Lupin879 wrote:Zamas used the ring many time and for this he has to be Kaioshin If he is not Kaioshin the fusion will not last but an hour.
Zamas is not a Kaioshin? Good, he can not use the ring and the fusion last one hour
Zamas is a Kaioshin? Good he can not have anymore the healing powers.
If one can change status also Kaioshin est can
In the anime Kaiohshin has only a special kai kai only to go to Zeno
The permanent fusion rule likely applies to all shinjin, not just Kaioshin. We'll see if that plot point even exists in the manga.
If Zamasu is a Kaioshin, then is Black a god of destruction? If so, where is his angel? He isn't a true Kaioshin. The potara and time rings are intended for and only permitted to be used by Kaioshin, but that doesn't mean they don't function otherwise.
It is never stated that Kaioshin's kai-kai only brings him to Zeno's realm. He also used it to get to Earth. If Kaioshin knowing kai-kai bothers you, just figure that he learned it when he was fused with Kibito.
Jinzoningen MULE wrote:I'm talking pre-Super, in regards to whether or not Kaioshin having the ability now is a retcon. Obviously, the Kaioshin can Kai-Kai now, but it wasn't always that way.
Could it be after their defuse he learned some Kibito techniques, maybe?
Are we too old to enjoy new Dragon Ball movies/series?
Spoiler:
Nickolaidas wrote: ↑Sun Jun 14, 2015 2:10 am
Guys, I'm going to be straight with you. If you feel the show has gotten 'silly' ... it hasn't. You're just 'too old for this shit'. Seriously, 95% of the people in those boards do not fit the target demographic of the show, so don't expect the show to be 'everything you hoped for'. I'm referring to the people here who expect Super to be rich with dark moments, serious storytelling, meaningful characters etc etc. It won't. It's a show for kids. A show for kids being kids. Everyone in those boards has a manchild in him/her, clamoring to get out, and that's fine. But having unrealistic expectations (such as believing the show grew up alongside you) is naïve at best. Honestly, do you take seriously a story where the supposed God of Destruction halts his urges to blow up stuff in order to eat ice cream sundae? That's the show's silliness at full force, take it for what it is. The show hasn't matured one bit, so don't expect it too. Again, I'm not saying that's a bad thing. I'm saying *that* is DB and always will be.
Jinzoningen MULE wrote:I'm talking pre-Super, in regards to whether or not Kaioshin having the ability now is a retcon. Obviously, the Kaioshin can Kai-Kai now, but it wasn't always that way.
Could it be after their defuse he learned some Kibito techniques, maybe?
That's possible, but since it seems now as if it's (and for all we know, always has been) a common Kaioshin technique, I don't give much credence to that explanation.
I always assumed Toriyama forgot that Kibito was the one who could teleport, and now his mistake is an official retcon. Kaioshin definitely couldn't teleport before merging with Kibito.
Lupin879 wrote:Zamas used the ring many time and for this he has to be Kaioshin If he is not Kaioshin the fusion will not last but an hour.
Zamas is not a Kaioshin? Good, he can not use the ring and the fusion last one hour
Zamas is a Kaioshin? Good he can not have anymore the healing powers.
If one can change status also Kaioshin est can
In the anime Kaiohshin has only a special kai kai only to go to Zeno
The permanent fusion rule likely applies to all shinjin, not just Kaioshin. We'll see if that plot point even exists in the manga.
If Zamasu is a Kaioshin, then is Black a god of destruction? If so, where is his angel? He isn't a true Kaioshin. The potara and time rings are intended for and only permitted to be used by Kaioshin, but that doesn't mean they don't function otherwise.
It is never stated that Kaioshin's kai-kai only brings him to Zeno's realm. He also used it to get to Earth. If Kaioshin knowing kai-kai bothers you, just figure that he learned it when he was fused with Kibito.
In episode 55, whis says only Kaioshin can go instantly to Zeno is not teleportation.
one fusee would be only a Supreme Kai in order for the fusion to stay permament
OLKv3 wrote:I always assumed Toriyama forgot that Kibito was the one who could teleport, and now his mistake is an official retcon. Kaioshin definitely couldn't teleport before merging with Kibito.
Toyotaro should remember him those things, I mean he should be useful for that.
Are we too old to enjoy new Dragon Ball movies/series?
