Why Do People Think Goku Wins All the Time?

[Wrigglything]

Whenever Dragon Ball gets discussed, some people would probably make a jab or a snarky remark that Goku wins his fights all, or at least most of, the time. Some, however, point out that he rarely wins at all, which sounds a little silly, but considering what they mean by Goku wins, being a Goku solo win, it starts to make some sense.

For perspective, his solo wins I could think off the top of my head in the mainline series excluding GT (since I never watched that) include King Piccolo Daimao and his son/reincarnation Jr, Moro, and if we fudge the rules a little bit, Freeza back at Namek (even with the explosion and the breathing in space part) and on Earth (though it was a Vegeta effort too), as well as Majin Buu (with a little bit of spirit bomb thrown in there).

The rest were team efforts, as can be seen with Jiren where he, Freeza and #17 finished him off, Vegeta through the help of the other Dragon Team members (well, what little they did or are anyway), despite him doing the bulk of the work admittedly, and if we add in some fudged winnings, the Buu situation was the accumulation of Earth's energy and Mr Satan's fame that helped seal Buu's fate.

My guess though is that this motion might have come from the movies pre BoG, though again like GT I don't have too much experience with it sadly. But from what I've seen or understood, it seems to write Goku as the one who will save the day and be the one who solves the problem and figure out the villain's weakness. Maybe that's where the statement lies from, but again feel free to correct me on that part, especially GT and movies, which I have limited experience with.

I suspect the other reasons is from those sort of fans exaggerating Goku's abilities to absurdity, to where others would become intimidated to interact to due to their seeming volatility, though that's likely more of a effect than a cause, so it might be more of a root cause. Perhaps it's the movies as mentioned earlier, pop culture's not so good understanding of Dragon Ball, the anime doing some things differently from the manga, or even just how the source material could be interpreted to be, and how Toriyama portrays his story to the masses.

But there might be other factors I didn't consider. I'd like to know if you guys feel there are other things I didn't consider about this perception being this popular, despite it being more so an exaggeration.

[Xeogran]

Must be the Z-era movies, since they're short and easily memorable and that's how most of them finished. But truthfully, he didn't win most of the fights by himself, Garlic Jr. was the first opponent and without Gohan's help they wouldn't defeat him. Same with Lord Slug, Broly and Janemba.

Even looking closely at GT, Goku didn't win most of his fights alone. He had tons of help against Baby Vegeta and would die plenty of times otherwise, #18 had to save him from Super 17 and again, plenty of help against Omega Shenron. Even the sub-arc villains like Rildo or Luud weren't finished off by Goku alone.

So that notion is just a stereotype that really doesn't portray the truth.

[BWri]

It's due to the way the story always positions him as so much stronger than his allies and how everyone blatantly jobs out so that Goku appears much much stronger than them. It's also due to how Goku tends to destroy henchmen effortlessly that his allies struggled with such as Tambourine, Drum, Nappa, Recoome, Jeice, Burter, and Moro's prison gang. I do think the movies contribute to this view too.

[Trouser]

That's what Vegeta's fanboys say.

[ABED]

He's the protagonist so naturally he's going to be the difference maker. The number of films where he defeats the bad guy also ups his numbers leading to the perception.

[MasenkoHA]

He lost to Jackie Chun, his first fight to Tao, his first fight with Piccolo Daimao, and Mr. Popo in the original Dragon Ball. His first match with Vegeta ended in a draw and only because Gohan and Krillin intervened. And he conceded to Cell in their match. Saying he wins all the time is objectively wrong.

[ClutchBangstrip]

These types of questions is the exact reason I stopped watching Abridged. These are beliefs propagated on the internet without either proof or proper context. It's just repeated so often that it becomes true. At least on the internet.

[TheGreatness25]

To me, Dragon Ball is Goku's story. So, much like most stories, I find it perfectly normal for the main protagonist to win in the end. Yeah, the Power Rangers won when the episode ended. Yes, Ash Ketchum won the majority of (if not all--I don't know, I'm not the biggest Pokémon historian) his battles. Yes, Yu-Gi-Oh won most of (if not all--see my Pokémon answer) his duels. Yes, Batman wins in the end. So on and so forth. So, too, does Goku win in the end too.

[Hellspawn28]

He lost to Jackie Chun, his first fight to Tao, his first fight with Piccolo Daimao, and Mr. Popo in the original Dragon Ball. His first match with Vegeta ended in a draw and only because Gohan and Krillin intervened. And he conceded to Cell in their match. Saying he wins all the time is objectively wrong.

He also lost to Captain Ginyu.

[ABED]

He lost to Jackie Chun, his first fight to Tao, his first fight with Piccolo Daimao, and Mr. Popo in the original Dragon Ball. His first match with Vegeta ended in a draw and only because Gohan and Krillin intervened. And he conceded to Cell in their match. Saying he wins all the time is objectively wrong.

He also lost to Captain Ginyu.

How do you see that as a loss? Their fight never officially ended.

[Puto]

Ginyu stole his body and left him bleeding and barely able to move. It’s a loss by any metric that doesn’t require death or unconsciousness.

[ABED]

Ginyu stole his body and left him bleeding and barely able to move. It’s a loss by any metric that doesn’t require death or unconsciousness.

He didn't win the fight. The fight wasn't over. It does require death because they were fighting to the death. Just my 2 cents.

[MasenkoHA]

Ginyu stole his body and left him bleeding and barely able to move. It’s a loss by any metric that doesn’t require death or unconsciousness.

He didn't win the fight. The fight wasn't over. It does require death because they were fighting to the death. Just my 2 cents.

While I don't agree that a fight has to end in death, even a fight to the death, to declare a winner, I am inclined to agree Goku didn't really lose the fight. Ginyu injured his own body, switched their bodies and then fled with Jheese.

