Vegeta doesn't care about surpassing Goku anymore.

[SansrivaaL]

Vegeta now who for some reason wants to be beside Bulma when she gives birth and doesnt want to leave her... like... I'm ok with character development but not this kind of development, this is for end game, for an ending chapter where we see the cast for one final time, this shouldnt happen mid way where theres a tournament coming up with universes at stake.

No, when the universe is at stake is a perfect time for this to come up. Now he has a newborn baby to protect, one that gives him the chance to actually be there for unlike when Bulma was pregnant last time. He has more personal investment in the tournament. In the end game, this wouldn't really matter.

What I'm saying is this isnt in Vegeta's character at all, he's a pure blooded saiyan who for some time now wants to surpass Goku and train with Whis, but for some reason this all goes down the shore because he's been daddy up'd, I would accept this more in an end game character development point of view and not in the actual start of the arc.
I actually think they'll dedicate everything for Bra, she will be the driving force for the team.

[Kanassa]

What I'm saying is this isnt in Vegeta's character at all, he's a pure blooded saiyan who for some time now wants to surpass Goku and train with Whis, but for some reason this all goes down the shore because he's been daddy up'd, I would accept this more in an end game character development point of view and not in the actual start of the arc.

Vegeta wanting to stay with Bulma isn't out of character, this development from what he did in the Cell Saga where he banged, left and then proceeded to give zero shits about the child (Well, until suddenly he cares out of nowhere because they needed an emotional scene). He still wants to fight, but he can put that aside to be there for his new born. I mean, if he isn't there for Bra, she might grow weak like Gohan did!

[SansrivaaL]

What I'm saying is this isnt in Vegeta's character at all, he's a pure blooded saiyan who for some time now wants to surpass Goku and train with Whis, but for some reason this all goes down the shore because he's been daddy up'd, I would accept this more in an end game character development point of view and not in the actual start of the arc.

Vegeta wanting to stay with Bulma isn't out of character, this development from what he did in the Cell Saga where he banged, left and then proceeded to give zero shits about the child (Well, until suddenly he cares out of nowhere because they needed an emotional scene). He still wants to fight, but he can put that aside to be there for his new born. I mean, if he isn't there for Bra, she might grow weak like Gohan did!

This is all I needed to read, well played, well played roasted that. Gotta keep them dibs on the princess of all saiyans Bra before some Gohan stuff starts sprouting out of her.

[TBMx]

Somebody tell me why Vegeta on seeing Goku go SSB Kaiokenx10 hasn't decided to use the dragonballs to wish for his tail back? Is it "pride"? What he's too prideful to regain a piece of lost iconic saiyan anatomy that was his before some fatass with a sword cut it off? Control over Ozaru is Vegeta's ultimate advantage over Goku. That's how he overcame Kaioken the first time. Why wouldn't he want to go Ozaru blue to match Goku's Kaiokenx10? He doesn't even need a moon as he knows how to make an artificial one. The writers don't give him any initiative because their attention is so squarely on Goku.

[SansrivaaL]

Somebody tell me why Vegeta on seeing Goku go SSB Kaiokenx10 hasn't decided to use the dragonballs to wish for his tail back? Is it "pride"? What he's too prideful to regain a piece of lost iconic saiyan anatomy that was his before some fatass with a sword cut it off? Control over Ozaru is Vegeta's ultimate advantage over Goku. That's how he overcome Kaioken the first time. Why wouldn't he want to go Ozaru blue to match Goku's Kaiokenx10? He doesn't even need a moon as he knows how to make an artificial one. The writers don't give him any initiative because their attention is so squarely on Goku.

Because animating tails is so 90's, way too much work. In universe he probably doesnt feel like it. Being that big can have its disadvantages, look at what happened with Bergamo.

