"Dragon Ball Super" FUNimation Dub Official Discussion Thread

[Ajay]

I might even say they blew the original away - I was that impressed.

For realsies?

Is it really so hard to believe?

[Baggie_Saiyan]

I might even say they blew the original away - I was that impressed.

For realsies?

The majority of the Japanese cast are aged, the English cast are in their prime and able to not only benefit from hearing the Japanese cast but to see episodes fully done on the whole. I've said it before the dub has potential to surpass the original so I wouldn't be too surprised if more and more examples of this keep popping up.

And tbh knowing the JPN cast don't have the benefits of what the dub cast have it's still pretty impressive that the JPN cast are as good as they are, so it is no disrespect to them at all.

[Noah]

Yes, it is disrespect as these are just your nostalgia ticks tingling, the original is always better no matter what. (Okay ignoring King Kai/Narrator bad performance in the first episodes)

[Ajay]

Yes, it is disrespect as these are just your nostalgia ticks tingling, the original is always better no matter what. (Okay ignoring King Kai/Narrator bad performance in the first episodes)

Nonsense.

I didn't grow up with this cast, so there's no nostalgia here.

The original language is not infallible simply because it's the original. That's a very silly perspective to take.

There's no disrespect. The Japanese cast are my preference, but I'm not going to deny Funimation the praise they deserve for this particular episode.

[Noah]

I didn't grow up with this cast, so there's no nostalgia here.

The original language is not infallible simply because it's the original. That's a very silly perspective to take.

There's no disrespect. The Japanese cast are my preference, but I'm not going to deny Funimation the praise they deserve for this particular episode.

That was directed to Baggie_Saiyan but since you answered: you could say the same about a movie with american actors dubbed in a foreigh lauguage, people in this country would praise the good work of the voice actors but most would prefer the original voices with subs. Even if you say "but we're talking about anime" the same applies since we're comparing a original cast with a dub.

[Baggie_Saiyan]

Yes, it is disrespect as these are just your nostalgia ticks tingling, the original is always better no matter what. (Okay ignoring King Kai/Narrator bad performance in the first episodes)

What? Did you even read the reasons why I gave? None of what I gave were anything remotely close to "nostalgia". Nozawa is 80 almost double the age of Schemmel, she has to record from unfinished episodes and has no guidance (other then from the director), Schemmel has her performance (as well as a director) as a guidance as well as access to not only finished episodes but entire arcs and in some cases even finalised Blu-ray footage! It is really not hard to believe that they can top the JPN cast.

Edit-

I didn't grow up with this cast, so there's no nostalgia here.

The original language is not infallible simply because it's the original. That's a very silly perspective to take.

There's no disrespect. The Japanese cast are my preference, but I'm not going to deny Funimation the praise they deserve for this particular episode.

That was directed to Baggie_Saiyan but since you answered: you could say the same about a movie with american actors dubbed in a foreigh lauguage, people in this country would praise the good work of the voice actors but most would prefer the original voices with subs. Even if you say "but we're talking about anime" the same applies since we're comparing a original cast with a dub.

It doesn't, live action acting and animation voice acting are completely different it is an non comparison, you cannot compare the dub of say a Japanese dub of Batman v Superman: Dawn of Justice to an English dub of Dragon Ball Super

[Ajay]

That was directed to Baggie_Saiyan but since you answered: you could say the same about a movie with american actors dubbed in a foreigh lauguage, people in this country would praise the good work of the voice actors but most would prefer the original voices with subs. Even if you say "but we're talking about anime" the same applies since we're comparing a original cast with a dub.

You're doing everything in your power to deny my opinion on a single episode. Your argument is so deeply flawed, I'm sorry.

A live action film involves real people -- their performances are one with the image. While it's not impossible that a dub may produce a more convincing performance, there's an unavoidable dissonance that you're fighting between the physical lip movements and the audio coming out of them. That is an inescapable flaw in live action dubbing that generally prevents any sort of comparison even taking place. There's lots of minutia when it comes to mixing a live action dub too, since you need to account for the acoustics of the original's environments. There are so many factors here that make this a totally apples and oranges comparison. It's aimless and it holds no water.

