuhiro Watsuki.

(If anything, folks should still be pounding down the tax fraud angle.)

(Final addendum: you can not like something, say something is really shitty, speak up about it, and it’s not “cancel culture”. I don’t want it to come across like folks shouldn’t and aren’t allowed to discuss whatever content they want. They can. It’s just… there’s nothing new to really say or discover here.)

[MasenkoHA]

You're making this a way bigger deal than it actually is.

Even searching Toriyama on Twitter doesn't pull up anyone talking about it.

Couldn't find anything doing a news search.


One or two people making Youtube videos about it doesn't equate to social media outrage much less canceling.

[TobyS]

"Cancelling" exists when it's like regular people losing a job at Home Depot because they said some genuinely stupid or offensive edgy shit in a tweet back in 2008 or something.

Rich celebrities are immune from cancellation and in fact ride the wave of infamy as marketing like Dave Chapelle or other hack comedians or D-list actors. Or Andrew Tate going on Tucker Carlson now.

Sometimes mid-tier people behave appallingly and stop getting work because people are disgusted with them and they are replaceable. That's just consequences to actions.

No one's free speech is impacted; no one has a right to a specific platform in perpetuity.

You can make an argument that media conglomerations and tech monopolies condensing all the platforms does kinda limit free speech. But that's a real issue and a left-wing one at that, so you won't see the alt-right morons crying about rapists not being able to voice cartoon characters anymore actually tackle those issues.

Back on topic...

Lady Red is stupid edgy humour that's inherently sexist but it's too stupid and cartoony to be shocking IMO. I can see it hurting or disappointing a survivor who was reading through Toriyamas back catalogue. I wouldn't cancel him for it but I wouldn't defend the work either.

The perv comments were obviously and clearly self-deprecating in nature. He's not a complete moron. There's 0 chance that was an actual declaration of intent to be a pedophile to his own kid in a public interview.

[Gridlock]

I don't think anyone in Japan, including Toriyama himself gives a crap, that the same 3-5 people from twitter/FB/TikTok/whatever are trying to stir up drama, over something that happened before any of them were born.

[DBZAOTA482]

Just because a 30 year old comic hurt some random SJW's feelings doesn't mean Toriyama is being cancelled.

[VegettoEX]

Just because a 30 year old comic hurt some random SJW's feelings doesn't mean Toriyama is being cancelled.

Want to pop back in and chime again that just like using "cancelled" unironically is usually a sign of general ignorance on the larger issues at play, using "SJW" unironically is also a really transparent sign.

Really struggling to understand how it is that the very website that translated this interview and is the source of all these posts/videos is simultaneously lambasted as "the SJW site" and yet has no problem hosting open discussion on these issues while also not having a problem dismissing the disingenuous and naive contextless attacks on it...

It's almost like there's nuance and history to stuff and handwaving people with acronyms is a bullshit, coward move...?

As someone certainly not defending the content of the ancient remarks but neither wishing to hide them or especially needlessly stir any completely unnecessary analysis, the "lolz SJW" commentary crowd can piss right off thank you very much.

[Zephyr]

"Cancelling" exists when it's like regular people losing a job at Home Depot because they said some genuinely stupid or offensive edgy shit in a tweet back in 2008 or something.

That's just called getting fired. Getting fired for dubious reasons, but getting fired nonetheless.

Things get cancelled. People get fired.

[JulieYBM]

I suspect that nothing will come of this but hey, an apology and promise to do better in the future would be nice.

[supersaiyamangod]

Some links discussing the matter

https://youtu.be/DyFuyyQ6tX8
https://youtu.be/SW1NgiWR5k4

So people are going after Toriyama for a response made in an interview 30 years ago. Essentially he was asked what type of old timer he would like to be and he basically said he would like to be like master Roshi and peep on his daughter in the bathroom. Another reason people are going after him is for a one shot children's manga he did in 1987, title lady red, that showcased a female getting raped in a cab.

The one shot is extremely awful but did he real say that about him and his daughter? because if true I can’t believe he said that that’s sad and shocking.

[MasenkoHA]

. Another reason people are going after him is for a one shot children's manga he did in 1987, title lady red, that showcased a female getting raped in a cab.

Fwiw it was published in Super Jump. A magazine aimed at an adult audience.

Not saying rape as comedy is okay regardless of the audience, but it wasn't being marketed towards children.

Could this be one of the reason for the passing of the torch over to his son Sasuke toriyama?

I think it's because Akira Toriyama is 67.