[TBMx]

Somebody tell me why Vegeta on seeing Goku go SSB Kaiokenx10 hasn't decided to use the dragonballs to wish for his tail back? Is it "pride"? What he's too prideful to regain a piece of lost iconic saiyan anatomy that was his before some fatass with a sword cut it off? Control over Ozaru is Vegeta's ultimate advantage over Goku. That's how he overcome Kaioken the first time. Why wouldn't he want to go Ozaru blue to match Goku's Kaiokenx10? He doesn't even need a moon as he knows how to make an artificial one. The writers don't give him any initiative because their attention is so squarely on Goku.

Because animating tails is so 90's, way too much work. In universe he probably doesnt feel like it. Being that big can have its disadvantages, look at what happened with Bergamo.

He was actually shown to be very quick in the great ape form in the saiyan saga and in GT, but the alternative is simply being blown away by Goku SSB Kaioken. So not "feeling like it" doesn't make sense.

[Analytical Delusion]

It's probably worth noting that at this point in the manga:

(1) Vegeta is (probably/possibly) presently stronger than Goku in their respective Blue forms.

(2) There has been no usage of kaioken, nor any hints of it being utilized in the future.

[SansrivaaL]

Somebody tell me why Vegeta on seeing Goku go SSB Kaiokenx10 hasn't decided to use the dragonballs to wish for his tail back? Is it "pride"? What he's too prideful to regain a piece of lost iconic saiyan anatomy that was his before some fatass with a sword cut it off? Control over Ozaru is Vegeta's ultimate advantage over Goku. That's how he overcome Kaioken the first time. Why wouldn't he want to go Ozaru blue to match Goku's Kaiokenx10? He doesn't even need a moon as he knows how to make an artificial one. The writers don't give him any initiative because their attention is so squarely on Goku.

Because animating tails is so 90's, way too much work. In universe he probably doesnt feel like it. Being that big can have its disadvantages, look at what happened with Bergamo.

He was actually shown to be very quick in the great ape form in the saiyan saga and in GT, but the alternative is simply being blown away by Goku SSB Kaioken. So not "feeling like it" doesn't make sense.

That was before, being big has its drawbacks, being slow is just 1 small part of it, being big makes you a giant target as well, honestly Bergamo should have given you the idea of what happens to giant people. Piccolo as well.

[TheMathemagician]

Somebody tell me why Vegeta on seeing Goku go SSB Kaiokenx10 hasn't decided to use the dragonballs to wish for his tail back? Is it "pride"? What he's too prideful to regain a piece of lost iconic saiyan anatomy that was his before some fatass with a sword cut it off? Control over Ozaru is Vegeta's ultimate advantage over Goku. That's how he overcame Kaioken the first time. Why wouldn't he want to go Ozaru blue to match Goku's Kaiokenx10? He doesn't even need a moon as he knows how to make an artificial one. The writers don't give him any initiative because their attention is so squarely on Goku.

Doesn't creating the Power Ball and going Oozaru drop your power so you're not actually getting the ten times boost? Goku gonna Goku though.

[TBMx]

Because animating tails is so 90's, way too much work. In universe he probably doesnt feel like it. Being that big can have its disadvantages, look at what happened with Bergamo.

He was actually shown to be very quick in the great ape form in the saiyan saga and in GT, but the alternative is simply being blown away by Goku SSB Kaioken. So not "feeling like it" doesn't make sense.

That was before, being big has its drawbacks, being slow is just 1 small part of it, being big makes you a giant target as well, honestly Bergamo should have given you the idea of what happens to giant people. Piccolo as well.

Again, those are different characters. Just because Giant Wolves and Giant Nameks are slow doesn't mean Ozaru is slow as well. They're different species. Again look at how much trouble Baby Vegeta gave SS4 Goku. Look at how much trouble Vegeta gave Goku in the Saiyan Saga. He wasn't able to just get around him. Saiyans evolved to use the great ape effectively. So based on what we've been shown in Dragonball media so far, I don't see those issues as legitimate concerns.

[sintzu]

There's no feasible way he can catch up.

