Kanzenshuu

Sparring, not life and death battles against the best of the best. All I'm pointing out is that the characters are often as strong as the narrative needs them to be. It's not the worst thing in the world. It feels like an awfully arbitrary line being drawn about what we are willing to buy regarding...

Fwiw Goten’s entire training was sparring with Chi Chi and learning the Bukujutsu technique from Gohan. Yet somehow he was only barely weaker than Trunks who sparred with Vegeta (whose obviously much stronger than Chi Chi ) and did the same intense gravity training as Vegeta. The only explanation w...

What do you mean by exposition? I mean the explanations for why characters get as strong as they get isn't what makes the story. The big value of a training scene or montage isn't primarily about explaining. It's about build up and drama. I want to ask a question let say Fighter A and Fighter B bot...

Not what I was getting at. Gohan was as strong enough to make a difference then after the battle powers go up exponentially Goten and Trunks just happen to be able to help out and are able to turn SSj w/o requisite anger The only thing Goten and Trunks were useful was their fusion, when they are un...

Goten and Trunks are as strong as they are because the plot necessitates it. I'm well aware of the half breed issue but why are they able to stand any chance against enemies as strong as they faced at that point in the story? Just because and that's okay. It's not whether it's out of nowhere that's...

Paragus had Broly as a training partner in a harsh and dangerous planet, yet he never got that powerful. What about Trunks that was stated to train with Pilaf, Pilaf isn't powerful. You’re missing the point. Freeza was already naturally powerful so actually putting in effort for four months was goi...

It's established very early in Z by Nappa and Vegeta that halfbreed Saiyans (and in turn Gohan) are special. Goten and Trunks are a stretch, although Trunks did have access to the gravity room from a very young age, and also sparred with Goten which would have made him stronger too. Goku turning SS...

I know what you meant but there is no "established logic of the story" when it comes to battle powers. And 17 did train, just off screen. I think you are getting bogged down in an irrelevant detail. Freeza went off and trained and was god tier in a matter of months. That's not what was ab...

Tenshinhan didn't retire. He is still a martial artist. He trains but just doesn't go to events like the TB anymore. Why would he? I forgot about that, your right it was mentioned that Tien was still training but he wouldn't compete in the tournament. Then there is the whole Tien who rescues Gohan ...

I ended up accepting Toei's attempt with the kids. Somehow it explains why they became slackers in EoZ: they wanted to take part in everything fight-related in DBS, but were denied to do so, and ended up searching for new ways to occupy their time (dating for Goten, and whatever Trunks was doing). ...

My biggest gripe is that they're supposed to be like 13-14 and they're still written like they're 7 years old. I mean, they're barely even written at all. I always found it funny when people would say "Goten and Trunks are still kids because its shonen and they appeal to kids." And I'm li...

17 was written to be SSB Tier with zero explanation because of pure fanservice. I agree that there is a missed opportunity to use them but is using 17 fanservice? Does he have that many fans? Yes his being that strong doesn't make sense but what they did with his personality was genuinely interesti...

I am pointing out that Goku doesn't learn. He doesn't grow more serious and the growing stakes don't fundamentally outweigh his love of battle. Goku may have shown concern that he was wrong to give Cell the senzu but that fear he shows is not indicitive of him learning something and being more seri...

He didn't realize his mistake. Goku panicked momentarily but goes right back to being (over)confident in his son when he's proven right about his power. Also Goku goes right back to his old ways so he doesn't learn from this situation. If we don't count Goku turning SSJ3 as a retcon, he gets into a...

Need I say again that Goku threw Cell a senzu before he fought Gohan? But sure he's always serious He regressed because one time he wasn't aware that a psychic was messing with him? And if he wins the TOP there is no need to resurrect his friends. Winning means they survive You finding his enthusia...

When the Buu Saga came I was surprise to see that Goku and Chi Chi had a second kid, I thought that was great a new character to the addition. Then when they showed their skills and the ability to transform into a Super Saiyan at a young age without any trouble even better. Remember Goten is the fir...

Just to be clear, we're all talking about the same Goku who immediately fucked up the details of Trunks' story and needed Piccolo to cover for him, right? The same Goku that told Bulma to have a healthy baby? The same Goku that casually gave away both Trunks' name and Vegeta being his father 3 year...

-Well, Gohan once sat on his ass for 20 hours and became Ultimate Gohan. This kind of asspull isn't new to the franchise, and while probably all of us couldn't believe Freeza got as strong with just 4 months of training, at least the reason was that he trained for it. I doubt they'll come up with a...

- Freeza never trained in his life, it wasn't really his sparring partner the culprit of his power up but himself, he had just that much untapped power. - I don't know where you are getting this, but Krilin cannot compete with anyone above Z SS. - Goku's base is a mess. But that was Toriyama's faul...

People who complain about the children's lack of screentime in Super are missing one important factor: They are fodder. They are fodder, they wouldn't last 10 seconds in a major fight. Goten is literally fodder who got oneshot by Goku Black AS SOON AS HE GOT HIS BODY. Trunks isn't much stronger eit...