(SPOILERS INSIDE) Will Kaioken Blue and/or Blue Evolution appear in the film?

[superfan2024]

As of this point, there's pretty much no Kaioken Blue and Blue Evolution appearing in the film just as I had predicted and hoped for!

Thread could be locked now.

Kaioken isn't a new form, it's just a different aura. Nothing to completely disregard it isn't appearing.

Tbh, Toei treats it like a form somewhat. And there could be a possibility that Goku could use it a little bit in the movie but... i’m pretty sure he’s just not.

[Zen Yabuki]

Wouldn’t mind seeing Kaioken Blue. Don’t care at all about Evolution tho

[shadowfox87]

If I were Toriyama, I wouldn't include SSBKK or SSBE, but Toei is that person sitting next to him whispering in his ear. I mean, the reason we're even having a film on Broly is because his editor influenced him. In order to sell more toys and merchandise, Toei will tell Toriyama to include it. SSG Vegeta is in the film even though the manga had it a long time ago. Many things from the manga later get adapted into the anime. However, SSG Vegeta only helps them to sell more toys and action figures now on SSG Vegeta even though it's just a recolor.

I wouldn't want to see SSBKK or SSBE. I would rather see CSSB and UI and follow the manga. SSBE was only given to Vegeta in the anime since he can't learn Kaioken. The same scene in which Goku uses SSBKK against Jiren is CSSB in the manga. Toriyama has already rewritten Bardock's story with DB Minus and Broly's story. He should have no problem using the manga over the anime as it is anyways, more consistent with the plot.

[JulieYBM]

I doubt it. Unless Nagamine adds them as part of his storyboard I do not foresee them being in Toriyama's script. I am hoping to see Mastery of Selflessness for Gokuu and Vegeta, though. That should be fun.

[PFM18]

People that stick to the anime and don't understand the process would be horrendously confused if SSBE/SSBKK were to not show up

[Baggie_Saiyan]

If I were Toriyama, I wouldn't include SSBKK or SSBE, but Toei is that person sitting next to him whispering in his ear. I mean, the reason we're even having a film on Broly is because his editor influenced him. In order to sell more toys and merchandise, Toei will tell Toriyama to include it. SSG Vegeta is in the film even though the manga had it a long time ago. Many things from the manga later get adapted into the anime. However, SSG Vegeta only helps them to sell more toys and action figures now on SSG Vegeta even though it's just a recolor.

I wouldn't want to see SSBKK or SSBE. I would rather see CSSB and UI and follow the manga. SSBE was only given to Vegeta in the anime since he can't learn Kaioken. The same scene in which Goku uses SSBKK against Jiren is CSSB in the manga. Toriyama has already rewritten Bardock's story with DB Minus and Broly's story. He should have no problem using the manga over the anime as it is anyways, more consistent with the plot.

Everything Toei have done in DBS has not been to "sell more toys" as always that has been the by product. SSGSS.E Vegeta hasn't been merched at all since it's debut in January, so they're not going to force Toriyama to include a form that has barely been marketed.

Odds of SSG Vegeta getting merched is slim. Very slim. Vegeta himself barely gets merched let alone the fact the form SSG barely does, hell they don't consider Vegeta even important enough to give him a movie Ichiban Kuji figure!

[majinwarman]

If I were Toriyama, I wouldn't include SSBKK or SSBE, but Toei is that person sitting next to him whispering in his ear. I mean, the reason we're even having a film on Broly is because his editor influenced him. In order to sell more toys and merchandise, Toei will tell Toriyama to include it. SSG Vegeta is in the film even though the manga had it a long time ago. Many things from the manga later get adapted into the anime. However, SSG Vegeta only helps them to sell more toys and action figures now on SSG Vegeta even though it's just a recolor.

I wouldn't want to see SSBKK or SSBE. I would rather see CSSB and UI and follow the manga. SSBE was only given to Vegeta in the anime since he can't learn Kaioken. The same scene in which Goku uses SSBKK against Jiren is CSSB in the manga. Toriyama has already rewritten Bardock's story with DB Minus and Broly's story. He should have no problem using the manga over the anime as it is anyways, more consistent with the plot.