"We will see" See what ?

Vegeta's not going to match SSB Kaioken.

He never fell behind to begin with.

We won't see it connect to GT, that's for sure.

You're right, he can't match what doesn't exist.

[TBMx]

There's no feasible way he can catch up.

"We will see" See what ?

Vegeta's not going to match SSB Kaioken.

He never fell behind to begin with.

We won't see it connect to GT, that's for sure.

You're right, he can't match what doesn't exist.

SSB Kaioken is canon, it's GT that's non canon. Or rather an alternate timeline now.

[Hugo Boss]

Perhaps Vegeta realized he has reached his limit and that surpassing Goku has no meaningful purpose. Perhaps he is close to the point when his body isn't as youthful as always. I think this isn't necessarily a bad decision to make, it's just shows Vegeta cares about things beyond fighting.

[SansrivaaL]

He was actually shown to be very quick in the great ape form in the saiyan saga and in GT, but the alternative is simply being blown away by Goku SSB Kaioken. So not "feeling like it" doesn't make sense.

That was before, being big has its drawbacks, being slow is just 1 small part of it, being big makes you a giant target as well, honestly Bergamo should have given you the idea of what happens to giant people. Piccolo as well.

Again, those are different characters. Just because Giant Wolves and Giant Nameks are slow doesn't mean Ozaru is slow as well. They're different species. Again look at how much trouble Baby Vegeta gave SS4 Goku. Look at how much trouble Vegeta gave Goku in the Saiyan Saga. He wasn't able to just get around him. Saiyans evolved to use the great ape effectively. So based on what we've been shown in Dragonball media so far, I don't see those issues as legitimate concerns.

Dont bring in GT here, thats non canon. Vegeta was fast, but that doesnt deny the fact that he's a giant target, he's easy to hit being that big, I'm not talking about the race stuff, its about being BIG as the definition itself.

[sintzu]

SSB Kaioken is canon.

It wasn't in Toriyama's outline so it's not.

What was in the manga was that Goku got 10× stronger than Vegeta and that's how Toei explained it while the manga explained it a different way.

We don't even see it used after the tournament except for a second in the Black arc. If it was a Toriyama plot point then it would've been used more.

[TheMathemagician]

SSB Kaioken is canon.

It wasn't in Toriyama's outline so it's not.

What was in the manga was that Goku got 10× stronger than Vegeta and that's how Toei explained it while the manga explained it a different way.

We don't even see it used after the tournament except for a second in the Black arc. If it was a Toriyama plot point then it would've been used more.

Except it is canon though. The anime and manga are both canon. Goku didn't just use SSBKK once after the fight against Hit. He used it literally in the past two episodes. It's canon and yes, Vegeta has been lagging behind since the U6 tournament.

[TBMx]

That was before, being big has its drawbacks, being slow is just 1 small part of it, being big makes you a giant target as well, honestly Bergamo should have given you the idea of what happens to giant people. Piccolo as well.

Again, those are different characters. Just because Giant Wolves and Giant Nameks are slow doesn't mean Ozaru is slow as well. They're different species. Again look at how much trouble Baby Vegeta gave SS4 Goku. Look at how much trouble Vegeta gave Goku in the Saiyan Saga. He wasn't able to just get around him. Saiyans evolved to use the great ape effectively. So based on what we've been shown in Dragonball media so far, I don't see those issues as legitimate concerns.

Dont bring in GT here, thats non canon. Vegeta was fast, but that doesnt deny the fact that he's a giant target, he's easy to hit being that big, I'm not talking about the race stuff, its about being BIG as the definition itself.

GT was made by the same company that's making Super so even non canon it's still relevant. The match between Goku SSB Kaiokenx10 vs Vegeta Ozaru Blue becomes can Vegeta prevent Goku from getting around him and can Goku get it done before he burns out. That's a far more interesting and even match than Goku SSB Kaioken simply blasting Vegeta SSB into Otherworld with ease. Both Kaioken and Ozaru have relative strengths and weaknesses.