Animation is unique in that the visuals drive the show; the performances are not inseparably connected to the images on screen, especially in Japan where the recording is done after the animation is complete (or at least, nearing completion). You don't have the same audio/visual distractions that live action shows have, nor are you locked into a certain type of voice -- the differences between Nozawa and Schemmel should tell you that much.

The original performance is rightfully placed on a pedestal because it's directed by staff deeply tied to the show's production, and that's great - that's absolutely how it should be. They set the bar, but that bar isn't incapable of being raised by a foreign studio's work. A good cast with a solid director in any country has a chance at pushing out a supreme performance. There's no wiggle room there - that's the beauty of voice work. The original mandates respect, but again, it's not infallible.

In episode 11, I found Schemmel and Douglas' performances far more compelling than Nozawa and Yamadera's. As someone who has rarely if ever felt that way about Dragon Ball's dubs vs the original cast, I was surprised, but I stand by it. Credit where credit is due, they blew that episode out of the water. The script was faithful with few exceptions, the mixing was solid, and the performances were natural and perfectly suited to what the scene required. It avoided almost all of the pitfalls that usually turn me away from dubs as a whole, and I praise them for that.

You're 100% entitled to feel differently, but you absolutely do not get to deny that opinion based on some misguided belief that what the original cast put out is irrefutably perfect.

[ekrolo2]

I've got to side with Ajay here, Schemmel and Douglas were beasts this time around, especially Schemmel during the very end when you've got Goku's internal monolog concerning Beerus' power.

It also doesn't hurt that Schemmel isn't horribly insufferable like Nozawa is in Super voicing Goku. And no, this isn't my saying I hate Nozawa, she's literally good in everything else but Goku in Super, even in the roles I don't feel like she works for such as Bardock.

[Baggie_Saiyan]

Speaking of Douglas the part he impaled Goku, literally gave me goosebumps! That was some frightening delivery. And the Schemmel underwater scene was definitely , he gets Goku now 100%. I genuinely cannot wait to see how they handle some of the even better Dragon Ball Super moments later.

[Freeza9000]

I actually like Schemmel's heartbroken moaning when Goku got impaled by Beerus.

[TheAldella]

"I have a present here for you, I made it myself"

[Asura]

Yes, it is disrespect as these are just your nostalgia ticks tingling, the original is always better no matter what. (Okay ignoring King Kai/Narrator bad performance in the first episodes)

It's rather ironic that you chalk up the compliments on the English dub performance to "nostalgia" yet you state "the original is always better no matter what"

Juuuuust saying.

[Noah]

I'm wasn't trying to change anyone's mind. I just don't see how in any perspective a dub can better than an original cast, either a animation or a movie, you may think different, but for me the original presentation will always prevail even though I give props to FUNImation for their work in the franchise recently.

It's rather ironic that you chalk up the compliments on the English dub performance to "nostalgia" yet you state "the original is always better no matter what"

Juuuuust saying.

Oh you thought so?

I didn't grow with the original dub either, but after having rewatched the whole series in 2013 (including Movies and OVAs) I enjoyed a lot the original voices, but sadly they're aging and probably cannot top their performances in Z anymore.

[GodVegetto91]

Yes, it is disrespect as these are just your nostalgia ticks tingling, the original is always better no matter what. (Okay ignoring King Kai/Narrator bad performance in the first episodes)

This is precisely the kind of typical bullshit stance that has infected the db community throughout the years over the internet!

So just because they're the "Original Cast" ... They're automatically OBJECTIVELY infinitely better!??

It's only your subjective opinion!

[Noah]

So just because they're the "Original Cast" ... They're automatically OBJECTIVELY infinitely better!??

Yes, pardon but I can't see the other way around.

[TheMikado]

I'm quite surprised there aren't more posts about #11.

I've not been massively in love with Super's dub so far -- it's felt a little over the top and some of the script additions seemed unnecessary and verging on parody. Watching Boo Kai's more grounded performances cemented that view pretty well.

This episode, though? Near perfect. Genuinely. Absolutely spectacular performances all around. I might even say they blew the original away - I was that impressed.

#11 was one of my favourite episodes during the original run and my preferred cast already did a good job. Never expected myself to be saying that Funi might have one-upped them.