Spoiler:
Nickolaidas wrote: ↑Sun Jun 14, 2015 2:10 am
Guys, I'm going to be straight with you. If you feel the show has gotten 'silly' ... it hasn't. You're just 'too old for this shit'. Seriously, 95% of the people in those boards do not fit the target demographic of the show, so don't expect the show to be 'everything you hoped for'. I'm referring to the people here who expect Super to be rich with dark moments, serious storytelling, meaningful characters etc etc. It won't. It's a show for kids. A show for kids being kids. Everyone in those boards has a manchild in him/her, clamoring to get out, and that's fine. But having unrealistic expectations (such as believing the show grew up alongside you) is naïve at best. Honestly, do you take seriously a story where the supposed God of Destruction halts his urges to blow up stuff in order to eat ice cream sundae? That's the show's silliness at full force, take it for what it is. The show hasn't matured one bit, so don't expect it too. Again, I'm not saying that's a bad thing. I'm saying *that* is DB and always will be.
OLKv3 wrote:I always assumed Toriyama forgot that Kibito was the one who could teleport, and now his mistake is an official retcon. Kaioshin definitely couldn't teleport before merging with Kibito.
Toyotaro should remember him those things, I mean he should be useful for that.
Do we know he definitely couldn't before or are you guys just making shit up to please your headcanon?
Jinzoningen MULE wrote: Maybe I should start making it a point not to comment when I'm not sure of something. Too many people know what they're talking about around here.
Disclaimer: I might get into a disagreement with you. Sometimes I might even get feisty about it. I'll never harbor negative feelings because of it though. I hope you feel the same way!
I made a bet with Alee9977 that Vegeta won't be beaten quickly by an opponent. If I lose, I switch my avatar to Vegeta getting beat by hit. If I win, he switches it to Vegeta holding Black by his hair. This will last a month.
OLKv3 wrote:I always assumed Toriyama forgot that Kibito was the one who could teleport, and now his mistake is an official retcon. Kaioshin definitely couldn't teleport before merging with Kibito.
Toyotaro should remember him those things, I mean he should be useful for that.
Do we know he definitely couldn't before or are you guys just making stuff up to please your headcanon?
This is a good point. Also, if Toriyama decides he wants to change something to move the story forward (like he always has), he has every right to do that. The same goes for Toyotaro.
Just found out Toyotaro drew a French Goku to celebrate DBS manga release in France and I think that's pretty awesome from him:
[spoiler] https://twitter.com/DBZcom/status/847369982753165312[/spoiler]
French fans are lucky.
kinisking wrote:Do we know he definitely couldn't before or are you guys just making shit up to please your headcanon?
We don't need to know as this is an obvious assumption. Toyotaro is his assistant and responsible for drawing the manga, but not just that, he's also a fan that could remember small or big details in the original manga which Toriyama has forgot. If they want to change just for change then it's up to them, but keeping consistent with things established decades ago would sure avoid holes in the story making it more enjoyable to readers.
Are we too old to enjoy new Dragon Ball movies/series?
Spoiler:
Nickolaidas wrote: ↑Sun Jun 14, 2015 2:10 am
Guys, I'm going to be straight with you. If you feel the show has gotten 'silly' ... it hasn't. You're just 'too old for this shit'. Seriously, 95% of the people in those boards do not fit the target demographic of the show, so don't expect the show to be 'everything you hoped for'. I'm referring to the people here who expect Super to be rich with dark moments, serious storytelling, meaningful characters etc etc. It won't. It's a show for kids. A show for kids being kids. Everyone in those boards has a manchild in him/her, clamoring to get out, and that's fine. But having unrealistic expectations (such as believing the show grew up alongside you) is naïve at best. Honestly, do you take seriously a story where the supposed God of Destruction halts his urges to blow up stuff in order to eat ice cream sundae? That's the show's silliness at full force, take it for what it is. The show hasn't matured one bit, so don't expect it too. Again, I'm not saying that's a bad thing. I'm saying *that* is DB and always will be.
kinisking wrote:Do we know he definitely couldn't before or are you guys just making shit up to please your headcanon?
We don't need to know as this is an obvious assumption. Toyotaro is his assistant and responsible for drawing the manga, but not just that, he's also a fan that could remember small or big details in the original manga which Toriyama has forgot. If they want to change just for change then it's up to them, but keeping consistent with things established decades ago would sure avoid holes in the story making it more enjoyable to readers.
I'm saying do you know that the supreme Kai couldn't teleport ? Was that stated anywhere or is it head canon.
Jinzoningen MULE wrote: Maybe I should start making it a point not to comment when I'm not sure of something. Too many people know what they're talking about around here.
