I just watched the ending of GT (Japanese version) and it was one of the most depressing things I’ve ever seen

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Re: I just watched the ending of GT (Japanese version) and it was one of the most depressing things I’ve ever seen

Post by MasenkoHA » Thu Feb 16, 2023 7:37 pm

dva_raza wrote: Thu Feb 16, 2023 7:29 pm Lol. Maybe that would work if he actually said goodbye to everyone. His kids weren't even aware that he was leaving to never come back. His family was expecting him for dinner l think.
:lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:

What?

What?

His family was right there along with Bulma and Vegeta when he left with Shenron.

He took the time to say goodbye to Krillin and Roshi and even stopped by hell to see Piccolo
Nothing sweet about him going into the void.
If his spirit can come around a 100 years later to watch 2 kids beat the snot out of each at a tournament I'm not sure if that counts as going into the void.

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Re: I just watched the ending of GT (Japanese version) and it was one of the most depressing things I’ve ever seen

Post by dva_raza » Thu Feb 16, 2023 7:47 pm

MasenkoHA wrote: Thu Feb 16, 2023 7:37 pm
dva_raza wrote: Thu Feb 16, 2023 7:29 pm Lol. Maybe that would work if he actually said goodbye to everyone. His kids weren't even aware that he was leaving to never come back. His family was expecting him for dinner l think.
:lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:

What?

What?

His family was right there along with Bulma and Vegeta when he left with Shenron.

He took the time to say goodbye to Krillin and Roshi and even stopped by hell to see Piccolo

Wow that funny huh. Notice how I didn't say anything about: Piccolo, Vegeta, Krillin and only said the words; *kids* and *family*? That's cause I was, get this, in fact talking about his kids and his wife.. Literally no idea whats amusing about that.
If his spirit can come around a 100 years later
:lol:
..he came back after...spending a hundred years without speaking to his family again okay.
Was this supposed to contradict something about what I said?

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Re: I just watched the ending of GT (Japanese version) and it was one of the most depressing things I’ve ever seen

Post by Thanos » Thu Feb 16, 2023 11:40 pm

The best word for the overall feeling throughout GT in general is 'wistful' (defined as having or showing a feeling of vague or regretful longing), and I don't think you can really dissect that feeling any better than that. GT absolutely nails that and it just climaxes by the end. The 10th Anniversary Special has this mood as well. Even though I rank GT at the lower tiers of Dragon Ball content overall, it's hard to not feel a lot of emotions by the end there. Not to mention the opening and ending sequences/themes (literally all of them)... ugh.
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Re: I just watched the ending of GT (Japanese version) and it was one of the most depressing things I’ve ever seen

Post by Rory » Sun Feb 19, 2023 3:28 pm

GT's ending is honestly too good for GT, but I'm really glad it exists anyway, it really made me feel happy to know the series I loved got such a mature and well creafted send-off.
I love it because it really fits in with that feeling of progression the series always had. It also really plays up Goku's whole worldly/experienced shtick we saw in the Boo arc. The idea that 'something' happens to Goku/Shenlong and it's really up to viewer's interpretation just feels so bold and great, I was genuinely in awe first time watching. It doesn't underestimate your intelligence at all, even the fanservice it provies is just so tasteful (Goku and Kuririn on the beach reflected in Senin's glasses). It's kind of the one big reason that I think GT is a net-positive, and certainly what I think about when thinking of the highlights of the whole franchise.

It's a shame that, like the good things in modern dragon ball, it's really built on top of flimsy scaffolding, so you need to look at it totally in a vacuum. I'd say if you find this to be one of the most depressing things you've ever seen, you should broaden the media your intake. Not even saying that as a dismissive/pricky thing, but really, there's tons of great movies/television/art out there, and it's okay to watch things and feel a little sad. Art can touch us in many ways, it's good to engage with those feels every now and then!

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Re: I just watched the ending of GT (Japanese version) and it was one of the most depressing things I’ve ever seen

Post by Piccolo_Daima » Tue Feb 21, 2023 7:13 pm

GT's ending is an abomination, probably the worst anime ending ever. Goku leaves with Shenron however we don't know where and why, you just can't do that, I mean if Goku was dead say he's dead, if he's alive then explain where did he go and why did he say goodbye to his friends, because it was implied that Goku left forever, so if he was alive why did he leave his family and friends forever? and again, where did he go?

You can have a bad ending or a good one, but the least you can do is explain to the audience what happens, especially what happens with the main character of the anime.