Everything Toei have done in DBS has not been to "sell more toys" as always that has been the by product. SSGSS.E Vegeta hasn't been merched at all since it's debut in January, so they're not going to force Toriyama to include a form that has barely been marketed.

Odds of SSG Vegeta getting merched is slim. Very slim. Vegeta himself barely gets merched let alone the fact the form SSG barely does, hell they don't consider Vegeta even important enough to give him a movie Ichiban Kuji figure!

People need to stop assuming everything they is for toys. Yes, they benefit with toy sales but they are not going to do everything for just it. They are suppose to making a movie not a toy sale.

[Baggie_Saiyan]

If I were Toriyama, I wouldn't include SSBKK or SSBE, but Toei is that person sitting next to him whispering in his ear. I mean, the reason we're even having a film on Broly is because his editor influenced him. In order to sell more toys and merchandise, Toei will tell Toriyama to include it. SSG Vegeta is in the film even though the manga had it a long time ago. Many things from the manga later get adapted into the anime. However, SSG Vegeta only helps them to sell more toys and action figures now on SSG Vegeta even though it's just a recolor.

I wouldn't want to see SSBKK or SSBE. I would rather see CSSB and UI and follow the manga. SSBE was only given to Vegeta in the anime since he can't learn Kaioken. The same scene in which Goku uses SSBKK against Jiren is CSSB in the manga. Toriyama has already rewritten Bardock's story with DB Minus and Broly's story. He should have no problem using the manga over the anime as it is anyways, more consistent with the plot.

Everything Toei have done in DBS has not been to "sell more toys" as always that has been the by product. SSGSS.E Vegeta hasn't been merched at all since it's debut in January, so they're not going to force Toriyama to include a form that has barely been marketed.

Odds of SSG Vegeta getting merched is slim. Very slim. Vegeta himself barely gets merched let alone the fact the form SSG barely does, hell they don't consider Vegeta even important enough to give him a movie Ichiban Kuji figure!

People need to stop assuming everything they is for toys. Yes, they benefit with toy sales but they are not going to do everything for just it. They are suppose to making a movie not a toy sale.

Exactly. It's really annoying when people just see DB is making money and assume everything Toei do is to sell toys and merchandise. UI is immensely popular yet it doesn't even look like it'll be in film! (If it is then they're not merching it straight away in December).

[majinwarman]

Everything Toei have done in DBS has not been to "sell more toys" as always that has been the by product. SSGSS.E Vegeta hasn't been merched at all since it's debut in January, so they're not going to force Toriyama to include a form that has barely been marketed.

Odds of SSG Vegeta getting merched is slim. Very slim. Vegeta himself barely gets merched let alone the fact the form SSG barely does, hell they don't consider Vegeta even important enough to give him a movie Ichiban Kuji figure!

People need to stop assuming everything they is for toys. Yes, they benefit with toy sales but they are not going to do everything for just it. They are suppose to making a movie not a toy sale.

Exactly. It's really annoying when people just see DB is making money and assume everything Toei do is to sell toys and merchandise. UI is immensely popular yet it doesn't even look like it'll be in film! (If it is then they're not merching it straight away in December).

You can't really stop people from thinking that no matter what you say.

[Miracles]

I really doubt it. We didn't see any sign of KK Blue or Beyond Blue in the trailer. Toriyama himself never really had Goku use KK outside his base form. This was a TOEI exclusive thing.
The MSSB's are more in line with Toriyama's Full power Super Saiya-jin modes back in Cell saga. Where they have more control and could utilizes more of it's power.

[1345521]

I really doubt it. We didn't see any sign of KK Blue or Beyond Blue in the trailer. Toriyama himself never really had Goku use KK outside his base form. This was a TOEI exclusive thing.
The MSSB's are more in line with Toriyama's Full power Super Saiya-jin modes back in Cell saga. Where they have more control and could utilizes more of it's power.

