Dragon Ball Super Strength Discussion Thread
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Re: Official Unofficial "Dragon Ball Super" Power Level Discussion Thread
"This is Black's version of Super Saiyan" and "this is Black as a Super Saiyan" are not exactly the same thing. I think the person who translated it might clarify that, but I can tell the description is about a different Super Saiyan, not about the regular one with golden hair or its power.
Re: Official Unofficial "Dragon Ball Super" Power Level Discussion Thread
If Super Saiyan Rose looked just like a Super Saiyan but with pink hair then I'd be more willing to believe it as Black also has a different colour aura and Kamehameha to Goku.
But it has the exact same aura as Super Saiyan Blue. It's clearly a pink equivalent to Super Saiyan Blue. With Toriyama's comments and the manga making it abundantly clear that Super Saiyan and Super Saiyan Rose are two different things then that should have precedence over some debatable dialogue in a promotional magazine that was written by god knows who.
But it has the exact same aura as Super Saiyan Blue. It's clearly a pink equivalent to Super Saiyan Blue. With Toriyama's comments and the manga making it abundantly clear that Super Saiyan and Super Saiyan Rose are two different things then that should have precedence over some debatable dialogue in a promotional magazine that was written by god knows who.
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Re: Official Unofficial "Dragon Ball Super" Power Level Discussion Thread
It can't possibly be SSJ anyway since SSJ has a 50x multiplier and if Black became 50x stronger he wouldn't even need Zamasu.Bullza wrote:If Super Saiyan Rose looked just like a Super Saiyan but with pink hair then I'd be more willing to believe it as Black also has a different colour aura and Kamehameha to Goku.
But it has the exact same aura as Super Saiyan Blue. It's clearly a pink equivalent to Super Saiyan Blue. With Toriyama's comments and the manga making it abundantly clear that Super Saiyan and Super Saiyan Rose are two different things then that should have precedence over some debatable dialogue in a promotional magazine that was written by god knows who.
Re: Official Unofficial "Dragon Ball Super" Power Level Discussion Thread
This is what I mean. The confusion come is that people forget that Super Saiyan God Super Saiyan is just Super Saiyan with god ki. It isn't a unique transformation and Toriyama clarified that holds true for all versions Super Saiyan since Super Saiyan 2 is literally just called Super Saiyan by everyone outside of Goku.Hugo Boss wrote:"This is Black's version of Super Saiyan" and "this is Black as a Super Saiyan" are not exactly the same thing. I think the person who translated it might clarify that, but I can tell the description is about a different Super Saiyan, not about the regular one with golden hair or its power.
What do you mean not needing Zamasu?TheUltimateNinja wrote:It can't possibly be SSJ anyway since SSJ has a 50x multiplier and if Black became 50x stronger he wouldn't even need Zamasu.Bullza wrote:If Super Saiyan Rose looked just like a Super Saiyan but with pink hair then I'd be more willing to believe it as Black also has a different colour aura and Kamehameha to Goku.
But it has the exact same aura as Super Saiyan Blue. It's clearly a pink equivalent to Super Saiyan Blue. With Toriyama's comments and the manga making it abundantly clear that Super Saiyan and Super Saiyan Rose are two different things then that should have precedence over some debatable dialogue in a promotional magazine that was written by god knows who.
Kanassa wrote:Goku barely took a backseat in the Buu saga, at best he took a leisurely stroll round back while everyone else cried for him to come back.precita wrote:Goku will still be around but take a Buu saga approach backseat.
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Re: Official Unofficial "Dragon Ball Super" Power Level Discussion Thread
He needed Future Zamasu to distract the heroes, if SSRose was a 50x multiplier he would easily oneshot the heroes on his own.HeroR wrote: What do you mean not needing Zamasu?
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Re: Official Unofficial "Dragon Ball Super" Power Level Discussion Thread
So how does that work?HeroR wrote:
This is what I mean. The confusion come is that people forget that Super Saiyan God Super Saiyan is just Super Saiyan with god ki. It isn't a unique transformation
SS Grants a fixed amount of boost, he can still use SS and gets the boost, but when he becomes SS using god ki, he is suddenly getting a waay bigger boost than SS should ever give, how?