Years ago I've read an interview of one of the writers of GT, and he said that the ending was let to the imagination of the audience so everyone can interpretate it, that means even the writers didn't know what happened in the ending, which means it was just rushed nonsense. It's a shame that for 20+ years that was the official ending of the best anime ever.

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Re: I just watched the ending of GT (Japanese version) and it was one of the most depressing things I’ve ever seen

Post by ABED » Tue Feb 21, 2023 8:15 pm

Piccolo_Daima wrote: Tue Feb 21, 2023 7:13 pm GT's ending is an abomination, probably the worst anime ending ever. Goku leaves with Shenron however we don't know where and why, you just can't do that, I mean if Goku was dead say he's dead, if he's alive then explain where did he go and why did he say goodbye to his friends, because it was implied that Goku left forever, so if he was alive why did he leave his family and friends forever? and again, where did he go?

You can have a bad ending or a good one, but the least you can do is explain to the audience what happens, especially what happens with the main character of the anime.

Years ago I've read an interview of one of the writers of GT, and he said that the ending was let to the imagination of the audience so everyone can interpretate it, that means even the writers didn't know what happened in the ending, which means it was just rushed nonsense. It's a shame that for 20+ years that was the official ending of the best anime ever.
Why can't they do that? It's ambiguous where he went, but that's not the point. He's gone for good. He's dead for all intents and purposes. The idea is that he made a deal. He gave his life so he could save the world one last time. The interview doesn't imply they don't know what happened, simply they left the question of where he went up to the audience but where he went isn't the point.
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Re: I just watched the ending of GT (Japanese version) and it was one of the most depressing things I’ve ever seen

Post by Rory » Wed Feb 22, 2023 4:20 pm

Piccolo_Daima wrote: Tue Feb 21, 2023 7:13 pmYou can have a bad ending or a good one, but the least you can do is explain to the audience what happens, especially what happens with the main character of the anime.
Keep this guy away from David Lynch! :o

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Re: I just watched the ending of GT (Japanese version) and it was one of the most depressing things I’ve ever seen

Post by dva_raza » Wed Feb 22, 2023 6:30 pm

Rory wrote: Sun Feb 19, 2023 3:28 pm Not even saying that as a dismissive/pricky thing, but really, there's tons of great movies/television/art out there, and it's okay to watch things and feel a little sad. Art can touch us in many ways, it's good to engage with those feels every now and then!
I’d say people who didn’t connect with GT’s ending is not due to lack of intake of sad stories but just the opposite, since obviously the more you experience of something, the more you kinda unwillingly refine your standards, or said thing becomes less impressive to you as opposed to other people.

For me, since the base tone of DB isn’t tragic, I just mostly found the ending here to be unnecessarily drastic and not in tune with this series. I saw it as presenting itself as wholesome to force a “closure” that I didn’t need.
And I’m not saying I wasn’t moved by the episode, there were chilling scenes like the one with Krillin, and the final montage too, but that doesn’t mean I have to appreciate how it resolved things.

Like mainly I didn’t feel Goku’s story had to end there, therefore I just don’t see the value in shoving a closure.
And overall I don’t really understand people’s wank for cLoSUrE and death like that automatically meant quality or significance.

For example I didn’t like the ending of Z either but I prefer it any time cause at least you’re not left with a feeling that Goku’s story ends off-screen, so that makes it more satisfying.
Last edited by dva_raza on Wed Feb 22, 2023 7:35 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: I just watched the ending of GT (Japanese version) and it was one of the most depressing things I’ve ever seen

Post by dva_raza » Wed Feb 22, 2023 6:37 pm

Piccolo_Daima wrote: Tue Feb 21, 2023 7:13 pm I mean if Goku was dead say he's dead, if he's alive then explain where did he go and why did he say goodbye to his friends, because it was implied that Goku left forever, so if he was alive why did he leave his family and friends forever? and again, where did he go?
I think it was pretty straightforward Goku became an ascended being. When he raises up for his last round and the enemy's blast hit his body without any effect, it was clear he was not alive anymore.

So that part is check. We know he absolutely died. That’s why Pan found his gi laying there while he still has it on miles away.

The part that sucks is that he didn’t' die in the traditional DB way we knew and fucked off without speaking to anybody ever again.
Such a ”bold and great” closure, wow. And yeah, we don't know what's the exact place he went to but I don't think that matters, you know it definitely wasn't the usual heaven he'd go to when he died.

