Was a new transformation really necessary for Goku?

[Saturnine]

Beerus was never technically a villain though. He acted as an antagonist in one instance, but that's about it.

[HeroR]

Beerus was never technically a villain though. He acted as an antagonist in one instance, but that's about it.

Threatening to blow up the Earth and ills billions over pudding does make him a villain. He isn't like Hit who was only against U7 because of a tournament.

[majinwarman]

I also think that Ultra Instinct was the first form/ technique that clearly built up in the series. They wanted the viewers to be hyped when it finally happens.

Right. It's not just another new form in the sense of oh just another regular power up.

There definitely is something different about UI I definitely get that feeling amongst the hype for it.

I just wished that we could see more of Ultra Instinct before Super ends.

[Baggie_Saiyan]

I also think that Ultra Instinct was the first form/ technique that clearly built up in the series. They wanted the viewers to be hyped when it finally happens.

Right. It's not just another new form in the sense of oh just another regular power up.

There definitely is something different about UI I definitely get that feeling amongst the hype for it.

I just wished that we could see more of Ultra Instinct before Super ends.

2 episodes are satisfying enough for me as long as it's well animated.

[ZenkaiBoosts]

^ It's crazy how much hype UI was getting, only for Goku to still lose anyway. Great job of making MUI Goku look weak in the end lol

This is 100% going to impact merch sales of MUI Goku IMO, and I hope someone from Toei reads this and realizes why.

Goku never getting a big win in Super is unacceptable.

Somewhere along the way, Toriyama/Toei completely completely lost the plot when it came to MUI Goku vs Jiren.

All this shine for one of the most boring bland characters ever in Dragon Ball in Jiren, at the expense of Goku.

I have to agree with this thread now. What was the point of MUI if Goku was still going to lose anyway? Just awful and disappointing. It is so much worse to give Goku this hyped form and have him still lose, then to just not give him anything

But hey. I'm just not going to watch 130 and 131 anymore. I'm going to show Toei my displeasure with my viewership and wallet

They had a perfect opportunity to make MUI Goku look as badass as SS1 yet dropped the ball massively

Imagine if Goku still lost to Frieza after getting SS1.. yet that's what's happening here for MUI Goku. Totally unacceptable

[majinwarman]

Right. It's not just another new form in the sense of oh just another regular power up.

There definitely is something different about UI I definitely get that feeling amongst the hype for it.

I just wished that we could see more of Ultra Instinct before Super ends.

2 episodes are satisfying enough for me as long as it's well animated.

I just want to see Goku fight Beerus with it before Super ends.

[Lord Frieza]

Necessary no, was going to happen yes.

Really as much as I like the forms, they should have just stuck with Super Saiyan God and called a stop there. Give the form tons of untapped potential and blend it with Kaio-ken and then manga's version of Ultra Instinct, they didn't need nything more after they put the word "GOD" in the title of a form.

[Baggie_Saiyan]

Necessary no, was going to happen yes.

Really as much as I like the forms, they should have just stuck with Super Saiyan God and called a stop there. Give the form tons of untapped potential and blend it with Kaio-ken and then manga's version of Ultra Instinct, they didn't need nything more after they put the word "GOD" in the title of a form.

Seems Toriyama didn't care for it. In it's own movie debut it was pushed aside almost immediately.

Although it made a comeback in the anime the marketing department just seemingly didn't care a shame because I do think SSG is an under appreciated design (still not a fan of the aura mind you). One of the reasons I actually prefer the retelling over the movie.

[Vegeta_Sama]

^ It's crazy how much hype UI was getting, only for Goku to still lose anyway. Great job of making MUI Goku look weak in the end lol

This is 100% going to impact merch sales of MUI Goku IMO, and I hope someone from Toei reads this and realizes why.

Goku never getting a big win in Super is unacceptable.

Somewhere along the way, Toriyama/Toei completely completely lost the plot when it came to MUI Goku vs Jiren.

All this shine for one of the most boring bland characters ever in Dragon Ball in Jiren, at the expense of Goku.

