"Dragon Ball Super (Manga)" Official Discussion Thread

Discussion specifically regarding the "Dragon Ball Super" TV series premiering July 2015 in Japan, including individual threads for each episode.

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Re: "Dragon Ball Super (Manga)" Official Discussion Thread

Post by Exline » Tue May 22, 2018 11:13 am

Meshack wrote:Fans: THE ANIMATED VERSION DOESNT FEEL LIKE ITS A BATTLE ROYALE OF 80 PEOPLE

Also Fans: GOKOU AND HIS FRIENDS ARE DOING EVERYTHING

Toyotarou: I’m making it feel like a battle royale and give other characters their time to shine in the comic

Fans: GOKOU AND HIS FRIENDS ARENT GETTING ENOUGH PANELS

Also Fans: PEOPLE ARE LOSING TOO QUICK

C’mon people. What do you want?
Except he's not properly giving characters their time to shine. He's making their involvement quite underwhelming. Not saying I'm against the elimination of 18 and Piccolo, but the way them and other characters were handled was very poorly.

[spoiler]And sigh when no one wants to read your alternate take on events ;([/spoiler]

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Re: "Dragon Ball Super (Manga)" Official Discussion Thread

Post by Meshack » Tue May 22, 2018 11:19 am

Doctor. wrote:
Meshack wrote:Kohei Horikoshi, the creator of the comic My Hero Academia. A lot of things in there is basically from other comics.

How do you punish him?
You mean in terms of story or in terms of art? Because MHA doesn't copy any book's story. If it plagiarizes art, then I don't know, but that's a big problem in itself.

Not up to me to decide.
He copies both. Literally Ochaco and Hinata had the same story arc during the first tournament arc that every battle comic has nowadays. Kota is basically the same kid as Inari and so many other things. Spider-Man and Venom and Deku and Muscular are in the SAME pose on their comic book covers (except Deku isn't grabbing Muscular's tongue).

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Re: "Dragon Ball Super (Manga)" Official Discussion Thread

Post by Doctor. » Tue May 22, 2018 11:20 am

Meshack wrote:He copies both. Literally Ochaco and Hinata had the same story arc during the first tournament arc that every battle comic has nowadays. Kota is basically the same kid as Inari and so many other things. Spider-Man and Venom and Deku and Muscular are in the SAME pose on their comic book covers (except Deku isn't grabbing Muscular's tongue).
I disagree, but even if you were right, two wrongs don't make a right again. I'm not here to defend other manga artists.

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Re: "Dragon Ball Super (Manga)" Official Discussion Thread

Post by OLKv3 » Tue May 22, 2018 11:30 am

Can you post any images of this Meshack?

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Re: "Dragon Ball Super (Manga)" Official Discussion Thread

Post by Marlowe89 » Tue May 22, 2018 11:34 am

Yeah, I can't defend something like this. Very disappointed in Toyotaro.

Ideally, I'd hope the powers that be at Shueisha don't give him anything more than a slap on the wrist and he learns from it. Obviously that's completely up to them, though.

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Re: "Dragon Ball Super (Manga)" Official Discussion Thread

Post by Doctor. » Tue May 22, 2018 11:35 am

OLKv3 wrote:Can you post any images of this Meshack?
He's talking about this:

[spoiler]Image[/spoiler]

Which is clearly an homage, since the lines don't overlap and the poses aren't even the same; only the angle is.

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Re: "Dragon Ball Super (Manga)" Official Discussion Thread

Post by OLKv3 » Tue May 22, 2018 11:44 am

Doctor. wrote:
OLKv3 wrote:Can you post any images of this Meshack?
He's talking about this:

[spoiler]Image[/spoiler]

Which is clearly an homage, since the lines don't overlap and the poses aren't even the same; only the angle is.
Yeah that's definitely a homage, not even remotely similar to Toyotaro's trace lol

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Re: "Dragon Ball Super (Manga)" Official Discussion Thread

Post by prince212 » Tue May 22, 2018 11:48 am

How you guys interpreted heles saying to Beerus “ that planet is an exception “ talking about not all her universe is beauty ?
It was as if a whole lot of people ...were screaming in pain....

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Re: "Dragon Ball Super (Manga)" Official Discussion Thread

Post by LightBing » Tue May 22, 2018 11:50 am

Yeah that goes far beyond an homage it's straight up a copy. Not cool Toyotarõ. Wonder about consequences if there's any.
prince212 wrote:How you guys interpreted heles saying to Beerus “ that planet is an exception “ talking about not all her universe is beauty ?
That that planet has a unique take on what's beautiful compared to the norm.