Disclaimer: I might get into a disagreement with you. Sometimes I might even get feisty about it. I'll never harbor negative feelings because of it though. I hope you feel the same way!
I made a bet with Alee9977 that Vegeta won't be beaten quickly by an opponent. If I lose, I switch my avatar to Vegeta getting beat by hit. If I win, he switches it to Vegeta holding Black by his hair. This will last a month.
kinisking wrote:
I'm saying do you know that the supreme Kai couldn't teleport ? Was that stated anywhere or is it head canon.
He said it was Kibito's ability(inb4 the original japanese text was another vague line!), when Goku told them he would struggle to find planet Namek after Buu blew up Earth.
kinisking wrote:I'm saying do you know that the supreme Kai couldn't teleport ? Was that stated anywhere or is it head canon.
No, but this is a small issue. Kibitoshin was able to teleport because it was Kibito abillity, as I said to Jinzoningen MULE, after their defuse Shin could have inherited some of Kibito techniques, maybe.
Are we too old to enjoy new Dragon Ball movies/series?
Spoiler:
Nickolaidas wrote: ↑Sun Jun 14, 2015 2:10 am
Guys, I'm going to be straight with you. If you feel the show has gotten 'silly' ... it hasn't. You're just 'too old for this shit'. Seriously, 95% of the people in those boards do not fit the target demographic of the show, so don't expect the show to be 'everything you hoped for'. I'm referring to the people here who expect Super to be rich with dark moments, serious storytelling, meaningful characters etc etc. It won't. It's a show for kids. A show for kids being kids. Everyone in those boards has a manchild in him/her, clamoring to get out, and that's fine. But having unrealistic expectations (such as believing the show grew up alongside you) is naïve at best. Honestly, do you take seriously a story where the supposed God of Destruction halts his urges to blow up stuff in order to eat ice cream sundae? That's the show's silliness at full force, take it for what it is. The show hasn't matured one bit, so don't expect it too. Again, I'm not saying that's a bad thing. I'm saying *that* is DB and always will be.
kinisking wrote:I'm saying do you know that the supreme Kai couldn't teleport ? Was that stated anywhere or is it head canon.
No, but this is a small issue. Kibitoshin was able to teleport because it was Kibito abillity, as I said to Jinzoningen MULE, after their defuse Shin could have inherited some of Kibito techniques, maybe.
What I'm saying is how do you know it was solely because of kibito? How do you know he didn't have it all along and just made kibito do it because it wastes energy ?
Jinzoningen MULE wrote: Maybe I should start making it a point not to comment when I'm not sure of something. Too many people know what they're talking about around here.
Disclaimer: I might get into a disagreement with you. Sometimes I might even get feisty about it. I'll never harbor negative feelings because of it though. I hope you feel the same way!
I made a bet with Alee9977 that Vegeta won't be beaten quickly by an opponent. If I lose, I switch my avatar to Vegeta getting beat by hit. If I win, he switches it to Vegeta holding Black by his hair. This will last a month.
Man, I'm really digging the idea that all the other Hakaishin art plotting against Goku and Universe 7. Little things like that are going to make the dynamic of the battle royal more interesting.
Spoiler:
Akira Toriyama wrote:My policy is to try and forget things once they’re over. Since if I don’t discard the old and focus on what’s new, I’ll overload my brain capacity. I still haven’t lived down going, “Who the heck is Tao Pai-pai?” that one time I was talking with Ei’ichiro Oda-kun. But the fact that there are still people reading the series after all this time… All I can say is; “thank you.” Really, that’s all.
Akira Toriyama wrote:Drawing Dragon Ball again reminded me of two things--how much I love it, and how much I never want to do it again.
Kunzait_83 wrote:And if you're upset because all this new material completely invalidates the tabletop RPG rulebook-sized statistical system and flowchart for the characters' "canonical Power Levels" that you'd been working on painstakingly for the last bunch of years now... well I don't think there's a kind, non-blunt way of saying this, but that's 100% entirely your own misguided fault for buying so deeply into all this nonsensical garbage in the first place. And that you also have IMMENSELY skewed and comically backwards priorities in what you think is most important and needed to make a good Dragon Ball story.
Zephyr wrote:Goodness, they wrote idiotic drivel in a children's cartoon meant to advertise toys!? Again!? For the ninetieth episode in a row!? Somebody stop the presses! We have to voice our concern over these Super important issues!