I have to agree with this thread now. What was the point of MUI if Goku was still going to lose anyway? Just awful and disappointing. It is so much worse to give Goku this hyped form and have him still lose, then to just not give him anything

But hey. I'm just not going to watch 130 and 131 anymore. I'm going to show Toei my displeasure with my viewership and wallet

They had a perfect opportunity to make MUI Goku look as badass as SS1 yet dropped the ball massively

Imagine if Goku still lost to Frieza after getting SS1.. yet that's what's happening here for MUI Goku. Totally unacceptable

Bro, forgive me if I say it, but you were talking on these forums about the past couple of episodes like they were the best thing ever ,like they came from God himself, you made thousands of posts, to the point where people were starting to reporter you to the mods, and now you're just gonna drop Super in the final 2 episodes?? With the overwhelming amout of praise you gave to this show throughout this past weeks it just seems childish to stop watching because you don't agree with a narrative decision. I too think it's a bullshit ending, but you're kinda overreacting a bit

[TheShadowEmperor8055]

^ It's crazy how much hype UI was getting, only for Goku to still lose anyway. Great job of making MUI Goku look weak in the end lol

This is 100% going to impact merch sales of MUI Goku IMO, and I hope someone from Toei reads this and realizes why.

Goku never getting a big win in Super is unacceptable.

Somewhere along the way, Toriyama/Toei completely completely lost the plot when it came to MUI Goku vs Jiren.

All this shine for one of the most boring bland characters ever in Dragon Ball in Jiren, at the expense of Goku.

I have to agree with this thread now. What was the point of MUI if Goku was still going to lose anyway? Just awful and disappointing. It is so much worse to give Goku this hyped form and have him still lose, then to just not give him anything

But hey. I'm just not going to watch 130 and 131 anymore. I'm going to show Toei my displeasure with my viewership and wallet

They had a perfect opportunity to make MUI Goku look as badass as SS1 yet dropped the ball massively

Imagine if Goku still lost to Frieza after getting SS1.. yet that's what's happening here for MUI Goku. Totally unacceptable

Bro, forgive me if I say it, but you were talking on these forums about the past couple of episodes like they were the best thing ever ,like they came from God himself, you made thousands of posts, to the point where people were starting to reporter you to the mods, and now you're just gonna drop Super in the final 2 episodes?? With the overwhelming amout of praise you gave to this show throughout this past weeks it just seems childish to stop watching because you don't agree with a narrative decision. I too think it's a bullshit ending, but you're kinda overreacting a bit

IKR? Guess he's a "hater" now

Criticisms aside, not too thrilled with the outcome. This is quite literally SSG all over again, a form that only changes the color of Goku's hair without totally raising it up, and is a form that is the "state of the gods", but only gets a really brief showing and still possibly loses again according to the spoilers. I really don't understand what's wrong with Goku just getting a clean win over a major antagonist without the need of help from some other person because he fucked up.

I'll still wait for the episode before judging it, but it doesn't look good from what the spoilers say.

[lancerman]

I don't really care that he loses. Since the beginning of Dragon Ball the entire concept was that no matter how strong Goku got he found someone who was better so he'd have a reason to push himself more.

He lost to Jackie Chun and realized he still had a ways to go. He lost to Tao, which motivated him to go up Korin tower and train. He lost to King Piccolo and drank the special water. He became the strongest man on the planet.... and then a bunch of aliens showed up... he beat the strongest alien in existence..... and then a mad scientist created even stronger killer robots......he surpassed those limits and an evil majin from a millennium ago returned..... then a god of destruction.... now he's surpassed everything and found a perfect form........ and a stronger guy beat him.

[Thani]

The overreaction over Goku's defeat is beginning to get out of hand, and it's pretty amusing.