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Re: "Dragon Ball Super (Manga)" Official Discussion Thread

Post by OLKv3 » Tue May 22, 2018 11:50 am

prince212 wrote:How you guys interpreted heles saying to Beerus “ that planet is an exception “ talking about not all her universe is beauty ?
I took it as her saying only Ribrianne's planet has beings more beautiful than her

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Re: "Dragon Ball Super (Manga)" Official Discussion Thread

Post by prince212 » Tue May 22, 2018 12:00 pm

OLKv3 wrote:
prince212 wrote:How you guys interpreted heles saying to Beerus “ that planet is an exception “ talking about not all her universe is beauty ?
I took it as her saying only Ribrianne's planet has beings more beautiful than her
Ok , so I guess heles is talking about Ribriannes planet like the beauty people planet with lots of not that beauty planets instead of just one planet being not beauty .
At some point I thought that Beerus was calling heles planet ugly
It’s hard to interpretate, I guess translation doesn’t help
It was as if a whole lot of people ...were screaming in pain....

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Re: "Dragon Ball Super (Manga)" Official Discussion Thread

Post by Weejus » Tue May 22, 2018 12:10 pm

After all these months of waiting (with expectations pretty low), Toyotaro still manages to butcher Ribrianne, turning her from a chipper, gimmicky, love-fixated fighter into a spiteful, vain joke. People are only going to hate Ribrianne even more as a result of this (I can kiss that SH Figuarts Ribrianne goodbye). I'm not even mad that she got yeeted out of the arena by that invisible guy or whatever. It's clear Toyotaro is trying to burn through everyone that isn't Goku or Jiren as fast as possible to get to the main event and get this trainwreck of an arc over with.

I don't even think resident Ribrianne worshipper @CJStriker_CBR could defend this trash.

Since the one thing I was interested in within the manga has been ruined, GG, my friends. I'm out.

(I do realise this is probably going to be perceived as a mouth-frothingly enraged overreaction on my part, but I dunno, man. I just liked Ribrianne, and really did not like this chapter.)
Last edited by Weejus on Tue May 22, 2018 12:14 pm, edited 2 times in total.

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Re: "Dragon Ball Super (Manga)" Official Discussion Thread

Post by Omniboy » Tue May 22, 2018 12:12 pm

prince212 wrote:
OLKv3 wrote:
prince212 wrote:How you guys interpreted heles saying to Beerus “ that planet is an exception “ talking about not all her universe is beauty ?
I took it as her saying only Ribrianne's planet has beings more beautiful than her
Ok , so I guess heles is talking about Ribriannes planet like the beauty people planet with lots of not that beauty planets instead of just one planet being not beauty .
At some point I thought that Beerus was calling heles planet ugly
It’s hard to interpretate, I guess translation doesn’t help
Actually that's not what it means. Fat and chubby is seen as attractive in Ribrianne's planet, as opposed to the rest of the universe where slender is seen as beautiful. Krillin is a short noseless bald guy, yet in Ribranne's world he would be seen as handsome. Her planet just has opposite beauty standards. What's unattractive to us, is attractive in Ribrianne's planet. Heles would be seen as ugly in Ribriannes world but beautiful to the rest of the universe, hence the "that planet is an exception."

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Re: "Dragon Ball Super (Manga)" Official Discussion Thread

Post by Doctor. » Tue May 22, 2018 12:14 pm

Weejus wrote:into a spiteful, vain joke.
That's already what she was.

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Re: "Dragon Ball Super (Manga)" Official Discussion Thread

Post by Weejus » Tue May 22, 2018 12:15 pm

Doctor. wrote:
Weejus wrote:into a spiteful, vain joke.
That's already what she was.
Joke? Yes. Vain? Not nearly as much in the anime. Spiteful? Not in the anime at all.

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Re: "Dragon Ball Super (Manga)" Official Discussion Thread

Post by Omniboy » Tue May 22, 2018 12:16 pm

Weejus wrote:After all these months of waiting (with expectations pretty low), Toyotaro still manages to butcher Ribrianne, turning her from a chipper, gimmicky, love-fixated fighter into a spiteful, vain joke.
What do you mean by this?

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Re: "Dragon Ball Super (Manga)" Official Discussion Thread

Post by RedHeat » Tue May 22, 2018 12:17 pm

The original artist behind that Captain America panel responded. Basically, he said he's "flattered" but he doesn't know much about legal things so he doesn't know how to proceed.
Feels over Reals.

