What are your top 3 dream fights?

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Re: What are your top 3 dream fights?

Post by Captain Space » Sat Jul 18, 2015 8:09 pm

DBZGTKOSDH wrote:
So, 10 years later, Oob finally appears. Goku expected Oob to be a trained fighter, and he expected his power to so great that he might lose. It turned out that Oob was untrained, but his power was exactly as great as Goku expected. Logically, for Oob to have met Goku's expectations without any training, he should be about as strong as Pure Boo. And SS3 Gotenks was about x8 stronger than Pure Boo, and Ultimate Gohan was even stronger than Gotenks.

So, how can Goku be stronger than Gohan, or even Gotenks, when he isn't even sure that he can defeat someone at Pure Boo's level? Why would Goku suddenly become many times stronger when he has both said & shown that he isn't capable of such gains anymore?
You mean Uub, who Goku at least matched in base?

I've never thought of EoZ Uub as being on Buu's level yet, but if you're going that route...yeah, that's base Goku, fighting him pretty well. And just going by the manga, he has three transformations above that...
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Re: What are your top 3 dream fights?

Post by supercat » Sat Jul 18, 2015 8:18 pm

Rocketman wrote:Neither Goku nor Vegeta can ever catch up to Gohan by "training". The gap is too wide, and both have no room left to grow.
Barring their new transformations and the recent turn of events, I'm inclined to agree with this. During the events of the Buu arc, both Goku and Vegeta were complete fodders compared to Gohan.

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Re: What are your top 3 dream fights?

Post by DBZGTKOSDH » Sat Jul 18, 2015 8:22 pm

Captain Space wrote:You mean Uub, who Goku at least matched in base?

I've never thought of EoZ Uub as being on Buu's level yet, but if you're going that route...yeah, that's base Goku, fighting him pretty well. And just going by the manga, he has three transformations above that...
Oob was untrained and didn't know how to use his power, not to mention that it was unstable since it kept rising the more angry he got. The moment he went at full power, aka at Pure Boo's level, was when he threw the Kiai, which was when Goku had seen enough.
James Teal (Animerica 1996) wrote:When you think about it, there are a number of similarities between the Chinese-inspired Son Goku and that most American of superhero icons, Superman. Both are aliens sent to Earth shortly after birth to escape the destruction of their homeworlds; both possess super-strength, flight, super-speed, heightened senses and the ability to cast energy blasts. But the crucial difference between them lies not only in how they view the world, but in how the world views them.

Superman is, and always has been, a symbol for truth, justice, and upstanding moral fortitude–a role model and leader as much as a fighter. The more down-to-earth Goku has no illusions about being responsible for maintaining social order, or for setting some kind of moral example for the entire world. Goku is simply a martial artist who’s devoted his life toward perfecting his fighting skills and other abilities. Though never shy about risking his life to save either one person or the entire world, he just doesn’t believe that the balance of the world rests in any way on his shoulders, and he has no need to shape any part of it in his image. Goku is an idealist, and believes that there is some good in everyone, but he is unconcerned with the big picture of the world…unless it has to do with some kind of fight. Politics, society, law and order don’t have much bearing on his life, but he’s a man who knows right from wrong.

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Re: What are your top 3 dream fights?

Post by Captain Space » Sat Jul 18, 2015 8:23 pm

I do agree that by the end of the Buu Saga, Gohan and Gotenks far outclass Goku and Vegeta.

I just don't think they randomly stopped being able to get stronger after that, and ten years is a long time--especially in Gohan's case, where as we've seen his power is decreasing when he doesn't train (EoZ implied Goten and Trunks still trained a little, so they probably didn't deteriorate in the same way, even if they didn't improve). So I think it's entirely reasonable that at least Goku, and maybe Vegeta too, surpassed the kids by EoZ.
Oob was untrained and didn't know how to use his power, not to mention that it was unstable since it kept rising the more angry he got. The moment he went at full power, aka at Pure Boo's level, was when he threw the Kiai, which was when Goku had seen enough.
And even that kiai didn't really hurt Goku at all. An attack at Pure/Kid Buu's full power would have turned base Buu Saga Goku into jelly.
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Re: What are your top 3 dream fights?