Is godly ki just really potent, if so did dende get stronger when he received god ki..
If so could the same insane boost be granted by humans when they power up but using god ki, which at this point is basically keeping your ki inside
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Re: Official Unofficial "Dragon Ball Super" Power Level Discussion Thread
Dende doesn't have God ki since he can be sensed. Being a God doesn't mean you get God ki.Ki Breaker wrote:So how does that work?HeroR wrote:
This is what I mean. The confusion come is that people forget that Super Saiyan God Super Saiyan is just Super Saiyan with god ki. It isn't a unique transformation
SS Grants a fixed amount of boost, he can still use SS and gets the boost, but when he becomes SS using god ki, he is suddenly getting a waay bigger boost than SS should ever give, how?
Is godly ki just really potent, if so did dende get stronger when he received god ki..
If so could the same insane boost be granted by humans when they power up but using god ki, which at this point is basically keeping your ki inside
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Re: Official Unofficial "Dragon Ball Super" Power Level Discussion Thread
Really? I was totally sure he does have both, he could also sense berrus so he is at least familiar with god ki, he isn't too powerful which apparently also helps in sensing gods, hit and freeza proved it..TheUltimateNinja wrote:Dende doesn't have God ki since he can be sensed. Being a God doesn't mean you get God ki.Ki Breaker wrote:So how does that work?HeroR wrote:
This is what I mean. The confusion come is that people forget that Super Saiyan God Super Saiyan is just Super Saiyan with god ki. It isn't a unique transformation
SS Grants a fixed amount of boost, he can still use SS and gets the boost, but when he becomes SS using god ki, he is suddenly getting a waay bigger boost than SS should ever give, how?
Is godly ki just really potent, if so did dende get stronger when he received god ki..
If so could the same insane boost be granted by humans when they power up but using god ki, which at this point is basically keeping your ki inside
Can Someone confirm if dende has some god ki or not?
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Re: Official Unofficial "Dragon Ball Super" Power Level Discussion Thread
We already know he doesn't since he can be sensed by mortals.Ki Breaker wrote:Really? I was totally sure he does have both, he could also sense berrus so he is at least familiar with god ki, he isn't too powerful which apparently also helps in sensing gods, hit and freeza proved it..TheUltimateNinja wrote:Dende doesn't have God ki since he can be sensed. Being a God doesn't mean you get God ki.Ki Breaker wrote: So how does that work?
SS Grants a fixed amount of boost, he can still use SS and gets the boost, but when he becomes SS using god ki, he is suddenly getting a waay bigger boost than SS should ever give, how?
Is godly ki just really potent, if so did dende get stronger when he received god ki..
If so could the same insane boost be granted by humans when they power up but using god ki, which at this point is basically keeping your ki inside
Can Someone confirm if dende has some god ki or not?
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Re: Official Unofficial "Dragon Ball Super" Power Level Discussion Thread
Even Kaio doesn't seem to have God Ki, since Goku was able to teleport to him.
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Re: Official Unofficial "Dragon Ball Super" Power Level Discussion Thread
So even now the Super Saiyan Blue multiplier is completely unknown isn't it? In both the anime and manga there's nothing to go on except it's an unknown amount stronger than Super Saiyan 3.
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Re: Official Unofficial "Dragon Ball Super" Power Level Discussion Thread
Yup, that much is apparent. Also doesn't help that the Manga is way different than the Anime in the interpretation of the God forms.Bullza wrote:So even now the Super Saiyan Blue multiplier is completely unknown isn't it? In both the anime and manga there's nothing to go on except it's an unknown amount stronger than Super Saiyan 3.
Jinzoningen MULE wrote:You're in the DB community, it's always a power level thread to someone.
Re: Official Unofficial "Dragon Ball Super" Power Level Discussion Thread
He didn't need Zamasu to distract the heroes. He just had no problem with Zamasu helping him since they were a team.TheUltimateNinja wrote:He needed Future Zamasu to distract the heroes, if SSRose was a 50x multiplier he would easily oneshot the heroes on his own.HeroR wrote: What do you mean not needing Zamasu?