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Re: "Dragon Ball Super (Manga)" Official Discussion Thread

Post by prince212 » Tue May 22, 2018 12:25 pm

Omniboy wrote:
prince212 wrote:
OLKv3 wrote: I took it as her saying only Ribrianne's planet has beings more beautiful than her
Ok , so I guess heles is talking about Ribriannes planet like the beauty people planet with lots of not that beauty planets instead of just one planet being not beauty .
At some point I thought that Beerus was calling heles planet ugly
It’s hard to interpretate, I guess translation doesn’t help
Actually that's not what it means. Fat and chubby is seen as attractive in Ribrianne's planet, as opposed to the rest of the universe where slender is seen as beautiful. Krillin is a short noseless bald guy, yet in Ribranne's world he would be seen as handsome. Her planet just has opposite beauty standards. What's unattractive to us, is attractive in Ribrianne's planet. Heles would be seen as ugly in Ribriannes world but beautiful to the rest of the universe, hence the "that planet is an exception."
Those two slim girls that accompanied riabrianne agreed about her beauty canon, one of them said that kuririn looks are beyond perfection, and they don’t seem to be from Ribriannes planet .
It was as if a whole lot of people ...were screaming in pain....

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Re: "Dragon Ball Super (Manga)" Official Discussion Thread

Post by Weejus » Tue May 22, 2018 12:33 pm

Omniboy wrote:
Weejus wrote:After all these months of waiting (with expectations pretty low), Toyotaro still manages to butcher Ribrianne, turning her from a chipper, gimmicky, love-fixated fighter into a spiteful, vain joke.
What do you mean by this?
It has been a while since I watched the anime, but I distinctly remember Ribrianne's personality focusing more on being gaudy rather than openly malicious. Yes, Ribrianne chastises Kuririn in the anime for his 'unattractive' appearance. Ribrianne and her crew in the anime don't show that much cockiness (outside of a few moments), but in the manga, their entire personalities boil down to 'overconfident and judgemental', which, in my eyes, is not what Ribrianne is about. Perhaps Toyotaro's intent was to make them seem more villainous, and made them into typical Saturday morning cartoon-esque joke antagonists, but without the chance to let any kind of humour breathe and give life to her character. Even just by looking at Ribrianne's facial expressions in the manga, she is almost always angry or pained, a far cry from the goofy, energetic character we saw in the anime. I also dislike how Rozie and Kakunsa were devolved into being Ribrianne's self esteem squad (I'm getting real Dr. Robotnik/Scratch and Grounder or Team Rocket vibes from this). I also dislike the change in relationship between Ribrianne and Heles, as well as between Ribrianne's planet and the rest of Universe 2. Part of what made Universe 2 memorable in the anime was the genuine sense of community not just the U2 team, but the universe as a whole. You got the sense that they cared about each other, that they were all friends. Heles' brief conversation with Beerus implies that Heles is (to any extent) ashamed of Ribrianne and/or her planet, and begrudgingly invited her to participate in the tournament. Condensing Ribrianne's role into just one chapter removed her already brief character arc that she had in the anime, which also helped her to stand out against a sea of fodder characters that we will likely never hear from again. Even Ribrianne's moves in the manga lack that comical, eccentric quality the ones in the anime had, instead doubling down on beauty puns while not having any real visual substance. There's probably more, but this is all I can think of for now.

Also, can someone somewhere please teach Toyotaro how to draw the female form? The man does not understand how breasts work.
Last edited by Weejus on Tue May 22, 2018 12:35 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: "Dragon Ball Super (Manga)" Official Discussion Thread

Post by Marlowe89 » Tue May 22, 2018 12:34 pm

LightBing wrote:Yeah that goes far beyond an homage it's straight up a copy.
Not quite a 100% copy. People have overlayed the two images to show that it's not perfectly one-to-one, but certain proportions and body parts (like the hand) are suspect.

However, the hand itself was also changed for the final image used in the V-JUMP cover; people were comparing Toyotaro's preliminary sketch posted on Twitter and the Captain America image. I don't see him getting fired for this, but anything's possible.

Personally, regardless of whether it's considered a reference or trace, it's not something I would condone at all. He's the official artist for an official manga serialization of one of the biggest entertainment franchises in Japan. He should be above that.
Last edited by Marlowe89 on Tue May 22, 2018 12:36 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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