To actually counter my point you need to demonstrate how Vegeta stands a better chance just staying in his regular SSB form. Because the idea of him outlasting Goku that way is ludicrous.

[sintzu]

The anime and manga are both canon.

Vegeta has been lagging behind since the U6 tournament.

They're too different to both be canon.

Since the U6 tournament he's been the main character while Goku's been in the background. The only reason he got so much screen time in the anime's version is probably because Toei were too afraid to take him out of the picture like what the manga did which according to Toyotaru, it doesn't change the main plot points that were written by Toriyama.

[SansrivaaL]

Again, those are different characters. Just because Giant Wolves and Giant Nameks are slow doesn't mean Ozaru is slow as well. They're different species. Again look at how much trouble Baby Vegeta gave SS4 Goku. Look at how much trouble Vegeta gave Goku in the Saiyan Saga. He wasn't able to just get around him. Saiyans evolved to use the great ape effectively. So based on what we've been shown in Dragonball media so far, I don't see those issues as legitimate concerns.

Dont bring in GT here, thats non canon. Vegeta was fast, but that doesnt deny the fact that he's a giant target, he's easy to hit being that big, I'm not talking about the race stuff, its about being BIG as the definition itself.

GT was made by the same company that's making Super so even non canon it's still relevant. The match between Goku SSB Kaiokenx10 vs Vegeta Ozaru Blue becomes can Vegeta prevent Goku from getting around him and can Goku get it done before he burns out. That's a far more interesting and even match than Goku SSB Kaioken simply blasting Vegeta SSB into Otherworld with ease. Both Kaioken and Ozaru have relative strengths and weaknesses.

To actually counter my point you need to demonstrate how Vegeta stands a better chance just staying in his regular SSB form. Because the idea of him outlasting Goku that way is ludicrous.

That doesnt matter, the fact that GT is non canon and Super is canon matters, Its not really a match anymore, the reason why Goku had a hard time before was because he was already drained since he used up too much energy, Vegeta going ape or not wouldnt have mattered (king kai said so himself)
There is no countering anything, if they do fight, Goku aint gonna go SSJBKK against SSJB Vegeta, we know how Goku loves a challenge, he wont go that far as to have an easy win against Vegeta, at best he'll pull another SSJ2 Goku V Majin Vegeta where he kept his SSJ3. So your idea of SSJBKK Goku V SSJB Vegeta wont happen in universe, unless you do a fanfic story then simply fanfic Vegeta and give him KK as well.

[TBMx]

That doesnt matter, the fact that GT is non canon and Super is canon matters, Its not really a match anymore, the reason why Goku had a hard time before was because he was already drained since he used up too much energy, Vegeta going ape or not wouldnt have mattered (king kai said so himself)
There is no countering anything, if they do fight, Goku aint gonna go SSJBKK against SSJB Vegeta, we know how Goku loves a challenge, he wont go that far as to have an easy win against Vegeta, at best he'll pull another SSJ2 Goku V Majin Vegeta where he kept his SSJ3. So your idea of SSJBKK Goku V SSJB Vegeta wont happen in universe, unless you do a fanfic story then simply fanfic Vegeta and give him KK as well.

It matters because Toei has always carried over the same biases from GT and appears to be going in a similar direction. But in Dragonball Z, Vegeta's senses, particularly his hearing had increased to the point where even after blinding him Goku had to get distance for the Spirit Bomb instead of engaging up close. Show me the quote where it says Vegeta going great ape wouldn't have mattered.

Vegeta does not fight opponents who sandbag as he regards it as spitting on his honour. You forget that Vegeta was extremely resentful that Goku hid ssj3, and he would not have fought if he knew about it ahead of time. He angrily accused Goku of mocking him. The only reason they fought in the Buu saga was because Vegeta thought he could win against Goku's best.