Kanassa wrote:Goku barely took a backseat in the Buu saga, at best he took a leisurely stroll round back while everyone else cried for him to come back.precita wrote:Goku will still be around but take a Buu saga approach backseat.
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Re: Official Unofficial "Dragon Ball Super" Power Level Discussion Thread
Okay, so what I've seen from the leaks is that Goku Black got a zenkai and a huge one. Because he kicks SSJB Vegeta's ass as a SSJ. And yes, Super Saiyan Rose does make its debut in the manga and Goku Black wastes Vegeta with it. The gap between SSJR and SSJB just got enormous.
EDIT: It's also strongly implied that Goku Black jobbed out on purpose to get the zenkai.
EDIT: It's also strongly implied that Goku Black jobbed out on purpose to get the zenkai.
Spoiler:
Re: Official Unofficial "Dragon Ball Super" Power Level Discussion Thread
Do we know for sure if he got a zenkai boost or was he just fooling around the entire time before? If it was the latter it's clear up the confusion of the last chapter.
If it's the former then I'm surprised that Black would have got a zenkai boost. I would have sworn that was a Toei thing because of how little sense it made. Why did nobody else get a zenkai boost?
Black and Trunks apparently fought multiple times so if they'd said Trunks received these zenkai boosts then it could have easily have explained why he was so strong, at least for the anime because in the manga he just said he trained.
It still definitely looks like Super Saiyan 2 Black to me, I don't recall ever seeing so many sparks drawn around a Super Saiyan.
Edit: Herms said this
"Zamasu guesses that when gods surpass Super Saiyan God they become pink rather than blue"
What does that mean? Doesn't blue already surpass Super Saiyan God?
If it's the former then I'm surprised that Black would have got a zenkai boost. I would have sworn that was a Toei thing because of how little sense it made. Why did nobody else get a zenkai boost?
Black and Trunks apparently fought multiple times so if they'd said Trunks received these zenkai boosts then it could have easily have explained why he was so strong, at least for the anime because in the manga he just said he trained.
It still definitely looks like Super Saiyan 2 Black to me, I don't recall ever seeing so many sparks drawn around a Super Saiyan.
Edit: Herms said this
"Zamasu guesses that when gods surpass Super Saiyan God they become pink rather than blue"
What does that mean? Doesn't blue already surpass Super Saiyan God?
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Re: Official Unofficial "Dragon Ball Super" Power Level Discussion Thread
Black was clearly stuck in Chapter 19. He was annoyed several times, asked how Vegeta was so strong (to beat him in SSJ2) in the fight and Zamasu says that he almost did not die.
Of course he fought in earnest
Of course he fought in earnest
Re: Official Unofficial "Dragon Ball Super" Power Level Discussion Thread
It means when a god is in a saiyan's body and turns SSGSS they're pink rather than blue, as we've long speculated.Bullza wrote:Edit: Herms said this
"Zamasu guesses that when gods surpass Super Saiyan God they become pink rather than blue"
What does that mean? Doesn't blue already surpass Super Saiyan God?
I don't see anything to imply there's a gap. Just because SSR Black is stronger than SSB Vegeta doesn't mean SSR's multiplier is higher. As you pointed out, he was winning even as SS which means his base is just that much higher.Lord Beerus wrote:Okay, so what I've seen from the leaks is that Goku Black got a zenkai and a huge one. Because he kicks SSJB Vegeta's ass as a SSJ. And yes, Super Saiyan Rose does make its debut in the manga and Goku Black wastes Vegeta with it. The gap between SSJR and SSJB just got enormous.
Re: Official Unofficial "Dragon Ball Super" Power Level Discussion Thread
I've done plenty of ranking for the anime version but I don't think I've ever done it for the manga so here's my attempt at doing so. It's pretty straightforward compared to the anime.