[VegettoEX]

It's bizarre that the videos maaaaaaaaybe sometimes show the name of the site, but don't tend to mention it, and even people posting here don't seem to know if it's real. Again, it's real, it's been translated here forever, it's old, etc. etc. etc. It comes from the franchise's first guidebook back in 1987:

https://www.kanzenshuu.com/translations/adventure-special-toriyama-qa/

(I clicked it so you don't have to: the first video linked even literally says "SO RECENTLY AN INTERVIEW CAME OUT"...!!! This video has to be intentional, knowing instigation. Absolute bullshit. At least the top comments are smart folks.)

And re: Toriyama's son, again, we have almost no context about that comment, and the folks who shared it widely on Twitter don't seem to actually understand English that well, nevermind Japanese. Based on what we can tell from what was shared, it's that Sasuke was handling (some of) the day-to-day project management operations, not the creative stuff.

[JulieYBM]

It should also be noted that the Dragon Ball Adventure Special was released on 18 November 1987—two years before Toriyama's daughter was born in October 1989. Still, what a weird, fucked up thing to say in a book aimed at kids.

[eledoremassis02]

This is giving me Law and Order Rape man episode vibes.

Yea, this stuff is sketchy. Was it sketchy in Japan when the comments were made (I think there is an argument to say no). We are looking at other countries and applying "our" current logic and culture on them (espeshally when it comes to things from the past). How does Toriyama feel now, what are his current stances and how do they stack up against modern Japanese? Do we hold him accountable or Japan in general?

Toriyama has shown some personal growth (even it stems from public shame)

Several targeted artists in Japan redrew the offending images in their work. In the 1980s there was a brief boom in “cute,” African cartoon characters—drawn in the spirit of the inflatable black Winkie dolls once popular in America. Akira Toriyama, who had drawn four little “cute” African natives in this style, obligingly went back and transformed them into “cute” cats.

Source: Dreamland Japan by Frederik L. Schodt

Mind you we are (the U.S) are still selling a manga (and anime) of his that sexualized a teenage girl and shows her naked and putting her in sexual situations.

On a side note, I'm suprised the manga doesnt have a warning on it now like Kodansha did on their ditial re-release of GTO


I'm surpised we dont see warnings like this or Warner Archives relese on more anime/manga

[JulieYBM]

This is giving me Law and Order Rape man episode vibes.

Yea, this stuff is sketchy. Was it sketchy in Japan when the comments were made (I think there is an argument to say no). We are looking at other countries and applying "our" current logic and culture on them (espeshally when it comes to things from the past). How does Toriyama feel now, what are his current stances and how do they stack up against modern Japanese? Do we hold him accountable or Japan in general?

Mind you we are (the U.S) are still selling a manga (and anime) of his that sexualized a teenage girl and shows her naked and putting her in sexual situations.

On a side note, I'm suprised the manga doesnt have a warning on it now like Kodansha did on their ditial re-release of GTO


I'm surpised we dont see warnings like this or Warner Archives relese on more anime/manga

You're being overly kind to a situation that really doesn't call for it. The comment was fucked up then and it is now, it doesn't need defending thirty-five years after the fact.

[eledoremassis02]

This is giving me Law and Order Rape man episode vibes.

Yea, this stuff is sketchy. Was it sketchy in Japan when the comments were made (I think there is an argument to say no). We are looking at other countries and applying "our" current logic and culture on them (espeshally when it comes to things from the past). How does Toriyama feel now, what are his current stances and how do they stack up against modern Japanese? Do we hold him accountable or Japan in general?

Mind you we are (the U.S) are still selling a manga (and anime) of his that sexualized a teenage girl and shows her naked and putting her in sexual situations.

On a side note, I'm suprised the manga doesnt have a warning on it now like Kodansha did on their ditial re-release of GTO


I'm surpised we dont see warnings like this or Warner Archives relese on more anime/manga

You're being overly kind to a situation that really doesn't call for it. The comment was fucked up then and it is now, it doesn't need defending thirty-five years after the fact.

Oh I agree it is, but again I think this is really an issue that takes aim at Japanese culture and what that implies and at what gounds do we have to make another culture change (where I feel that change need to come from within) *if that change has not already happend*

Just for context, my post wasnt just about his quote but Toriyamas (or atleast 80s Toriyamas) and 80s Japan as a whole.

[DBZAOTA482]

This reminds me of Nick Cannon trying to cancel Eminem with that Foolish Pride track (which is almost as old as Lady Red) like it's a shocking and new revelation. Only difference is Foolish Pride is actually hateful and racist (on top of not being a very good song in general) while Lady Red is just tasteless dark humor.

Toriyama doesn't speak English so I doubt he cares about all this propaganda.