Honestly so what if Goku loses? The last thing I wanted was seeing Jiren being fodderized anyway. It would make the GoDs irrelevant, and the awaited rematch of Beerus vs Goku a dead giveaway. I don't mind Jiren losing also, since Goku do deserves a major win, but I fail to see how him losing to Jiren in an epic fight makes the form looks weak, since it fought a guy explicitly stated to be above the GoDs. Or is MUI supposed to be on the level of angels now, or dare I say, of El Grande Padre? C'mon now.

PS: Yay, my first (i think?) post in this site.

[HeroR]

I don't really care that he loses. Since the beginning of Dragon Ball the entire concept was that no matter how strong Goku got he found someone who was better so he'd have a reason to push himself more.

He lost to Jackie Chun and realized he still had a ways to go. He lost to Tao, which motivated him to go up Korin tower and train. He lost to King Piccolo and drank the special water. He became the strongest man on the planet.... and then a bunch of aliens showed up... he beat the strongest alien in existence..... and then a mad scientist created even stronger killer robots......he surpassed those limits and an evil majin from a millennium ago returned..... then a god of destruction.... now he's surpassed everything and found a perfect form........ and a stronger guy beat him.

Goku got stronger even when he had no real reason to like when he beat Piccolo. And we don't even know how Jiren beat him.

The overreaction over Goku's defeat is beginning to get out of hand, and it's pretty amusing.

Honestly so what if Goku loses? The last thing I wanted was seeing Jiren being fodderized anyway. It would make the GoDs irrelevant, and the awaited rematch of Beerus vs Goku a dead giveaway. I don't mind Jiren losing also, since Goku do deserves a major win, but I fail to see how him losing to Jiren in an epic fight makes the form looks weak, since it fought a guy explicitly stated to be above the GoDs. Or is MUI supposed to be on the level of angels now, or dare I say, of El Grande Padre? C'mon now.

PS: Yay, my first (i think?) post in this site.

It really isn't since chances are, Super isn't going to end with Goku vs Beerus.

[Kenneth La Torre]

The overreaction over Goku's defeat is beginning to get out of hand, and it's pretty amusing.

Honestly so what if Goku loses? The last thing I wanted was seeing Jiren being fodderized anyway. It would make the GoDs irrelevant, and the awaited rematch of Beerus vs Goku a dead giveaway. I don't mind Jiren losing also, since Goku do deserves a major win, but I fail to see how him losing to Jiren in an epic fight makes the form looks weak, since it fought a guy explicitly stated to be above the GoDs. Or is MUI supposed to be on the level of angels now, or dare I say, of El Grande Padre? C'mon now.

PS: Yay, my first (i think?) post in this site.

Give it a few days, people will calm down. It’s honestly the fandoms overhyping of MUI that let to this, believing that reaching this form will make goku unbeatable.

[Dbzfan94]

I just want to see Goku fight Beerus with it before Super ends.

Unless you want a 2 minute fight it wont happen considering the series has 2 episodes left.

[ZenkaiBoosts]

The last thing I wanted was seeing Jiren being fodderized anyway.

Yet you are ok with a new form from Goku possibly being fodderized.

Regardless, you are entitled to your opinion. Just like how people are entitled to their opinions of wanting Goku to win and or fodderize Jiren etc.

If you want people to accept your opinion, you should be accepting of those who wanted to see Goku win/fodderize Jiren etc. Only fair right?

No need to say that their reactions were getting out of hand. Who are you to make that judgment?

Why aren't people allowed to be disappointed that their favorite charcater, the main charcater Goku, still lost anyway despite a new form? Especially with all the hype of the new form too. They have a right to speak their opinion (assuming the spoilers are true)

What if the spoilers are red hearings to mislead and Goku actually does win? Will you then complain? Will people then have the right to tell you that your reactions not liking that ending are/were out of hand?

[ZenkaiBoosts]

Evem though I'm disappointed by the spoilers, I won't ever become a hater haha.

I still love Super. The tournament of power arc up to this point has been one of my greatest arcs in Dragon Ball history

I can't change my opinions on episodes that have already aired and were some of my greatest episodes ever in Dragon Ball: )

IF Mastered UI Goku defeats Jiren then mastered UI>>>>SS1 when it was shown for the first time, for me..