Zeno Tier
Zeno
High God Tier
Grand Priest
Vados
Whis
Beerus
Champa
Low God Tier
Super Saiyan Rose Black (Post Zenkai)
Super Saiyan Black (Post-Zenkai)
Super Saiyan Blue Goku/Vegeta
Golden Frieza
Hit
Super Saiyan God Goku
Golden Frieza
Buu Saga Tier
Super Saiyan 2 Vegeta
Super Saiyan Black (Pre Zenkai)
Mystic Gohan
Super Saiyan 3 Gotenks
Base Black (Pre Zenkai)
Super Saiyan 3 Goku/Super Saiyan 2 Trunks
Super Saiyan Trunks
Majin Buu
Super Saiyan 2 Goku
Cell Saga Tier
Hit (Suppressed)
Super Saiyan Goku/Vegeta
Super Saiyan Cabba
Magetta
Zamasu
Frost (Final Form)
Piccolo
Frieza Saga Tier
Base Trunks
Base Goku/Vegeta
Base Cabba
Frost (Third Form)
Frost (First Form)
Botamo
Maybe Golden Frieza could be one higher or one lower. Zamasu could easily be higher as I just placed him where I feel Supreme Kai would be. Otherwise I think that's about right.
Zeno Tier
Zeno
High God Tier
Grand Priest
Vados
Whis
Beerus
Champa
Low God Tier
Super Saiyan Rose Black (Post Zenkai)
Super Saiyan Black (Post-Zenkai)
Super Saiyan Blue Goku/Vegeta
Golden Frieza
Hit
Super Saiyan God Goku
Golden Frieza
Buu Saga Tier
Super Saiyan 2 Vegeta
Super Saiyan Black (Pre Zenkai)
Mystic Gohan
Super Saiyan 3 Gotenks
Base Black (Pre Zenkai)
Super Saiyan 3 Goku/Super Saiyan 2 Trunks
Super Saiyan Trunks
Majin Buu
Super Saiyan 2 Goku
Cell Saga Tier
Hit (Suppressed)
Super Saiyan Goku/Vegeta
Super Saiyan Cabba
Magetta
Zamasu
Frost (Final Form)
Piccolo
Frieza Saga Tier
Base Trunks
Base Goku/Vegeta
Base Cabba
Frost (Third Form)
Frost (First Form)
Botamo
Maybe Golden Frieza could be one higher or one lower. Zamasu could easily be higher as I just placed him where I feel Supreme Kai would be. Otherwise I think that's about right.
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Re: Official Unofficial "Dragon Ball Super" Power Level Discussion Thread
This is not to say absolutely nothing. It has been said that the SSGSS form of gods is pink not blue, ie this form of Black is the same thing as SSB but Rose, Power Up is the same.Okay, so what I've seen from the leaks is that Goku Black got a zenkai and a huge one. Because he kicks SSJB Vegeta's ass as a SSJ. And yes, Super Saiyan Rose does make its debut in the manga and Goku Black wastes Vegeta with it. The gap between SSJR and SSJB just got enormous.
What is your anime rank in the current episode?I've done plenty of ranking for the anime version but I don't think I've ever done it for the manga so here's my attempt at doing so. It's pretty straightforward compared to the anime.
____
My Rank in the anime is:
Zeno
Daishinkan
Whis / Vados
Beerus
Champa
Vegito SSGSS
Merged Zamasu
Goku (Kaioken)
Vegeta (SSGSS) / Hit
Black
Trunks
Golden Freeza
Zamasu
Re: Official Unofficial "Dragon Ball Super" Power Level Discussion Thread
My thoughts too. Black didn't jobber on purpose. Vegeta kicked his ass and he was lucking that Future Zamasu was able to heal him. If this was planned, he would have taking his licks more gracefully.TheSaiyanGod wrote:Black was clearly stuck in Chapter 19. He was annoyed several times, asked how Vegeta was so strong (to beat him in SSJ2) in the fight and Zamasu says that he almost did not die.
Of course he fought in earnest
Kanassa wrote:Goku barely took a backseat in the Buu saga, at best he took a leisurely stroll round back while everyone else cried for him to come back.precita wrote:Goku will still be around but take a Buu saga approach backseat.