Kamiccolo9 wrote:Fair enough, I concede. Sean Schemmel probably has some kind of hidden talent. Maybe he is an expert at Minesweeper. You're right; calling him "talentless" wasn't fair.
Michsi wrote: ↑Mon Jul 04, 2022 11:29 amIn Super Piccolo got yelled off the stage by Vegeta in the U6 Tournament arc and lost to Jiminy Cricket in the ToP , he deserved 15 new transformations with his theme song played by Metallica in the background.
Lord Beerus wrote:Man, I'm really digging the idea that all the other Hakaishin art plotting against Goku and Universe 7. Little things like that are going to make the dynamic of the battle royal more interesting.
Wrong thread, buddy. I am curious to see if that happens in the manga when the time comes, though.
Lord Beerus wrote:Man, I'm really digging the idea that all the other Hakaishin art plotting against Goku and Universe 7. Little things like that are going to make the dynamic of the battle royal more interesting.
Lord Beerus wrote:Man, I'm really digging the idea that all the other Hakaishin art plotting against Goku and Universe 7. Little things like that are going to make the dynamic of the battle royal more interesting.
Wrong thread, buddy. I am curious to see if that happens in the manga when the time comes, though.
I'm hoping the manga take that route, too. That's why I posted that tidbit here...
You believe me, right?
Freeza9000 wrote:May I quote you in another thread?
Well, I've already taken my comment to main Super thread. If that's where you were heading with this. But if not, go for it.
Spoiler:
Akira Toriyama wrote:My policy is to try and forget things once they’re over. Since if I don’t discard the old and focus on what’s new, I’ll overload my brain capacity. I still haven’t lived down going, “Who the heck is Tao Pai-pai?” that one time I was talking with Ei’ichiro Oda-kun. But the fact that there are still people reading the series after all this time… All I can say is; “thank you.” Really, that’s all.
Akira Toriyama wrote:Drawing Dragon Ball again reminded me of two things--how much I love it, and how much I never want to do it again.
Kunzait_83 wrote:And if you're upset because all this new material completely invalidates the tabletop RPG rulebook-sized statistical system and flowchart for the characters' "canonical Power Levels" that you'd been working on painstakingly for the last bunch of years now... well I don't think there's a kind, non-blunt way of saying this, but that's 100% entirely your own misguided fault for buying so deeply into all this nonsensical garbage in the first place. And that you also have IMMENSELY skewed and comically backwards priorities in what you think is most important and needed to make a good Dragon Ball story.
Zephyr wrote:Goodness, they wrote idiotic drivel in a children's cartoon meant to advertise toys!? Again!? For the ninetieth episode in a row!? Somebody stop the presses! We have to voice our concern over these Super important issues!
Kamiccolo9 wrote:Fair enough, I concede. Sean Schemmel probably has some kind of hidden talent. Maybe he is an expert at Minesweeper. You're right; calling him "talentless" wasn't fair.
Michsi wrote: ↑Mon Jul 04, 2022 11:29 amIn Super Piccolo got yelled off the stage by Vegeta in the U6 Tournament arc and lost to Jiminy Cricket in the ToP , he deserved 15 new transformations with his theme song played by Metallica in the background.
Maybe, just maybe, Kaioshin simply learned Kai-Kai from Kibito? You know, we've seen a few fighters even in the original manga having this mysterious ability to learn new techniques from others.
James Teal (Animerica 1996) wrote:When you think about it, there are a number of similarities between the Chinese-inspired Son Goku and that most American of superhero icons, Superman. Both are aliens sent to Earth shortly after birth to escape the destruction of their homeworlds; both possess super-strength, flight, super-speed, heightened senses and the ability to cast energy blasts. But the crucial difference between them lies not only in how they view the world, but in how the world views them.
Superman is, and always has been, a symbol for truth, justice, and upstanding moral fortitude–a role model and leader as much as a fighter. The more down-to-earth Goku has no illusions about being responsible for maintaining social order, or for setting some kind of moral example for the entire world. Goku is simply a martial artist who’s devoted his life toward perfecting his fighting skills and other abilities. Though never shy about risking his life to save either one person or the entire world, he just doesn’t believe that the balance of the world rests in any way on his shoulders, and he has no need to shape any part of it in his image. Goku is an idealist, and believes that there is some good in everyone, but he is unconcerned with the big picture of the world…unless it has to do with some kind of fight. Politics, society, law and order don’t have much bearing on his life, but he’s a man who knows right from wrong.