Post by DBZGTKOSDH » Sat Jul 18, 2015 8:33 pm

Captain Space wrote:And even that kiai didn't really hurt Goku at all. An attack at Pure/Kid Buu's full power would have turned base Buu Saga Goku into jelly.
But Oob can't control his power properly, so we don't know if his attacks are as strong as they should be. Either Oob was at Pure Boo's level, but couldn't use his power properly, or Goku sensed his dormant powers being on Pure Boo's level.

The thing is, Oob can't logically be stronger than Pure Boo, since he hasn't done any training, and Goku expected Oob to be strong enough to beat him, and Oob met Goku's expectations, so he can't be weaker than Pure Boo either. So, Goku definitely expected Oob to be on Pure Boo's level, and he believed that there was a chance he would lose, in an all-out battle. Which makes it impossible for him to be stronger than SS3 Gotenks, not to mention Gohan.
James Teal (Animerica 1996) wrote:When you think about it, there are a number of similarities between the Chinese-inspired Son Goku and that most American of superhero icons, Superman. Both are aliens sent to Earth shortly after birth to escape the destruction of their homeworlds; both possess super-strength, flight, super-speed, heightened senses and the ability to cast energy blasts. But the crucial difference between them lies not only in how they view the world, but in how the world views them.

Superman is, and always has been, a symbol for truth, justice, and upstanding moral fortitude–a role model and leader as much as a fighter. The more down-to-earth Goku has no illusions about being responsible for maintaining social order, or for setting some kind of moral example for the entire world. Goku is simply a martial artist who’s devoted his life toward perfecting his fighting skills and other abilities. Though never shy about risking his life to save either one person or the entire world, he just doesn’t believe that the balance of the world rests in any way on his shoulders, and he has no need to shape any part of it in his image. Goku is an idealist, and believes that there is some good in everyone, but he is unconcerned with the big picture of the world…unless it has to do with some kind of fight. Politics, society, law and order don’t have much bearing on his life, but he’s a man who knows right from wrong.

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Re: What are your top 3 dream fights?

Post by supercat » Sun Jul 19, 2015 3:32 am

DBZGTKOSDH wrote:
Captain Space wrote:And even that kiai didn't really hurt Goku at all. An attack at Pure/Kid Buu's full power would have turned base Buu Saga Goku into jelly.
But Oob can't control his power properly, so we don't know if his attacks are as strong as they should be. Either Oob was at Pure Boo's level, but couldn't use his power properly, or Goku sensed his dormant powers being on Pure Boo's level.

The thing is, Oob can't logically be stronger than Pure Boo, since he hasn't done any training, and Goku expected Oob to be strong enough to beat him, and Oob met Goku's expectations, so he can't be weaker than Pure Boo either. So, Goku definitely expected Oob to be on Pure Boo's level, and he believed that there was a chance he would lose, in an all-out battle. Which makes it impossible for him to be stronger than SS3 Gotenks, not to mention Gohan.
While there's no doubt that Goku was impressed with Uub's power, the kid doesn't need to have all of Buu's power right from the get-go to warrant the Saiyan's attention. Even if Uub had a power level comparable to Imperfect Cell / Semi-perfect Cell, Goku would be excited, as he would see it as an opportunity to train the boy.

In any case, he probably sensed Uub's dormant potential. If the kid really did start off with all the power he had in his former life, he would be powerful enough to one-shot fighters like Super Perfect Cell, Majin Vegeta, SSJ2 Gohan, etc.

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Re: What are your top 3 dream fights?

Post by Captain Space » Sun Jul 19, 2015 6:10 am

DBZGTKOSDH wrote:
Captain Space wrote:And even that kiai didn't really hurt Goku at all. An attack at Pure/Kid Buu's full power would have turned base Buu Saga Goku into jelly.
But Oob can't control his power properly, so we don't know if his attacks are as strong as they should be. Either Oob was at Pure Boo's level, but couldn't use his power properly, or Goku sensed his dormant powers being on Pure Boo's level.

The thing is, Oob can't logically be stronger than Pure Boo, since he hasn't done any training, and Goku expected Oob to be strong enough to beat him, and Oob met Goku's expectations, so he can't be weaker than Pure Boo either. So, Goku definitely expected Oob to be on Pure Boo's level, and he believed that there was a chance he would lose, in an all-out battle. Which makes it impossible for him to be stronger than SS3 Gotenks, not to mention Gohan.
He believed there was a chance he would lose in the tournament. And it's quite possible the no-SSJ 'rule' was still in effect.