I agree but mssj and mssj blue actually don't work the same way.
Mssj allows to be able maintain better ki control of ssj, which means mastering the form where it requres little stamnia to use, it is easy to control the rage trigger of it, able to easily fluctuate the out-put level of it (so you can like surpress yourself easily in the form to like Nappa tier if you wish).
Mssj blue is just where you are using the absloute full power of ssj blue at constant. That's it. It's still takes heavy stamnia to maintain, your control of Ki is simply that you store all of that ki in you, but you can't fluctuate it at all like for mssj.

But yeah, I agree. I really hope those forms are not in the movie. I would be flabbergasted if mssj blue is in the movie.

[Rakurai]

I really doubt it. We didn't see any sign of KK Blue or Beyond Blue in the trailer. Toriyama himself never really had Goku use KK outside his base form. This was a TOEI exclusive thing.
The MSSB's are more in line with Toriyama's Full power Super Saiya-jin modes back in Cell saga. Where they have more control and could utilizes more of it's power.

I agree with this. SSB-KK and SSBE were quite arbitrary. CSSB is more in line with the narrative of the series about mastering forms, and keeps the premise of SSB being the main transformation of the series without having to worry why Goku or Vegeta go XXX if they're struggling as SSB's.

If SSB-KK/SSBE do appear, then that's because of Toei's influence and not because Toriyama wanted those forms to appear.

[emperior]

If SSB-KK/SSBE do appear, then that's because of Toei's influence and not because Toriyama wanted those forms to appear.

Not really. Toriyama said in a interview he was going to use some of the anime-only ideas in his outlines. Kaioken may be among those.

[PFM18]

If SSB-KK/SSBE do appear, then that's because of Toei's influence and not because Toriyama wanted those forms to appear.

Not really. Toriyama said in a interview he was going to use some of the anime-only ideas in his outlines. Kaioken may be among those.

Source?

[Pannaliciour]

It depends how fans receive these forms. If its good for the money then they will.

Ssj god vegeta will apear in the anime=movie for the first time i guess. A Manga adaption in the movie. But lets not forget Kale was Toei idea and the manga also included Kale. So if the supply is sufficient enough then everything can happen.

Personally I would love to see a movie animated kaio ken .

[emperior]

If SSB-KK/SSBE do appear, then that's because of Toei's influence and not because Toriyama wanted those forms to appear.

Not really. Toriyama said in a interview he was going to use some of the anime-only ideas in his outlines. Kaioken may be among those.

Source?

Yeah, I fucked up on this one. I don’t know whether I was right or wrong, but the latter is more probable. I was sure of having read of this thing, but I haven’t been able to find a source so it’s most likely false. I can’t find a source of Toyotaro revealing that Toriyama checks all DB related storyboards either. Am I going crazy?

[BlueBasilisk]

Not really. Toriyama said in a interview he was going to use some of the anime-only ideas in his outlines. Kaioken may be among those.

Source?

Yeah, I fucked up on this one. I don’t know whether I was right or wrong, but the latter is more probable. I was sure of having read of this thing, but I haven’t been able to find a source so it’s most likely false. I can’t find a source of Toyotaro revealing that Toriyama checks all DB related storyboards either. Am I going crazy?

The storyboard bit was from this interview: https://pastebin.com/K7FGtFfp

I really doubt it. We didn't see any sign of KK Blue or Beyond Blue in the trailer. Toriyama himself never really had Goku use KK outside his base form. This was a TOEI exclusive thing.
The MSSB's are more in line with Toriyama's Full power Super Saiya-jin modes back in Cell saga. Where they have more control and could utilizes more of it's power.

Kaioken Blue and SSBE both re-use ideas from Toriyama's original manga. Kaioken obviously being Kaioken, with Goku similarly fucking up his body the first time he used it (vs Hit/vs Vegeta), then being able to stabilize it and maximize its power at 20 only to fail against a far superior foe (vs Jiren/vs Frieza). Evolution is essentially just Super Saiyan Blue Grade 2 with a darker hair color and visible pupils. It's more apparent in the model sheet were it has the normal Blue hair color and is just called "Super Saiyan Blue Strengthened."