(Luckily I never saw this until last year when Super already existed so the shock lasted for a little while and then I just considered GT to be a mistake.)

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Re: I just watched the ending of GT (Japanese version) and it was one of the most depressing things I’ve ever seen

Post by Hellspawn28 » Wed Feb 22, 2023 7:26 pm

It won't surprise me if they originally plan to set up something with Goku Jr and Vegeta Jr, but those plans went nowhere.
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Re: I just watched the ending of GT (Japanese version) and it was one of the most depressing things I’ve ever seen

Post by Rory » Wed Feb 22, 2023 7:35 pm

dva_raza wrote: Wed Feb 22, 2023 6:30 pm I’d say people who didn’t connect with GT’s ending is not due to lack of intake of sad stories but just the opposite, since obviously the more you experience of something, the more you kinda unwillingly refine your standards, or said thing becomes less impressive to you as opposed to other people.
Well luckily I'm not responding to any-old-person, I'm responding to OP! They explicitly stated they found it to be really depressing, and that they wished it ended in a more 'the story of Goku continues' fashion (similar to Super). Based on your other posts here I'm not too intersted in a super long back and forth, though, so hopefully we can leave it at that. :)

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Re: I just watched the ending of GT (Japanese version) and it was one of the most depressing things I’ve ever seen

Post by dva_raza » Wed Feb 22, 2023 8:10 pm

Rory wrote: Wed Feb 22, 2023 7:35 pm Well luckily I'm not responding to any-old-person, I'm responding to OP! They explicitly stated they found it to be really depressing, and that they wished it ended in a more 'the story of Goku continues' fashion (similar to Super). Based on your other posts here I'm not too intersted in a super long back and forth, though, so hopefully we can leave it at that. :)
Wow wtf lol. That was defensive. I'm not sure what made you assume I wasn't referring to the OP or what about what I said felt like it would prompt a super long back and forth but you can actually do whatever you want champ, and I'll do the same.

In fact. I wanna add to this now too,
Rory wrote: Wed Feb 22, 2023 4:20 pm
Piccolo_Daima wrote: Tue Feb 21, 2023 7:13 pmYou can have a bad ending or a good one, but the least you can do is explain to the audience what happens, especially what happens with the main character of the anime.
Keep this guy away from David Lynch! :o
Speaking as a hardcore Lynch fan who also doesn't like randomly cryptic endings in tonally straightforward comedy-action cartoons, I think your conclusions are hilarious. Not that GT’s ending was cryptic to me, but the point is if it was for someone else, that doesn’t mean they don’t like or understand abstract or surrealist media and probably just that they didn't find it fitting or organic here (which was my point with the depressing/sad thing too). Just a thought. :)

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Re: I just watched the ending of GT (Japanese version) and it was one of the most depressing things I’ve ever seen

Post by ABED » Wed Feb 22, 2023 9:42 pm

Considering GT doesn't altogether fit DB's aesthetic, an ending that doesn't fit Toriyama's world, but fits GT works fine. We've already got the whole "the story may continue" ending with the manga, so a more conclusive ending works here. It's sad but in the same way any ending is sad. Even happy endings can be a little sad because it's ending.
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Re: I just watched the ending of GT (Japanese version) and it was one of the most depressing things I’ve ever seen

Post by JulieYBM » Wed Feb 22, 2023 9:50 pm

Rory wrote: Wed Feb 22, 2023 4:20 pm
Piccolo_Daima wrote: Tue Feb 21, 2023 7:13 pmYou can have a bad ending or a good one, but the least you can do is explain to the audience what happens, especially what happens with the main character of the anime.
Keep this guy away from David Lynch! :o
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(Actually, the GT ending is way easier to decipher than what Lynch was going for in Twink Peaks, although I think even then if you paid attention you'd get that ending to Twin Peaks).
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Re: I just watched the ending of GT (Japanese version) and it was one of the most depressing things I’ve ever seen

Post by Cursed Lemon » Thu Feb 23, 2023 12:25 pm

It's almost like GT had an actual ending

Yes I'm going there
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Re: I just watched the ending of GT (Japanese version) and it was one of the most depressing things I’ve ever seen

Post by MasenkoHA » Thu Feb 23, 2023 1:08 pm

Cursed Lemon wrote: Thu Feb 23, 2023 12:25 pm It's almost like GT had an actual ending

Yes I'm going there
They all had an actual ending

Whether those individual endings were actually satisfactory is whole other ball of wax.