In any case, I'm pretty sure that yes, Uub was not on Buu's level yet, most of his power was still 'dormant', as evidenced by Goku keeping up with him and surviving his final attack with basically no damage, all in base form. Pretty sure Goku could beat Uub pretty easily if he transformed at this point, since at the end he says he wants to fight Uub once the latter has trained and gotten stronger.
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Re: What are your top 3 dream fights?

Post by Dbzejo » Sun Jul 19, 2015 7:47 am

Sooo, Goku lost against Superman, again. Fuck screwattack, seriously ...

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Re: What are your top 3 dream fights?

Post by DBZGTKOSDH » Sun Jul 19, 2015 8:20 am

supercat wrote:While there's no doubt that Goku was impressed with Uub's power, the kid doesn't need to have all of Buu's power right from the get-go to warrant the Saiyan's attention. Even if Uub had a power level comparable to Imperfect Cell / Semi-perfect Cell, Goku would be excited, as he would see it as an opportunity to train the boy.
But Goku wasn't just excited, he was expecting someone that could defeat him, so he can't be weaker than Pure Boo, or at least, his dormant powers can't be. Oob probably didn't use all of his dormant powers in his fight, or at least, he used them at the last second of the fight.

The point I want to make is that SS3 Goku can't have surpassed SS3 Gotenks, or even be close to SS2 Gotenks, if he was expecting someone at Pure Boo's level to have a chance to beat him.
Captain Space wrote:He believed there was a chance he would lose in the tournament. And it's quite possible the no-SSJ 'rule' was still in effect.
Mr. Boo was in the tournament, and he was planning to beat him if he was to fight him, so the no-SS rule wasn't there this time.
In any case, I'm pretty sure that yes, Uub was not on Buu's level yet, most of his power was still 'dormant', as evidenced by Goku keeping up with him and surviving his final attack with basically no damage, all in base form. Pretty sure Goku could beat Uub pretty easily if he transformed at this point, since at the end he says he wants to fight Uub once the latter has trained and gotten stronger.
If Oob was a trained fighter, as Goku originally expected him to be, then he would have used Super Saiyan 3, since he wanted an all-out fight.


Anyway, this has gone way off-topic, so let's end this here. We now have a thread for this after all.
James Teal (Animerica 1996) wrote:When you think about it, there are a number of similarities between the Chinese-inspired Son Goku and that most American of superhero icons, Superman. Both are aliens sent to Earth shortly after birth to escape the destruction of their homeworlds; both possess super-strength, flight, super-speed, heightened senses and the ability to cast energy blasts. But the crucial difference between them lies not only in how they view the world, but in how the world views them.

Superman is, and always has been, a symbol for truth, justice, and upstanding moral fortitude–a role model and leader as much as a fighter. The more down-to-earth Goku has no illusions about being responsible for maintaining social order, or for setting some kind of moral example for the entire world. Goku is simply a martial artist who’s devoted his life toward perfecting his fighting skills and other abilities. Though never shy about risking his life to save either one person or the entire world, he just doesn’t believe that the balance of the world rests in any way on his shoulders, and he has no need to shape any part of it in his image. Goku is an idealist, and believes that there is some good in everyone, but he is unconcerned with the big picture of the world…unless it has to do with some kind of fight. Politics, society, law and order don’t have much bearing on his life, but he’s a man who knows right from wrong.

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Re: What are your top 3 dream fights?

Post by SSJ2FutureGohan » Sun Jul 19, 2015 8:33 am

DBZGTKOSDH wrote:Mr. Boo was in the tournament, and he was planning to beat him if he was to fight him, so the no-SS rule wasn't there this time.
Who said Goku can't be Innocent Boo without Super Saiyan?

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Re: What are your top 3 dream fights?

Post by DBZGTKOSDH » Sun Jul 19, 2015 10:33 am

SSJ2FutureGohan wrote:
DBZGTKOSDH wrote:Mr. Boo was in the tournament, and he was planning to beat him if he was to fight him, so the no-SS rule wasn't there this time.
Who said Goku can't be Innocent Boo without Super Saiyan?
Let's go to the proper thread, instead of continuing being off-topic.
James Teal (Animerica 1996) wrote:When you think about it, there are a number of similarities between the Chinese-inspired Son Goku and that most American of superhero icons, Superman. Both are aliens sent to Earth shortly after birth to escape the destruction of their homeworlds; both possess super-strength, flight, super-speed, heightened senses and the ability to cast energy blasts. But the crucial difference between them lies not only in how they view the world, but in how the world views them.