I'm glad I'm not the only one who feels that way about the dub.. that being said I have no problem with the voice acting itself but I haven't seen the latest episode to make an opinion one way or the other. I've been watching Super and Boo Kai back to back so I'm in same boat where it's a bit jarring to go from one depiction to another. The script changes were subtle but if watching regularly they adding up. I was actually watching in hopes that the dub would fix or correct some of the more questionable dialogue such as Rageta 10% and simply omit it, that didn't happen.. if this episode is specifically good then I'm looking forward to it.

[NintendoBlaze53]

So just because they're the "Original Cast" ... They're automatically OBJECTIVELY infinitely better!??

Yes, pardon but I can't see the other way around.

Don't a fair few users here consider English Kai better then Japanese Kai? Hell if we're talking non Dragon Ball there are a few dubs that are on par if not better then the original. And if the Original is always better, then Dragon Ball's cast is best with no voices, cause the manga was the original, thus it is better. My point is a generic "The original is always better" argument is flawed and in many instances is not true, voice acting included.

[GodVegetto91]

So just because they're the "Original Cast" ... They're automatically OBJECTIVELY infinitely better!??

Yes, pardon but I can't see the other way around.

That's precisely the answer. You subjectively can't see it differently. That still doesn't make it an objective fact. Someone else may well prefer the Dub over the original. There are no rules when it comes to subjective opinions afterall.

[Noah]

Don't a fair few users here consider English Kai better then Japanese Kai? Hell if we're talking non Dragon Ball there are a few dubs that are on par if not better then the original. And if the Original is always better, then Dragon Ball's cast is best with no voices, cause the manga was the original, thus it is better. My point is a generic "The original is always better" argument is flawed and in many instances is not true, voice acting included.

We're mainly talking about the anime here, so don't come with that. I have no problems with the FUNImation dub even in its early days where people used to mock it, I even had a thread of a some scenes that I thought were better there, my point is the dub as a whole is no better than the original, but of course I'm not adressing that as a fact.

[Scsigs]

Forgive me, everyone, for being late to the party. I'll pick up my cup & begin to drink the spiked punch immediately.

Yes, it is disrespectful as these are just your nostalgia ticks tingling, the original is always better no matter what. (Okay ignoring King Kai/Narrator bad performance in the first episodes)

Cowboy Bebop, Fullmetal Alchemist, One Piece. All of these shows are ones I've heard others describe as having English dubs that are just as good, if not better, than the originals.
Even Watanabe says he prefers the English dub Spike Spiegel to the Japanese one and apparently one of the English voice actors claimed Yoko Kanno, series composer, said, "Our Spike, good. Your Spike, sexy!" from what I've read on TV Tropes.
Fullmetal Alchemist, the original, is looked at with such reverence in part thanks to the dub. Chris Sabat even said in his interview with Geekdom101 that it was a dub that happened at just the right time in just the right way.
One Piece's is subjective, as I've cited on this site myself about Colleen's Luffy getting irritating to some.
For bonus points, Miyazaki has even given his praise of the English dub of Ponyo by Disney
I've seen all of these shows & heard their dubs. I am a connoisseur of dubs & only really look up clips of the subs if I feel curious, or wanna see a certain scene. All opinions are subjective, but this is one of the best dub jobs I've seen. For a series that, for the first 2 arcs, could've just been given autopilot performances by its returning actors, I'm glad they're putting all they have into it, even when the first arc is paced really badly in places to pad it out.

That was directed to Baggie_Saiyan but since you answered: you could say the same about a movie with American actors dubbed in a foreign language, people in this country would praise the good work of the voice actors but most would prefer the original voices with subs. Even if you say "but we're talking about anime" the same applies since we're comparing a original cast with a dub.

As stated already, live action dubbing versus anime dubbing are nowhere near comparable. There's a serious disconnect between live mouth movements with another language talking over them & lip flaps with dialogue fit to match them, which is what FUNimation does. The only anime you can try to compare to live action dubbing is Akira, since that film was voice acted first, then the mouths of the characters were animated around their performances. I've seen that film multiple times in English, once with the 80s dub, & a few times with the '01 dub, & it's certainly an experience, let me tell ya. Even with the dialogue written to fit the mouths as best they could, it's clear the Japanese audio's the most fitting. Every other anime with lip flaps, however, it's not that simple.

