Zenos & Grand Priest Suspicion

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Zagacious
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Zenos & Grand Priest Suspicion

Post by Zagacious » Thu Jun 22, 2017 5:03 pm

There is just something about the Zenos and Grand Priest that make me extremely suspicious. Their apathy about erasing universes makes them seem almost evil, destruction for literally no purpose. At the same time, it seems like the Zenos have no idea what they're doing or why, and feels like the Grand Priest or someone higher may be the actual one in charge. Is this just a strange decision on how they're made / represented, or do you believe there is some plot related reason they are like this?

It also seems kind of strange that the individual Gods of Destruction and their Angels/Kais are mostly benevolent and reasonable, while the highest level of gods (Grand Priest/Zenos) are just mindlessly destructive and enjoy watching destruction (or at least enjoy watching fighting). What do you think about this? I'm sure the reasons may be revealed toward the end of the tournament, but for now I will be very disappointed if there isn't a reasoning behind making them this way.

I've always said toward the beginning that maybe Zenos is just bluffing that he'll erase the universes so everyone truly gives a 100% effort in the tournament (probably Grand Priest's ideas), and even if that's not true he will most likely be convinced to not erase universes and instead continue doing periodic tournaments in the future.
Another idea I had toward the beginning that Zeno was made as a kind of comedy gag, in the sense that there's this guy who's immeasurably strong(est), but he appears to have very little common sense and act and look like a child (kind of like Goku), and they just kind of went with it and kept Zeno permanently and can't change how he was originally acting for the gag. I kind of understand the comedy of having an infinitely strong god that looks like Zeno, I just hope that's not the only reason he is choosing to erase them. If you are ruler of all universes, wouldn't more universes be preferable to less? I think Grand Priest even said once "Zenos has always said there are too many universes" I feel as though Zenos may be a cover or puppet for the real powerful entity behind it all.

It makes some sense for Zeno to enjoy high level fighting, since there have probably never been tournaments of this magnitude of power and variety before, but at the same time if he is surprised by a lot of it then maybe he is not really omnipotent at all, or at the very least not omnipresent or omniscient. He's also shown to not be completely invulnerable to the effects of time travel, since it effectively copied him.
Last edited by Zagacious on Thu Jun 22, 2017 8:09 pm, edited 11 times in total.

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Dai-Saiyajin
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Re: Zenos & Grand Priest Suspicion

Post by Dai-Saiyajin » Thu Jun 22, 2017 7:04 pm

These kind of questions is what I am expecting to be answered in this ToP and/or in the next saga:

what is the origin of Zeno ?
why he never grow up (both mentally and physically) ?
who created the 12 (18) universes ?
why 6 universes are destroyed ?
where is the other 6 angels from the destroyed universes ?
what is the real objective of Daishinkan and the angels ?
what is the true extent of the powers of both Zeno and Daishinkan ?
where is the Dragon God Zarama ?

Is these kind of questions that I want to be answered in this saga or in the next arc, something that expand the lore.

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Re: Zenos & Grand Priest Suspicion

Post by GodKaio-Ken » Sun Jun 25, 2017 9:44 am

Dai-Saiyajin wrote:These kind of questions is what I am expecting to be answered in this ToP and/or in the next saga:

what is the origin of Zeno ?
why he never grow up (both mentally and physically) ?
who created the 12 (18) universes ?
why 6 universes are destroyed ?
where is the other 6 angels from the destroyed universes ?
what is the real objective of Daishinkan and the angels ?
what is the true extent of the powers of both Zeno and Daishinkan ?
where is the Dragon God Zarama ?

Is these kind of questions that I want to be answered in this saga or in the next arc, something that expand the lore.
1) Good question
2) Because growing up is subjective. Other characters may seem more mature we dont know how smart he is really...also hes the king of all so it doesnt really matter to him.
3) I'm interested in whether Zeno did this or if he also has a creator counterpart.
4) They sort of already told us its because Zeno was in a bad mood. We dont know what caused that mood but they implied it was trivial
5) Also a good question.
6) Well their purpose is to serve Zeno in a sense but I think you mean do they have other motives. Maybe..
Also wondering this.
7) Zeno can pretty much do anything it seems but idk if there is a limit.
8) Doubt they will answer this but maybe.
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Lionel
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Re: Zenos & Grand Priest Suspicion

Post by Lionel » Tue Jun 27, 2017 2:20 pm

Deities in general seem to be relatively detached from the affairs of their allocated regions of creation. You can make note of this mentality existing as early as Dragon Ball when Goku inquired why Popo and Kami didn't bother to quell the Piccolo Daimao menace if they had the power to accomplish it. What was the representative responce to this important question? "We have our reasons". It continues on upwards from there through the four cardinal monarchs, the Grand Kai, Kaioshin, and so on. It should be noted that some deities are more invested in mortal affairs than others. For example, King Kai was personally observing Goku's progress throughout his adventures on Namek. Freeza was a menace whom even a cardinal king in the heavens reviled for his cruelty and power. The fact Goku was a pupil of King Kai's whom he wanted the best for only compounded his paranoia about the situation, and thus his involvement, more.

Threats only garner the attention of the gods if they happen to be of a magnitude that warrants their intervention like Buu, or if the matter happens to involve one of their own like Zamasu. I feel as though it may be safe to conclude Zeno is a primordial entity whose involvement and observation of the multiverse predates most, if not all other gods. His stature and disposition were probably developed as gags originally, like you said -- as well as to reinforce Toriyama's habit of giving intentionally misleading diminutive appearances to characters who are in fact very powerful and dangerous.

With everything that Zeno has experienced, the destruction of any universe probably doesn't phase him in the slightest. People come and go. The only ones who could possibly leave any kind of lasting impression with Zeno are immortals or the abnormally freakish like Goku who stand out from all the dull sycophants that surround the Omni-King.

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Re: Zenos & Grand Priest Suspicion

Post by Zagacious » Tue Jun 27, 2017 3:38 pm

Lionel wrote:Deities in general seem to be relatively detached from the affairs of their allocated regions of creation. You can make note of this mentality existing as early as Dragon Ball when Goku inquired why Popo and Kami didn't bother to quell the Piccolo Daimao menace if they had the power to accomplish it.I feel as though it may be safe to conclude Zeno is a primordial entity whose involvement and observation of the multiverse predates most, if not all other gods. His stature and disposition were probably developed as gags originally, like you said -- as well as to reinforce Toriyama's habit of giving intentionally misleading diminutive appearances to characters who are in fact very powerful and dangerous.

With everything that Zeno has experienced, the destruction of any universe probably doesn't phase him in the slightest. People come and go. The only ones who could possibly leave any kind of lasting impression with Zeno are immortals or the abnormally freakish like Goku who stand out from all the dull sycophants that surround the Omni-King.
Yes I noticed this was kind of the theme of gods to be careless and destructive on a whim, but I think most of it is just there for comedy reasons and also possibly to make the DBS Universe(s) appear darker. Zeno not being phased by the destruction is a lot different than him actually causing the destruction himself and with no actual reasons "Zenos has always said there are too many universes". It's one thing to not interfere with issues that destroy a single planet, but it's way different to actively choose to erase them with no apparent reasons. I hope there is some actual reason later on that we don't know about, such as having too many universes causes unknown cross-universe issues we don't know about yet, because otherwise I'll be kind of disappointed with the Zenos behavior of just "I'm a child I want to destroy things cause there's too many things" looks like of silly.

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