Superman is, and always has been, a symbol for truth, justice, and upstanding moral fortitude–a role model and leader as much as a fighter. The more down-to-earth Goku has no illusions about being responsible for maintaining social order, or for setting some kind of moral example for the entire world. Goku is simply a martial artist who’s devoted his life toward perfecting his fighting skills and other abilities. Though never shy about risking his life to save either one person or the entire world, he just doesn’t believe that the balance of the world rests in any way on his shoulders, and he has no need to shape any part of it in his image. Goku is an idealist, and believes that there is some good in everyone, but he is unconcerned with the big picture of the world…unless it has to do with some kind of fight. Politics, society, law and order don’t have much bearing on his life, but he’s a man who knows right from wrong.

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Re: What are your top 3 dream fights?

Post by Noah » Sun Oct 11, 2015 12:13 am

1. Goku vs Vegeta III: For the same reasons

2. Gohan vs Piccolo: Classic Master vs Apprentice battle, Piccolo would lose, but it would be so awesome if he said after his defeat that he didn't believe that little crybaby would get so that far

3. Vegeta vs Gohan: It has so much potential, Gohan surpassed Vegeta many times... The battle between them in GT was good, but I expecting something even greater than that
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Re: What are your top 3 dream fights?

Post by nickzambuto » Sun Oct 11, 2015 6:59 am

Oolong vs Puar, grudge match. To the death.

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Re: What are your top 3 dream fights?

Post by Dragon Ball Ireland » Sun Oct 11, 2015 10:45 am

Doctor. wrote:1. Goku vs Vegeta - Same reasons as your own, it'd be the best way to end the series. I'd be fine with either of them winning, really, a draw or the winner not being revealed would be a cop-out, though.
Story-wise I think having a winner would be doomed to fail. On one hand Goku is the main protagonist so having him win would feel far too generic/predictable, and Vegeta winning wouldn't feel believable as it would only be meaningful in the context of him finally surpassing Goku, which would require TOEI to definitively overwrite GT by making Super cross into its alleged timeline, and I can't see them doing that for fear of how it would affect merchandise sales of Super Saiyan 4, etc.

The original Beyblade anime (all three seasons) ended with an ambiguous ending and that worked. As with GT's ending some things are better left to interpretation.
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Re: What are your top 3 dream fights?

Post by Froggy » Sun Oct 11, 2015 10:52 am

mecha frieza final transformation 100% without the problems frieza get when 100% vs goku or future trunks (on first arrival)

king cold final transformion 100% vs dont care.
i just want to see his full power since they mentioned he is stronger than frieza but never demonstrated anything.

whis vs the female counterpart from the 6th universe.

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Re: What are your top 3 dream fights?

Post by wolffangfisting » Fri Nov 17, 2017 2:20 pm

Man-Wolf vs Mr. Satan

Yajirobe vs Ox King

Vegeta vs Dabura

Yamcha vs Chiaotzu

Boss Rabbit (Monster Carrot) vs Fangs the Vampire

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Re: What are your top 3 dream fights?

Post by ABED » Fri Nov 17, 2017 2:41 pm

SSG Goku vs. Raditz. It would be nice seeing Goku's brother's reaction to seeing him as a god after considering him trash.
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Re: What are your top 3 dream fights?

Post by sintzu » Fri Nov 17, 2017 2:46 pm

Goku vs Piccolo round 2.

Vegeta vs Piccolo.

Gohan vs Freeza (for real).
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Re: What are your top 3 dream fights?

Post by ABED » Fri Nov 17, 2017 2:49 pm

sintzu wrote:Vegeta vs Piccolo.
I'm sure Sabat would love that.
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Re: What are your top 3 dream fights?

Post by sintzu » Fri Nov 17, 2017 3:28 pm

ABED wrote:
sintzu wrote:Vegeta vs Piccolo.
I'm sure Sabat would love that.
I can't believe that didn't happen. There was so much tension between them up till the Cell arc that them going at it seemd like a matter of time.
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