[1345521]

Not really. Toriyama said in a interview he was going to use some of the anime-only ideas in his outlines. Kaioken may be among those.

Source?

Yeah, I fucked up on this one. I don’t know whether I was right or wrong, but the latter is more probable. I was sure of having read of this thing, but I haven’t been able to find a source so it’s most likely false. I can’t find a source of Toyotaro revealing that Toriyama checks all DB related storyboards either. Am I going crazy?

I can’t find a source of Toyotaro revealing that Toriyama checks all DB related storyboards either.
Just literally go on wikia. It literally states how the manga works. And go to the links of soruce if you dont trust wikia.
Akira toriyama has basically stated how he prefers toyotaro's manga>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>..Toei anime for super.
I thought most people knew that by now. Hopefully that'll play into akira using manga fillers and refrences to write his movie and using ABSLOUTLY NO TOEI fillers. Step 1, he already use ssj god vegeta. step 2, introduce mssj blue now. NO KAIOKEN OR EVOLUTION (which porbably aren't even in his story but toei might just add them in and ruin his orginal idea)

[1345521]

Source?

Yeah, I fucked up on this one. I don’t know whether I was right or wrong, but the latter is more probable. I was sure of having read of this thing, but I haven’t been able to find a source so it’s most likely false. I can’t find a source of Toyotaro revealing that Toriyama checks all DB related storyboards either. Am I going crazy?

The storyboard bit was from this interview: https://pastebin.com/K7FGtFfp

I really doubt it. We didn't see any sign of KK Blue or Beyond Blue in the trailer. Toriyama himself never really had Goku use KK outside his base form. This was a TOEI exclusive thing.
The MSSB's are more in line with Toriyama's Full power Super Saiya-jin modes back in Cell saga. Where they have more control and could utilizes more of it's power.

Kaioken Blue and SSBE both re-use ideas from Toriyama's original manga. Kaioken obviously being Kaioken, with Goku similarly fucking up his body the first time he used it (vs Hit/vs Vegeta), then being able to stabilize it and maximize its power at 20 only to fail against a far superior foe (vs Jiren/vs Frieza). Evolution is essentially just Super Saiyan Blue Grade 2 with a darker hair color and visible pupils. It's more apparent in the model sheet were it has the normal Blue hair color and is just called "Super Saiyan Blue Strengthened."

Thank you for bringing in the 100% Facts with that toyotaro interview

[emperior]

The storyboard bit was from this interview: https://pastebin.com/K7FGtFfp

If SSB-KK/SSBE do appear, then that's because of Toei's influence and not because Toriyama wanted those forms to appear.

Not really. Toriyama said in a interview he was going to use some of the anime-only ideas in his outlines. Kaioken may be among those.

Source?

Thanks to BlueBasilisk I have the source for the “Toriyama checks all DB related storyboards” thing: https://pastebin.com/K7FGtFfp (which was also sort of confirmed by Toriyama himself in the manga volume 1 interview with Toyotaro: http://www.kanzenshuu.com/translations/ ... b-version/).

I was also finally able to find where it was said that Toriyama is adding anime-only elements to his story, and I actually remembered it well and didn’t just make it up:
(Minute 2:50 https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=mdHqHnK-FvY)
”Mr. Toriyama gives the same rough script to both. The anime and manga are produced independently. We don't discuss who does what. But sometimes, once Mr. Toriyama has watched the anime, he sometimes thinks: “this is a good idea, maybe I will introduce it in my story”. The same goes on the anime side. There is an interaction afterwards."

Here’s further confirmation of Toriyama’s involvement with the writing of Super’s episodes too: https://twitter.com/toshio916/status/859668635656126464

Here there is even further confirmation that Toriyama was indeed in continuous contact with the anime staff: http://www.kanzenshuu.com/translations/ ... vival-arc/

It also seems like they are planning to have Toriyama even more involved than he ever was: https://mobile.twitter.com/Herms98/stat ... 3904764928
So please, no crying that it wasn’t Toriyama’s idea or that he didn’t approve of it once we see Kaioken in the movie.

This post is basically a resource of proof that Toriyama is involved with anime Super. A lot.