I'm simply disappointed by what appears to be the ending. Goku is an amazing iconic character and I'm disappointed in how they appear to be shafting him for the ending. Especially to build up MUI that long, only to artifically weaken it at the end for the sake of Jiren? Thats very VERY disappointing.

But after letting it sink In, I am a positive person, and I agree with @TheShadowEmperor8055 , I will wait for the episode to air until making any final judgements

I remain hopeful and positive that the ending spoilers were red hearings to mislead

And I trust Toriyama/Toei to make it great

[VegettoEX]

Please do not report posts in bad faith that do not actually go against the spirit of our community guidelines. Account strikes can and will be issued back against these.

Comments and analysis that you simply don't agree with and ask you to provide more information are not personal attacks.

[ZenkaiBoosts]

^ It's crazy how much hype UI was getting, only for Goku to still lose anyway. Great job of making MUI Goku look weak in the end lol

This is 100% going to impact merch sales of MUI Goku IMO, and I hope someone from Toei reads this and realizes why.

Goku never getting a big win in Super is unacceptable.

Somewhere along the way, Toriyama/Toei completely completely lost the plot when it came to MUI Goku vs Jiren.

All this shine for one of the most boring bland characters ever in Dragon Ball in Jiren, at the expense of Goku.

I have to agree with this thread now. What was the point of MUI if Goku was still going to lose anyway? Just awful and disappointing. It is so much worse to give Goku this hyped form and have him still lose, then to just not give him anything

But hey. I'm just not going to watch 130 and 131 anymore. I'm going to show Toei my displeasure with my viewership and wallet

They had a perfect opportunity to make MUI Goku look as badass as SS1 yet dropped the ball massively

Imagine if Goku still lost to Frieza after getting SS1.. yet that's what's happening here for MUI Goku. Totally unacceptable

Bro, forgive me if I say it, but you were talking on these forums about the past couple of episodes like they were the best thing ever ,like they came from God himself, you made thousands of posts, to the point where people were starting to reporter you to the mods, and now you're just gonna drop Super in the final 2 episodes?? With the overwhelming amout of praise you gave to this show throughout this past weeks it just seems childish to stop watching because you don't agree with a narrative decision. I too think it's a bullshit ending, but you're kinda overreacting a bit

This is a response in bad faith and seems more of a personal attack or personal query, then anything to do with the topic. You exaggerating my character and posts, or even calling me childesh was also not welcomed or appreciated by me Vegeta. I dont ever attack you and even helped you out with your questions about music. Thank you.

[GodVegetto91]

^ It's crazy how much hype UI was getting, only for Goku to still lose anyway. Great job of making MUI Goku look weak in the end lol

This is 100% going to impact merch sales of MUI Goku IMO, and I hope someone from Toei reads this and realizes why.

Goku never getting a big win in Super is unacceptable.

Somewhere along the way, Toriyama/Toei completely completely lost the plot when it came to MUI Goku vs Jiren.

All this shine for one of the most boring bland characters ever in Dragon Ball in Jiren, at the expense of Goku.

I have to agree with this thread now. What was the point of MUI if Goku was still going to lose anyway? Just awful and disappointing. It is so much worse to give Goku this hyped form and have him still lose, then to just not give him anything

But hey. I'm just not going to watch 130 and 131 anymore. I'm going to show Toei my displeasure with my viewership and wallet

They had a perfect opportunity to make MUI Goku look as badass as SS1 yet dropped the ball massively

Imagine if Goku still lost to Frieza after getting SS1.. yet that's what's happening here for MUI Goku. Totally unacceptable

You know what, i fully FULLY agree with you mate! It seems like you and i have the same mindset in a lot of things! Lol

I hope the Ultra Instinct Goku toys will NOT sell well just to show them a lesson! That will teach Toei and Toriyama for messing with the fans.

They’re hyping up this form to the fans only to have it lose, Yet they expect the fans to financially support them by buying this form’s Merch!???? I didn’t think so. I believe in justice!