But whether you consider a loss for Goku or an abandoned match either way Goku doesn’t have a perfect win record even if we're strictly discussing Z

[Koitsukai]

Goku was spared by Ginyu, it didn't end in death because Ginyu chose not to off him. Or he miscalculated when he injured himself, expecting Goku to die soon enough.

Being a fight without rules, Ginyu's special technique is perfectly valid. Goku couldn't counter it, it served its purpose. He wasn't defeated fairly, perhaps, but he still failed to overcome his opponent's attack and didn't die due to plot-related reasons.

Death not happening doesn't mean a thing, Zarbon didn't kill Vegeta yet he won the first round.

[ABED]

He thought he did kill Vegeta. Goku was down but not out. Vegeta was incapacitated and couldn't have won had Zarbon known he was alive. Ginyu left because he falsely believed Goku couldn't continue. Goku couldn't overcome AN ATTACK. That doesn't make it the end of the fight. We're talking about a guy who has had every single one of his limbs injured and STILL won a life and death battle. Oh and he also had a hole blasted right through his chest.

Goku was alive, not due to plot armor, he's just tough, and Ginyu is arrogant.

I would consider this fight inconclusive. Goku doesn't win, but he doesn't lose either, which goes to the point of the thread.

[Dragon Ball Ireland]

In my experience its less so that people think Goku wins all the time, but more that he gets the win all the time, directly or otherwise, that no matter what other characters do Goku will always get the finishing blow.

And yes there are countless examples of times Goku, if not ultimately victorious was the catalyst that allowed the conflict to end. The entire Red Ribbon Army, Piccolo Diamoh, Freeza and Boo were defeated by Goku (with help from others in most cases) or Vegeta and Cell where Goku guides Gohan, so I hear people argue Goku won. I would consider the first battle with Vegeta a draw because Goku, Gohan and Vegeta were all unable to stand by the end of it, but nonetheless it is the destination, not the journey that I hear being criticized.

I don't have a problem with it personally, because Goku trains very hard and perseveres so there should be a reward. Its even more admirable in cases mentioned like Piccolo Diamoh arc where Goku loses the first fight, returns stronger than before and comes out victorious. And yes there is certainly some Vegeta fans that would love to see him kill a major villain, I still think having him defeat Freeza in Resurrection F would have been really neat, but Goku's successes in combat are by no means unearned.

"Mary Sue" (or "Gary Sue" for males) is also quite the buzzword in media circles today and the people that throw it around are always looking for a new target. I don't consider Goku one but I have heard people try to argue he is.

[Majin Man 101]

In all MAJOR series fights, his records are as follows.

Note, while Goku does lose to these foes consistently, he usually comes back stronger at a later time and date to get the W.

Goku vs Pilaf Gang-W
Goku vs Boss Rabbit-W
Goku vs Red Ribbon Army-W
Goku vs Piccolo Daimao-W
Goku vs Piccolo Jr.-W
Goku vs Raditz-L (Resulting in Death)
Goku vs Nappa-W
Goku vs Vegeta-Tie(you could argue Goku lost this fight as Vegeta had him dead to rights, because he would not have won without Gohan, Kururin, and Yajirobe there to back him up at the end.
Goku vs Ginyu Force-W
Goku vs Freeza-W
Goku vs Android 19-L (circumstancial yes I know)
Goku vs Cell-L (forfeit)
Goku vs Yakon-W
Goku vs Majin Vegeta-Tie (Goku could have busted out Super Saiyan 3 if he so desired so this could have been a W)
Goku vs Majin Boo-W (Mission successful, stalled for time and later stated it would have been theoretically possible to kill Majin Boo at this point)
Goku vs Majin Boo again-W with Genki Dama.
Goku vs Baby-W
Goku vs Super 17-W
Goku vs Shadow Dragons-W
Goku vs Beerus-L
Goku vs Golden Freeza in Super-L (Only saved because Whis reversed time)
Goku vs Hit- I honestly don't even remember who won the universe 6 tournament
Goku vs Goku Black-L (The biggest L which resulted in the destruction of an entire dimension not just universe.
Goku vs Jiren-W

These are just the ones that I thought off the top of my head.

Honestly though, without the intervention of others, Goku would have lost plenty more of these fights. As it stands, Goku does come out on top with more Wins than losses, and a few ties as well. But as stated previously, without the help of others he would have been screwed from a very early point.

[nineko]

He lost to Jackie Chun, his first fight to Tao, his first fight with Piccolo Daimao, and Mr. Popo in the original Dragon Ball.

You forgot this little gem:

[Cursed Lemon]

It's not that Goku wins every fight. It's that the other characters lose almost 100% of their fights once Z hits.

[MasenkoHA]

It's not that Goku wins every fight. It's that the other characters lose almost 100% of their fights once Z hits.

Piccolo beat Raditz with Goku's help

Krillin and Piccolo beat most of the Saibaman and Yamcha was winning against one until it decided to go kamikaze

Vegeta beat Cui and Dodoria and then Zarbon in their rematch. Vegeta would also beat Jheese after getting another boost (and never lost to him).

The Dead Z fighters beat the dead Ginyu fighters (anime filler but still)

Gohan, Krillin, and Piccolo beat the Mazoku Shitennou and Garlic Jr

Future Trunks beat Cyborg Freeza and King Cold

Vegeta beat Android 19 and caused Android 20 to run off and resort to desperate measures

Vegeta was beating Cell until he gave him the chance to go absorb 18.

Gohan beat Cell

Krillin beat whats his face in the 25th Tenkaichi Tournament

Vegeta beat PuiPui.


Where is this "they lose almost 100 percent of their fights" coming from? Surprise surprise Goku is the main character so it's not like Yamcha is going to defeat Nappa before Goku even shows up