We're mainly talking about the anime here, so don't come with that. I have no problems with the FUNImation dub even in its early days where people used to mock it, I even had a thread of a some scenes that I thought were better there, my point is the dub as a whole is no better than the original, but of course I'm not addressing that as a fact.

He was mainly coming in with the manga to point out how ridiculous a lot of what you've been saying is. "The original is always better" is kind of a flawed argument in some cases. For instance, remakes. Since we're talking anime, let's go with one. Fullmetal Alchemist: Brotherhood is, for me, better than the original series on this level as a reboot of the original & a remake of the manga. Dragon Ball Z: Kai, even though a recut of Z, is technically a remake. I think this series does a wonderful job in trimming the majority of the fat of Z to give fans & new viewers a much better representation of the manga as well as a faster-paced storyline, which I commend Toei for. I hope other studios follow suit with their long runners, particularly Studio Periot with Naruto & Bleach, should they continue it eventually. Even some consider the Resurrection F arc of Super better than the movie because of that movie's rushed pacing, as well as some of the things it changes for the better. Even some Power Rangers seasons are better then their Sentai source materials in many ways, though that's much less remake as it is adaptation, but they do use a lot of the Sentai stuff in their stories.
Dubs are much the same way. They are, in essence, trying to reproduce the original Japanese version in different languages with their own sets of actors. Most of the time they're good in their own rights, sometimes they're just as good if not better, & sometimes they're terrible. I've seen a lot of dubs over the years & have seen plenty of all 3. Even though I don't doubt the quality of the original language casts, I prefer to watch something in my own language.
It's a good thing you admit you're not saying that mentality is law, because it really can't be 100%. Opinions are subjective &, really, people should understand that others have differing opinions, whether you get why or not. You can question them, or disagree, but accepting they exist is the first thing to do beforehand. I've seen a lot of opinions on the web that I, personally, don't agree with, but I understand they exist.

The original performance is rightfully placed on a pedestal because it's directed by staff deeply tied to the show's production, and that's great - that's absolutely how it should be. They set the bar, but that bar isn't incapable of being raised by a foreign studio's work. A good cast with a solid director in any country has a chance at pushing out a supreme performance. There's no wiggle room there - that's the beauty of voice work. The original mandates respect, but again, it's not infallible.
In episode 11, I found Schemmel and Douglas' performances far more compelling than Nozawa and Yamadera's. As someone who has rarely if ever felt that way about Dragon Ball's dubs vs the original cast, I was surprised, but I stand by it. Credit where credit is due, they blew that episode out of the water. The script was faithful with few exceptions, the mixing was solid, and the performances were natural and perfectly suited to what the scene required. It avoided almost all of the pitfalls that usually turn me away from dubs as a whole, and I praise them for that.

This. This guy gets it. You can commend something about a topic while agreeing with a different viewpoint as well. Most of us don't doubt the quality of the Japanese cast, even though we have our reservations about it, but the English cast deserves their praise when it's called for. It's taken almost 20 years, but Schemmel finally gets the character of Goku 100% & has a handle of how to portray him correctly. His performance matches what he needs to give the role what it needs. Sounding completely badass during the more serious moments & completely hilarious during the more comedic moments, he's been knocking it out of the park so far. His delivery of the more high-pitched moments Goku's had thus far are just utterly hilarious in just the right way. His original performance from Z was, at points, some of the most cringy voice acting I've ever heard. Serviceable, but not great. Decent for an amateur at the time though. With the years of voice work he's gotten in various places, plus getting better scripts & direction, he's finally able to let through a performance worthy of the character. Purists & others may prefer Nozawa, but there's no denying Sean's excellent in his own right. My only hope is that they tweak his Goku Black voice when it gets to that arc, but I'm not too worried. They've most likely heard all of the feedback from Xenoverse 2's DLC launch & have watched the arc, so they'll give Black the voice tone & performance he needs to sound great. I'm betting Sean's also looking forward to really sinking his teeth into the role in the show over the few lines he had to record for the game.