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Re: I just watched the ending of GT (Japanese version) and it was one of the most depressing things I’ve ever seen

Post by SuperSaiyaManZ94 » Thu Feb 23, 2023 1:15 pm

Well, it certainly feels more conclusive of an ending (at least for the anime version of the story. And that's with Z more or less adapting the final chapters as is) than Toriyama did with the manga, which was basically "Goku meets and fights random kid who also happens to be the evil Buu's reincarnation, he decides to fly off with him to God knows where in order to train him while his family and friends sans Vegeta are left baffled." and yeah it fits the offbeat, unusual child at heart way of thinking that Goku has but at the same time also was basically an abrupt ending Toriyama came up with because after almost 11 years he was burnt out and ready to move on from Dragon Ball.

Article for reference, including comparison between the original and revised Kanzenban endings

https://www.kanzenshuu.com/features/fan ... ll-ending/
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Re: I just watched the ending of GT (Japanese version) and it was one of the most depressing things I’ve ever seen

Post by MasenkoHA » Thu Feb 23, 2023 1:27 pm

SuperSaiyaManZ94 wrote: Thu Feb 23, 2023 1:15 pm Well, it certainly feels more conclusive of an ending (at least for the anime version of the story. And test that's with Z more or less adapting the final chapters as is) than Toriyama did with the manga, which was basically "Goku meets and fights random kid who also happens to be the evil Buu's reincarnation, he decides to fly off with him to God knows where in order to train him while his family and friends sans Vegeta are left baffled." and yeah it fits the offbeat, unusual child at heart way of thinking that Goku has but at the same time also was basically an abrupt ending Toriyama came up with because after almost 11 years he was burnt out and ready to move on from Dragon Ball.

Article for reference, including comparison between the original and revised Kanzenban endings

https://www.kanzenshuu.com/features/fan ... ll-ending/
Eh, I've said it before. If you favor Goku as a messianic archtype who enriched the lives of everyone he met and changed them for the better then sure the manga's ending will leave you feeling cold. GT's ending delivers on the Toei version of Goku.

But for Toriyama's Goku who just wants to fight strong opponents and has a track record of abandoning everyone to go train? Taking off with the reincarnation of the strongest opponent he ever faced (until Super botched that ooooops) to train him and have that great fight is a perfectly fitting ending, the 23rd Budokai's ending was just better.

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Re: I just watched the ending of GT (Japanese version) and it was one of the most depressing things I’ve ever seen

Post by SuperSaiyaManZ94 » Thu Feb 23, 2023 3:07 pm

MasenkoHA wrote: Thu Feb 23, 2023 1:27 pm
SuperSaiyaManZ94 wrote: Thu Feb 23, 2023 1:15 pm Well, it certainly feels more conclusive of an ending (at least for the anime version of the story. And test that's with Z more or less adapting the final chapters as is) than Toriyama did with the manga, which was basically "Goku meets and fights random kid who also happens to be the evil Buu's reincarnation, he decides to fly off with him to God knows where in order to train him while his family and friends sans Vegeta are left baffled." and yeah it fits the offbeat, unusual child at heart way of thinking that Goku has but at the same time also was basically an abrupt ending Toriyama came up with because after almost 11 years he was burnt out and ready to move on from Dragon Ball.

Article for reference, including comparison between the original and revised Kanzenban endings

https://www.kanzenshuu.com/features/fan ... ll-ending/
Eh, I've said it before. If you favor Goku as a messianic archtype who enriched the lives of everyone he met and changed them for the better then sure the manga's ending will leave you feeling cold. GT's ending delivers on the Toei version of Goku.

But for Toriyama's Goku who just wants to fight strong opponents and has a track record of abandoning everyone to go train? Taking off with the reincarnation of the strongest opponent he ever faced (until Super botched that ooooops) to train him and have that great fight is a perfectly fitting ending, the 23rd Budokai's ending was just better.
Yeah, the GT ending works better if you prefer Toei's DB/Z/GT own interpretation of Goku over his manga counterpart. The manga ending works better for Toriyama's version of him.
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Re: I just watched the ending of GT (Japanese version) and it was one of the most depressing things I’ve ever seen

Post by Hellspawn28 » Fri Feb 24, 2023 3:51 pm

The ending of GT was the end of an era. Dragon Ball was officially done with, and we would never see a new Dragon Ball anime series until nearly 18 years later. It being a clip show was a good idea to show off the best moments that happen in the last 11 years of DB airing on TV. They did skip over the clips of the Saiyan saga oddly enough.
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